View Full Version : Spoken Like the Truth?

10-27-2011, 10:36 AM
I'm not trying to bust anyone in particular with this post, as I know everyone has a opinion about everything, myself included, but if you will notice, many, many posts have opinions expressed as fact, with seldom any data to back that up.

One example is the mowing of overgrown properties with a Z. Any thread dealing with that will have a few saying how hard it is on your mower, etc, etc. Okay, but does anyone have anything to back that up? Is it really that hard on your mower, if you use your head? Anyone ever blown a hydro mowing 18 inch grass? Any broken belts, overheated or blown engines? Burned out PTO clutch? In other words, do you THINK it is hard on a mower, or has past experience proven that to you?

It is the same as issues like oil change intervals, filter use, and type or viscosity of oil. I've seen probably a dozen threads about which type oil to use, and every time you see lots of opinons expressed, mine as well, but, in the case of myself at least, I'm basing most of those opinions on what I've read, rather than actual experience. For those that blast dino oil, have you run dino and synthetic oils in identical engines and had the dino lubricated engine fail sooner? Have you changed oil at 100 hrs on one engine, 50 hrs on another identical engine, and seen a major difference in the engine life? Do your engines actually last longer with Wix filters than Fram?

I am just wondering how often opinions are stated as fact, when, in fact, the poster doesn't have a clue?

10-27-2011, 10:51 AM
Does it take a rocket science degree and 20 years experience to feel an engine rpm lower as it moves through a weeks average growth into extra tall grass?

Problem with extra stress, is some are willing to say well I'll do it just once and will get away with it. The problem is they find themselves in a bind and say once more won't hurt. The point it eventually does. But the to late point never gets detected until the line has been crossed.

This is why it is better to use your old back up mower. Or rent the required machine and charge the customer appropriately.

With the price of equipment why treat it in a manner that will shorten it's life?

Patriot Services
10-27-2011, 11:00 AM
Let's not confuse opinion with comment. You can have an opinion without direct experience or knowledge. Is that really helpful to someone else? Probably not. You can just be following the sheeple as well. I put more stock in someones direct experience with a product or situation. Does is apply 100% to me or anyone else? Not likely, buts that's why we supposedly have the power to reason. I'm amazed at how many people think Wikipedia is a fully verified informational source.
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SouthSide Cutter
10-27-2011, 02:23 PM
Sometimes you can tell who knows what he is talking about and who doesnt. Never had a mtr fail with a Fram filter, been using them over 40 years. But some blast them. Never had a mtr fail with Penn 10W30 either but some blast it. Have seen the difference between dino and syn oil on my race mtrs. So I know there is a difference. What gets me the most and alot on here say this. What ever the manual says is gospel. So they do what ever the manual says, filters, oil, greasing etc. My own personal opinion they dont have much experience. The older guys I worked with at the Power Plants didnt have a degree but had tons of experience you could learn alot from them. But the newer College guys would not ask them or listen to them on anything. They would actually say where did you get your degree. After you read some stuff some post you can figure it out.

10-27-2011, 03:41 PM
If the manufacturer says to you 900 weight pink oil with blue stripes to maintain my warrantly that is what I am using, at least for the time of the warranty. I will do my part to do what the manufacturer says needs to be done - just like the guard no guard decussion on weed whackers, if the manufacturer says the warranty if void with out, mine is on. I don't have money to burn or throw away to save a nickle today which will cost my a dollar tomorrow and how many seconds to you save by not walking around to the other side of the bush when you are weed whacking compared to the cost of a new one.

10-27-2011, 03:48 PM
@moturkey - good post - there seems to be a lot of conversation about new guys and low balling and how stupid the other guy is or isn't - the idea of real information coming from experience or from scientific research is important as long as we know from whence it came. Which leads me to think about figuring cost - if we have a realy discussion on how people really figure out their overhead and how and why it is important - then and only then will the low baller understand the slippery road he/she is on.

10-27-2011, 04:21 PM
Just a thought as this thread goes forward. When it comes to the experience you are talking about, it is important to mention if you are a solo or have employees. Care,maintenance, lifetime, reliability, etc. of equipment being run by employees is in a world of its own compared to solo.

10-27-2011, 04:29 PM
@keystone, not only is the experience different, but I think the mindset is also. It would be great to see more meaningful discussions.

Richard Martin
10-27-2011, 04:40 PM
All I can say is to try to be truthful and factual. If you're wrong admit you're wrong and move on. I've had to do that a bunch of times myself.

The reason I'm here is to network with my peers, get ideas and inspiration, and to help others if I can.

BTW, I have cut a bunch of oil filters open to see what's actually in them. I'll pass on the Fram thank you.

10-27-2011, 04:43 PM
That's the Internet for ya..they are known as "arm chair experts". No real experience, just someone behind a computer pretending to be someone they are not. Another term I learned in the corporate world was "water cooler talk". Just because your buddy says so or you over heard someone doesn't make it true.

10-27-2011, 05:26 PM
This forum is full of of Hot air, just like any other forum out there. One guy boasting about one mower or its performance is just an opinion until fair data is taken. Very, very few can back anything on here because the lack of hard evidence or accurate data. This doesnt bother me though. The men here are passionate about their equipment and many are very experienced and offer an honest answer. However, there are many that make statements that are questionable and really shouldnt....Im sure I have been guilty of a few.

It just goes to show that an individual must do their own homework and research whatever information they are needing. Sure, the Net is a fabulous tool in finding out info on anything, but you still have to determine the source, their habits AND their actual knowledge on the subject while at the same time weeding out the BS.

There are too many "my way or the highway" opinions out there, just like there has always been. Im afraid a variable "Utopia" of accurate info will never exist no matter who you are listening to or dealing with.

