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View Full Version : Experiences with various Smart Controllers


ArTurf
10-12-2011, 02:06 PM
I am looking at pushing smart controllers or add on smart sensors to my customers present control. I have a heck of a time teaching some customers how to change settings to go along with the weather. What smart controllers have you used & installed that seem to do a good job adjusting to conditions? Really don't want a system that changes the run times just the frequency of watering days. Most of my customers have a Hunter Pro C.

SoCalLandscapeMgmt
10-12-2011, 02:35 PM
I am looking at pushing smart controllers or add on smart sensors to my customers present control. I have a heck of a time teaching some customers how to change settings to go along with the weather. What smart controllers have you used & installed that seem to do a good job adjusting to conditions? Really don't want a system that changes the run times just the frequency of watering days. Most of my customers have a Hunter Pro C.

Solar Sync. It will vary the run times but some days it zeroes them out if no watering is needed. You basically program for peak irrigation requirements and it moves things down or off from there. Cheap, easy to install. I have a couple on sites..... I'm indifferent to them. I'm not overly impressed nor am I dissapointed but for what it costs it's fairly effective.

FIMCO-MEISTER
10-12-2011, 02:51 PM
I'd like to get some feedback on these. Not controller specific but an add on.
http://www.alextronix.com/usm.html
Posted via Mobile Device

jvanvliet
10-12-2011, 04:58 PM
We have 10 Hunter Solar Syncs on one site. Easy to manage; no major problems.

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unit28
10-12-2011, 05:41 PM
well I dunno...
But I'm checking out Toro's stuff.
Is that a bad idea?
Most resi's run Toro as they're based here.

irrig8r
10-12-2011, 09:59 PM
Anyone using this one?

http://irritrol.com/controllers/controllers_climatelogic.html

irrig8r
10-12-2011, 10:03 PM
This one looks slike a PITA, just because it looks like that horrible Greenkeeper/ ECx line.

http://www.toro.com/en-us/homeowner/professional-irrigation/controllers/Pages/Model.aspx?pid=XTRA-SMART-Controller

S.O.Contracting
10-12-2011, 10:23 PM
Anyone using this one?

http://irritrol.com/controllers/controllers_climatelogic.html

The climate logic works alot like the solar sync just adjusts your percentages based on weather. It plugs into the remote port on the controller so only works on irritrol/toro. Haven't really heard good or bad about them.

Cloud9Landscapes
10-13-2011, 01:13 AM
I like the solar sync. It is very accurate when you set it up and position it correctly, I've had good luck with positioning it close to the area to be watered and providing the sensor with the same light conditions. When you use it with the Pro-c conventional it mounts inside the cabinet and is fully protected from the elements.

Sprinkus
10-13-2011, 08:38 AM
Really don't want a system that changes the run times just the frequency of watering days.

Any particular reason why?

bmwsmity
10-13-2011, 10:37 AM
I have 50+ customers I installed Solar Syncs between 1-2 years ago, and I've had TONS of issues. I had one completely die in less than 2 weeks. I've had at least 10 need replacement from displays that stopped working (responding to button pushes, no display at all) along with dealing with ones that despite being in ideal locations, notched the ET adjustment to less than 40% in the dead of summer, no matter how much the region and sensitivity were adjusted. I have to say, I've never been so frustrated with a product nor had something frustrate my customers so much. Oh, and I had at least 5 that turned off the controller for rain, despite not having rain for weeks in summer. Junk.

I switched to Rain Bird's ESP SMT, and have had ZERO issues. Much better system, and about the same cost. Only downside is a slightly more complicated setup and an enormous rain sensor. But it works great and customers are happy.
Posted via Mobile Device

SoCalLandscapeMgmt
10-13-2011, 11:40 AM
I switched to Rain Bird's ESP SMT, and have had ZERO issues. Much better system, and about the same cost. Only downside is a slightly more complicated setup and an enormous rain sensor. But it works great and customers are happy.
Posted via Mobile Device

Well yeah... The Solar Sync is a toy compared to the SMT. I've got a couple of Solar Syncs out there but I have over 30 SMT's out there and the SMT is hands down the best stand alone weather based controller on the market.

