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Landscape Poet
12-08-2011, 10:39 AM
So here is the thing. My family is in town for a little visit. Of course we are hitting up the usual suspect like Disney. As I was buying my Niece all the Disney crap that she wanted, I started noticing over and over how much of these products are made over seas.

With FL economy sucking ass the way it does right now. Could Disney not make a huge difference if they opened up shop and insisted all these dolls be made in FL - in the Orlando Market - Back in Walt's hometown of marceline missouri? At least somewhere in the STATES?

The profit margins would still be there in my opinion do to the high cost of these dolls, key chains etc anyway....but even if they were $2 higher each item, for God's sake if your kid is kicking and screaming that they want it, $2 is not going to stop you from buying a item you already know is over priced right! I mean you are already paying $9 a beer at Disney, is paying $12.99 for the doll instead of $10.99 going to add up to that much on your $3K vacation to Orlando?

Would this not be the appropriate thing for Disney to do in order to provide good corporate citizenship? Would this not be a great opportunity for them to run a made in FL, made in America campaign? Lord knows that if we actually produced some kind of good here in FL instead of just being serviced based, it would not be a bad thing, and what is a better way than supplying a local theme park with the billions they sell in merchandise. I would venture to say of course there would be other things Disney could take pride in with this venture....no child labor issue, think of the ecological savings by not transporting all that merchandise in plane and boats from overseas!

Last but not least - if you agree - how would you - how could you approach Disney with these ideas?

Your Thoughts

fl-landscapes
12-08-2011, 10:57 AM
Mike I am sure they would love to be able to manufacture things made in the USA. Problem is our gov has become so huge and consumes so much money it needs to tax and cripple corporations with fees and permits etc. To feed it's appetite Which makes it almost impossible to make products here and be competitive or profitable. Add in union burdens and the EPA and forget about it. Oh and good luck finding people willing to work manufacturing jobs for small pay checks, they would rather let others pay their way then take a job and work their way up the ladder. They do market research all the time and if they thought they could get another two bucks a doll they would raise the price and keep manufacturing over seas. They know exactly what the sweet spot is when it comes to maximizing sales and pricing merchandise.
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yamadooski
12-08-2011, 04:14 PM
Fl Scapes said it perfectly.
My family works for Government Motors and he used to make $30 per hour at the Janesville, Wi. location.
That plant closed and he was transferred to another now making only 18 per hour.
Im sure we can make goods here for 18 per hour! But its the communist government we have that jacks up the price.
The business tax in China is way cheaper.
Oh and the the liberals that want a communist country as China maybe you should talk to my inlaws that have been around the world a dozen times or more and they can tell you all you want to know about socialism and comunism.

phasthound
12-08-2011, 04:57 PM
Fl Scapes said it perfectly.
My family works for Government Motors and he used to make $30 per hour at the Janesville, Wi. location.
That plant closed and he was transferred to another now making only 18 per hour.
Im sure we can make goods here for 18 per hour! But its the communist government we have that jacks up the price.
The business tax in China is way cheaper.
Oh and the the liberals that want a communist country as China maybe you should talk to my inlaws that have been around the world a dozen times or more and they can tell you all you want to know about socialism and comunism.

My in-laws thank God that they were able to get out of China and are grateful for the opportunities they have here in the US.

fl-landscapes
12-08-2011, 05:08 PM
My in-laws thank God that they were able to get out of China and are grateful for the opportunities they have here in the US.

I'm am thankful every day for being born in this great country. Just not sure if we are becoming greater or less great. The future at this point is in question especially the near future. We have great opportunity but will our children have the same?
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Patriot Services
12-08-2011, 05:22 PM
I just got nauseous. Legislation is in the works to allow mega casinos. Just what we don't need. Now don't give me the construction and casino jobs will give way to tourism dollars crap. Nevada is right with us in foreclosure and unemployment.
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Ric
12-08-2011, 05:29 PM
Fl Scapes said it perfectly.
My family works for Government Motors and he used to make $30 per hour at the Janesville, Wi. location.
That plant closed and he was transferred to another now making only 18 per hour.
Im sure we can make goods here for 18 per hour! But its the communist government we have that jacks up the price.
The business tax in China is way cheaper.
Oh and the the liberals that want a communist country as China maybe you should talk to my inlaws that have been around the world a dozen times or more and they can tell you all you want to know about socialism and comunism.

yamadooski

Sorry but IMHO $ 18.00 an hour is still way over payment for unskilled labor. With a little effort you can train Monkeys to do the same work. The Union are just as guilty for our lack of industry and globalization. Ford Motors oOut sourced a robotic assembly plant to Brazil. Not because of Cheap Labor, but lack of objection to automated assembly. BTW Brazil is a first world country with a standard of living very similar to the USA.

