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rlmlandscape
01-30-2012, 12:27 PM
Trying to find out from other guys what their two man crews are grossing per hour. I started my business up last year in a new state/market and came from working in a very run down/ cheap market for many year where the going rate for an acre yard was $45/cut. I advertise for high end residential landscaping and was think somewhere around $80/hr gross for a two man crew would be about average, but I'm not sure if this is two low or two high for a mowing crew. I know I should charge what I need to make after my cost but am just trying to get an idea of average since people will only pay x amount of dollars to have their yard cut each week.

Landrus2
01-30-2012, 12:35 PM
i dont like to work by the hour :waving:

rlmlandscape
01-30-2012, 12:50 PM
Neither do I, but im trying to find out if a two man crew is out cutting a lawn and it takes them an hour, inlcuding collecting and disposing of lawn clipping is 80/hr fair market price or is it to cheap. Lawns are being cut with a 48" walker with one man trimming and edging. Property is blown off before and after cutting to ensure all debris is collected.

Thanksman
01-30-2012, 01:55 PM
Neither do I, but im trying to find out if a two man crew is out cutting a lawn and it takes them an hour, inlcuding collecting and disposing of lawn clipping is 80/hr fair market price or is it to cheap. Lawns are being cut with a 48" walker with one man trimming and edging. Property is blown off before and after cutting to ensure all debris is collected.

Hey man, new to the game here as you are aware. But I have been doing my research. You are in the ball park..70 to 80 an hour.:)

Hawkshot99
01-30-2012, 01:57 PM
I have never worked with a 2nd person, so take this with a grain of salt. I work alone, and usaully do about $50-60 a hour by myself on average lawns, not high end, but decent places. Based off of that the 2nd person needs to be making you way more than $20-30 a hour to cover there cost of being there, otherwise it would be better to have 1 person work alone, and just get a bit less done per day.

ralph02813
01-30-2012, 02:02 PM
Trying to find out from other guys what their two man crews are grossing per hour. I started my business up last year in a new state/market and came from working in a very run down/ cheap market for many year where the going rate for an acre yard was $45/cut. I advertise for high end residential landscaping and was think somewhere around $80/hr gross for a two man crew would be about average, but I'm not sure if this is two low or two high for a mowing crew. I know I should charge what I need to make after my cost but am just trying to get an idea of average since people will only pay x amount of dollars to have their yard cut each week.

This is a tough one, I aim for $60. I fly solo. But let me say $60. is mowing time it generally takes me 6 hours away from home to to make $240-$300. People have a hard time paying to have someone cut for a price, for me I really make money when I am doing a number of small lawns close together 3 - lawns I do right close to each other are worth $105, takes me just over an hour, then I ride for 10 min. and spent 2 1/2 hours making the same.
I think the most important thing is to know what you need to make to pay your bills including your salaries. Once you know the bottom line of what you need to pay bills, the you can start figuring out how much profit you want to make, or what your return on investment is going to by or at least what the goal of it should be.

Florida Gardener
01-30-2012, 02:23 PM
A lot of this depends on where you live. Those prices would be on the higher end in Florida....
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rlmlandscape
01-30-2012, 02:35 PM
This is a tough one, I aim for $60. I fly solo. But let me say $60. is mowing time it generally takes me 6 hours away from home to to make $240-$300. People have a hard time paying to have someone cut for a price, for me I really make money when I am doing a number of small lawns close together 3 - lawns I do right close to each other are worth $105, takes me just over an hour, then I ride for 10 min. and spent 2 1/2 hours making the same.
I think the most important thing is to know what you need to make to pay your bills including your salaries. Once you know the bottom line of what you need to pay bills, the you can start figuring out how much profit you want to make, or what your return on investment is going to by or at least what the goal of it should be.