Kiril
10-13-2011, 12:41 PM
I'd like to get some feedback on these. Not controller specific but an add on.
http://www.alextronix.com/usm.html

Despite the claim it is not an ET controller, it is an ET controller, and one that will be less accurate than the WMSL or any other ET based controller.

Kiril
10-13-2011, 12:54 PM
Well yeah... The Solar Sync is a toy compared to the SMT. I've got a couple of Solar Syncs out there but I have over 30 SMT's out there and the SMT is hands down the best stand alone weather based controller on the market.

Well, maybe for residential purposes in that specific price range ..... rep.

ArTurf
10-13-2011, 01:10 PM
Any particular reason why?

I guess I am from the school of thought if you are going to water (on established lawns), water deeply. I like to water at least a 1/3" to 1/2" per cycle. I tried a solar sync and it would adjust the run times down out of what I consider acceptable since it only adjust time and not frequency.

FIMCO-MEISTER
10-13-2011, 01:28 PM
Despite the claim it is not an ET controller, it is an ET controller, and one that will be less accurate than the WMSL or any other ET based controller.

Whose claim? Not mine. As opposed to a solar sync which I don't consider et either it might be a better product. George alexinian pushes this product as an effective water saving device. He is in to real watersavings not theoretical.
Posted via Mobile Device

Kiril
10-13-2011, 01:45 PM
Whose claim? Not mine.

Product claim.

As opposed to a solar sync which I don't consider et either it might be a better product.

Why wouldn't you consider it ET? What exactly do you think it is estimating?

George alexinian pushes this product as an effective water saving device. He is in to real watersavings not theoretical.

WTF does that mean Pete? You are talking out of your ass again.

It won't be more effective than any other temperature based smart controller that allows for programming per landscape coefficient method. Perhaps you need to review the Hargreaves-Samani equation again. In the event you can't/won't, it allows you to roughly estimate ET using only real time temperature and location data.

irrig8r
10-13-2011, 02:37 PM
Jeez guys, more bickering? Really?

Meanwhile, I am going to try installing one Irritrol Climate Logic tomorrow.

http://irritrol.com/videos/climatelogic_video.html

I only have two newer Total Controls that I've installed out there that will be compatible. I've approached both customers about this upgrade, and 50% have said yes.

Looks like there's more to it than the Solar Sync, plus it has the mini weather monitor/ rain shutoff. So it's really kind of in between a Solar Sync and an ESP-SMT feature wise.

List price is at 229.00, but of course the ESP-SMT only goes up to 13 zones. Each of these is 18 and I think you can get even get a TC-24 these days.

Mike Leary
10-13-2011, 02:48 PM
Each of these is 18 and I think you can get even get a TC-24 these days.

As far as I know, they make a 24. Toro also has a clone of the TC called the "Custom Command" that goes to 36, I wonder if the Irritrol Climate system would work on them as well? Let us know how that works out, those are fine clocks.

FIMCO-MEISTER
10-13-2011, 04:01 PM
Product claim.



Why wouldn't you consider it ET? What exactly do you think it is estimating?



WTF does that mean Pete? You are talking out of your ass again.

It won't be more effective than any other temperature based smart controller that allows for programming per landscape coefficient method. Perhaps you need to review the Hargreaves-Samani equation again. In the event you can't/won't, it allows you to roughly estimate ET using only real time temperature and location data.

Any device not measuring real rainfall amounts or soil moisture is a borderline ET device at best. Maybe in dry CA one can attain some modicum of ET watering with a wafer sensor but in an area such as Dallas that usually avgs 35"/ year a wafer sensor will not be nearly as accurate as a tipping rain gauge sensor. A wafer sensor measures neither the total amount or the intensity level.

Once again there is no claim that it is an ET add on to a controller. It could better be described as a smart seasonal adjust. It deducts from the max programmed run time but does not add minutes or go over the programmed run time. Only azz talking being done is by you.