BTW go to pesticide Forum and read the Post about working under someone else Pesticide License. The OP wasn't interested in actually working toward getting his own license legally, But rather how he could beat the system with a Illegal Rent A License. I am sorry but that seems to be attitude of people today, They want everything handed to them and don't want to work for anything.


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unkownfl
12-08-2011, 07:28 PM
yamadooski

Sorry but IMHO $ 18.00 an hour is still way over payment for unskilled labor. With a little effort you can train Monkeys to do the same work. The Union are just as guilty for our lack of industry and globalization. Ford Motors oOut sourced a robotic assembly plant to Brazil. Not because of Cheap Labor, but lack of objection to automated assembly. BTW Brazil is a first world country with a standard of living very similar to the USA.

BTW go to pesticide Forum and read the Post about working under someone else Pesticide License. The OP wasn't interested in actually working toward getting his own license legally, But rather how he could beat the system with a Illegal Rent A License. I am sorry but that seems to be attitude of people today, They want everything handed to them and don't want to work for anything.


..

I really don't see why someone has to work for someone else in order to get that license. If you have a degree and pass a test then the license should be given. Don't you still have to work for someone for at least a year Ric? Have you been to Brazil? I don't see how that is the closest standard of living compared to the US or we have came down a few notches without me noticing I guess...

gregory
12-08-2011, 08:55 PM
i agree with both ric and fl. and i will add this our own fault between our goverment and the walmart type we have become we dont want something that is going to last we want cheap...

Johnagain
12-08-2011, 10:35 PM
I really don't see why someone has to work for someone else in order to get that license. If you have a degree and pass a test then the license should be given. Don't you still have to work for someone for at least a year Ric? Have you been to Brazil? I don't see how that is the closest standard of living compared to the US or we have came down a few notches without me noticing I guess...

I know I'm not Ric but I have been to Brazil a number of times. The standard of living is very high in most parts of Brazil, but the parts we are often shown on tv are they very poor parts. The best thing that Brazil does is tax the crap out of imports. When we were shipping equipment to them the import tariffs would be almost 100% of purchase price. This has made Brazil one of the very few countries that is self sufficient. Other than America, Brazil would be the only other country I would ever think about living in.

Ric
12-08-2011, 10:36 PM
I really don't see why someone has to work for someone else in order to get that license. If you have a degree and pass a test then the license should be given. Don't you still have to work for someone for at least a year Ric? Have you been to Brazil? I don't see how that is the closest standard of living compared to the US or we have came down a few notches without me noticing I guess...

Unknown

Are you one of those who wants everything handed to you on a Silver Platter. Pest Control is a skilled trade the same as a Plumber of Electrician. Skilled Trades have Apprenticeships.

Yes with a degree you still have to work with a CPO for a year. In my case I had more than 3 years before I had the degree. I qualified by time and not education, It was easier paper work. But I passed the test easy because I have the education. I would also like to think I do better work because of that same education.

unkownfl
12-09-2011, 03:08 PM
Unknown

Are you one of those who wants everything handed to you on a Silver Platter. Pest Control is a skilled trade the same as a Plumber of Electrician. Skilled Trades have Apprenticeships.

Yes with a degree you still have to work with a CPO for a year. In my case I had more than 3 years before I had the degree. I qualified by time and not education, It was easier paper work. But I passed the test easy because I have the education. I would also like to think I do better work because of that same education.

I did 8000 hours of grunt work before I became a lineman. I don't expect anything to be given out. I just don't think it's right to be forced to work for anyone if you can pass the same qualifications in the end. Make the test harder or whatever. I really have no intentions to do any treatment besides round-up on beds etc. which I already hold a limited license. It should be either or in my opinion. You could still do a fellowship while going to school or something equivalent. You can become just about any contractor in FL without having to work under someone for x amount of year so being you have a degree and pass w/e test.