Yea, I too make my money doing installs, patios, mulch cleanups etc. I just came from working and growing up in N.J. and in my area it was extremely saturated so I have a skewed vision of what I could/ should be making up here now. I see guys like marcellos and gorries who operate out of east greenwich and the owners (granted they have about five crews going) drive around in bmws and own homes in Florida they escape to in the winter. I'm just trying to figure out what their crews are pulling in per hour so that I'm on the same pay scale as them(if you get what I'm saying). Granted some of my houses I may get 75 for a cut each week and it takes the two of us an hour, but then these homeowners spend another 600/month on average having us do other maintenance work at their property so maybe its not so bad.

rlmlandscape
01-30-2012, 02:38 PM
I have never worked with a 2nd person, so take this with a grain of salt. I work alone, and usaully do about $50-60 a hour by myself on average lawns, not high end, but decent places. Based off of that the 2nd person needs to be making you way more than $20-30 a hour to cover there cost of being there, otherwise it would be better to have 1 person work alone, and just get a bit less done per day.

Makes sense. If I look at it that way say my trimmer gets paid 12/hr then add on taxes so it ups it to around 15/16 hr plus the added expense of insurane for an employee maybe im profiting 12/hr off him.

orangemower
01-30-2012, 02:44 PM
Makes sense. If I look at it that way say my trimmer gets paid 12/hr then add on taxes so it ups it to around 15/16 hr plus the added expense of insurane for an employee maybe im profiting 12/hr off him.

This sounds like you don't know what you're doing.

rlmlandscape
01-30-2012, 02:47 PM
This sounds like you don't know what you're doing.

Whoaa big guy over here. Last year was my first year in business and I'm trying to learn what I can. If you have don't want to contribute any good information don't comment on the thread. Sorry were not all gods gifts when it comes to running a business and know everything.

orangemower
01-30-2012, 04:56 PM
If you're spending an hour at one place and two guys are hustling then $80 is on the low side.

H & M Yard Improvements
01-30-2012, 05:11 PM
In my area im lucky if I can get 30-40 per cut. People are REAL cheap. Guess i can thank the lowballers for that.

orangemower
01-30-2012, 05:24 PM
In my area im lucky if I can get 30-40 per cut. People are REAL cheap. Guess i can thank the lowballers for that.

That's the problem in Jersey. All the laws, regulations and licensing fees. Guys that "pay to play" as they say are going to hurt more due to all the regulations, laws and fees to run a business. The lowballers fly low and skip out on all the bs regulations,laws and fees. As you said, force the price down by under bidding because they don't pay for all the licenses and stuff.

H & M Yard Improvements
01-30-2012, 07:51 PM
That's the problem in Jersey. All the laws, regulations and licensing fees. Guys that "pay to play" as they say are going to hurt more due to all the regulations, laws and fees to run a business. The lowballers fly low and skip out on all the bs regulations,laws and fees. As you said, force the price down by under bidding because they don't pay for all the licenses and stuff.

I believe it. I had a few people call me in the middle of last season to have their lawn cut because their lasy guy stopped showing up and when i gave them my estimate @ $50 per cut they looked like they were going to have a heart attack. They said my last guy only charged me $25. I said thats why your guy stopped showing up. Probably figured out that he wasnt making enough or either said f this. Needless to say they wouldnt budge on what the last guy charged them and I said im sorry but I cant do it that cheap, my overhead wouldnt even be covered with $25 and good luck in your search.

ralph02813
01-30-2012, 09:10 PM
Yea, I too make my money doing installs, patios, mulch cleanups etc. I just came from working and growing up in N.J. and in my area it was extremely saturated so I have a skewed vision of what I could/ should be making up here now. I see guys like marcellos and gorries who operate out of east greenwich and the owners (granted they have about five crews going) drive around in bmws and own homes in Florida they escape to in the winter. I'm just trying to figure out what their crews are pulling in per hour so that I'm on the same pay scale as them(if you get what I'm saying). Granted some of my houses I may get 75 for a cut each week and it takes the two of us an hour, but then these homeowners spend another 600/month on average having us do other maintenance work at their property so maybe its not so bad.