10-27-2011, 11:05 PM
i think something that adds to the confusion is everyone's experiences are different...one person can buy a mower and it lasts 2000hrs and another person could've bought the same kind of mower and it only lasted 500hrs....so in both of their minds they are right and actually they are both right lol...just different experiences...so experience can in fact be wrong sometimes...the one guy could say that's a bad mower but you could go buy one and it last 2000hrs like the other guys and for you it would be a good mower.....so really you can't listen to anyone else's experience lol...just go by your own...that's really the best answer...you can try to get a general consensus of other people's experiences and go from there..."on your own"....i dunno how many times i've read reviews of stuff on the internet that said this product sucks or that product sucks but when i used it myself it was a great product and i never had any problems...i think alot of it comes down to how people treat things....some people are just more careful and treat things with a little more care than others...some treat stuff like crap and expect it to last forever lol...and everyone's idea of being careful is different from one person to the next lol.....all comes down to this...everyone is different...every single person in the world...so only you can decide what's right for you.

10-28-2011, 05:39 AM
Good discussion; Lot of well put points and opinions. I see it as "To each there own" You like Chevy I like Ford. It don't matter. I have always advocated I am not a brand loyalist. But I would not take a VW to the race track a brag about how good and fast my car is. We are talking commercial equipment, it is suppose to work hard and do it every day all day. Will it last longer if I baby it some maybe, maybe not.

All of us LOC work hard to get good equipment that we can afford. Becoming attached to what makes you money is natural. If I tear up my equipment it me that has to deal with it. I (as other) are responsible for our actions. Not the $%#@%$ manufacture or what some salesmen said to me. Its is ME, But I am making money when I abuse my equipment. Many of my local competition feel a lot like some hare. They would not tough some of the property I mow. OK don't complain about how bad the business is and how much your profits have gone down.

If everyone like the same thing, everyone would have married my wife.

10-28-2011, 11:03 AM
We began using this site as an informational tool. It should be for sharing information and making our industry better educated and more unified as an industry. However I have found there is an awful lot of im sure better than you. And name calling going on in quite a few threads. Share your knowledge and experiences don't s@#t on people. Good luck to all.
ps good thread.
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10-28-2011, 12:48 PM
well said dependable, I agree. I don't post here as much as I use to for that very reason.

10-28-2011, 05:51 PM
Hey dependable - that is why I am here, to learn and share!!!

10-28-2011, 06:29 PM
Well, I found this site because I was looking for info. Like all forums, I had to separate the wheat from the chaff but in the end I believe I was pretty informed. The truth bears out every time I use the machine I ended up buying (so far, knock on my skull).

10-28-2011, 06:44 PM
Well, with anything you get "experts". Know-it-alls are everywhere with very few real experts. Its funny how many people on here are "experts" at mowing grass. A homeowner can mow grass, some do a better job than what they get from a "pro". Some are "experts" at repair of the equipment we all use in this trade but I rarely read a single post from a seasoned tech who knows anything. Even in shop you get a lot of "know-it-alls". Experience is the only thing that can even deem anyone to become and expert, and few people have any real experience with anything, especially on this site.

10-28-2011, 07:02 PM
@StihlMechanic I cannot remember who said it, or more correctly how many said it, but the puffers are obvious - it seems to me for the short time I have been here - maybe 6 months, that a couple of guys have really gone beyond the listening and have sent me both on line and off line heart felt critisim and ideas, and I am grateful. We all have to remember and especially me that we need to qualify I responses - cause after all we all ain't hanging on the same corner. Quailifying your critizim or idea helps everyone - smile - and - hit the grass kid

Big Bad Bob
10-28-2011, 07:05 PM
You can believe everything I say. I'm always right..............................well.....................Unless I'm wrong.

10-28-2011, 07:09 PM
I have always been taught that when you are "new" at something (at a place of work in particular), you keep your mouth shut! You have to earn respect from your peers, just because you have been in the industry (whatever one it may be) for several months, doesn't mean that you are some gift to that industry.

To all the new guys in the industry...you are not an expert. Just because you have a month's worth of seat time on a machine doesn't mean that you just became an expert on all commercial equipment. If you have experience with a particular machine, then feel free to share if it is relavent to the topic being discussed.

There are guys on here that I just can't stand since they seem think they know everything about anything. What people need to realize is that no one knows everything, we all continue to learn. I will come right out and admit that I don't know everything and I am always learning something new.

There are many knowledgable people on this site and have helped me greatly when I needed it.

Richard Martin
10-28-2011, 09:16 PM
There are many knowledgable people on this site and have helped me greatly when I needed it.

Speaking of that...

I think I finally figured out why you were having problems with your Dixie collection. It's a little late for that now but...:cry:

10-28-2011, 09:53 PM
I definitely consider myself a newbie, just finished my first full season of being a LCO. I hope I've never come off as a know it all, but at times have tried to share things with others that I had learned, with some of the even newer guys than me. I can truthfully say that I've learned a ton by reading this forum, even about life issue's. I've at times read threads and said DAMN I did that, I guess I was wrong for handling it that way. I can say that this forum has saved me a LOT of headaches, one of the biggest, the importance of saying NO! and not taking on just any and every job that came my way, as tempting as it is in the beginning. To everybody here that DOES SHARE, THANK YOU!

10-28-2011, 11:10 PM
Speaking of that...

I think I finally figured out why you were having problems with your Dixie collection. It's a little late for that now but...:cry:

Yea, I guess a year and a half is a little late to fix the problem now.

Though you have sparked my curiosity about it...shoot me a PM and let me know when you get a chance.