Ric
12-09-2011, 03:19 PM
I did 8000 hours of grunt work before I became a lineman. I don't expect anything to be given out. I just don't think it's right to be forced to work for anyone if you can pass the same qualifications in the end. Make the test harder or whatever. I really have no intentions to do any treatment besides round-up on beds etc. which I already hold a limited license. It should be either or in my opinion. You could still do a fellowship while going to school or something equivalent. You can become just about any contractor in FL without having to work under someone for x amount of year so being you have a degree and pass w/e test.

Unknown

It Really Doesn't matter what you think. The law is the Law and I didn't make that law or can I change it. I just live with in the law.

Patriot Services
12-09-2011, 04:01 PM
I did 8000 hours of grunt work before I became a lineman. I don't expect anything to be given out. I just don't think it's right to be forced to work for anyone if you can pass the same qualifications in the end. Make the test harder or whatever. I really have no intentions to do any treatment besides round-up on beds etc. which I already hold a limited license. It should be either or in my opinion. You could still do a fellowship while going to school or something equivalent. You can become just about any contractor in FL without having to work under someone for x amount of year so being you have a degree and pass w/e test.

I think your wrong on this. The DBPR website lists every contractor field requiring a license and even if the state doesn't require it many counties do. Hillsborough requires a 1000 hours to sit for the irrigation license. They run sting ops here all the time for unlicensed contractors.
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unkownfl
12-09-2011, 04:10 PM
You can be a GC CC EC etc with just college with a Bachelors related to the construction industry or engineering. You may have to hold a License in Engineering for x amount of years such as to obtain an Electrical Engineering license which is pretty hard.

Landscape Poet
12-10-2011, 11:00 PM
Mike I am sure they would love to be able to manufacture things made in the USA. Problem is our gov has become so huge and consumes so much money it needs to tax and cripple corporations with fees and permits etc. To feed it's appetite Which makes it almost impossible to make products here and be competitive or profitable. Add in union burdens and the EPA and forget about it. Oh and good luck finding people willing to work manufacturing jobs for small pay checks, they would rather let others pay their way then take a job and work their way up the ladder. They do market research all the time and if they thought they could get another two bucks a doll they would raise the price and keep manufacturing over seas. They know exactly what the sweet spot is when it comes to maximizing sales and pricing merchandise.
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Couple things on this. Has the public sector wages really gone up that much? Most are simply given a % raise each year which is above inflation from my understanding. I see opening for public jobs all the time and the salary does not seem to be that out of line. Hell when you consider inflation most people are most likely losing money most years with there increase if they even get one in the private sector, i know several people over the last two years which the companies froze all payroll increases or at least minamized them. Is it that the government is that bad - or is it that private companies are just not as willing to spend the money?

And in terms of them and the EPA - so they have to obey laws that are made to protect us. Some are extreme I am sure...but there purpose is to protect us. That is not a bad thing and when we are talking about being good corporate citizens - should they not want to have the goods produced in a manner which they know they are not in anyway effecting the environment.

In terms of working for a low wage in a manufacturing environment - we get them to work at the theme parks in the blistering FL son for it, the work on the grounds crews in local LCO organizations that take care of these resorts for less than min wage if you consider they are most likely missing EOW during the winter months if they are not laid off completely. In terms of Union activity it is a right to work state...so if they do not want to participate they do not have too as employees, so the only way they should want to vote a union in is if they feel they are being abused and the union gets the vote numbers.

In terms of Gov't regulation - again we are talking about being a good corporate citizen - so they should want to be on track ...and how much worse can it be that worry about a 60 minutes special on how the happiest place on earth is using child sweat shops to create good for them? Hell a lot of towns are giving away crazy incentives for factories to come in and create jobs and I am sure there are several around here in FL and would offer up crazy incentives to get Disney into town.

Don't know for sure but several hundred jobs directly for the manufacturing part and all the jobs that could come in a indirect fashion would be great.