Sounds to me like we work the same way! I am smiling hope you guys are!

bj1bmx
02-12-2012, 11:29 AM
$70-90 an hour depending on how close the lawns are to one another. this is a two man crew with no more than 5-10 drive between each house.

too many lco's in the area to charge more than that... if you want to make more you need to increase volume here in south jersey

CUSTOMLAWN10
02-12-2012, 12:48 PM
First you need to know your overhead. What does it cost to keep the doors open. Do this for you insurance, buildings, vehicles/ fixed assets and costs. I have learned with admin costs the lovely government/payroll expenses you should expect your cost of labor to be 30-35 percent additional of the hourly wage you are paying. That is $10 per will cost you $13-$13.50. Then some say you charge triple you cost, but market and economic influences may affect that theory.

With that firgure your cost per hour plus you profit margin. I am not a fan of low ballers, but after talking to a couple they are charging what they need to to make money. Lastly, i run all one man crews that join forces on big commercial. Your capitol investment is more, but you labor expense is much less and profits margins are double to triple what two man crews are.

Kelly's Landscaping
02-12-2012, 02:46 PM
Loading the trucks and trailer each morning and unloading at night. Fueling up once a week plus all the drive time from lawn to lawn. Then add in dumping the grass at our recycling place 1-4 times a week depending on the grass growth at the time. Then there is lunch stops and emergency repair stops. Include all of THAT and then yes we gross $80 an hour for a 2 man cutting crew. Far to many want to concentrate on their best hour and point to that as reality if that's the case then $125 for a 2 man crew in just 45 mins is our number. But I live in reality and pay all the bills that come from non billable hours and you need to include them in your averages or your just fooling yourself.

rlmlandscape
02-12-2012, 03:23 PM
Yea I figured my cost to run the business including my labor and everything else come to just under $55 and hour. I was more trying to find out what percent profit you would add onto this. Trying to find a industry standard so I can figure this all out a little better. Im gonna shoot for 90/hr this year.

ralph02813
02-13-2012, 04:56 AM
Yea I figured my cost to run the business including my labor and everything else come to just under $55 and hour. I was more trying to find out what percent profit you would add onto this. Trying to find a industry standard so I can figure this all out a little better. Im gonna shoot for 90/hr this year.

First, let me say, I am not saying this to you, just useing your statement - profit needs to be derived at by adjusting both rates and cost - to do one with out the other can lead you down a bumpy road.

hackitdown
02-13-2012, 07:23 AM
It depends on how productive you are. It depends on your equipment. And how smart and hard you and your employees work. I shoot for $100 per hr for 2 men. Then I try to beat that as often as I can. It is not easy to do better than $100 with mowing, but we easily beat the number for special services like aeration, dethatching, cleanups, brush cutting, pruning, etc.

rlmlandscape
02-13-2012, 08:32 AM
First, let me say, I am not saying this to you, just useing your statement - profit needs to be derived at by adjusting both rates and cost - to do one with out the other can lead you down a bumpy road.

Not sure if I exactly follow what your saying ralph. Care to elaborate for me.

BBC.lawn.services
02-13-2012, 10:07 AM
I put an extra 10%-20% on the top when I'm finished in most cased. The smaller the property the great the %. (for me this is pretty much to cover taxes etc.)

atleast in Oklahoma running a business legally cost you an extra $3 per hour on employe. Insurance is another cost. I believe the end of the year taxes come out to somewhere around 10% of profit that's left in the bank. I probably will spend most of it in re-investment.

For me running legally cost me an extra $9 an hour with one employ on the ground. (keep in mind I only run about 500 hr. a year at most)

too me lowballers are people who don't know all their costs thus they think they can price cheaply and meet those.

People who don't run legally are going to save an extra $9 an hour so they can charge cheaper. Not lowballing in my mind.

For me at the end of the day for a two man crew mowing with a ZTR for one hour and have a WE/blower going for an hour is going to run at about - $80 for me. (at 10%)

Mikegyver
02-13-2012, 11:03 AM
I try to run at minimum 60 a hr for 2 guys. Its hard down here because there's so many guys out there cutting grass. I try to break even on the mowing...I make the real $$$ on leaves, contracts, landscaping, and irrigation.
Mike

ralph02813
02-13-2012, 01:00 PM
Not sure if I exactly follow what your saying ralph. Care to elaborate for me.

what I am trying to say is that you have to work both sides of the ledger, what things cost (total price of overhead) and what you charge. So someone might be able to look at the way they are doing things and find savings also which helps to grow the profit margin while containing the price sturcture.
Does that make sense!?

rlmlandscape
02-13-2012, 01:17 PM
what I am trying to say is that you have to work both sides of the ledger, what things cost (total price of overhead) and what you charge. So someone might be able to look at the way they are doing things and find savings also which helps to grow the profit margin while containing the price sturcture.
Does that make sense!?