SoCalLandscapeMgmt
10-13-2011, 04:16 PM
Well, maybe for residential purposes in that specific price range ..... rep.

I sure wish I knew who I am supposed to be a Rep for.... that way I could go demand my paycheck!

Mike Leary
10-13-2011, 05:20 PM
I sure wish I knew who I am supposed to be a Rep for.... that way I could go demand my paycheck!

:laugh: Interesting how many of us hype something we really like and get called a REP.

irrig8r
10-13-2011, 06:16 PM
As far as I know, they make a 24. Toro also has a clone of the TC called the "Custom Command" that goes to 36, I wonder if the Irritrol Climate system would work on them as well? Let us know how that works out, those are fine clocks.

Not only do they make a 24, but these days (as of the Irritrol ELITE September 16 newsletter) they also make them in 36 and 48 station versions with pedestal type steel boxes.

Back to the Climate Logic... SWAT tests of Irritrol controllers used with the Climate Logic, according to the same newsletter:

http://ih.constantcontact.com/fs022/1104983460111/img/69.jpg


The only drawback is they only work with the models listed that were made in the last couple of years. You'll see a phone jack connector on the back side of the panel (except on the KwikDial, for which the CL comes with an adapter cable.)

I'll post a photo in a bit of the ESP-SMT weather monitor next to the Climate Logic one. The lack of a self-tipping rain gauge makes it much smaller.

FIMCO-MEISTER
10-13-2011, 06:56 PM
In a drier climate I can see the tipping rain gauge being less important than in an area that gets more rainfall. I guess if I had to pull a number out 20"/year of rainfall would be the break point. Less than 20" go for the smaller monitor. More than 20" get the tipping rain gauge.

Kiril
10-13-2011, 08:10 PM
Any device not measuring real rainfall amounts or soil moisture is a borderline ET device at best. Maybe in dry CA one can attain some modicum of ET watering with a wafer sensor but in an area such as Dallas that usually avgs 35"/ year a wafer sensor will not be nearly as accurate as a tipping rain gauge sensor. A wafer sensor measures neither the total amount or the intensity level.

Pete ..... if you would please refrain from talking about subjects you know nothing about we could avoid all the "bickering".

All "smart" controls, be they add on or built in, are doing nothing more than providing an estimate of ET and adjusting the controller to compensate. Call it what you want, bicker all you want, but at the end of the day, they all will still be estimating ET .... or more accurately ..... PET.

Once again there is no claim that it is an ET add on to a controller. It could better be described as a smart seasonal adjust. It deducts from the max programmed run time but does not add minutes or go over the programmed run time. Only azz talking being done is by you.

Wake up Pete .... I said it is an ET add-on despite product claims to the contrary. Beyond that, there are two serious drawbacks to this add-on.

First, it requires your peak summer time irrigation requirements be programmed with extreme accuracy. Any deviation on either side of actual peak requirements will impact the performance of the calculation and your irrigation efficiency.

Second, it only allow for a 2 week interval or less, unless I missed something. What happens if you have an interval over 14 days?

Kiril
10-13-2011, 08:12 PM
:laugh: Interesting how many of us hype something we really like and get called a REP.

Chipmunks and Cheese are SICK .......... REP ........ !

Kiril
10-13-2011, 08:17 PM
In a drier climate I can see the tipping rain gauge being less important than in an area that gets more rainfall. I guess if I had to pull a number out 20"/year of rainfall would be the break point. Less than 20" go for the smaller monitor. More than 20" get the tipping rain gauge.

Where are you getting that number from? We get at least that much or more rain in a year and yet a rain gauge of any kind is practically worthless in the central valley.

Mike Leary
10-13-2011, 08:30 PM
a rain gauge of any kind is practically worthless

Unless properly maintained and tested, I would agree with sonny.

irrig8r
10-13-2011, 08:31 PM
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-T_sdT0mCMKM/Tpd9LFFG1rI/AAAAAAAAFZs/5zfdlesueho/s640/2011-10-13_17-04-22_208.jpg

ESP-SMT monitor on the left, Climate Logic sensor on the right

irrig8r
10-13-2011, 08:46 PM
Pete ..... if you would please refrain from talking about subjects you know nothing about we could avoid all the "bickering".