Landscape Poet
12-10-2011, 11:03 PM
I just got nauseous. Legislation is in the works to allow mega casinos. Just what we don't need. Now don't give me the construction and casino jobs will give way to tourism dollars crap. Nevada is right with us in foreclosure and unemployment.
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I was just telling one of my relatives about this tonight on the way home. Lots of push starting about allowing legalized gambling here in the Orlando market. I guess it would be the ultimate for some folks, mom and kids go to the parks, gma and gpa go to the casinos and we would be getting them on every angle :rolleyes:

jvanvliet
12-11-2011, 07:25 AM
I shudder to think of the social impact Las Vegas type casinos will have on the Orlando area, if that's where they will be located.

Having been to Las Vegas (for an educational seminar and once with my wife for fun) I can tell you that the atmosphere outside of the gaming houses is debased. We were accosted on the streets by a continual cadre of pimps handing out lurid and graphic invitations for "escort services", my wife on my arm not withstanding (other couples with children in tow were similarly propositioned). This will create the antithesis of the environment Disney and Orlando is trying to foster.

The abject poverty and blight on the periphery of the "Strip" and "Glitter Gultch" was stunning. When a Las Vegas policeman found us wondering outside of the "green zone" he warned us that we were in grave danger of being robbed, assaulted or even killed for the meager possessions we had with us.

Prostitution goes arm in arm with that particular atmosphere as does drugs, loan sharking, alcoholism, etc. this activity leads to burglary, assault and battery and even worse; as if we don't have enough of a problem with these vices and crimes in Florida already.

Gaming in Florida is a desperate act by the legislature to produce revenue for the State. They tend to ignore the economic burden placed on the communities that host the casinos as well as the State itself since they must bear the burden of the expense of law enforcement, economic loss to citizens and the cost of incarceration.

Florida should review the lessons learned form the Atlantic City, Biloxi, etc. experiments and carefully consider not falling subject to the laws of unintended consequences.

Take the time to read through the following statistical report on Gaming community related crimes vs. Non-Gaming.

http://www.maine.com/editions/2006-05-15/images/20060531000107C.pdf

fl-landscapes
12-11-2011, 08:14 AM
Sounds like you agree with big government. Manufacturers don't send jobs over seas for fun, it's certainly not a good pr move. It cost too much to manufacture products here. Wages are a small part but regulation is out of control. And yes gov wages have escalated far faster than private sector jobs and that is an indisputable fact. I just read an article about how many beat cops in ny made over 200k and a couple almost 300k. How about the fl superintendent who got the million dollar buy out and is now collecting unemployment? Bottom line is our gov is extremely wasteful and they need to fund it somehow.


Couple things on this. Has the public sector wages really gone up that much? Most are simply given a % raise each year which is above inflation from my understanding. I see opening for public jobs all the time and the salary does not seem to be that out of line. Hell when you consider inflation most people are most likely losing money most years with there increase if they even get one in the private sector, i know several people over the last two years which the companies froze all payroll increases or at least minamized them. Is it that the government is that bad - or is it that private companies are just not as willing to spend the money?

And in terms of them and the EPA - so they have to obey laws that are made to protect us. Some are extreme I am sure...but there purpose is to protect us. That is not a bad thing and when we are talking about being good corporate citizens - should they not want to have the goods produced in a manner which they know they are not in anyway effecting the environment.

In terms of working for a low wage in a manufacturing environment - we get them to work at the theme parks in the blistering FL son for it, the work on the grounds crews in local LCO organizations that take care of these resorts for less than min wage if you consider they are most likely missing EOW during the winter months if they are not laid off completely. In terms of Union activity it is a right to work state...so if they do not want to participate they do not have too as employees, so the only way they should want to vote a union in is if they feel they are being abused and the union gets the vote numbers.

In terms of Gov't regulation - again we are talking about being a good corporate citizen - so they should want to be on track ...and how much worse can it be that worry about a 60 minutes special on how the happiest place on earth is using child sweat shops to create good for them? Hell a lot of towns are giving away crazy incentives for factories to come in and create jobs and I am sure there are several around here in FL and would offer up crazy incentives to get Disney into town.