Yea makes total sense. Thought you were talking about something more in depth and more complex haha.

ralph02813
02-14-2012, 06:58 AM
Yea makes total sense. Thought you were talking about something more in depth and more complex haha.

Whew, I had me worried!

OneLineAtATime
02-14-2012, 07:45 AM
I hate these threads, this is like the 10th one. Wait i think the last one was "How much for 3 man crew".. Look this industry is so over populated, the only way to win bids is be the lowest. Nobody cares about anything else. Now after you win the customer over they will pay higher prices. I aim for double your money. Job cost you $100 to make it happen charge $200. You will lose this bid for being to high, so you go in at $145. Then slowly increase prices because this customer loves you.

Brickman way- Do mowing and mulching at cost and try to make up for it in snow removal if it snows.

ralph02813
02-14-2012, 08:22 AM
I hate these threads, this is like the 10th one. Wait i think the last one was "How much for 3 man crew".. Look this industry is so over populated, the only way to win bids is be the lowest. Nobody cares about anything else. Now after you win the customer over they will pay higher prices. I aim for double your money. Job cost you $100 to make it happen charge $200. You will lose this bid for being to high, so you go in at $145. Then slowly increase prices because this customer loves you.

Brickman way- Do mowing and mulching at cost and try to make up for it in snow removal if it snows.

I tend to agree with you for different reason - yes the industry is over populated not the lowest price, but the best price with the best work.
I worked in the seafood industry for 30 years - 75% of the industry is gone largely because most were using magic formulas like yours.
You have to know "all your true cost" and make that the corner stone for pricing.

DoetschOutdoor
02-14-2012, 11:53 AM
I hate these threads, this is like the 10th one. Wait i think the last one was "How much for 3 man crew".. Look this industry is so over populated, the only way to win bids is be the lowest. Nobody cares about anything else. Now after you win the customer over they will pay higher prices. I aim for double your money. Job cost you $100 to make it happen charge $200. You will lose this bid for being to high, so you go in at $145. Then slowly increase prices because this customer loves you.

Brickman way- Do mowing and mulching at cost and try to make up for it in snow removal if it snows.



Yea, that might work for brickman when you are doing millions in snow removal alone but I guarandamtee that they are making a nice chunk on mowing and other services, not doing it for just cost. Also, you are a ****** if you think this plan of action will work with the average landscaper. There is still plenty of business out there, whether you find it and keep it and make a profit is up to you.

OneLineAtATime
02-14-2012, 12:21 PM
Yea, that might work for brickman when you are doing millions in snow removal alone but I guarandamtee that they are making a nice chunk on mowing and other services, not doing it for just cost. Also, you are a ****** if you think this plan of action will work with the average landscaper. There is still plenty of business out there, whether you find it and keep it and make a profit is up to you.
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OneLineAtATime
02-14-2012, 12:25 PM
Yea, that might work for brickman when you are doing millions in snow removal alone but I guarandamtee that they are making a nice chunk on mowing and other services, not doing it for just cost. Also, you are a ****** if you think this plan of action will work with the average landscaper. There is still plenty of business out there, whether you find it and keep it and make a profit is up to you.

Brickman dose a billion in snow.. I have bided against them many times, and have copies of the estimates. Yes its cost, they will sale the prop. Manager on extra services to turn a profit.
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OneLineAtATime
02-14-2012, 12:27 PM
I tend to agree with you for different reason - yes the industry is over populated not the lowest price, but the best price with the best work.
I worked in the seafood industry for 30 years - 75% of the industry is gone largely because most were using magic formulas like yours.
You have to know "all your true cost" and make that the corner stone for pricing.

I'll 2nd that
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