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View Full Version : Leaky seals: PGP vs 5004


WalkGood
08-10-2011, 04:08 PM
I don't deal with 5004's much at all. Mostly see PGP's. For some reason Hunter is the most used in my part of the world.

Anyway, strictly speaking about wiper seal life/failure what do you see in 5004's versus PGP's? Plastic not metal.

Just the wiper seals. Nothing about distance, spray angles, lobster dinners, hats or dinner cruises from the manufacturer.

I just replaced 10 PGP's at one residential place due to wiper seal leakage. Date codes from 1999 and 2000. Pressure was poor due to all the combined leakage on 3 zones.

This was in very sandy/gritty soil. Shafts all scratched up, scored. Two-thirds of the heads were also too low in the turf. Some near the driveway got run over and pushed down. Others I'm thinking the turf roots "grew" higher over time.

txirrigation
08-10-2011, 04:15 PM
I get a lot more prolonged use out of 5004's on temp systems. There are always leaking issues with the PGP's. Also it would be nice if they freaking screwed the riser on tight enough from the factory on the PGP.

Seems like a temp system is good testing grounds for products because you can see where the hydro seed is growing and where it isnt. Also they are above grade so small leaks are easy to see. Also temp systems get beat up pretty good by foot traffic so over time you can find out which is better.

FIMCO-MEISTER
08-10-2011, 04:36 PM
I know PGP leaks were becoming a beating when I left. What little I used the 500 I was very impressed. Love the fact they have LA nozzles on the tree and a small screwdriver for adjustment. SAM/PRS 5000 was an awesome head. Longevity I can't speak for.

DanaMac
08-10-2011, 06:32 PM
I see more water leaking at the seals on the 5004 than the PGP, but I prefer everything else about the 5004.

hunterpreferred
08-10-2011, 10:40 PM
PGP's are terrible. Not sure about the Rainbird heads. We started using strictly I 20's about 3 years ago, very pleased with performance so far. The only thing PGP's are good for is making $$ upgrading to I20's

mitchgo
08-11-2011, 01:30 AM
For some reason when I see 5004 I see a crap head.. When I see a 5004+ Sam head I see dependability and high quality.

pgp a crap head - pgp utlra dependability and high quality- same with i20's.

Wet_Boots
08-11-2011, 08:30 AM
Your check is in the mail

txirrigation
08-11-2011, 11:18 AM
For some reason when I see 5004 I see a crap head.. When I see a 5004+ Sam head I see dependability and high quality.

pgp a crap head - pgp utlra dependability and high quality- same with i20's.

The i20's are awesome. Spray patterns were incredible, I just wish more people were willing to pay for them.

PS- They just paid us to install, they wanted to do the clean-up to save money.

AI Inc
08-11-2011, 12:11 PM
The i20's are awesome. Spray patterns were incredible, I just wish more people were willing to pay for them.

PS- They just paid us to install, they wanted to do the clean-up to save money.

In all reality , a 20 heads job is what $105 more? I dont sell em with installs but they are sure are nice heads. Thought about it before.

Wet_Boots
08-11-2011, 12:27 PM
Same gear drive - smaller nozzle selection

DanaMac
08-11-2011, 12:43 PM
Same gear drive - smaller nozzle selection

And stronger spring, so on low pressure applications this is a problem. I have one system we take care of, and every year when I turn start it up, I have to use the flow control on the heads to get all the others to pop up. Even throughout the summer the heads do not always pop up.

AI Inc
08-11-2011, 02:17 PM
And stronger spring, so on low pressure applications this is a problem. I have one system we take care of, and every year when I turn start it up, I have to use the flow control on the heads to get all the others to pop up. Even throughout the summer the heads do not always pop up.

That is a concern , and another reason I havnt gone that route. Biggest reason thou is no matter what I use I still need pgp,s , so I figure Ill just use them.

Mike Leary
08-11-2011, 03:51 PM
Same gear drive - smaller nozzle selection

Prolly got a few hundred I-20 6" stainless ultras in service, problem zero.

Wet_Boots
08-11-2011, 04:56 PM
Prolly got a few hundred I-20 6" stainless ultras in service, problem zero.Same gears and seals (I believe) as a PGP - put some 1/2 gpm nozzles in some of them and watch them awhile.

AI Inc
08-11-2011, 06:18 PM
I dont have a lot of I-20,s out there, but Ive yet to see one with a leaking seal.

bcg
08-11-2011, 06:25 PM
I hardly ever run into I-20's but I've replaced a couple this year because of leaky seals. I had a long discussion about this problem with my Hunter rep at a party a couple of months ago and he insisted that I see more failed Hunter heads because there are more Hunter heads installed than anyone else. I guess that could be but I know that I've had more than a few systems where I've replaced every rotor on them because over 90% of the PGPs were leaking at the wiper seal or threads and I went 5004's in every case because I've never personally seen the same problem in a system with T-Birds (the fixed version) or 5000's. I've also never seen a 5000 launch the turret off the head like I do with PGP's so my feeling is that they 5000's are just more reliable and durable heads and I do like the pattern of the rain curtain nozzles better. I've never had a need to go below 1.0GPM on a rotor so the extras on the PGP tree really don't do me any good. Most of the time when I'm replacing a PGP, it's been nozzled with # 6 or 7 with #9 being a close 3rd.

Wet_Boots
08-11-2011, 06:25 PM
I've replaced a few - they break as easy as a PGP, if they aren't retracted.

CAPT Stream Rotar
08-11-2011, 11:52 PM
I've noticed pgp's on higher than 30 Psi pressure systems fail eaiser..


anyone else?

WalkGood
08-12-2011, 12:03 AM
I've noticed pgp's on higher than 30 Psi pressure systems fail eaiser..


anyone else?

What size nozzles at 30psi? Is that static or dynamic pressure?

Even at 30 psi dynamic pressure, gotta nozzle down to get any decent distance with 4 heads.

hunterpreferred
08-12-2011, 07:17 AM
We have installed over 2000 I20's this season. Never had leaky seals. A few do not rotate right out of the box. The other problem is as Dana mentioned, not always popping up with low psi. Removing the check valve helps, but is not always an option.

Sprinkus
08-12-2011, 09:15 AM
What size nozzles at 30psi? Is that static or dynamic pressure?


;) :hammerhead:

WalkGood
08-12-2011, 06:00 PM
;) :hammerhead:

.... and you are ....?

Go :hammerhead: yerself.

Wet_Boots
08-12-2011, 06:23 PM
five o'clock - time to get hammered

Sprinkus
08-12-2011, 10:08 PM
Eight o'clock and already there.
Think I'll go out and measure the static pressure on my rotor.