Don't know for sure but several hundred jobs directly for the manufacturing part and all the jobs that could come in a indirect fashion would be great.
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fl-landscapes
12-11-2011, 08:18 AM
EPA isn't there to protect us mike it is just another tool to make laws geared towards social engineering.
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jvanvliet
12-11-2011, 08:59 AM
Initially in the Untited States, laws were established to protect people from the tyrany of their fellow man, however, once in place there is no mechanism that protects people from the tyrany of the law and government.

fl-landscapes
12-11-2011, 12:44 PM
Mike, let me play devils advocate. You have talked and outlined many times how you operate the sod part of your business. You sub it out and don't do any physical work but are able to get such a good deal from the installer that you can just sell the job, mark it up and collect a check. How many foreigners work for that company you sub too laying sod or in the sod fields? We all know all these sod companies are using foreigners if not outright illegals. Especially one that does cheap work. Do you think you should take your own advice, hire some American workers and start doing sod installs at a higher price? I mean, I am sure just like you would be happy to pay more for Disney dolls made in fl I am sure people would be happy to pay more for sod if it was being laid by non illegals. Probably not and like Disney I am sure you like your profit margin.
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jvanvliet
12-11-2011, 01:27 PM
Mike, let me play devils advocate. You have talked and outlined many times how you operate the sod part of your business. You sub it out and don't do any physical work but are able to get such a good deal from the installer that you can just sell the job, mark it up and collect a check. How many foreigners work for that company you sub too laying sod or in the sod fields? We all know all these sod companies are using foreigners if not outright illegals. Especially one that does cheap work. Do you think you should take your own advice, hire some American workers and start doing sod installs at a higher price? I mean, I am sure just like you would be happy to pay more for Disney dolls made in fl I am sure people would be happy to pay more for sod if it was being laid by non illegals. Probably not and like Disney I am sure you like your profit margin.
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I make my margins by using undocumented labor and stiffing them on their pay. let em sue me. (JK)

gregory
12-11-2011, 01:33 PM
Mike, let me play devils advocate. You have talked and outlined many times how you operate the sod part of your business. You sub it out and don't do any physical work but are able to get such a good deal from the installer that you can just sell the job, mark it up and collect a check. How many foreigners work for that company you sub too laying sod or in the sod fields? We all know all these sod companies are using foreigners if not outright illegals. Especially one that does cheap work. Do you think you should take your own advice, hire some American workers and start doing sod installs at a higher price? I mean, I am sure just like you would be happy to pay more for Disney dolls made in fl I am sure people would be happy to pay more for sod if it was being laid by non illegals. Probably not and like Disney I am sure you like your profit margin.
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very good point....

stickleylawncare
12-11-2011, 04:20 PM
Initially in the Untited States, laws were established to protect people from the tyrany of their fellow man, however, once in place there is no mechanism that protects people from the tyrany of the law and government.

The United States was founded on the principles of protecting man from the tyranny of Government. The very idea and purpose of the Constitutions was to protect people from the tyranny of Government by placing actual limits on the Government before any other laws were even written. (Something very unique in world history)

And there is a mechanism in place to protect the people from the tyranny of law and government... its voting. Our system doesn't always work out perfect, but its sure better than anything else that's been tried in the last 6000 years or so.

Landscape Poet
12-12-2011, 06:51 PM
Mike, let me play devils advocate. You have talked and outlined many times how you operate the sod part of your business. You sub it out and don't do any physical work but are able to get such a good deal from the installer that you can just sell the job, mark it up and collect a check. How many foreigners work for that company you sub too laying sod or in the sod fields? We all know all these sod companies are using foreigners if not outright illegals. Especially one that does cheap work. Do you think you should take your own advice, hire some American workers and start doing sod installs at a higher price? I mean, I am sure just like you would be happy to pay more for Disney dolls made in fl I am sure people would be happy to pay more for sod if it was being laid by non illegals. Probably not and like Disney I am sure you like your profit margin.
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Although the company that I use is owned and operated by a hispanic family - they are citizens - at least the owner and son in law which do a majority of the work - there is a brother in law that I am not sure about however so I guess your point is valid to a degree in regards to this manner, except the sod work is being done at market rate already or above. The sod farm itself - I can not speak of as I do not know anything about the workers there as they are down south further than I will drive, the owner I can tell you is most likely a legal resident unless other countrymen have developed our southern twang in their English as I have had many conversations with him.

Your point is valid but a little off directed at my business for the above mentioned reason. However as stated I am not positive every aspect of the process is ran by legal citizens.