Frankly Kiril, you seem to be the instigator of a good share of it....

The way it reads is mostly about your attitude. You can't seem to correct anyone else's versions of facts w/o throwing in a put down at the same time. Is it an inherent meanness? I really can't tell.

I appreciate the knowledge you bring to this forum, but sometimes you DO come across as an elitist know-it-all.

Pete, OTOH, can't seem to NOT react to you and I think you get a big kick out of that and egg him on. You are a master baiter.

Mike Leary
10-13-2011, 09:04 PM
Frankly Kiril, you seem to be the instigator of a good share of it....

The way it reads is mostly about your attitude. You can't seem to correct anyone else's versions of facts w/o throwing in a put down at the same time. Is it an inherent meanness? I really can't tell.

I appreciate the knowledge you bring to this forum, but sometimes you DO come across as an elitist know-it-all.

Pete, OTOH, can't seem to NOT react to you and I think you get a big kick out of that and egg him on. You are a master baiter.

True, not that any of us have pushed the envelope and had my good buddy Michael Donovan delete the bullshit. :confused:

txirrigation
10-13-2011, 10:35 PM
True, not that any of us have pushed the envelope and had my good buddy Michael Donovan delete the bullshit. :confused:

I am tempted further to un-block.... nope. Got to admit Kiril knows his stuff, the way it is presented as an attack on intelligence gets to me though.

After the last smart controller debate I took out the Pro-C at my house and installed the RB SMT with the weather station. Grass is still green, had to do some adjustments a week later and it has been ok so far.

Overall I believe that it may be worth it, we will see as the weather changes. I refuse to install something I have not tested myself, so next spring I may be installing the SMT more.

FIMCO-MEISTER
10-13-2011, 11:54 PM
I like the smt but I've only used it once. In a situation I've been able to monitor it closely. S. CA Landscape drove me by a bunch he's installed and he does a clean sharp install with the monitor on a pole. Also demoed the hermit crab for me and that is a nifty add on. It would be worth having a couple of those on hand to deal with a site that is a pia and a long way off. Then you can remove it and use it somewhere else. Mobile central control.
Posted via Mobile Device

Kiril
10-14-2011, 07:56 AM
Frankly Kiril, you seem to be the instigator of a good share of it....

The way it reads is mostly about your attitude. You can't seem to correct anyone else's versions of facts w/o throwing in a put down at the same time. Is it an inherent meanness? I really can't tell.

I appreciate the knowledge you bring to this forum, but sometimes you DO come across as an elitist know-it-all.

Pete, OTOH, can't seem to NOT react to you and I think you get a big kick out of that and egg him on. You are a master baiter.

Gregg, did it occur to you that certain people take pleasure in pushing my buttons? Is it inherent meanness to respond negatively to that ..... you better believe it, especially what Pete and others have thrown in my direction in the past. Perhaps you have forgotten or didn't read those posts, but I feel my attitude or "meanness" is perfectly justified towards those people .... especially Pete .... you are however more than welcome to disagree with that.

BTW .... I don't "put down" everyone, just those who have shown they deserve it by treating me in the same fashion. I'm not a present the other cheek kinda guy. As I have said numerous times .... treat me with respect and I will do the same in return. Pete's response to that is I do not deserve his (or anyones) respect.

Kiril
10-14-2011, 08:16 AM
I am tempted further to un-block.... nope. Got to admit Kiril knows his stuff, the way it is presented as an attack on intelligence gets to me though.

It is your attitude towards me that prompts it in your case, and every other case. Now if you want to see someone who puts down just about everyone they post a response too see Ric.

I will add, everyone is welcome to their opinion .... however when opinion is presented as fact I will have a major problem with that. This is a public forum where people come to get accurate information about irrigation and other landscape related topics. The professionals of this site should make sure their information is correct before posting, that is their responsibility. Now if you cop an attitude when you get corrected, expect the gloves to come off. Why people think it is OK for them (and others) to treat me like shiit .... but take exception when it is returned is beyond me.

irrig8r
10-14-2011, 11:17 AM
Btw, haven't spent a lot of time on LS lately, but I don't think I recall seeing Wet Boots around...
Posted via Mobile Device

Mike Leary
10-14-2011, 07:33 PM
Btw, haven't spent a lot of time on LS lately, but I don't think I recall seeing Wet Boots around..

He was busy on the pump discussion thread. I heard he went on the cruise with Jim Lewis. Plus, he knows better (like I should) to stay away from Kiril/Peter diatribes. :dizzy:

FIMCO-MEISTER
10-14-2011, 08:35 PM
Think of it as bingo
If you manage to get from Kiril a WTF/Talking out of your ASS/subjects you know nothing about/treat me with respect/ all in one thread you've won at kiril bingo.

Kiril
10-14-2011, 08:38 PM
He was busy on the pump discussion thread. I heard he went on the cruise with Jim Lewis. Plus, he knows better (like I should) to stay away from Kiril/Peter diatribes. :dizzy:

That is a good thing ..... you never know what those "inherently mean" people might do. I might rip your head off with my bare hands and piss down your throat .... you know ..... being "inherently mean" and all. :laugh:

Kiril
10-14-2011, 08:40 PM
Think of it as bingo
If you manage to get from Kiril a WTF/Talking out of your ASS/subjects you know nothing about/treat me with respect/ all in one thread you've won at kiril bingo.

Ahhhhhh .... the ramblings of the self-righteous. Bless us savior Pete.

Sprinkus
10-14-2011, 08:49 PM
Ever check out how many people are viewing the Irrigation forum?
Right now it's around 60. And not hardly even a thank you for all of the technical information and entertainment that we provide.

BTW, I always thought of this forum as a place for professional irrigators to hang out and share our experiences, and maybe help a person or two along the way.
A civil discussion/debate will certainly keep more people interested in viewing and contributing to this forum than the opposite.
And here's the giant truck just 'cause I wanted to see it:
:gmctruck:

Wet_Boots
10-14-2011, 09:26 PM
get a Ford, you piker :)

Mike Leary
10-14-2011, 09:38 PM
get a Ford, you piker :)

Geez, Boots, no rack? Oh, I forgot, you're a poly guy.

irrig8r
10-14-2011, 09:56 PM
So, back to the topic...

I installed the Irritrol Climate Logic today.

If you install it, mount it so you can see it face on... a little to this side or that and it's much harder to see, though I read tonight in the manual that you can change the LCD display settings.

The mounting arm on the sensor is a little weak IMO for something that costs this much. I was going to mount it to a copper roof gutter, but it has a rolled edge and the arm won't clamp securely. Going to put it on a post in some ground cover behind the pool equipment instead. Easier access for battery changes, open to the sky, but not in the way or too visible.

The thing that bugs me the most are the things the manual leaves out, like explaining clearly how and when it overrides the clock programming.

Hitting the clicker on the sensor a couple of times synching it and checking it out seems to have set the controller to 2 days off (which you can do manually in the Rain Off position.)

All zones had to be assigned to Program A. Doesn't tell me if I also have to set days of the week , so I left three days on there. All zones are set for their peak run times (July) per instructions.

More as I dig deeper into it.

Tried calling them this afternoon a with a few questions, but of course they close at 4:00 PM , and I called at 4:04.

Mike Leary
10-14-2011, 10:02 PM
Got some pics, Gregg?

1idejim
10-15-2011, 10:45 AM
Ever check out how many people are viewing the Irrigation forum?
Right now it's around 60. And not hardly even a thank you for all of the technical information and entertainment that we provide.

BTW, I always thought of this forum as a place for professional irrigators to hang out and share our experiences, and maybe help a person or two along the way.
A civil discussion/debate will certainly keep more people interested in viewing and contributing to this forum than the opposite.
And here's the giant truck just 'cause I wanted to see it:
:gmctruck:

thank you, irrigation gods:laugh:

castle555
10-18-2011, 03:47 AM
Hi guys, been awhile. Wanted to weigh in on this because it needs more information for guys not so sure about the application of these SWT controllers.

I've installed both the Hunter Pro-C with Solar Sync and the Irritrol (Toro) Climate Logic.
Others I've used in the last couple of years are Toro's Intellisense and SmartDial (same thing) and the Weathermatic with SLW20.

The Intellisense can be set up to obtain daily ET data from Satellite (small subscription fee.
Also set up a few RainBird ESP SMT systems and found them to need allot of monitoring and checking to make sure the programming was correct. You can mistakenly double or
'ghost' program them in the advanced mode.
Although they do give you a nice display of current data and ET values with a history. And, you can save your contractor program settings to reset it later when the owner fouls it up, as they most certainly will do.

The really neat thing about Climate Logic is it downloads 10 years of ET and Weather data based on that area's microclimate into the Climate Logic module from a chip. You can also synchronize several Climate Logics to the same sensor within 1000 feet to run multiple controllers (Cost Savings).

I mount the sensors on a fence or other spot (yes, even a rain gutter) in 'full sun'. The key to these controllers is checking the results over a few weeks time and monitoring carefully that they are doing what you want them to do.
I have to say that 'Climate Logic' is the most follow-up free one I've used with established plants and fairly good irrigation systems. Even across different Sunset Western climate zones (9 and 14).
It also matters as to how efficient the watering system is that one is using with the selected controller. When designing and installing new irrigation systems, that eliminates inefficiency and these controllers work even better, of course!
There could be a wrench in the whole thing with gross inefficiency if the irrigation system is old or not maintained. I fortunately haven't had any irrecoverable problems, and a only a few power outtages.

As for Hunter and Solar Sync, It is a very good set up, however, do not hook up the 'blue wire' with newly installed landscape plantings until they have had a chance to root in. Then a couple of weeks later connect and signal it.

Also make sure that you have made any adjustments to the scheduling and program with the controller in the 100% watering mode any time you change settings (very important!). And, place the Solar Sync sensor in a 'Full Sun' location.
Best thing about the Pro-C is that it is probably the most homeowner or property manager friendly type that a non-expert can figure out and easily program. Just need the region number and start at default '5' for water needs, then adjust.
As for an owner adjusting the Intellisense, I put a label on it that says "Don't Even Think About it"
Contactor defaults are a great thing.

ArTurf
10-18-2011, 11:15 AM
[Best thing about the Pro-C is that it is probably the most homeowner or property manager friendly type that a non-expert can figure out and easily program. Just need the region number and start at default '5' for water needs, then adjust.
As for an owner adjusting the Intellisense, I put a label on it that says "Don't Even Think About it"
Contactor defaults are a great thing.[/QUOTE]


One reason I chose the Pro-C is I thought it would be easy for the homeowner to program and change settings. No problem in some cases but over half cannot get it. Not referring to the solar sync but the basic settings. Not blaming the design of the Pro C, just want to hit some of my customers over the head to knock some sense into them at times.

How does everyone teach thier customers to operate the controller? Guess I might need to start another post on this subject.

Wet_Boots
10-18-2011, 11:39 AM
I emphasize "safe operations" that leave the original program intact. Manual cycles, mostly. Keep the Hunters' dial away from the areas where the program can be changed.

ArTurf
10-18-2011, 12:08 PM
I emphasize "safe operations" that leave the original program intact. Manual cycles, mostly. Keep the Hunters' dial away from the areas where the program can be changed.

The main thing I need tht customers to adjust is the frequency of watering or "Set Days to Water". I generally do not need them to adjust start times or run times, just frequency. I give them them a carfully written out set of instructions which in a nutshell states water more frequently when it is hotter and dryer and less when the opposite is the case. Some seem to think there is one magical setting for the whole season. They can't seem to realize the difference in 80 degree vs 105 degree conditions. Go figure.

Mike Leary
10-18-2011, 12:40 PM
How does everyone teach thier customers to operate the controller?

I never did, simply offered a service contract that included seasonal adjustments and performance inspection. Most jumped at the offer, especially their wives. :clapping:

ArTurf
10-18-2011, 01:02 PM
I never did, simply offered a service contract that included seasonal adjustments and performance inspection. Most jumped at the offer, especially their wives. :clapping:

Great idea. Although not sure that would work in my case. Will keep it mind though and perhaps modify.

Why are the wives so happy to see you on a regular basis?:nono:

Wet_Boots
10-18-2011, 02:00 PM
the "performance inspection" of course

ArTurf
10-18-2011, 02:26 PM
I usually stick to business on this forum but I can't resist this one.

I guess irrigation guys are good at getting stuff wet.

Mike Leary
10-18-2011, 02:38 PM
the "performance inspection" of course

:laugh::laugh: I don't know about you guys, but the majority of my clients were women, who's hubbies I never dealt with, except that they signed the checks. Some I never met, but most "guys" like to screw with the clock after coming home and killing a couple of drinks. The next day, or so, wife would call and I'd come over and zero and re-program the clock. More than a few had their own checking account and paid me so "the big guy" would never know. Lockable enclosures helped, but getting into Hardie "Touch Command" clocks pretty much put a end to hubby and his hobby.

irrig8r
10-19-2011, 03:20 PM
Hi guys, been awhile. Wanted to weigh in on this because it needs more information for guys not so sure about the application of these SWT controllers.

I've installed both the Hunter Pro-C with Solar Sync and the Irritrol (Toro) Climate Logic.
Others I've used in the last couple of years are Toro's Intellisense and SmartDial (same thing) and the Weathermatic with SLW20.

The Intellisense can be set up to obtain daily ET data from Satellite (small subscription fee.
Also set up a few RainBird ESP SMT systems and found them to need allot of monitoring and checking to make sure the programming was correct. You can mistakenly double or
'ghost' program them in the advanced mode.
Although they do give you a nice display of current data and ET values with a history. And, you can save your contractor program settings to reset it later when the owner fouls it up, as they most certainly will do.

The really neat thing about Climate Logic is it downloads 10 years of ET and Weather data based on that area's microclimate into the Climate Logic module from a chip. You can also synchronize several Climate Logics to the same sensor within 1000 feet to run multiple controllers (Cost Savings).

I mount the sensors on a fence or other spot (yes, even a rain gutter) in 'full sun'. The key to these controllers is checking the results over a few weeks time and monitoring carefully that they are doing what you want them to do.
I have to say that 'Climate Logic' is the most follow-up free one I've used with established plants and fairly good irrigation systems. Even across different Sunset Western climate zones (9 and 14).
It also matters as to how efficient the watering system is that one is using with the selected controller. When designing and installing new irrigation systems, that eliminates inefficiency and these controllers work even better, of course!
There could be a wrench in the whole thing with gross inefficiency if the irrigation system is old or not maintained. I fortunately haven't had any irrecoverable problems, and a only a few power outtages.




1) How will a power outage effect the Climate Logic? Does it have an NV memory?


2) Instructions told me to assign all zones to program A, though scrolling through the CL menu it wants to know if I want it to cover Pgm. A, A+B, or A+B+C... so how does that work?


Typically I assign lawns to A, shrubs and groundcover to B, and either annual beds or a drip system or whatever else is going on to C.

A usually gets a start time between 2AM and 6AM, but B or C could start as early as 9PM, and run fewer days per week. And newly planted annuals might get a short run mornings and afternoons, depending on the time of year.

Since Climate Logic doesn't ask me to put in all the parameters like the ESP-SMT does, then how does it know which zones need more water besides the peak watering time I program in for say July?

irrig8r
10-19-2011, 03:36 PM
Ahhh... pg. 13 of the manual... I CAN assign all three programs if I want to. It defaults to A, but I can add in the others I guess that means if I want Pgm. C to run independent of the CL override I can do that too.

http://irritrol.com/controller_manuals/pdfs/manual_climatelogic.pdf

What I don't get is the "dry-out days". The default is only 0.5 days. I changed it 2.0.

irrig8r
10-20-2011, 03:03 PM
So, digging deeper into the manual for the Climate Logic, I can't seem to find a way to distinguish between water needs of different kinds of plants, or fine tune different zones. No factoring in of a crop coefficient, sun exposure (though the sensor gets mounted in full sun), slope, soil type, etc.

I have no idea whether programming different start times and water days in Pgm B or C in the Total Control will be completely overidden by this device or not. I have no way of knowing which days it will water... there is a menu for Water Restriction setup, which is supposed to allow limiting to "a specific daily time period", but I think it's universal, across all zones in whichever programs I want to include.

So it seems like the only control I have is with setting up peak run times, and I can't just water (for instance) outlying established shrubs or semi-naturalized ground cover every two weeks....

UNLESS... can I still run those independent of the Climate Logic if I assign them to Pgm B and include only Pgm A in the CL coverage?

:dizzy:



Does Hunter's Solar Sync operate the same way?


Sure wish Irritrol Tech Support was easier to get hold of by phone.

irrig8r
10-20-2011, 04:55 PM
OK, so it feels like I'm talking to myself here, but here's an update:

Byron from Irritrol/ Toro returned my call and was very helpful.

The way this device works is that:
1.) The water days and start times are whatever I set them up to be.

2.) The actual run times are a percentage, based on historical ET plus sensor data, of the peak that I set up.

3.) I can still have my evening start times in B and morning starts in A, or however I want to do it, and assign whichever stations make sense to whichever program I want.

4.) The water restrictions part is for when I want it NOT to water. This device doesn't use a "water window".

5.) There is a water adjust feature, but it's global across all zones. Any tweaking should really be done with the peak run times or water days. The soil type, plant type, slope, etc. are all up to me to figure out when setting those peak run times.

6.) I can exclude either Pgm. B, or Pgms. B + C from the Climate Logic if I wish and they will run as programmed. (For instance, drip to containers under an overhang, new plantings, etc.)

If anyone has any other insights, please share.

castle555
10-22-2011, 02:46 AM
Sorry about the response time here, but you were doing so well on your own.
I believe the CL has non-volatile memory.
When you uploaded the data from the chip they give you it programs in 10 years of ET data for the micro-climate for the area where your customer's property is located. I think in addition to zip code, it also allows long. and lat. input which is even more accurate.
The sensors begin to collect the daily ET data from solar and temps.
And, it has wind average speeds and daily temps in the data you uploaded, so when it's hot and windy the old 'farmers almanac' of data you put in there will work. It is a little unnerving i admit to set this thing up and then go 'presto' it waters!
My understanding of the ABC program thing is it still runs consecutively as to how you program it, so I think you've got a handle on that.

SaveH20
01-13-2014, 02:39 PM
For those that are looking for an add-on device to change watering day frequencies, Toro has a wireless soil moisture sensor named the Precision Soil Sensor http://tinyurl.com/lz78s8q. The sensor plugs into your turf, calibrates for the first 24 hours, set the desired moisture level in the receiver that hooks up to most every manufacturer's controller, and then the sensor interrupts the common wire when the moisture level is above the set threshold.

:cool2:

greenmonster304
01-13-2014, 05:20 PM
For those that are looking for an add-on device to change watering day frequencies, Toro has a wireless soil moisture sensor named the Precision Soil Sensor http://tinyurl.com/lz78s8q. The sensor plugs into your turf, calibrates for the first 24 hours, set the desired moisture level in the receiver that hooks up to most every manufacturer's controller, and then the sensor interrupts the common wire when the moisture level is above the set threshold.

:cool2:

I smell a rep.
Posted via Mobile Device

1idejim
01-13-2014, 07:01 PM
I smell a rep.
Posted via Mobile Device

Long Island boy have good nose.
Posted via Mobile Device

Lite Headed
01-13-2014, 07:34 PM
Dateline Riverside, Cali. :laugh: