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smallstripesnc
02-29-2012, 01:56 PM
Hello everyone,

As some of you know I only use small mowers on my lawn and was planning to use the new Toro Timemaster 30 as my main unit.

I just picked it up yesterday and right after getting it I had two properties to try it on. Both are fescue lawns and we're decently high and one the front yard is very hilly.

The mower performed great in all conditions and I was surprised at how easily the mower pulled and how well it cut.

Today I got to try it on a new property and the grass was once again fescue and very high and thick. The mower handled it well and didn't bog down or anything it just sounded like it always does.

So far I'm impressed and I don't see why a lot of people are saying a ton of negative comments about this mower. It seems to be a solid unit and I believe with regular maintenance it'll do fine for commercial work.

WHIPPLE5.7
02-29-2012, 02:11 PM
Thanks for the review. Although it does have a few short falls I feel it could be a very productive machine for the small amount of money it cost. Please keep us updated.
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orangemower
02-29-2012, 03:51 PM
Let us know when you have 500-600hrs on it.
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PremierT&L
02-29-2012, 05:39 PM
At that price you could just replace it at 500 hours. We are looking closely at these mowers b/c we have a number of neighborhoods with very small yards. Seems like a good mower in between the 21 and 36. We are also looking at the Ybravo 25.

Thanks for the review.

larryinalabama
02-29-2012, 05:53 PM
What engine does it have? Where did you purchase it?

frameslawn
02-29-2012, 06:40 PM
Sounds good, cant wait to hear more feedback about this unit as I dont start mowing here for another 5-6 weeks.

lawnkingforever
02-29-2012, 08:22 PM
At that price you could just replace it at 500 hours. We are looking closely at these mowers b/c we have a number of neighborhoods with very small yards. Seems like a good mower in between the 21 and 36. We are also looking at the Ybravo 25.

Thanks for the review.

I am in the situation. My Grandstand is a bit much for some properties and I have a few fenced in yards where the
narrow gates won't even allow a 36". A pushmower is not very productive, right now I use a 33" craftsman which has been surprisingly durable over the years, but I am not happy with the cut quality. The Toro interests me because of how light and nimble it seems to be.
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shadetreelawns
02-29-2012, 08:29 PM
[QUOTE=lawnkingforever;4331683]I am in the situation. My Grandstand is a bit much for some properties and I have a few fenced in yards where the
narrow gates won't even allow a 36". A pushmower is not very productive, right now I use a 33" craftsman which has been surprisingly durable over the years, but I am not happy with the cut quality. The Toro interests me because of how light and nimble it seems to be.


Lawnking I was in the same boat. I have a snapper pro 36" and I have since bought the toro 30" it has been great. The quality of cut is excellent. I find myself using it more and more because of the quality of cut.

chobley
03-01-2012, 08:35 AM
I look foward to hearing how it holds up..
I use a residential toro 22" for lots of stuff and I ended up stripping two sets of rear tires last year . Drove me nuts ! I hope the design or parts are made better on the 30"..

LawnMan19
03-01-2012, 09:13 AM
What is the engine on it?

orangemower
03-01-2012, 09:13 AM
I look foward to hearing how it holds up..
I use a residential toro 22" for lots of stuff and I ended up stripping two sets of rear tires last year . Drove me nuts ! I hope the design or parts are made better on the 30"..
A Toro rep posted a bunch of info in another thread about this mower. He states that it uses metal trans parts over the plastic. It should hold up with moderate use.
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chobley
03-01-2012, 09:28 AM
A Toro rep posted a bunch of info in another thread about this mower. He states that it uses metal trans parts over the plastic. It should hold up with moderate use.
Posted via Mobile Device

Good News ! Thanks
I'll look for his post

smallstripesnc
03-01-2012, 11:46 AM
[QUOTE=lawnkingforever;4331683]I am in the situation. My Grandstand is a bit much for some properties and I have a few fenced in yards where the
narrow gates won't even allow a 36". A pushmower is not very productive, right now I use a 33" craftsman which has been surprisingly durable over the years, but I am not happy with the cut quality. The Toro interests me because of how light and nimble it seems to be.


Lawnking I was in the same boat. I have a snapper pro 36" and I have since bought the toro 30" it has been great. The quality of cut is excellent. I find myself using it more and more because of the quality of cut.

I agree that the quality of cut is excellent and I was actually very surprised when I first tried it out especially on the new lawn that was super high and thick.

Valk
03-01-2012, 12:43 PM
April and May lush Spring growth will prolly be a bigger challenge...maybe a deal-breaker. I would need this mower to side-discharge like a banshee...or it wouldn't be worth it.

Hey someone...am just curious, how much will a new tranny cost if/when 'it' happens? And, how much will a repair be if the timed blade drive belt breaks? How much are new spindles?

I truly/seriously hope this is a winner...but the jury will remain out until Nov, imo.
Best of luck!

samsaira
03-01-2012, 09:14 PM
April and May lush Spring growth will prolly be a bigger challenge...maybe a deal-breaker. I would need this mower to side-discharge like a banshee...or it wouldn't be worth it.

Hey someone...am just curious, how much will a new tranny cost if/when 'it' happens? And, how much will a repair be if the timed blade drive belt breaks? How much are new spindles?

I truly/seriously hope this is a winner...but the jury will remain out until Nov, imo.
Best of luck!

I agree with you. People are getting excited about this Toro 30 inch timemaster but it NOT COMMERCIAL GRADE. Why can't people understand it is a ticking residential time bomb that will blow in a few weeks. Especially when someone is trying to cut 15 lawns a day.

jiggz
03-01-2012, 09:27 PM
I want a review from you in 6 months and a year..


I'm not being a D!ck at all, Me and alot of people are going to be interested in how it will hold up in a commercial environment..I just don't see how it will, better off with a 32.. I hope it works out great for you, but keep us posted

sjessen
03-01-2012, 09:34 PM
Am guessing Toro reads these threads. As much interest as been expressed in this mower it would not be surprising to see a 30" commercial version of this unit at some point. Maybe a couple more horses, beefier transmission, spindles, wheels, thicker deck, etc.

For those of us using a super recycler this unit holds promise. For those who use 21's as a commercial unit, not so much.

OakNut
03-01-2012, 09:44 PM
I'm interested to hear how well it mulches.

I use a Toro SuperRecycler and I'm very happy with it's mulching ability. I don't bag unless it's necessary, so before I'd even consider one of these, I'd like to hear some feedback on that aspect.

I don't think this mower could replace a true 32-36" walk behind, but I do see an application for it.

WHIPPLE5.7
03-01-2012, 10:06 PM
I think this mower will hold up alittle better than some people are giving it credit for but it still a very laborous thing to use and turn. For the life of me I can't figure out why we don't see more 32/34 dual hydro WB machines. The BOP 32 is sweet but no longer available. I'm willing to pay $4K for a mower that size but not many good ones available. I have a BOP 36 dually right now as a main mower and I'm guessing I'll buy one of these Toro 30's as a backup mower in case the 36 bites the dust. Although taking longer I'd be able to finish accounts with it. Also why doesn't Wright mfg redesign their 32 stander so it has much wider tires with less air so it doesn't rut real bad. They have to know this is issue. I feel companies are falling somewhat short of what we need.

stephen424
03-01-2012, 11:00 PM
I bought the mower for my lawn (tall fescue). It works well for well maintained lawns. I decided to use it on a neighbors lawn that's not so maintained. I had to cut areas with henbit weeds twice, three times in some spots. Maybe that just the blades?

But I like the unit overall. Its a homeowner unit, period, and should be used as one. Its not built for cutting more than 2 lawns, once a week. I don't understand why people can't accept that. Its the whole "you can't turn a *#* n2 a housewife" rule. It WON'T replace a commercial 32, 36.
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smallstripesnc
03-01-2012, 11:26 PM
I bought the mower for my lawn (tall fescue). It works well for well maintained lawns. I decided to use it on a neighbors lawn that's not so maintained. I had to cut areas with henbit weeds twice, three times in some spots. Maybe that just the blades?

But I like the unit overall. Its a homeowner unit, period, and should be used as one. Its not built for cutting more than 2 lawns, once a week. I don't understand why people can't accept that. Its the whole "you can't turn a *#* n2 a housewife" rule. It WON'T replace a commercial 32, 36.
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I have to disagree about it not being able to handle more than 2 lawns a week. Ive used mine on a variety of terrain and super thick over grown fescue (new client) and so far its done great! I admit the blades dont have much lift but it definitely mulches well and hasnt cumped on me yet. The engine seems to offer plenty of power and the personal pace system seems to pull pretty good.

The weight is very well distributed so its very easy to maneuaver and I have not bagged with it yet so im not sure how well itll do with such a low lift blade.

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stephen424
03-01-2012, 11:33 PM
How can you disagree with my statement about it not being able to handle more than 2 lawns??? How long have you owned it, a week?

Trust me, its not going to last. I mean, even Toro states that its a "consumer" product. So if you don't believe me and you don't believe Toro...then good luck
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smallstripesnc
03-01-2012, 11:38 PM
Ive used a toro 22'' pp recycler with blade brake clutch with pretty much the same engine weekly for awhile now with zero issues. I change the oil monthly and always run 93 octane and a clean air filter.

Before I got the toro 22" I used an old yard machines by mtd push mower daily for many months. Sure I had to prime it by pouring gas in the carb but it was like that when I got it and even with so much use I had zero issues due to daily use. It just proves a unit doesnt have to be rated commercial to withstand 5-8hrs daily use.

The timemaster is pretty much a beefed up version so im sure itll do fine with regular maintenance. Ive had a toro rep tell me its rated a homeowner unit but he believes itll do fine for daily use on residential properties. Only time will tell.
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Exact Rototilling
03-02-2012, 12:47 AM
I think this mower will hold up alittle better than some people are giving it credit for but it still a very laborous thing to use and turn. For the life of me I can't figure out why we don't see more 32/34 dual hydro WB machines. The BOP 32 is sweet but no longer available. I'm willing to pay $4K for a mower that size but not many good ones available. I have a BOP 36 dually right now as a main mower and I'm guessing I'll buy one of these Toro 30's as a backup mower in case the 36 bites the dust. Although taking longer I'd be able to finish accounts with it. Also why doesn't Wright mfg redesign their 32 stander so it has much wider tires with less air so it doesn't rut real bad. They have to know this is issue. I feel companies are falling somewhat short of what we need.

I belive my Quickie 32 dually will eat the Toro 30 for lunch in cut quality, horse power and productivity. Problem is currently not available new.... parts issue has many of us concerned. The Toro is easier to deal with when bagging ...since it bags to the rear. Timed blades keep the deck and mower shorter.

I only use my Ybravo 25 for some tight trimming and grassy swells basically a replacement for a 21". The draw backs of the Ybravo 25 is the cut height Max is at 3.5" and there is no side discharge provision. There are few blades I will try this spring on my Ybravo 25 that I belive will make it even better in soaking wet grass while bagging. Time will tell.... In the rain I use the Ybravo exclusively and grind out mowing accounts. The design of the Toro deck ....soaking wet.grass.....I have my doubts.

I think mower manufacturers need to.steep it up and get their 32-36 standers and dual.hydro mowers on a serious weight loss program. In a walk behind the BOP dually 32 is in a class by itself at under 400 pounds, great blade.selection etc.
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FastMan
03-02-2012, 05:56 AM
This Timemaster mower is exactly what I've been looking for. Perfect. Going down to my dealer to pick one up.

lawnboy dan
03-02-2012, 07:15 AM
my toro 32 wb is starting its 19th season this spring. enough said

smallstripesnc
03-02-2012, 08:13 AM
my toro 32 wb is starting its 19th season this spring. enough said

Thats awesome! I honestly don't think they design things to last that long these days =/.

FastMan
03-02-2012, 11:19 PM
Just in case anyone is thinking of getting one of these, do it fast. I went to my dealer today and he told me he has a few scheduled to come in any day now, but doesn't expect them to last. Demand is high, and the distributor told him the factory is not able to keep up with it.

Might be different in various parts of the country, but I had him put my name on one of the few he has coming in.

Platinum2
03-02-2012, 11:38 PM
You know....last year I asked the lawnsite community what type of mower I should consider purchasing to mow my modest 1/3 acre lawn and nearly everyone said to buy used commercial equipment....exmark, quickie, whatever because residential equipment is so inferior, is cheap, would not hold up...blah, blah, blah.

Now, Toro releases a residential grade 30" mower and all you commercial contractors can't wait to buy one so you can start mowing 15 lawns a week with it. :confused:

Whatever.

Valk
03-03-2012, 01:05 AM
No, there are plenty of skeptics waiting for the jury to deliberate and return with a verdict come November.
There will be bugs for Toro to address...same with anything new.

But will it handle constant use?
How long will it last as just a mowing-beyond-the-small-gates kind of mower?

I hope some folks out there mount an hour meter so we can get realistic measurements.

stephen424
03-03-2012, 01:36 AM
The "commercial contractors" that are rushing to buy these units for daily use aren't really "commercial contractors", in my opinion.

Just because you mow 5 lawns a week doesn't make you a LCO.

Like I said, I bought one for my lawn because I cut my grass 3x a week (yea I know) and don't like a lot of weight on my lawn. So I've always cut my lawn with 21s or 22s.

I'd still suggest buying a used exmark over buying the Toro 30, if it'll fit your budget.

The guys that are flocking to this mower to use everyday aren't 50-lawn-a-week guys. Just my opinion tho, I could be wrong
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Exact Rototilling
03-03-2012, 01:58 AM
You know....last year I asked the lawnsite community what type of mower I should consider purchasing to mow my modest 1/3 acre lawn and nearly everyone said to buy used commercial equipment....exmark, quickie, whatever because residential equipment is so inferior, is cheap, would not hold up...blah, blah, blah.

Now, Toro releases a residential grade 30" mower and all you commercial contractors can't wait to buy one so you can start mowing 15 lawns a week with it. :confused:

Whatever.

Valid point but I would not buy one as a primary mower personally. I leave my Ybravo 25 parked as much as possible and use my Bop duallys as the primary mowers. The cut is considerably better than the Ybravo. But the Ybravo is considerably better than a Toro SR4.

Unless the Toro 30 cuts wet grass nearly.as well.as.the Ybravo ...I'm not.interested in the mower. That's why I want to buy one.from.Home.Depot and.then return it.if not happy.

I have selected some unauthorized high lift blades for my Ybravo 25 for testing that I belive will make its wet grass mowing performance even better.

Anyhow back to the original point. The Toro 30 is a niche market mower. I hope I never.have to buy another 21" mower ever again.

The OPE manufacturers need to.get on the stick on Commercial grade light weight mowers. I suspect the Toro 30 will be too wide for grassy swell.duty....time will tell.
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Smallaxe
03-03-2012, 09:56 AM
Never buy another 21" mower, ever again... my sentimentents exactly...

Of course there are locations in which it will fit better and quicker, between weed whacker and Timemaster...

smallstripesnc
03-03-2012, 10:23 AM
The "commercial contractors" that are rushing to buy these units for daily use aren't really "commercial contractors", in my opinion.

Just because you mow 5 lawns a week doesn't make you a LCO.

Like I said, I bought one for my lawn because I cut my grass 3x a week (yea I know) and don't like a lot of weight on my lawn. So I've always cut my lawn with 21s or 22s.

I'd still suggest buying a used exmark over buying the Toro 30, if it'll fit your budget.

The guys that are flocking to this mower to use everyday aren't 50-lawn-a-week guys. Just my opinion tho, I could be wrong
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I'm at 24 lawns per week right now and I'll be using the timemaster as my main unit. So far so good with it but only time will tell.

MJB
03-03-2012, 11:10 AM
This is the perfect mower for guys like me that use mostly ztr's but need a walkbehind here and there. I hate wasting time with a 22" mower , and never needed a commercial walk behind yet. Looks like the wheels and possobly the transmission are the weak points, so whoever buys one should try not to abuse it more than normal. POSITIVE you can pick up parts at home depot.

orangemower
03-03-2012, 12:05 PM
mjb, they said the trans uses metal gears over the smaller plastic gears found in the 21-22 deck mower. I'm sure there's a weak spot somewhere on the mower.
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FastMan
03-04-2012, 12:19 PM
This is the perfect mower for guys like me that use mostly ztr's but need a walkbehind here and there. I hate wasting time with a 22" mower , and never needed a commercial walk behind yet.

This is the very same reason I'm buying one. It will be the mower I use only when I have to, in the areas where I can't get my 60" ztr rider or 48 inch hydro walk behind onto. Currently I use a 21 inch on those areas. Time is money, and at my $75/hr rate this $1000 machine will pay for itself quickly. After that, I'm making money.

stephen424
03-04-2012, 01:11 PM
I'm at 24 lawns per week right now and I'll be using the timemaster as my main unit. So far so good with it but only time will tell.

wow smallstripes, you grow fast. you just sent me a PM a couple weeks ago saying that you only do 5 lawns a week and that you cut out of a 1995 BMW sedan!!! now you're at 24 lawns a week! you have one hell of a marketing plan. and how do you fit that 30" timemaster in your trunk?

mikeypizano
03-04-2012, 01:46 PM
This forum really amazes me. I use a 21" ONLY and when I looked at threads, everyone was saying to get a cheap one, not a commercial one, so how is this any different?

WHIPPLE5.7
03-04-2012, 02:16 PM
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Platinum2
03-05-2012, 11:48 PM
This forum really amazes me. I use a 21" ONLY and when I looked at threads, everyone was saying to get a cheap one, not a commercial one, so how is this any different?


Yeah...this community is funny like that. Usually, if they're spending your money then they will tell you buy commercial equipment. However, if they are spending their own money, they will somehow find a way to justify why it is ok for them to buy a residential piece of equipment by saying things like "it will fit in small spaces" is "lightweight", or something else. Really, they purchase it because it is cheap relative to commercial equipment.

To top it off, they'll use the sh*t out of it and say it's garbage after it breaks when it wasn't designed for commercial applications in the first place.

Neat, huh? :rolleyes:

mikeypizano
03-05-2012, 11:49 PM
Yeah...this community is funny like that. Usually, if they're spending your money then they will tell you buy commercial equipment. However, if they are spending their own money, they will somehow find a way to justify why it is ok for them to buy a residential piece of equipment by saying things like "it will fit in small spaces" is "lightweight", or something else. Really, they purchase it because it is cheap relative to commercial equipment.

To top it off, they'll use the sh*t out of it and say it's garbage after it breaks when it wasn't designed for commercial applications in the first place.

Neat, huh? :rolleyes:

Yep but I just had to call them out on it this time! :laugh:

Platinum2
03-06-2012, 11:01 PM
Yep but I just had to call them out on it this time! :laugh:

Nice to see someone else is on bullsh*t patrol too!

Busybee Lawns
03-07-2012, 12:00 AM
About Time!
** Bottom line**
*If it make you money who cares?? use it!

smallstripesnc
03-07-2012, 09:24 AM
wow smallstripes, you grow fast. you just sent me a PM a couple weeks ago saying that you only do 5 lawns a week and that you cut out of a 1995 BMW sedan!!! now you're at 24 lawns a week! you have one hell of a marketing plan. and how do you fit that 30" timemaster in your trunk?

To clarify I have a 1983 bmw 320i and haul with a 4x6 trailer. Yes I used to put my 22 recycler in my trunk but I finally got a trailer.

As far as marketing I put out over 5000 fliers and word of mouth has really helped me and is the reason I have so many clients.

My point is the mower has been great so far! Its making me money and thats all that matters. When it gives me issues ill fix it.
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tyler_mott85
03-07-2012, 03:48 PM
LOL he said that's why he has "so many clients" LOL

I actually DO only have 5 lawns that I care for myself. 6 if i include my own. 7 if I include my aunts that I mow a few times a year to help out. I've been in this industry for a LONG time compared to how old I am. I've mowed thousands of different lawns in this city and put thousands of hours on mowers. I've worked for a lot of companies. I've been the grunt worker, I've been the foreman over seeing three mowing crews, I've had up to 20 lawns myself....so why am I looking at this timemaster with interest? Even if it is a "residential" mower?

Because it might be the ONE mower I can own that will replace TWO mowers that I currently use to take care of my 5 or 6 or 7 lawns.

And the whole notion that "consumer" grade mowers can't stand up to "commercial" use is bologna. I own a JohnDeere JX75 which I bought new in the year y2k. That's 2000 for all you young folks. I used that mower to push mow 20 lawns a week for 5 years before I cut back. I have never had to replace anything on it except for the wheels that I wore out...twice. Proper maintenance (which many consumers do not do on their $300 troy-bilts) and common sense has kept this mower going. The only reason I would get rid of it now is if this timemaster would replace what my 48" walk behind can't do. Which is fit through a couple gates that even a 32" walkbehind won't fit through.

Sorry, I've worked all day in a 30mph steady wind. I'm cranky. My point is just because something is called something has very little to do with what it can do. I'm only 5'8...sometimes 5'9 if i'm proud...and people call me short. But I can do a heck of a lot more things than "tall" people can.

samsaira
03-07-2012, 04:19 PM
LOL he said that's why he has "so many clients" LOL

I actually DO only have 5 lawns that I care for myself. 6 if i include my own. 7 if I include my aunts that I mow a few times a year to help out. I've been in this industry for a LONG time compared to how old I am. I've mowed thousands of different lawns in this city and put thousands of hours on mowers. I've worked for a lot of companies. I've been the grunt worker, I've been the foreman over seeing three mowing crews, I've had up to 20 lawns myself....so why am I looking at this timemaster with interest? Even if it is a "residential" mower?

Because it might be the ONE mower I can own that will replace TWO mowers that I currently use to take care of my 5 or 6 or 7 lawns.

And the whole notion that "consumer" grade mowers can't stand up to "commercial" use is bologna. I own a JohnDeere JX75 which I bought new in the year y2k. That's 2000 for all you young folks. I used that mower to push mow 20 lawns a week for 5 years before I cut back. I have never had to replace anything on it except for the wheels that I wore out...twice. Proper maintenance (which many consumers do not do on their $300 troy-bilts) and common sense has kept this mower going. The only reason I would get rid of it now is if this timemaster would replace what my 48" walk behind can't do. Which is fit through a couple gates that even a 32" walkbehind won't fit through.

Sorry, I've worked all day in a 30mph steady wind. I'm cranky. My point is just because something is called something has very little to do with what it can do. I'm only 5'8...sometimes 5'9 if i'm proud...and people call me short. But I can do a heck of a lot more things than "tall" people can.

Well, I bet it won't last to cut 25 lawns a day. That's how many I will be doing. So, there is something to be said about the difference between "commercial" and "residential". Yeah, it's great for 5 lawns a week.

tyler_mott85
03-07-2012, 06:25 PM
Well, I bet it won't last to cut 25 lawns a day. That's how many I will be doing. So, there is something to be said about the difference between "commercial" and "residential". Yeah, it's great for 5 lawns a week.

What do you use now to maintain your 25 lawns a day?

I have not made a claim that there is no difference between consumer and commercial grade products, I've simply said that I've been able to make a consumer grade push mower (all be it, admittedly near close to their commercial line, back in the day) last for 12 years with no break downs with just good maintenance and common sense.

If all my lawns were junk lawns that were really rough and always overgrown, and I bashed the mower into curbs and ran over tree stumps and did not tie the mower down during transport it would not last as a commercial grade mower would. I've used commercial Snappers at multiple lawn care companies around here. I've seen those mowers go into lakes, fall off the back of truck on the highway at 65mph, mow into tree stumps and they all started up and finished the day. I would not expect that out of a consumer grade mower. And while $1000 is very high for a typical 21" consumer grade mower the productivity increase of going to a 30" mower is where you save your money.

I would not use this mower in rough city lots or on any lawns other than the finest I can get my paws on. It's all about what you want to do with this mower.

There are very real concerns about the power of this mower in relation to the size of the deck, the plastic wheels, the drive system, etc. and all that will come to light in the future.

You will buy a $1000 commercial 21" mower and get many many years out of it maintaining 25 yards a day. Decades if you only use it for a few small, hard to reach areas/back yards.

Or you can buy this $1000 consumer grade mower and get a few years out of it maintaining many yards a day or decades for a few yards/week or bigger back yards as long as they are fine lawns. All of this would be done is less TIME. and since time is worth money and everyone's time is worth a different amount to themselves it really is up to more than just number crunching on if this risk is worth it.

Ohhhh...Pizza's here... :usflag:

melissa and ken irving
03-07-2012, 06:57 PM
Let's not kid ourselves, toro themselves emphasize that this is a homeowner model, period. I started cutting lawns with a 22" toro homeowner mower, then i bought another one. Wish i had started with better equipment, chutes clogging, transmissions giving up, cheap wheels, etc.. i will be looking at this model closely but i know you won't be able to count on it like you would a commercial unit. Expect parts of it not to last long. It will have it's place. What I'm happy about is the fact that commercial guys are interested in a mower like this and that you'll be seeing other similar mowers, hopefully a little more comm., from other companies, if not toro themselves.

smallstripesnc
03-07-2012, 08:58 PM
To me its a lot of clients. More than I started with.

Time is definitely money and I did get to try this mower on an overgrown fescue lawn with a lot of onions and a few very thick patches of chicweed and the lawn was an acre.

The result was putting the discharge chute on and it did get clogged a few times and it didnt cut the onions well also this mower should NOT be rated for an acre. This is a new weekly client and hes a good friend and pays well but that first cut was rough!




Theres nothing wrong with that.
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Valk
03-08-2012, 12:15 PM
Why timed-blades?
Am sure there's not just one all-encompassing reason for this design. A shorter mower by a couple inches...therefore a shorter deck? A better cut perhaps? The Walker guys certainly like their timed blades but that's a WHOLE different design altogether.

But, if the blades were NOT timed, then this mower would be a little longer due to the trimside blade being located more forward...and it would then likely not have (possibly) catastrophic damage if even a simple thing like the drivebelt breaking happens.

So, why timed-blades? Seems like a recipe for future issues.

MJB
03-08-2012, 01:08 PM
Why timed-blades?
Am sure there's not just one all-encompassing reason for this design. A shorter mower by a couple inches...therefore a shorter deck? A better cut perhaps? The Walker guys certainly like their timed blades but that's a WHOLE different design altogether.

But, if the blades were NOT timed, then this mower would be a little longer due to the trimside blade being located more forward...and it would then likely not have (possibly) catastrophic damage if even a simple thing like the drivebelt breaking happens.

So, why timed-blades? Seems like a recipe for future issues.

To keep the blades from hitting each other.

Valk
03-08-2012, 05:46 PM
To keep the blades from hitting each other.

:laugh: :hammerhead:
How many of the mowers in your avatar/sig have timed blades?

mikeypizano
03-08-2012, 05:53 PM
My guess is marketing reasons.

RGM
03-08-2012, 06:08 PM
I have tried this mower and for me it could be a good fit but its not for everyone. It wont replace a 32'' or 36'' in productivity and in the long run not worth it. I work by myself now cut 30-40 lawns a week and places where I cant get my 60'' zero turn like pool areas etc I use a Honda mower which is need of being replaced. It would save me enough time over a year to more then pay for the the extra $400 for time-master mower. The engine is 8.5 foot torque pound lager then the 6.5 6.75 on the personal pace. The trans is much larger and is the cone type I was told.

Valk
03-08-2012, 06:18 PM
My guess is marketing reasons.

If so...am thinking the R&D guys would about like to choke them.
A blade spinning at ~19,000 feet/min (=216mph) should not have the opportunity to hit another blade in the same plane. The real tragedy is that the left blade would intersect with the right blade blade-tip to blade-tip...and that could equal a theoretical ~432 mph collision if the drive belt were to break.

Off-set blades avoid this whole scenario.

MJB
03-08-2012, 06:47 PM
If so...am thinking the R&D guys would about like to choke them.
A blade spinning at ~19,000 feet/min (=216mph) should not have the opportunity to hit another blade in the same plane. The real tragedy is that the left blade would intersect with the right blade blade-tip to blade-tip...and that could equal a theoretical ~432 mph collision if the drive belt were to break.

Off-set blades avoid this whole scenario.

Obviously Walker Mowers has been doing this for 20 + years successfully, and others have copied it. Don't know what the fuss :confused: is about. Time well tell if the gearboxes hold up on the TimeMaster, TORO surely considered the hazards before using cheap gearboxes on the time blades.

instyle
03-08-2012, 06:58 PM
I have a walker and I have had the blades hit. They are timed to not hit, but when you hit something with one blade and it cuts the shear pins, the blades can hit, and they will. Result....one blade will cut through the other blades lip. no big deal. Replace the pins and cut away.
I also have non timed blade machines, when the blades don't overlap, in thick grass, it will leave a stripe of uncut grass if your going too fast. I prefer timed blades

Mark Hill
03-08-2012, 07:17 PM
I've used almost every mower out there, and every size, and this is the only one I will buy over and over again. They each typically last me about 750 hrs believe it or not. It's an exceptional mower between 22-36 (probably the best), and certainly most cost effective. Holds up beautifully in thick lawns as well, yet still has a delicate precision cut for some of those finer lawns. Overall I highly recommend it. :)

Valk
03-09-2012, 10:24 AM
I've used almost every mower out there, and every size, and this is the only one I will buy over and over again. They each typically last me about 750 hrs believe it or not. It's an exceptional mower between 22-36 (probably the best), and certainly most cost effective. Holds up beautifully in thick lawns as well, yet still has a delicate precision cut for some of those finer lawns. Overall I highly recommend it. :)

750 hr on a Toro Timemaster 30 already? Really??

Smallaxe
03-09-2012, 05:28 PM
Toro must have the worst web pages in the net!!! Can't find a dealer near me and no place to look... Those morons , must still have 1914 customer service...

MJB
03-09-2012, 06:18 PM
Toro must have the worst web pages in the net!!! Can't find a dealer near me and no place to look... Those morons , must still have 1914 customer service...

Check with Home Depot website.

Smallaxe
03-10-2012, 09:46 AM
Check with Home Depot website.

I'd like a dealer that can talk with me about it and test drive it... besides, HD is a long drive for me...

THEGOLDPRO
03-10-2012, 09:47 AM
I saw one at my dealer yesterday and the owner told me he woulden't even sell me one if i asked for it because i would kill it within a week lol

OakNut
03-10-2012, 10:49 AM
I don't even want to think about what one would cost if they made a commercial grade version of it.

4 seasons lawn&land
03-10-2012, 11:00 AM
You have to get something decent for $1000. It cant be that bad. It might not have grease spindles, or an oil filter motor. If you would kill it in a week, or a year for that matter it is a total piece of crap. Is that what $1000 gets you now?

f50lvr2
03-10-2012, 11:40 AM
I saw one at my dealer yesterday and the owner told me he woulden't even sell me one if i asked for it because i would kill it within a week lol

That's because he thinks he can sell you something more expensive.

yardsmart
03-10-2012, 12:04 PM
I was at dealer yesterday and he had 1 setting out. I asked him about it and he said that either the Y Bravo 25 or the 21 toro for commercial. He said he wasn't sure of the 30 yet since it has been tested. He did have some of the larger companies order a few to test them out and give him feedback when season ended. The machines i saw didn't look commercial but i am curios about them though. Time will tell if they can hold up or not to extreme use. I bet there will be several upgrades in the future.

brucec
03-10-2012, 02:59 PM
Posted via Mobile Device

brucec
03-10-2012, 03:03 PM
My Toro dealer told me today that a commercial version would be in the $1600 to $1700 range. He said he may know something mon. About a commercial version
Posted via Mobile Device

knox gsl
03-10-2012, 06:35 PM
That mower in a commercial version for $1700 would be a great deal.
Posted via Mobile Device

frameslawn
03-14-2012, 10:25 PM
Any new updates on the timemaster, thinking of purchasing one in the next few weeks

joed
03-14-2012, 10:30 PM
My local dealer told me that Toro is bringing out a commercial version of the 30" Timemaster in 2013. No details yet but that would an awesome machine.

WHIPPLE5.7
03-14-2012, 10:49 PM
My local dealer told me that Toro is bringing out a commercial version of the 30" Timemaster in 2013. No details yet but that would an awesome machine.

I doubt a dealer would even know that even if it were true. They don't leak that kind of stuff out early.

THEGOLDPRO
03-14-2012, 10:53 PM
That's because he thinks he can sell you something more expensive.

No, He just knew it was a piece of garbage. Its got a thin little stamped deck, The little lame plastic hookup for a garden hose,The wheels were completely plastic, Basically everything was made of plastic except for the deck and the engine. It was a flaming pile of homeowner garbage.

ALEX'S LANDSCAPING
03-14-2012, 10:53 PM
I just saw it at my local dealer today for the first time and man that thing is nice!

joed
03-14-2012, 11:07 PM
Here's the dealer's spring newsletter. Click on the link and scroll down to page 3. You'll see the reference to a commercial model there.

http://kooybros.com/uploads/SpringNews_SinglePages.pdf

ALEX'S LANDSCAPING
03-14-2012, 11:11 PM
Here's the dealer's spring newsletter. Click on the link and scroll down to page 3. You'll see the reference to a commercial model there.

http://kooybros.com/uploads/SpringNews_SinglePages.pdf

That's interesting.
I have not got my newsletter from Kooy Bros yet.
Thanks Joe D!

Platinum2
03-16-2012, 09:25 PM
I just bought the Timemaster today. I am not a contractor and will use this exclusively for what it was designed to do....be a residential mower.

There are few options in this class for residential machines. I looked at the Cub Cadet CC 760 at my local Cub dealer. It actually looked and felt pretty solid, but I was not convinced the long-term quality was there. It did have a nice strong motor, grease fittings and a few other nice touches. I would argue that most people who have problems with this machine likely either bought them from a box store, use them commercially, or both. I have little doubt this machine would serve a homeowner pretty well.

Anyway, also loooked at Ariens WAW 34 mower. Heavy for a homeowner machine. I would pitty most any woman that had to use it. I was turned off by the deck being welded to the machine. No good can come from that. I realize Billy Goat has a nice new model available as well. But it was up around $1700 and I felt that was pushing too far for my use.

The Timemaster is lighter weight than all of them, built well, and includes a bagger which was optional on the others. It was also the least expensive, though a low price was not my primary goal in finding a mower to suit my needs. However, it also has the smallest cut of the bunch, a tradeoff I was willing to make given the other features of the unit such as the adjustable handlebars, fast ground speed, and smallish footprint...especially when stored in the off season.

My dealer has 12 in stock, so my guess is they should be in plentiful supply at other dealers real soon for those of you who would like to own one.

Cheers!:drinkup:

OakNut
03-16-2012, 09:54 PM
I just bought the Timemaster today. I am not a contractor and will use this exclusively for what it was designed to do....be a residential mower.

There are few options in this class for residential machines. I looked at the Cub Cadet CC 760 at my local Cub dealer. It actually looked and felt pretty solid, but I was not convinced the long-term quality was there. It did have a nice strong motor, grease fittings and a few other nice touches. I would argue that most people who have problems with this machine likely either bought them from a box store, use them commercially, or both. I have little doubt this machine would serve a homeowner pretty well.

Anyway, also loooked at Ariens WAW 34 mower. Heavy for a homeowner machine. I would pitty most any woman that had to use it. I was turned off by the deck being welded to the machine. No good can come from that. I realize Billy Goat has a nice new model available as well. But it was up around $1700 and I felt that was pushing too far for my use.

The Timemaster is lighter weight than all of them, built well, and includes a bagger which was optional on the others. It was also the least expensive, though a low price was not my primary goal in finding a mower to suit my needs. However, it also has the smallest cut of the bunch, a tradeoff I was willing to make given the other features of the unit such as the adjustable handlebars, fast ground speed, and smallish footprint...especially when stored in the off season.

My dealer has 12 in stock, so my guess is they should be in plentiful supply at other dealers real soon for those of you who would like to own one.

Cheers!:drinkup:

After you've used it a bit, your input would be appreciated - contractor or not.

Mulching/bagging performance, bagging, ease/difficulty of use - how does it handle on turns...

Congrats on the new mower! Had I not just bought a $5,000 36" walk behind, I'd be considering one of these for a few specific applications.

Platinum2
03-16-2012, 10:50 PM
After you've used it a bit, your input would be appreciated - contractor or not.

Mulching/bagging performance, bagging, ease/difficulty of use - how does it handle on turns...

Congrats on the new mower! Had I not just bought a $5,000 36" walk behind, I'd be considering one of these for a few specific applications.

Sounds like Toro may begin producing a commercial version next year. That may be a good fit for contractor purposes. If the Timemaster proves to be a good unit, I can only imagine a commercial unit being even better. i will post a review when the mowing season gets underway. My previous mower was a 22" Toro Recycler, so that will be a good benchmark from which to compare.Thumbs Up

Exact Rototilling
03-17-2012, 01:03 AM
Yes the easy fold up vertical handle for a low foot print stow is a good point for contractors as well. Less trailer truck space required and it's a single lever process. I took note of that feature when I saw it and was reminded of.it when i saw the toro video today. The mower.with.electric start and personal pace might be something my wife could use to help me mow certain types of lawns with. She has a calcified tendon that I think is mainly activated by recoil starting. I was also looking at this mower to have a noob helper. Maybe my 11 year old son.....? Less intimidating than starting out with a bigger mower thus damage to my equipment and properties etc.....?
Posted via Mobile Device

Exact Rototilling
03-17-2012, 01:12 AM
Sounds like Toro may begin producing a commercial version next year. That may be a good fit for contractor purposes. If the Timemaster proves to be a good unit, I can only imagine a commercial unit being even better. i will post a review when the mowing season gets underway. My previous mower was a 22" Toro Recycler, so that will be a good benchmark from which to compare.Thumbs Up

If Toro is looking for a R&D field tester for a commercial version 30" look no futher.

My favorite mowers are.the Ybravo 25 and the BOP Quickie 32 dually hydro. I also own a Lawn Solutions aerator that Toro bought out. :) Small lawns is.my gig.

I guarantee I could get the machine dialed in by August of this year.easy. Best blades, the machine will ready.to go and contractor approved.

We just need to keep.the weight down on it.

:waving:
Posted via Mobile Device

Platinum2
03-17-2012, 01:13 AM
I got the electric start model for the rare occasion that I let the wife touch our lawn.:laugh:

Exact Rototilling
03-17-2012, 01:22 AM
I got the electric start model for the rare occasion that I let the wife touch our lawn.:laugh:

Yes the Toro YouTube video.with the small stature lady running it is slick. That really got me thinking .....it looks so easy....even my wife can run one with pro results....? Maybe....
Posted via Mobile Device

jlanfran
03-17-2012, 07:02 PM
Can anyone comment on the TimeMaster's performance on grade? The Toro website mentions a "traction assist" feature.

Exact Rototilling
03-17-2012, 07:22 PM
Can anyone comment on the TimeMaster's performance on grade? The Toro website mentions a "traction assist" feature.

It is just a blue grab finger anchor to offset the added resistance of going uphill so there.is.less.pushing on.the handle with wheels slippage while going up a grade.
Posted via Mobile Device

smallstripesnc
03-17-2012, 07:45 PM
I've had this unit for a few weeks now and have been using it on 5+ lawns daily since the say I got it.

I actually am really disappointed with Briggs and Stratton. The parts that I thought would give issues aren't its the engine. I wouldn't even say the machine is "under powered" but the other day I was cutting a lawn and I stopped and disengaged the blades to pick something up and the engine rpm's shot up like crazy! It sounded like it was about to take off from the deck and go into outer space!

I immediately shut down the machine and inspected the major components and everything checked out okay and I re-started the machine and it was the same way. I tried engaging the blades still the same high rpm's. Also a click/clank sound developed at the same time. The noise only happens when you engage the blades but is fine after they fully engage, and it happens when your holding down the off switch to shut it down and does it until its shut down completely.

I took the unit to the dealer and they said that Briggs and Stratton must not of tightened the governor down well because it came loose and caused the high rpm's it was an easy fix but the click/clank noise the dealer blamed on the recoil is not the issue. I mentioned the noise to him after he brought the machine out to help load it up for me. He kept blaming the recoil and tried to take off the nuts to inspect it but he claimed they were torqued too tight and he couldn't get them off. He said he'll order a new hood which will come with the recoil so it will fix the issue and said to go home and run it anyways and if it messes up bring it back.

I got it home inspected it myself and well the guy B.S'ed me about the nuts because one was missing so I'm sure he did take the recoil off to adjust the governor. I also had my wife hold down the off switch while I inspected the machine for the noise. Well it turns out its the auto choke rod that goes from the carb to something next to the muffler. I immediately called the dealer and told him about it. The dealer said to bring it back so I did. He tried to tell me that the noise was normal and since I had issues with the unit I was "hearing things" and at that point I was pretty pissed because it DID NOT make the noise before the high rpm thing. At that time he mentioned that the high rpm thing was my fault because he claimed there's a metal piece that has a spring that goes to the governor and the piece was bent and I must of hit it. That was B.S because I looked at a brand new unit and after they "adjusted it back" it looks exactly the same as the new unit and you could see the metal piece was not touched because if it was I'd see some sort of marks or where it was bent but I didn't. It looks shiny and new just like the new units they have.

When I got home I contacted toro and explained the issues.

So I brushed it off and took the unit to a few lawns the next day and it lasted one before the high rpm thing happened again! At the time it happened Toro called me and asked if the issues were still there and I told them the click/clank noise was and explained about what it was and that the dealer claimed I was "hearing things" and even they said its not normal and needs to be fixed and also told her the high rpm thing just happened again! She said to bring it back to the dealer and call her back to tell them the mower is there and they will have a toro rep in contact with the dealer to either hear about the issues over the phone or maybe make a visit to see themselves.

I am SOOOO frustrated! You guys were probably all right about this unit not withstanding daily use. Its not even the toro end of it really its the Briggs and Stratton engine! I am constantly getting phone calls and literally have tons of calls daily for new clients I'm already near 30 clients and can't afford to have this machine down!

Who knows when it'll be fixed the dealer said it could be a week to a month or so just depends when they can get to it and when the toro rep gets up with them and he said it may be awhile because they never contact the dealers when they say they will!

I'm down $1000 pretty much and could of gotten a decent older 32 or 36 belt walk behind for a few bucks more!

A commercial version better have a better engine or I wouldn't purchase it!

Snapper Jack
03-17-2012, 08:21 PM
It doesn't take a "KEEN EYE" to know that 30" timemaster is nothing but a bolted together pile of crap. A $1000 down the John is a hard learning experience for sure could of bought a real decent used commercial mower no doubt and I hope it all works out for you in the end.

smallstripesnc
03-17-2012, 08:25 PM
It doesn't take a "KEEN EYE" to know that 30" timemaster is nothing but a bolted together pile of crap. A $1000 down the John is a hard learning experience for sure could of bought a real decent used commeracial mower no doubt and I hope it all works out for you in the end.

Thanks and I'm praying Toro will take care of everything for me because otherwise I'll definitely make sure everyone on lawnsite and everyone I know really knows how Toro and Briggs and Stratton are!

I'm lucky enough to have a friend thats letting me borrow a 48 walk behind for a few days next week so I can hopefully play catch up and knock out some properties. But its not a permanent solution and I need to hopefully get the Timemaster 30 fixed ASAP but I'm not counting on it or get a 32 or 36 walk behind but I just don't have the funds now to get one. I was really counting on the new unit to be semi-reliable and I wouldn't of expected the engine to be giving me issues if anything the mower design itself to give issues!

Exact Rototilling
03-17-2012, 09:22 PM
Well this is a great explanation why the dealer support issue with a name brand is bunk. All depends on.the dealer. I'd rather fix the thing myself and.save time overall.

I belive the engine is largely the same brigs pro on my Lawn Solutions aerator and.what is also on.the Turfco XT5.

If you have that.many accounts and only one.mower might want to get another back up mower.
Posted via Mobile Device

Smallaxe
03-18-2012, 09:10 AM
... Its not even the toro end of it really its the Briggs and Stratton engine! I am constantly getting phone calls and literally have tons of calls daily for new clients I'm already near 30 clients and can't afford to have this machine down! ...

Briggs and Stratton has been junk ever since their 'strike' years ago... I do not buy B&S engines for the business anymore... I even quit buying them for personal use...

smallstripesnc
03-18-2012, 11:53 AM
Briggs and Stratton has been junk ever since their 'strike' years ago... I do not buy B&S engines for the business anymore... I even quit buying them for personal use...

I will never purchase a briggs and stratton engine again. I'm pretty much going to loose my business over the issues because they definitely aren't being speedy about fixing the unit.

NEPAbowhunter
03-18-2012, 11:54 AM
Why purchase a residential lawnmower for a commercial lawn mowing business, use it multiple times a day, day in and day out on customers lawns, then when it breaks complain about it?:confused:

smallstripesnc
03-18-2012, 12:13 PM
Why purchase a residential lawnmower for a commercial lawn mowing business, use it multiple times a day, day in and day out on customers lawns, then when it breaks complain about it?:confused:

The last component I would of expected to fail is the engine. Briggs and Stratton have always made good engines but I guess now they are slacking and a "cheap" company just trying to make a quick dollar and not caring about if their engines last!

Your right I shouldn't of bought a residential unit for commercial use but I've only had it since 2/28/2012 and its already giving me issues! With the hours I've put on it the unit would of lasted approximately one mowing season or less for a home owner.

MJB
03-18-2012, 12:16 PM
That sounds like a fluke that happened during production. A loose bolt can happen on any commercial mowers too. I bought a brand new Exmark $9000 a few yrs back and the air cleaner was not attached to the carb the hose was just butted up to it. Luckily I caught it after my initial inspection after it was delivered.

The Briggs engine didn't fail, the unit was not inspected properly by your dealer, or you. Granted that is not something you normally watch for.

smallstripesnc
03-18-2012, 12:21 PM
That sounds like a fluke that happened during production. A loose bolt can happen on any commercial mowers too. I bought a brand new Exmark $9000 a few yrs back and the air cleaner was not attached to the carb the hose was just butted up to it. Luckily I caught it after my initial inspection after it was delivered.

The Briggs engine didn't fail, the unit was not inspected properly by your dealer, or you. Granted that is not something you normally watch for.

You do have a point but I got it repaired and then the next day the first lawn I cut with it after being fixed the issue happened again! Also the auto choke rod going from the carb to a piece next to the muffler shouldn't be making noise but it is. It started with the high rpm thing and the dealer says I'm "hearing things" but toro says it shouldn't be making any noise or anything like that. Like you said I'm dealing with a bad dealer and it just sucks.

weaver
03-18-2012, 12:29 PM
I've had this unit for a few weeks now and have been using it on 5+ lawns daily since the say I got it.

I actually am really disappointed with Briggs and Stratton. The parts that I thought would give issues aren't its the engine. I wouldn't even say the machine is "under powered" but the other day I was cutting a lawn and I stopped and disengaged the blades to pick something up and the engine rpm's shot up like crazy! It sounded like it was about to take off from the deck and go into outer space!

I immediately shut down the machine and inspected the major components and everything checked out okay and I re-started the machine and it was the same way. I tried engaging the blades still the same high rpm's. Also a click/clank sound developed at the same time. The noise only happens when you engage the blades but is fine after they fully engage, and it happens when your holding down the off switch to shut it down and does it until its shut down completely.

I took the unit to the dealer and they said that Briggs and Stratton must not of tightened the governor down well because it came loose and caused the high rpm's it was an easy fix but the click/clank noise the dealer blamed on the recoil is not the issue. I mentioned the noise to him after he brought the machine out to help load it up for me. He kept blaming the recoil and tried to take off the nuts to inspect it but he claimed they were torqued too tight and he couldn't get them off. He said he'll order a new hood which will come with the recoil so it will fix the issue and said to go home and run it anyways and if it messes up bring it back.

I got it home inspected it myself and well the guy B.S'ed me about the nuts because one was missing so I'm sure he did take the recoil off to adjust the governor. I also had my wife hold down the off switch while I inspected the machine for the noise. Well it turns out its the auto choke rod that goes from the carb to something next to the muffler. I immediately called the dealer and told him about it. The dealer said to bring it back so I did. He tried to tell me that the noise was normal and since I had issues with the unit I was "hearing things" and at that point I was pretty pissed because it DID NOT make the noise before the high rpm thing. At that time he mentioned that the high rpm thing was my fault because he claimed there's a metal piece that has a spring that goes to the governor and the piece was bent and I must of hit it. That was B.S because I looked at a brand new unit and after they "adjusted it back" it looks exactly the same as the new unit and you could see the metal piece was not touched because if it was I'd see some sort of marks or where it was bent but I didn't. It looks shiny and new just like the new units they have.

When I got home I contacted toro and explained the issues.

So I brushed it off and took the unit to a few lawns the next day and it lasted one before the high rpm thing happened again! At the time it happened Toro called me and asked if the issues were still there and I told them the click/clank noise was and explained about what it was and that the dealer claimed I was "hearing things" and even they said its not normal and needs to be fixed and also told her the high rpm thing just happened again! She said to bring it back to the dealer and call her back to tell them the mower is there and they will have a toro rep in contact with the dealer to either hear about the issues over the phone or maybe make a visit to see themselves.

I am SOOOO frustrated! You guys were probably all right about this unit not withstanding daily use. Its not even the toro end of it really its the Briggs and Stratton engine! I am constantly getting phone calls and literally have tons of calls daily for new clients I'm already near 30 clients and can't afford to have this machine down!

Who knows when it'll be fixed the dealer said it could be a week to a month or so just depends when they can get to it and when the toro rep gets up with them and he said it may be awhile because they never contact the dealers when they say they will!

I'm down $1000 pretty much and could of gotten a decent older 32 or 36 belt walk behind for a few bucks more!

A commercial version better have a better engine or I wouldn't purchase it!

Hey man sorry you are having problems with your new mower... Don't you atleast have a 30 or 90 day replacement or return policy? I do know if you bought it at home depot i think it's a 30 day return policy... Hope this info helps you...

MJB
03-18-2012, 12:31 PM
You do have a point but I got it repaired and then the next day the first lawn I cut with it after being fixed the issue happened again! Also the auto choke rod going from the carb to a piece next to the muffler shouldn't be making noise but it is. It started with the high rpm thing and the dealer says I'm "hearing things" but toro says it shouldn't be making any noise or anything like that. Like you said I'm dealing with a bad dealer and it just sucks.

Can you afford to buy a cheap walk behind for 3 or $400 to keep going until this is resolved? You may find this will get fixed and the mower may work great the rest of the year. I bought a cheap Toro from Home Depot last year for $300 and it works great even though its built cheap. Its the Personal Pace mower 22" might even be the same engine. I'll have to look. I have more problems with Honda engines than anything else. Makes me think it's all about the luck of the draw these days as to what you get.

smallstripesnc
03-18-2012, 12:33 PM
Hey man sorry you are having problems with your new mower... Don't you atleast have a 30 or 90 day replacement or return policy? I do know if you bought it at home depot i think it's a 30 day return policy... Hope this info helps you...

I bought it from Interstate supplies and services in Stallings, NC. I WISH I bought it from Home dept because they would probably exchange or return it.

weaver
03-18-2012, 12:34 PM
I just looked at Home Depots website and they do have a 90 return policy 100% refund...

smallstripesnc
03-18-2012, 12:37 PM
Can you afford to buy a cheap walk behind for 3 or $400 to keep going until this is resolved? You may find this will get fixed and the mower may work great the rest of the year. I bought a cheap Toro from Home Depot last year for $300 and it works great even though its built cheap. Its the Personal Pace mower 22" might even be the same engine. I'll have to look. I have more problems with Honda engines than anything else. Makes me think it's all about the luck of the draw these days as to what you get.

I have a 22" Toro personal pace but it smokes when you start it and when you shut it down. It also uses oil. Another Briggs and Stratton but its the 7.0 torque not the 8.75 on the timemaster.

I found that a commercial Snapper 21" with the same Briggs and Stratton 8.75 engine has an oil filter! To me an engine with an oil filter seems that they are selling it to last not to be replaced in a year of so.

Your right though I may get it back and it may be the most reliable machine ever but it is all about luck these days it seems.

I have a 19 inch Lawnboy 2 cycle mower but it doesn't adjust to 3.5 inches and a lot of my clients will get pissed if I cut 3 inches.

OakNut
03-18-2012, 12:45 PM
I bought it from Interstate supplies and services in Stallings, NC. I WISH I bought it from Home dept because they would probably exchange or return it.

I can almost guarantee you that my dealer would have just given me a new unit if I were having the issues you are having - especially since it's a new design and "bugs" can happen.

Home Depot may take the return, but if you need it serviced, you may as well pull up a chair and grab a good book.



I predict this thread will become the poster child for "I told you they are junk". All over one reported issue.

smallstripesnc
03-18-2012, 12:48 PM
I can almost guarantee you that my dealer would have just given me a new unit if I were having the issues you are having - especially since it's a new design and "bugs" can happen.

Home Depot may take the return, but if you need it serviced, you may as well pull up a chair and grab a good book.



I predict this thread will become the poster child for "I told you they are junk". All over one reported issue.

I wish the dealer I got it from would just give me a new unit because as all of you know you CAN'T afford down time! My phone has been ringing off the hook the past week or so and I'm at 30 clients or so and counting and I just can't use a 19 inch lawn boy or a 22 recycler on that many lawns! Even if I hire help it will be hard but I really can't afford to hire help yet and don't want to if I don't have to!

I already see the "I told you so" coming my way!

weaver
03-18-2012, 12:48 PM
I can almost guarantee you that my dealer would have just given me a new unit if I were having the issues you are having - especially since it's a new design and "bugs" can happen.

Home Depot may take the return, but if you need it serviced, you may as well pull up a chair and grab a good book.



I predict this thread will become the poster child for "I told you they are junk". All over one reported issue.

What's the difference ? He said his dealer won't get in no hurry about fixing it.. What do you think he's gonna be like when it comes time for service... Home depot would have gave him a new mower no questions asked and he would be out making money again... Bottom line... So much for his dealer support..

smallstripesnc
03-18-2012, 12:52 PM
What's the difference ? He said his dealer won't get in no hurry about fixing it.. What do you think he's gonna be like when it comes time for service... Home depot would have gave him a new mower no questions asked and he would be out making money again... Bottom line... So much for his dealer support..

I can only imagine how quick they will be about servicing the unit! I better get a comfortable chair and a really long book for that!

I agree so much for dealer support. I guess buying at the big box store would of been the better option!

Exact Rototilling
03-18-2012, 01:00 PM
Just buy another Toro 30 from Home Depot already...

You need another back up mower right. If it turns out to be a POS return it.
Posted via Mobile Device

OakNut
03-18-2012, 01:00 PM
What's the difference ? He said his dealer won't get in no hurry about fixing it.. What do you think he's gonna be like when it comes time for service... Home depot would have gave him a new mower no questions asked and he would be out making money again... Bottom line... So much for his dealer support..

True, since his dealer doesn't seem to be interested in helping him. That said, after 90 days, Home Depot isn't going to be any more useful.

Most people buy things because they plan on using them for more than 90 days and expect the repairs to come much later than that. A good dealer is always the better choice.

MJB
03-18-2012, 02:26 PM
True, since his dealer doesn't seem to be interested in helping him. That said, after 90 days, Home Depot isn't going to be any more useful.

Most people buy things because they plan on using them for more than 90 days and expect the repairs to come much later than that. A good dealer is always the better choice.

A good deealer will tell you your not suppose to use it commercially, so they won't be much help to a newby with no dealer relationship . Where if you buy from Home Depot you can get most parts, and do it yourself if needed. Everyone that buys 1 of these better inspect it more often especially the gov, linkage etc.

Richard Martin
03-18-2012, 03:05 PM
The last component I would of expected to fail is the engine. Briggs and Stratton have always made good engines but I guess now they are slacking and a "cheap" company just trying to make a quick dollar and not caring about if their engines last!

I don't know what planet you're from but Briggs has anything but a good reputation. They have always made bottom of the barrel engines that go on the cheapest mowers out there. At one time they made a decent larger engine but their small engines have always been junk.

When myself and others with similar experiences warned you about this little Briggs engine did you think we were talking out of our asses? :nono:

JCLawn and more
03-18-2012, 03:19 PM
I've had this unit for a few weeks now and have been using it on 5+ lawns daily since the say I got it.

I actually am really disappointed with Briggs and Stratton. The parts that I thought would give issues aren't its the engine. I wouldn't even say the machine is "under powered" but the other day I was cutting a lawn and I stopped and disengaged the blades to pick something up and the engine rpm's shot up like crazy! It sounded like it was about to take off from the deck and go into outer space!

I immediately shut down the machine and inspected the major components and everything checked out okay and I re-started the machine and it was the same way. I tried engaging the blades still the same high rpm's. Also a click/clank sound developed at the same time. The noise only happens when you engage the blades but is fine after they fully engage, and it happens when your holding down the off switch to shut it down and does it until its shut down completely.

I took the unit to the dealer and they said that Briggs and Stratton must not of tightened the governor down well because it came loose and caused the high rpm's it was an easy fix but the click/clank noise the dealer blamed on the recoil is not the issue. I mentioned the noise to him after he brought the machine out to help load it up for me. He kept blaming the recoil and tried to take off the nuts to inspect it but he claimed they were torqued too tight and he couldn't get them off. He said he'll order a new hood which will come with the recoil so it will fix the issue and said to go home and run it anyways and if it messes up bring it back.

I got it home inspected it myself and well the guy B.S'ed me about the nuts because one was missing so I'm sure he did take the recoil off to adjust the governor. I also had my wife hold down the off switch while I inspected the machine for the noise. Well it turns out its the auto choke rod that goes from the carb to something next to the muffler. I immediately called the dealer and told him about it. The dealer said to bring it back so I did. He tried to tell me that the noise was normal and since I had issues with the unit I was "hearing things" and at that point I was pretty pissed because it DID NOT make the noise before the high rpm thing. At that time he mentioned that the high rpm thing was my fault because he claimed there's a metal piece that has a spring that goes to the governor and the piece was bent and I must of hit it. That was B.S because I looked at a brand new unit and after they "adjusted it back" it looks exactly the same as the new unit and you could see the metal piece was not touched because if it was I'd see some sort of marks or where it was bent but I didn't. It looks shiny and new just like the new units they have.

When I got home I contacted toro and explained the issues.

So I brushed it off and took the unit to a few lawns the next day and it lasted one before the high rpm thing happened again! At the time it happened Toro called me and asked if the issues were still there and I told them the click/clank noise was and explained about what it was and that the dealer claimed I was "hearing things" and even they said its not normal and needs to be fixed and also told her the high rpm thing just happened again! She said to bring it back to the dealer and call her back to tell them the mower is there and they will have a toro rep in contact with the dealer to either hear about the issues over the phone or maybe make a visit to see themselves.

I am SOOOO frustrated! You guys were probably all right about this unit not withstanding daily use. Its not even the toro end of it really its the Briggs and Stratton engine! I am constantly getting phone calls and literally have tons of calls daily for new clients I'm already near 30 clients and can't afford to have this machine down!

Who knows when it'll be fixed the dealer said it could be a week to a month or so just depends when they can get to it and when the toro rep gets up with them and he said it may be awhile because they never contact the dealers when they say they will!

I'm down $1000 pretty much and could of gotten a decent older 32 or 36 belt walk behind for a few bucks more!

A commercial version better have a better engine or I wouldn't purchase it!

I called my dealer for information on this unit. They told me as follows "We are not carrying toro snow blowers and toro push mowers this year. Toro is using a B&S engine that is made in china and they keep coming in for warranty work for the same reason and we refuse to sell them until they fix the issue." I told them thank you for not selling crap.

WHIPPLE5.7
03-18-2012, 03:26 PM
Well, we can all agree that this machine has some issues but that was to be expected. I commend Toro for trying something innovative and hope they take feedback from people and roll out a better one mid season or next year. I like this size machine but I'm not buying one yet. Every other LCO in my area uses Walkers and Toro Grandstands on 1/4acre or less size lots. I feel that is a total waste of a large hig dollar machine. I currently use a BOP 36 dually but it won't be around forever. I think if/when I break away from solo and hire 2 guys I'll have them on Ybravo 25s and Toro 30's. Much improved production rated over 21's and way less overhead than Walkers and Grandstands.

MJB
03-18-2012, 03:48 PM
You should get 300 hrs out of a cheap briggs anyway. I got one with 200 hrs that is used on steep hills but it is just a 3.5 hp unit on a murray mower. I change the oil once a year because its a throw away mower, but it keeps working. Are the newer B&S made worse than they were 5 yrs ago?

Exact Rototilling
03-18-2012, 07:29 PM
I called my dealer for information on this unit. They told me as follows "We are not carrying toro snow blowers and toro push mowers this year. Toro is using a B&S engine that is made in china and they keep coming in for warranty work for the same reason and we refuse to sell them until they fix the issue." I told them thank you for not selling crap.

Now I'm wondering if the brigs pro on my Lawn Solutions is made in China ....:confused:

Same engine on the XT5.....
Posted via Mobile Device

sjessen
03-18-2012, 08:23 PM
Every manufacturer is trying to cut costs on every component of every product any way they can. Say Briggs sells 10,000,000 small engines per year worldwide. If they can save a quarter on each one they are looking at $2,500,000 extra profit. It may mean the difference between being profitable or not. Unfortunately, along with cost savings oftentimes comes cuts in quality and reliability. Am guessing something like this has happened here.

Fire/Grass
03-18-2012, 08:31 PM
I am just a residential homeowner who is in the market for a new mower. I was really excited about the timemaster but am doubting it more and more. I wanted to stay under a $1000 dollars for my unit. I am only mowing around 1/4 of an acre, but wanted to be able to do it quickly. Kids going in 10 different directions with all the activities. I have one with my name on it once they take delievery, but not sure if I should just go with the Honda HRX now with these Briggs issues. My dealer seems to like the Briggs engines, but has steered me away from other Toro's which he said had the undesirable engine package. I need to pull the trigger soon. Grass needs cut.

Platinum2
03-18-2012, 10:22 PM
I would like to chime in on a few points here. First of all, I want to be clear about the fact that I am a residential user. I have some family that was in the lawncare business years ago, but I have not ever worked in that capacity.

That said, any B&S motor I have ever used has never given me any problems regardless of what it was mounted on. The only exception was a 16HP B&S that needed a rebuild after 15 years and lord knows how many hours. With the exception of routine maintenance, these engines require very little in my experience.

About the TimeMaster.....I just bought mine and have not used it yet. My dealer indicated to me that Toro put a considerable amount of time in R&D and field testing of this unit. From what I understand, Toro put many hours of use on their test models, hit various objects to test blade skipping resiliance, and conducted other fail tests. When Toro was satisfied with the performace, they ok'd production.

What can I conclude? Well, most likely, this unit will be solid. Assembly and QC may lag a bit in the beginning like most other mass produced products, but as production moves forward I would expect things to tighen up considerably. As with most any residential equipment, I expect those using it for commercial purposes will be the one's having the majority of the problems and thus, crying foul. :nono: That certainly seems to be the case here with some. Therefore, I propose we all take the following oath:

"Thou shall not use residential mowing equipment for commercial purposes, use the hell out of it, have it break as a result, and whine to others that said equipment is unreliable garbage." I'm just sayin'..........

There are many forum members who want to hear reviews of the product being used for which it was designed. I think this should be the focus for discussions related to this product going forward.

Quotient
03-18-2012, 10:50 PM
I have about 10 residential lawns which have narrow backyard gates that won't permit entry of my 48 walk-behind. For that reason, I've been eye(ing) the new 30 inch Toro TimeMaster like a fox eyes a rabbit. It just seems like it could be such a time-saver; but I can't get over the idea of having a Briggs-n-Stratton engine. I know from decades of experience that they are junk... and I'm sure that Toro feels that Briggs is their only choice for this mower because of how cheaply they can buy them... and in this manner Toro can sell this mower at a decent price-point to the consumer. That's all fine and good for them, but whenever I purchase lawn equipment, I always look for the availability of a non-Briggs, non-Kohler, non-Tecumseh engine, and in this case it appears that no quality engine options are being offered.

Truthfully, I'd glady pay $300 or $400 more for this mower if it had a Kawasaki or Robin engine, or even a Honda; but the idea of relying on a Briggs engine just bothers me to the point of having a nervous breakdown. I think I'm just going to stick with my few old Snapper 21 inch commercial push mowers with Wisconsin Robin engines. It takes way too much time to mow large backyard areas with a 21, but at least I know the engines are bullet-proof.

It looks like the engine, and the plastic wheels, are the only noticeable drawbacks to this mower. I wonder how tough it would be to yank the stock engine and replace it with something....... ...... Japanese.

Snapper Jack
03-19-2012, 02:22 AM
I have an old Snapper Jet Vac with a Briggs OHV 6.5Hp with over 1000 hrs and is just now seeping oil out the crank seals, which I plan on replacing soon.Briggs engine life expectancy is a hit and miss and if you look at the statistics over decades of usage with anything associated for residential or commercially with an Briggs engine,you're gonna receive negative feed back and it's Briggs who's has cast this shadow over their heads for producing a faulty and cheap product. The only real Briggs meant for commercial or residential usage would be the Vanguard engine.

Smallaxe
03-19-2012, 09:37 AM
I haven't gone to look at the Exmark 26 yet... Does Exmark use both B&S AND Honda engines...

I don't know if B&S is capable of producing reliable machines, it must be just the luck of the draw... Toro used to have a quality engine years ago, that very well may have been manufactured by B&S back then, but it seems that many manufacturers are just picking up any substandard unit that B&S puts out...

Platinum2
03-19-2012, 10:37 AM
I have about 10 residential lawns which have narrow backyard gates that won't permit entry of my 48 walk-behind. For that reason, I've been eye(ing) the new 30 inch Toro TimeMaster like a fox eyes a rabbit. It just seems like it could be such a time-saver; but I can't get over the idea of having a Briggs-n-Stratton engine. I know from decades of experience that they are junk... and I'm sure that Toro feels that Briggs is their only choice for this mower because of how cheaply they can buy them... and in this manner Toro can sell this mower at a decent price-point to the consumer. That's all fine and good for them, but whenever I purchase lawn equipment, I always look for the availability of a non-Briggs, non-Kohler, non-Tecumseh engine, and in this case it appears that no quality engine options are being offered.

Truthfully, I'd glady pay $300 or $400 more for this mower if it had a Kawasaki or Robin engine, or even a Honda; but the idea of relying on a Briggs engine just bothers me to the point of having a nervous breakdown. I think I'm just going to stick with my few old Snapper 21 inch commercial push mowers with Wisconsin Robin engines. It takes way too much time to mow large backyard areas with a 21, but at least I know the engines are bullet-proof.

It looks like the engine, and the plastic wheels, are the only noticeable drawbacks to this mower. I wonder how tough it would be to yank the stock engine and replace it with something....... ...... Japanese.

Toro already indicated that a commercial version of the TimeMaster would be available in 2013. I'm sure it will have the powerplant you are seeking. Why not just be patient and use your Snapper:confused:s for one more season and replace them next year with the commercial Toro?

bizeagle
03-19-2012, 05:39 PM
I read these pessimistic comments about the dual blade system on this new Toro mower. There seems to be some misunderstanding about the design. I was skeptical too because the blades are driven by a belt (my old GTS-5 eats belts like peanuts due to my ultra thick zoysia and the way the belt drive system is exposed to debris from mulching system). I have been interested in the TimeMaster for the feature set as my old GTS-5 is very old and tired. I started by looking at the photos & schematics to understand the engineering behind the cutting system and came away fairly impressed. First of all, the blades are mechanically linked in a synchronous a metal gear transmission that is isolated from the underside of the deck. So, unless the metal gears break, the blades cannot collide. Secondly, the power input side to the entire blade transmission is one single belt driven pulley. So, if the blade hits a stump, the belt will slip instead breaking the gears in the blade transmission.
Secondly, as the blades are very short 15.4" vs. 21/ 22" inch blade, grass resistance has less impact against the force of the blades, giving the cutting system more leverage to overcome the grass.
Third, the blades spin at a very high speed in opposite directions to keep the grass suspended in the air pocket under the deck delivering many cuts to each piece of grass until the pieces becomes too small and slip out of the turbulence. So, conceptually, it should be a great mulcher and produce a beautiful cut. I also like the larger rear wheels which should provide extra traction. I am stoked about the design because I am looking for a mower that saves me time, stands up to zoysia while still delivering a great cut. I will keep a watch on this forum to see what everyone's experience is over the next several months as southern lawns are getting thicker as the weather warms up. Also, after reading about all the exploding transmissions on Hondas, I am not going in that direction despite their new 6 year warranty. I am trying to find a dealer that will let me try one out on my lawn.

Valk
03-20-2012, 01:20 PM
the blades spin at a very high speed in opposite directions to keep the grass suspended in the air pocket under the deck
If the blades are indeed spinning in opposite directions, how would this mower properly discharge the clippings?

Valk
03-20-2012, 01:56 PM
Regarding the governor issue:

IFF this engine is anything like the B&S on Super Recycler 21s (from '07 and earlier)...then one MUST be careful when mowing around low shrubs and low branches. The governor spring/mount are right out front and exposed...and the mount would easily bend inward...or even outward if it got hung up in a particular way. I've even had the spring yanked off/bent/FUBAR'd -> making for an extra trip to the mower shop just to get a dang replacement spring.

JCat
03-20-2012, 02:26 PM
Based on all that I have read here, I am leaning towards the Xmark :

http://r3.cygnuspub.com/files/cygnus/image/GIP/2011/FEB/600x400/commercial21xseries_10225603.jpg

It is still a Toro !

JCLawn and more
03-20-2012, 02:31 PM
If the blades are indeed spinning in opposite directions, how would this mower properly discharge the clippings?

it would be like a walker mower. Its made to bag so the discharge is the rear and it your open side spout then it would be really mulched by the time it gets discharged.

MJB
03-20-2012, 02:58 PM
The Timemaster blades are timed but both go the same direction. Looking at the pic under the deck at the blades,and the baffles, it actually looks like it will bag dry grass well. Mulching might be ok but not when cutting more than 1.5 inches. They are not like the walkers blades or the edges would be opposite each other.

JCLawn and more
03-20-2012, 03:02 PM
The Timemaster blades are timed but both go the same direction. Looking at the pic under the deck at the blades,and the baffles, it actually looks like it will bag dry grass well. Mulching might be ok but not when cutting more than 1.5 inches. They are not like the walkers blades or the edges would be opposite each other.

I did not know, just that if they went in opposite direction it would be like a walker.

bizeagle
03-20-2012, 03:29 PM
I got a better look at the drive system schematic and found that the blades are driven by cogs which mesh with a cog belt. Just like a timing belt on an automotive engine, the blades are kept in synch by the cogs on the belt. The cog belt is driven by a separate V-belt pulley and 1 of 2 v-belts. So there are a total of 3 belts: 1 Cog belt to synch & drive the blades, 1 v-belt to drive the cog belt off the engine crank shaft and 1 v-belt to drive the rear wheels off the engine crank shaft. So the shock absorption for the blade drive is a combination of V-belt slippage, belt flex and springs on the belt tension pulleys.

Regarding the bagging, based on the diagrams, as the blades rotate toward each other from front to back, the blades generate back pressure from the center of the deck toward the rear of the deck. So, when the back deck door is open and the bag is on, the air pressure goes straight out the back of the mower. Close the back door and the pressure goes upward, pushes the grass to the ceiling of the deck and recirculates the grass to the middle over and over, mulching it into a fine particles. If the TimeMaster mulches like my old GTS-5 Super Recycler(which is a much better mulcher than the current Super Recycler) I will like this mower. Wanting to find a dealer who will let me try a TimeMaster my zoysia.

Richard Martin
03-20-2012, 03:54 PM
Based on all that I have read here, I am leaning towards the Xmark It is still a Toro !

It's actually an Exmark. Toro owns Exmark and they may share some technology but they are still competitors. Kinda like Jeff Gordon and Dale Earnhart Jr. One owner, two teams.

Richard Martin
03-20-2012, 03:56 PM
Who's just making stuff up? I thought the blades were counter rotating and driven by a gear box with metal gears. Didn't someone say that?

The cogged belt setup sucks.

MJB
03-20-2012, 04:20 PM
I got a better look at the drive system schematic and found that the blades are driven by cogs which mesh with a cog belt. Just like a timing belt on an automotive engine, the blades are kept in synch by the cogs on the belt. The cog belt is driven by a separate V-belt pulley and 1 of 2 v-belts. So there are a total of 3 belts: 1 Cog belt to synch & drive the blades, 1 v-belt to drive the cog belt off the engine crank shaft and 1 v-belt to drive the rear wheels off the engine crank shaft. So the shock absorption for the blade drive is a combination of V-belt slippage, belt flex and springs on the belt tension pulleys.

Regarding the bagging, based on the diagrams, as the blades rotate toward each other from front to back, the blades generate back pressure from the center of the deck toward the rear of the deck. So, when the back deck door is open and the bag is on, the air pressure goes straight out the back of the mower. Close the back door and the pressure goes upward, pushes the grass to the ceiling of the deck and recirculates the grass to the middle over and over, mulching it into a fine particles. If the TimeMaster mulches like my old GTS-5 Super Recycler(which is a much better mulcher than the current Super Recycler) I will like this mower. Wanting to find a dealer who will let me try a TimeMaster my zoysia.


Where did you find those pics of the drive schematics? Can ypu post it here for the rest of us to see? I like the idea as long as we can access the belts once per yr to adjust or replace per year.

Valk
03-20-2012, 04:32 PM
BOTH blades rotate clockwise from the operator's perspective:

http://www.toro.com/en-us/Homeowner/Pages/timemaster/feature3.aspx

bizeagle
03-20-2012, 04:34 PM
Here it is. See attachment

Exact Rototilling
03-20-2012, 04:36 PM
BOTH blades rotate clockwise:

http://www.toro.com/en-us/Homeowner/Pages/timemaster/feature3.aspx

Yes also confirmed by Toro YouTube video.
Posted via Mobile Device

Richard Martin
03-20-2012, 05:28 PM
From just looking at the parts diagram I can see nothing special about this mower. It looks just like the same transmission you see on a million other mowers.

MJB
03-20-2012, 08:29 PM
From just looking at the parts diagram I can see nothing special about this mower. It looks just like the same transmission you see on a million other mowers.

Its not to be compared to a commercial mower Richard. We are just looking at it to see where the weaknesses are, and to determine if it would hold up for a season, and if 1 could easily get the parts needed like belts, wheels, etc. I will never buy a commercial 21 inch mower, so this mower should last as long as any other non commercial 21" mower with the advantage of it being lightweight and 30" cut. I can spend $700 on a residential 21' OR A $1000 FOR 30" residential mower .

Not to be used for bushwacking junk lawns, it would never last obviously. Is it worth $1000 for someone like myself who would use it part time for 2 or 3 years? So far I can see the value for me I mulch, or bag, rarely side discharge small lawns. But maybe not for a full timer that only uses walkbehinds for everything.

JCLawn and more
03-20-2012, 08:33 PM
it will be exciting if the cogs strip on the belt.

Richard Martin
03-21-2012, 04:43 AM
Its not to be compared to a commercial mower Richard. We are just looking at it to see where the weaknesses are, and to determine if it would hold up for a season, and if 1 could easily get the parts needed like belts, wheels, etc. I will never buy a commercial 21 inch mower, so this mower should last as long as any other non commercial 21" mower with the advantage of it being lightweight and 30" cut.

That weight thing is part of the problem that I see. It's looks like the same transmission but the mower weighs way more than comparable mowers that have the same tranny. Although I've never had a problem with that transmission, I have heard people belittle these types of mowers because of that tranny.

I too am looking to see where the weaknesses are. The only point I've compared to a commercial mower is the lack of power compared to a slightly (2 inches) larger commercial mower. The commercial mower probably only uses 1, maybe 2 of those extra ponies to propel a gear drive mower. The commercial mower has a serious torque multiplied drive system. It doesn't need power, it has torque.

JCat
03-21-2012, 09:53 AM
I visited my local dealer to look at one. I was very interested in this NEW type of mower.

I know my opinion has no support . . . but this machine just looked like it had a "greater potential for problems" than normal. I have nothing to base this opinion on other than my experience with working on (other) machines and vehicles.

If you get a chance, take a close look . . . you might just agree with me. I hope I am wrong, because it looks like it could be a big time saver. Considering that it is brand-new, (and a commercial one is due soon), I'm gonna take a wait-and-see approach.

Busybee Lawns
03-21-2012, 11:47 PM
I got to try one out today. pretty nice! soild gear incasement.and Lots of power from the engine

IT was nice to hear the blades roar on this Mower. The blade tip speed is up ***there** by the sound of it.
But Keep in Mind Look @ this as a** bigger version** or a** scaled up model** of a((( SR4)))), nothing more or less! this could be used commercially with no problem. **if your doing it your self!!!! I asked the dealer about a commercial version? he said yes, but not within a few year! He knew about this time master 5 year before it came out! so he say's. I Don't Know***** But I do know thoses little 15'' blades were Humming!!!!

Valk
03-22-2012, 09:53 AM
...this could be used commercially with no problem. ...if you're doing it yourself!!!!
OK...good to know. :cool:
The roar of the blades WILL overcome...!

We'll ALL know more come November.
May this mower prove to be better than it appears...and be the answer to everyone's prayers. Amen.

ALEX'S LANDSCAPING
03-23-2012, 07:09 PM
A Video one of the dealers I shop at made: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8vaONtM-uuQ

borwicks
03-23-2012, 07:39 PM
I stopped by 3 dealers today. 2 of them knew nothing about it. I asked if they would take the safety covers off so i could look at? ???
Them: why?
Me: you want to sale it or not.
Them: we are not removing the covers.
Me: thank you, have good day.

smallstripesnc
03-23-2012, 08:04 PM
I finally got my unit back from the dealer today after getting toro and briggs and stratton involved I was hoping the issue would be fixed!

I then took it to a clients lawn and I got the front about half way done and I disengaged the blades and the high rpms came right back!

When I picked the mower up the dealer told me the spring lost tension and they had to re-tension the spring.

I got a used Scag 36 inch with a 12.5 Kohler and I have to say that its sad an older unit is more reliable than a BRAND NEW mower! I know a few people on here have been saying that the unit should only be used for homeowners which I agree it is a home owner unit but why would they offer a "commercial" warranty? Also it should be able to stand up to more than two weeks of daily use without issues.

Busybee Lawns
03-23-2012, 08:29 PM
I think the main problem that your having is that the Governor spring is expossed on this machine so when cutting and go under brush your hitting the spring !!! it should be hidden!!!

ALEX'S LANDSCAPING
03-23-2012, 08:36 PM
I finally got my unit back from the dealer today after getting toro and briggs and stratton involved I was hoping the issue would be fixed!

I then took it to a clients lawn and I got the front about half way done and I disengaged the blades and the high rpms came right back!

When I picked the mower up the dealer told me the spring lost tension and they had to re-tension the spring.

I got a used Scag 36 inch with a 12.5 Kohler and I have to say that its sad an older unit is more reliable than a BRAND NEW mower! I know a few people on here have been saying that the unit should only be used for homeowners which I agree it is a home owner unit but why would they offer a "commercial" warranty? Also it should be able to stand up to more than two weeks of daily
use without issues.

Congrats on the new mower!

Exact Rototilling
03-23-2012, 08:56 PM
To be blunt I'm still buying one but this will clearly not be a primary use mower for me. When I looked at it week or so ago I saw several things that might break quickly if you have employees beating up on equipment.

I'm buying it as a niche mower only. Noob employee to start on, wife to run, maybe my 11 year old son.....? I just wish Home Depot carried the Electric start version....so I could take it back with no.struggle if turn out to be trouble.for me. :rolleyes:
Posted via Mobile Device

MJB
03-23-2012, 09:01 PM
To be blunt I'm still buying one but this will clearly not be a primary use mower for me. When I looked at it week or so ago I saw several things that might break quickly if you have employees beating up on equipment.

I'm buying it as a niche mower only. Noob employee to start on, wife to run, maybe my 11 year old son.....? I just wish Home Depot carried the Electric start version....so I could take it back with no.struggle if turn out to be trouble.for me. :rolleyes:
Posted via Mobile Device

You should be able to order it off the website and have it delivered to home depot. See if they will order it for you.

Exact Rototilling
03-23-2012, 09:27 PM
You should be able to order it off the website and have it delivered to home depot. See if they will order it for you.
Pull start only $999. :(
Posted via Mobile Device

smallstripesnc
03-23-2012, 09:59 PM
I think the main problem that your having is that the Governor spring is expossed on this machine so when cutting and go under brush your hitting the spring !!! it should be hidden!!!

I do agree its not a good design to have it exposed but the issue never happens when near anything. It has only occured out in the open.
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Platinum2
03-24-2012, 11:38 PM
I took delivery of my TimeMaster today. It rained all day so I was unable to do a test mow. However, tomorrow looks like it will be dry and sunny so I will certainly put it to work. My lawn is quite thick and long at this point so it should be a good test for the mower.

A couple of preliminary observations:

First, the mower started easily and ran smooth. I engaged the blades in the driveway and it made a very impressive "whoosh" sound as the deck spun up to operating speed. Very confidence inspiring.

Second, I did test the Personal Pace drive system and it can go from a crawl to a rather robust ground speed requiring the operator to jog to keep up. I think that is the real beauty of this design....it offers a wide cut and impressive ground speed to complete a mow quickly.

Third, while the electric start for some (including myself) may be unnecessary, it works brilliantly and I have not seen a better, more efficient design for an electric start system. Toro did a nice job here.

Lastly, while a real test has yet to be done, I have little doubt about the strength of the B&S Professional motor. It is similar to the 190cc motor Toro uses on their other consumer-grade Recycler mowers, but has been tuned for more torque and this becomes evident immediately after engaging the blades. In terms of motor longevity and durability, only time will tell.

Overall, build quality appears to be on par or above with respect to other Toro residential mowers. That is to say, this is strictly a well made residential-grade unit, make no mistake about it. For those looking for a "cheap commercial mower alternative" forget it....not its purpose. :nono: For homeowner's, I expect this will be a great unit. Thumbs Up

I will do a more complete review tomorrow and will upload a video to YouTube.

Regards,

GW

JCLawn and more
03-25-2012, 07:07 AM
Hope it works well but in case you did not read my post from before My dealer up here will not sell Toro snow blowers or push mower do to the fact that they are having issues with the motor that they can't figure out. They said that the motor is made in china that they keep having them back with the problem and no solutions. They keep fixing them just to have them back again. So they would not even give me a price on the unit.
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Richard Martin
03-25-2012, 07:40 AM
Lastly, while a real test has yet to be done, I have little doubt about the strength of the B&S Professional motor. It is similar to the 190cc motor Toro uses on their other consumer-grade Recycler mowers, but has been tuned for more torque and this becomes evident immediately after engaging the blades. In terms of motor longevity and durability, only time will tell.

Is this a factual statement? Can you back this claim up with any documentation? Can you provide us a link to a claim made to this effect by either Toro or Briggs and Stratton?

I have a great deal of difficulty calling any engine Professional when it doesn't even have an oil filter.

Platinum2
03-25-2012, 08:49 AM
Is this a factual statement? Can you back this claim up with any documentation? Can you provide us a link to a claim made to this effect by either Toro or Briggs and Stratton?

I have a great deal of difficulty calling any engine Professional when it doesn't even have an oil filter.

First of all, yes, I can back this up. But I am not going to do your research for you. A quick trip to the B&S website will tell you all you need to know. That said, I own BOTH a Toro Recycler and the TimeMaster and both have 190 cc engines and my Recycler is 6.75 torque and my TimeMaster is 8.75 torque. I'm not suggesting they are the same motor, but likely similar just tuned differently. Car makers for example, do this sort of thing all the time.

As far as the motor not being "professional", the B&S website states "These engines offer consumers and professionals commercial-grade features including easier starting, smoother and quieter operation, increased durability, and longer life." You are free, of course, to argue with B&S that these features do not translate into the motor being professional.

For the homeowner, for whom this product was designed, it should be sufficient. There was another thread on Lawnsite where the Toro rep discussed the field testing done on this unit. They put many hours on it and he made no mention of any engine failures. As usual, I would suspect any failures experienced by others are a direct result of commercial use or the occasional lemon common in mass-produced products.

Regards,

GW

JCLawn and more
03-25-2012, 09:09 AM
But enough of them to where my dealer won't sell them even if I begged them.
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Platinum2
03-25-2012, 09:28 AM
But enough of them to where my dealer won't sell them even if I begged them.
Posted via Mobile Device

I would be suspicious of your dealer's behavior rather than suspicious of the B&S engine/Toro brand. It sounds like he has a personal issue with B&S and/or Toro perhaps. He might as well not sell any Simplicity or Snapper lawn mowers then either since most of them use that same engine or one from the same engine family (unless you get Snapper commercial...those have Kawasaki I believe). MTD uses the Chinese Powermore engines. Would he rather sell that? What does he sell?

JCLawn and more
03-25-2012, 09:38 AM
Simplicity, Toro, kubota, sthil, giant vac. They are actually the only dealer in the area that focuses on customer relationships. They are largest dealer in the area. My other dealer that sells snapper wants to drop them because he is having issues and he won't sell certain ones. With Toro they said every push mower they sell comes back with the same issue and Toro will not fix the issue. Its an issue of not ruining brand sales rather than preference.
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OakNut
03-25-2012, 10:47 AM
"These engines offer consumers and professionals commercial-grade features including easier starting, smoother and quieter operation, increased durability, and longer life."

Sorry, but they listed several "commercial-grade features" that aren't really features. If it actually USED any commercial grade parts/designs they would have been listed. In advertising you play up your strong points - you don't make them "vague".

To speak of this engine as commercial grade is just silly.

JCLawn and more
03-25-2012, 10:53 AM
Plus commercial does not equal user friendly. Try a belt drive walk behind
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Richard Martin
03-25-2012, 11:01 AM
First of all, yes, I can back this up. But I am not going to do your research for you. A quick trip to the B&S website will tell you all you need to know. That said, I own BOTH a Toro Recycler and the TimeMaster and both have 190 cc engines and my Recycler is 6.75 torque and my TimeMaster is 8.75 torque. I'm not suggesting they are the same motor, but likely similar just tuned differently. Car makers for example, do this sort of thing all the time.

So the answer is no, you cannot provide links. It's as I thought. :laugh:

willretire@40
03-25-2012, 11:14 AM
We have a dealer here that has 5 locations. The one i go to is allowing me to demo one for a couple of days. That have 5 in stock. My dealer always talks about how Toro has the best customer support.
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JCLawn and more
03-25-2012, 11:19 AM
They seem good. I think grasshopper maybe a little better but they are good. I want to try one, but what the dealer said scared me forsure.
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Platinum2
03-25-2012, 11:42 AM
So the answer is no, you cannot provide links. It's as I thought. :laugh:

Since you are unwilling to do your own research either because you are too stupid, lazy, or both...here you go:

B&S 190cc, 6.75 torque motor:
http://www.briggsandstratton.com/engines/push-mower/detail/?series=675+Series&id=%7B7B28D2C4-D0B4-4DC6-9014-1BF165799B4B%7D


B&S 190cc 8.75 torque motor:
http://www.briggsandstratton.com/engines/push-mower/detail/?series=Professional+Series+875&id=%7b065CCCA5-4EE7-4939-AB24-B9725640D627%7d



Next time, don't be prick.

Regards,

GW

JCLawn and more
03-25-2012, 12:22 PM
you don't have to look hard to see that these motors are completely different. Maybe the same block, but everything else is different.

Chilehead
03-25-2012, 02:59 PM
After reading this thread for a few days, I decided to hop over to Home Depot to check one out. My local store did not have any, only the ability to order one from a catalog with pictures/basic specs. I asked them to check with the other stores nearby to see if they had any on hand. Sure enough, they all had zero as well. Now for the record, I am in ATLANTA y'all!! If any HD store would have one to look at, it should be one in ATLANTA!! I will be calling my local Toro dealership on Monday to see if they have one I can check out. I really need a 21" replacement, but don't need a full-blown commercial unit because I only use my 21" on about a half acre of turf every week.....two properties with narrow gates.

Richard Martin
03-25-2012, 03:20 PM
Since you are unwilling to do your own research either because you are too stupid, lazy, or both...here you go:

Next time, don't be prick.

Regards,

GW

Why is that when someone is wrong they start throwing insults.

Here's your 2 engines jackwad.

This 875 is an overhead valve design.
http://www.briggsandstratton.com/~/media/Images/product_catalog/Briggs%20and%20Stratton/Engine/875-Pro-Series.ashx?w=200&h=200&bc=white

This 675 is a flat head design or in B&S speak, an L head.
http://www.briggsandstratton.com/~/media/Images/product_catalog/Briggs%20and%20Stratton/Engine/XRZ_DOM_675_BLK_LV.ashx?w=192&h=200&bc=white

The ONLY thing these 2 engines have in common is their displacement. And you want to call people stupid or lazy? If you can't easily see the carb and muffler are on different sides on these 2 engines you're stupid.

And if you had done some real research into these 2 engines you'd also find out that they are completely different internally. So I'm also calling you the lazy one.

Prick. :laugh:

Snapper Jack
03-25-2012, 03:43 PM
Now Richard.....Despite the engines outer structural and obvious differences,you of all people should now that gray paint being a lighter shade causes less piston frictional drag,therefore produces a tab more Hp. Now I've been called a Dick and Prick before so no need to go down that road:laugh:

Platinum2
03-25-2012, 04:33 PM
Why is that when someone is wrong they start throwing insults.

Here's your 2 engines jackwad.

This 875 is an overhead valve design.
http://www.briggsandstratton.com/~/media/Images/product_catalog/Briggs%20and%20Stratton/Engine/875-Pro-Series.ashx?w=200&h=200&bc=white

This 675 is a flat head design or in B&S speak, an L head.
http://www.briggsandstratton.com/~/media/Images/product_catalog/Briggs%20and%20Stratton/Engine/XRZ_DOM_675_BLK_LV.ashx?w=192&h=200&bc=white

The ONLY thing these 2 engines have in common is their displacement. And you want to call people stupid or lazy? If you can't easily see the carb and muffler are on different sides on these 2 engines you're stupid.

And if you had done some real research into these 2 engines you'd also find out that they are completely different internally. So I'm also calling you the lazy one.

Prick. :laugh:

First, I never said anywhere in this thread that these two engines were the same. Nowhere. I said they were similar (in regard to their displacement) but each was tuned (or designed, you might say) for its own purpose. If you want to analyze every last bolt on each motor to see their differences be my guest, but that was never the point of my post. It was merely to illustrate that there are different 190cc engines B&S offers in their consumer-grade mowers and that the TimeMaster has an 8.75 torque version.

It is obvious you could not draw that conclusion for yourself, I didn't think it was all that hard to follow, if it was, I'm sorry. But, right from the get-go you struck an attitude in your responses to my posts. This is uncalled for, unprofessional, and ultimately a little low-class. I am not a contractor, nor do I own/operate a lawn service, but I have distant family who ran several successful lawncare operations for many years, so I still follow the business a bit.

I can't imagine interviewing you to have your company care for my estate. If this is typically how you interact with people I can say for certain you would not get the contract. Lastly, your tone and attitude do not help to portray a positive image of the industry in which you represent.

So much for me trying to be helpful. You can figure the TimeMaster out on your own. I don't have any questions about the mower because I own it. In fact, I just got done using it.

Good day,

GW

Richard Martin
03-25-2012, 04:43 PM
First, I never said anywhere in this thread that these two engines were the same. Nowhere. I said they were similar (in regard to their displacement) but each was tuned (or designed, you might say) for its own purpose.

Yes you did.

"It is similar to the 190cc motor Toro uses on their other consumer-grade Recycler mowers, but has been tuned for more torque "

The two engines are similar just like a B&S 190CC engine is similar to a Chrysler Hemi.

It hasn't been tuned for more power, it was completely redesigned from the ground up for more power.

JCLawn and more
03-25-2012, 04:50 PM
It is similar to the 190cc motor Toro uses on their other consumer-grade Recycler mowers, but has been tuned for more torque and this becomes evident immediately after engaging the blades.

This statement suggests you meant that its the same motor with different tuning to get more torque and that is what differs from consumer grade. What ticked people off was that you tried to make a point hence you put 1st, 2nd, 3rd and so on. If I go on here to make a point about what someone said to prove them wrong most likely I will get eaten alive even if I am right. Its the internet. If we came out to do a job we would put up with it cuz we want your money and we would not say anything cuz we need to be your buddy until the job is done. Then we walk away. I think we can all relate to that on here. Home owners can be very stupid when it comes to lawn stuff (not talking about you) and we have to put up with a lot of crap. Any time you deal with people you have to deal with a lot of crap. On here we don't.

JCLawn and more
03-25-2012, 04:52 PM
The two engines are similar just like a B&S 190CC engine is similar to a Chrysler Hemi.

Thats right, they both need air and fuel. They both have a crankshaft, and they both have a starter (well one option does). i think your on to something.

weaver
03-25-2012, 04:55 PM
The Briggs website does infact refer to the 8.75 torque to be a professional series engine... I myself like a lot of others don't consider it to be but they do call it a pro engine...

JCLawn and more
03-25-2012, 04:59 PM
The Briggs website does infact refer to the 8.75 torque to be a professional series engine... I myself like a lot of others don't consider it to be but they do call it a pro engine...

Professional does not mean commercial either. Professional is not a regulated term. Just like if I put the term heavy duty it does not mean anything. Heavy duty compared to what? Its a selling pitch.

Platinum2
03-25-2012, 05:01 PM
Yes you did.

"It is similar to the 190cc motor Toro uses on their other consumer-grade Recycler mowers, but has been tuned for more torque "

The two engines are similar just like a B&S 190CC engine is similar to a Chrysler Hemi.

It hasn't been tuned for more power, it was completely redesigned from the ground up for more power.

I still do not see the word "same.":confused:

weaver
03-25-2012, 05:03 PM
Professional does not mean commercial either. Professional is not a regulated term. Just like if I put the term heavy duty it does not mean anything. Heavy duty compared to what? Its a selling pitch.

Hey i did'nt say that it did... All i said was that the Brggs website calls that engine a professional engine... Refering to someone in an earlier post that said it was'nt..

JCLawn and more
03-25-2012, 05:04 PM
Hey i did'nt say that it did... All i said was that the Brggs website calls that engine a professional engine... Refering to someone in an earlier post that said it was'nt..

I know that, I am just saying that professional does not mean professional by saying that it is. I am agreeing with you.

Platinum2
03-25-2012, 05:07 PM
This statement suggests you meant that its the same motor with different tuning to get more torque and that is what differs from consumer grade. What ticked people off was that you tried to make a point hence you put 1st, 2nd, 3rd and so on. If I go on here to make a point about what someone said to prove them wrong most likely I will get eaten alive even if I am right. Its the internet. If we came out to do a job we would put up with it cuz we want your money and we would not say anything cuz we need to be your buddy until the job is done. Then we walk away. I think we can all relate to that on here. Home owners can be very stupid when it comes to lawn stuff (not talking about you) and we have to put up with a lot of crap. Any time you deal with people you have to deal with a lot of crap. On here we don't.

My statement suggests nothing more than what it said. "It was similar" meaning in size. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less. I did not say "same" ever. If people want to get ticked off because they read too far into things, I guess that's up to them. I should have said "similar in size" because no one can seem to infer that on their own. That's my fault I guess.

Platinum2
03-25-2012, 05:08 PM
Anyway.....let's be more productive here folks. Moving on.......

The mower is great. I like it. You each should try one.:)

weaver
03-25-2012, 05:08 PM
My statement suggests nothing more than what it said. "It was similar" meaning in size. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less. I did not say "same" ever. If people want to get ticked off because they read too far into things, I guess that's up to them. I should have said "similar in size" because no one can seem to infer that on their own. That's my fault I guess.

Well i'm glad you're willing to finally admit it...:laugh:

JCLawn and more
03-25-2012, 05:11 PM
My statement suggests nothing more than what it said. "It was similar" meaning in size. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less. I did not say "same" ever. If people want to get ticked off because they read too far into things, I guess that's up to them. I should have said "similar in size" because no one can seem to infer that on their own. That's my fault I guess.

:clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping: there you go. The meaning was determined by the context and "similar" by the context was meant same size, same engine, different tuning for torque. You meant "similar" meaning same size different better engine which no one got. :hammerhead: case closed

I think the guy who started the page is no longer with us:angel:

NEPAbowhunter
03-25-2012, 06:38 PM
Broke in the Timemaster today on the first cut of the year. First time I had to cut the lawn in March here in Northeast PA. The mower performed great as expected for being a brand new mower. I chose to bag the clippings which weighed down the mower and it had no problem motoring along at my pace. I liked the fact that I did not have to pull start it again after dumping the bag. The mower also shaved my cut time which was the main reason for getting it in the first place. Time will tell how it holds up over the season, but after the first run of TORO's new Timemaster I have to give it a thumbs up. Thumbs Up

JCLawn and more
03-25-2012, 06:41 PM
I wish they would put front casters on it, but looks good.

ALEX'S LANDSCAPING
03-25-2012, 07:04 PM
Broke in the Timemaster today on the first cut of the year. First time I had to cut the lawn in March here in Northeast PA. The mower performed great as expected for being a brand new mower. I chose to bag the clippings which weighed down the mower and it had no problem motoring along at my pace. I liked the fact that I did not have to pull start it again after dumping the bag. The mower also shaved my cut time which was the main reason for getting it in the first place. Time will tell how it holds up over the season, but after the first run of TORO's new Timemaster I have to give it a thumbs up. Thumbs Up

Nice stripes!

ALEX'S LANDSCAPING
03-25-2012, 07:07 PM
I wish they would put front casters on it, but looks good.

That would make it the ultimate mower!
A good feature for the commercial version. (if they do make one, hopefully)

Exact Rototilling
03-25-2012, 07:53 PM
Broke in the Timemaster today on the first cut of the year. First time I had to cut the lawn in March here in Northeast PA. The mower performed great as expected for being a brand new mower. I chose to bag the clippings which weighed down the mower and it had no problem motoring along at my pace. I liked the fact that I did not have to pull start it again after dumping the bag. The mower also shaved my cut time which was the main reason for getting it in the first place. Time will tell how it holds up over the season, but after the first run of TORO's new Timemaster I have to give it a thumbs up. Thumbs Up

What height was that cut at? Thanks for.posting the before and after. First cuts.of.the season.are not.the best.testing ground but I think this is the only user pic thus far.
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NEPAbowhunter
03-25-2012, 08:26 PM
Got one more notch to go and the mower cut height will be maxed out.

Exact Rototilling
03-25-2012, 11:22 PM
Got one more notch to go and the mower cut height will be maxed out.
Can you measure the blade height at that setting....by chance...? The cut looks longer than 3.5".

Ybravo 25 maximum cut height is 3.5"....that is one of the drawbacks of that mower.
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JCat
03-26-2012, 09:08 AM
Can anyone tell me if (on average) a Briggs engine will last just as long as "something else" ?

My luck has been horrible with them.

JCLawn and more
03-26-2012, 09:34 AM
So have mine and most people I know. Only the horizontal shafts seem to last in my experience.
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KrayzKajun
03-26-2012, 09:57 AM
I saw a timemaster in person ths morning at my dealer. Boy is tht one ugly mower.
Posted via Mobile Device

JCat
03-26-2012, 03:00 PM
I was told by my dealer that Toro purchased Exmark to get access to their patents and engineering expertise. I was also told to expect to see a lot of Exmark influence on furture Toro products. I don't know if any of this is true, but my dealer also said that Toro is keeping Exmark separate and autonomous in order to NOT ruin the good Exmark reputation.

Snapper Jack
03-26-2012, 03:03 PM
Nice stripes!
If you say so:laugh::laugh:

ALEX'S LANDSCAPING
03-26-2012, 04:26 PM
If you say so:laugh::laugh:

(exept for the last one on the right)

ALEX'S LANDSCAPING
03-26-2012, 04:40 PM
I was at my dealer's open house today and I talked to a Toro rep there.
He told me that Toro has no plans (right now) to produce a commercial version of the TimeMaster 30".
And then he went on saying that it might hold for heavy duty use if you take great care of it (we all know that).
But one good thing that I got out of this was that there might be 2 more different engine choices: KOHLER and KAWASAKI (don't quote/ask me on this because I do not know anything on this matter.):confused:

bizeagle
03-26-2012, 06:15 PM
Think I will hold out a while for the Kawasaki or Kohler. What kind of luck are y'all having with Kohler these days?

Exact Rototilling
03-26-2012, 09:33 PM
If you say so:laugh::laugh:
Well ....I kind of agree. The cut did not look all that HOT. That's why I asked what exactly the mowing height is. First cut of the season is not always the best looking ......?

The cut quality has to match my Ybravo 25 or this mower is history for my purposes. I already know my Quickie 32 will have a better looking manicured cut.
Posted via Mobile Device

Exact Rototilling
03-26-2012, 09:53 PM
All things considered I’m far less concerned about the B&S engine than I am about cut quality. Turfco puts this engine on their XT5 aerator. Lawn Solutions saw fit to to put it on their 21” WB aerator. To rate an engine commercial - does it really have to have an oil filter....? I’m certainly not putting it in the same class as Honda GX or GXV engines. None of my Honda have oil filters....?

Anyhow here is a Briggs pic for you to enjoy. My only complaint on this engine is the foam pre filter is not wide enough. :hammerhead:

Anyone know of a wider pre-filter that will work on this puppy. I use the super tacky dirt bike oils on all my foam pre filters.

JCLawn and more
03-26-2012, 10:58 PM
interesting.

petscanning
03-27-2012, 12:37 PM
Exact have you done fescue with you r toro yet? I am finding out the timemaster really sucks with fescue right now, even if its dry the fescue itself retains to much water so when I am cutting it bunches up badly. Any suggestions

Exact Rototilling
03-27-2012, 12:48 PM
Exact have you done fescue with you r toro yet? I am finding out the timemaster really sucks with fescue right now, even if its dry the fescue itself retains to much water so when I am cutting it bunches up badly. Any suggestions
I don't own the mower yet. May buy an electric start from the dealer this week.

Yes fine fescue when soaking wet will even clog my Ybravo 25 if I go too fast.

All I can say is delay the tougher lawns later in the day if you can. Mowing season has not started here yet.

When I get the mower I will post cut quality pics compared to my other mowers.

Higher lift blades are a must. I posted on Toro's Facebook page and asked....? Were are the high lift blades for this mower? None available. :hammerhead:
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petscanning
03-27-2012, 12:54 PM
Its been 80 degrees here and the grass blades are dry but the fescue still has a lot of water retained it from last weeks rain. I think the problem with the toro is it has to move the wet grass from one side to the other so it mulches it so fine before it can get to the bag or chute it turns into a wet paste. If it had a second blow out point on the other side you could probably do it. On Bermuda it mulches so fine you cant even tell you didnt bag. Its a good mower but has a real weakness thats for sure.

Exact Rototilling
03-27-2012, 02:07 PM
At this point just set the back of the mower one notch higher to reduce clumping....and higher lift blades .....someday :rolleyes:
Posted via Mobile Device

petscanning
03-27-2012, 02:17 PM
No joke the fescue I seeded in this guy yard this last fall is growing 6 to 8 inches a week. I actually dble mowed it almost to a scalping to see if I can dry the ground out and slow this crap down. His yard last year took me maybe 45mins now without dble mow is taking me over 1.5 hours. So thick and high in seven days its about to kill me

MJB
03-27-2012, 02:57 PM
No joke the fescue I seeded in this guy yard this last fall is growing 6 to 8 inches a week. I actually dble mowed it almost to a scalping to see if I can dry the ground out and slow this crap down. His yard last year took me maybe 45mins now without dble mow is taking me over 1.5 hours. So thick and high in seven days its about to kill me

You might try side discharging as fast as you can on the 1st pass, then raise the deck 1 notch and bag the clippings, until it slows down.

petscanning
03-27-2012, 03:26 PM
You might try side discharging as fast as you can on the 1st pass, then raise the deck 1 notch and bag the clippings, until it slows down.

I had the side charge open and the back open with no bag (yes dangerous) still couldnt do it without clumping and it raised 2 notches above normal height. I think the problem is this guy had scotts for like 20 years and they sprayed his lawn but he really didnt have any grass looked almost like a clay desert. Well now introduce real seed and 20 years of built up fertilizer and now you have a lawn on steroids

JCat
03-27-2012, 03:27 PM
With 2 15" blades, won't the speed of the blade tips be significantly slower than if the blades were longer?
Are there other mowers sold with similar blade (tip) speeds?
Is there an ideal blade speed or is faster better ?

Richard Martin
03-27-2012, 03:39 PM
With 2 15" blades, won't the speed of the blade tips be significantly slower than if the blades were longer?
Are there other mowers sold with similar blade (tip) speeds?
Is there an ideal blade speed or is faster better ?

You can play with the pulley sizes to regulate the blade speed. There is a limit of 19,000 FPM (feet per minute) for the blade tip speed. It is not a law, only a recommendation set by ANSI. ANSI is a private standards company, they don't make law or regulations.

Most manufacturers shoot for 18,500 FPM. Sometimes though, faster isn't always better, especially when dealing with wet grass.

granville
03-28-2012, 03:54 PM
I went to my dealer to see the timemaster ...but he said Toro had held back back there timemaster order to fix a problem Toro was having with the electric start models. Anybody hear about problems with the timemaster's electric start:confused:

petscanning
03-28-2012, 03:58 PM
my E start works

granville
03-28-2012, 04:43 PM
I wonder if there will be a service bulletin for mowers already sold.....I asked what the problem was ? They said Toro didnt tell them....just said they had a problem with electric start and were correcting the problem before they shipped any more...

fake_usa
04-02-2012, 11:31 AM
I bought a Timemaster from HomeDepot yesterday so I thought I would give back in form of a quick review to this forum considering I read a lot of posts on here before buying a mower this season.

I mulched a 3/4 acre yard, some spots were pretty wet from the rain we had the day before. It did a nice job mulching, no clumps. It exceeded my expectations.
In the back of my yard I have some wild flowering weeds growing, they were maybe 5 to 7 inches tall. and more ridged then your normal grass or weeds.
anyway,, the mower would leave a Mohawk type cut on this section, I guess the blades were blowing the the weeds down or just completely missing them in the center of the mower where the blades cross paths.
It didn't do this on the normal grass, granted my lawn is not thick yet cause we just moved in but I'd like to try this mower at my mother's house which has ultra thick Zoysia grass,, that would be a nice test,,, if i end up bringing it down to her house I'll report back with the results.

The mower didn't seem to suck up and mulch leaves that were matted down to the dirt over the winter, I though it might have but it didn't, maybe lowing the deck to the lowest setting would have helped but I didn't try it. In the mowers defence it was still pretty wet out there and the leaves were packed down pretty good.


The mower's stop button does not work, I had to pull the spark plug boot off to shut off the engine.
Got a nice shock too cause like a dumb ass I did it bare handed the first time.. lol.
I can't remember where but I read a post online that this happened to someone else's Timemaster.

Overall I like the machine, I would have liked a zeroturn sit down but my yard has a really steep slope on one side and there would be no way I could use a tractor or zeroturn there so this thing works out great in that section.

I had a personal pace mower before and I liked it and still use it on my mothers yard, the nice addition to the timemaster is the extra handle you can squeeze to make the mower move, it is actually a nice addition to the personal pace system. I found myself using it quite often on the hilly section.

I think this mower will be great this summer and I look forward to using it.

Thanks,

MJB
04-02-2012, 12:45 PM
I bought a Timemaster from HomeDepot yesterday so I thought I would give back in form of a quick review to this forum considering I read a lot of posts on here before buying a mower this season.

I mulched a 3/4 acre yard, some spots were pretty wet from the rain we had the day before. It did a nice job mulching, no clumps. It exceeded my expectations.
In the back of my yard I have some wild flowering weeds growing, they were maybe 5 to 7 inches tall. and more ridged then your normal grass or weeds.
anyway,, the mower would leave a Mohawk type cut on this section, I guess the blades were blowing the the weeds down or just completely missing them in the center of the mower where the blades cross paths.
It didn't do this on the normal grass, granted my lawn is not thick yet cause we just moved in but I'd like to try this mower at my mother's house which has ultra thick Zoysia grass,, that would be a nice test,,, if i end up bringing it down to her house I'll report back with the results.

The mower didn't seem to suck up and mulch leaves that were matted down to the dirt over the winter, I though it might have but it didn't, maybe lowing the deck to the lowest setting would have helped but I didn't try it. In the mowers defence it was still pretty wet out there and the leaves were packed down pretty good.


The mower's stop button does not work, I had to pull the spark plug boot off to shut off the engine.
Got a nice shock too cause like a dumb ass I did it bare handed the first time.. lol.
I can't remember where but I read a post online that this happened to someone else's Timemaster.

Overall I like the machine, I would have liked a zeroturn sit down but my yard has a really steep slope on one side and there would be no way I could use a tractor or zeroturn there so this thing works out great in that section.

I had a personal pace mower before and I liked it and still use it on my mothers yard, the nice addition to the timemaster is the extra handle you can squeeze to make the mower move, it is actually a nice addition to the personal pace system. I found myself using it quite often on the hilly section.

I think this mower will be great this summer and I look forward to using it.

Thanks,

Did the grass clippings buildup under the deck at all? This will cause a mower to lay over the grass in the center between the blades. Wet leaves can be a pain to pick up unless you have a rake on the front that loosings them up , I use a thatch rake attachment on my ztr's in the spring for that reason. thanks for the review , maybe some pics next time .

fake_usa
04-02-2012, 01:22 PM
Did the grass clippings buildup under the deck at all? This will cause a mower to lay over the grass in the center between the blades. Wet leaves can be a pain to pick up unless you have a rake on the front that loosings them up , I use a thatch rake attachment on my ztr's in the spring for that reason. thanks for the review , maybe some pics next time .

I only cut about a 50 ft strip of moist grass before I got to the weeds so I don't think there could have been much build up that quick. After cutting the weed section I mowed the rest of the yard without any type of mohawk effect...

I'll check under the deck for build up tonight after work.

When those weeds grow back I'll take some pictures or a video if it happens again and post it.

Exact Rototilling
04-02-2012, 01:29 PM
MJB,

I'm buying an electric start T30 this week. If it can't hang with the conditions I mow I will sell asap even if I loose $ on it. :)

Been super wet here broke the record books for the wettest March ever.
Posted via Mobile Device

petscanning
04-02-2012, 04:28 PM
MJB,

I'm buying an electric start T30 this week. If it can't hang with the conditions I mow I will sell asap even if I loose $ on it. :)

Been super wet here broke the record books for the wettest March ever.
Posted via Mobile Device

Exact... Dont do it. I have the same one and I was ready to sell mine for a loss but luckily my Toro dealer is going to take it back and I will get something else. Unless its dry plants your going to hate it I promise.

MJB
04-02-2012, 08:26 PM
MJB,

I'm buying an electric start T30 this week. If it can't hang with the conditions I mow I will sell asap even if I loose $ on it. :)

Been super wet here broke the record books for the wettest March ever.
Posted via Mobile Device

We are having a late spring here too, we get a little rain as it blows over on the way to you. I just started some cleanups today and I'm only using the TORO Personal Pace 22" and it does a nice job. But if your lawns are all as heavy as the pics you posted with the Y Bravo in the rain then I wouldn't expect much from the Toro TimeMaster unless it's dry.

I might be interested in a month or so once we hit full stride if you don't like it.
I don't fertilize as much anymore because everyone is cutting costs, so I stretch the fertilizer out to just twice per year, and mulch most of the season. Look forward to your pics on the not so heavy lawns as well as the others.

Exact Rototilling
04-02-2012, 09:15 PM
Exact... Dont do it. I have the same one and I was ready to sell mine for a loss but luckily my Toro dealer is going to take it back and I will get something else. Unless its dry plants your going to hate it I promise.
Truth be told...now that I own a Ybravo 25 and I have dialed in the best of the off the shelf high lift blades for my Quickie 32 I can start my day earlier this season and frankly take.on more accounts.

It's a shame Toro doesn't have high lift blades for this mower.....as of yet. :hammerhead:

Not sure....? :rolleyes:
Posted via Mobile Device

Richard Martin
04-03-2012, 07:26 AM
It's a shame Toro doesn't have high lift blades for this mower.....as of yet. :hammerhead:

Not sure....? :rolleyes:

I don't know if they ever will. The engine struggles with a low lift blade, it would probably have a lot of trouble with a hi lift blade.

happyhollow
04-03-2012, 12:11 PM
I bought the Toro 30 inch from a local lawn dealer, had it assembled by him and he delivered it personally to my house (on his way home). Nice service! He explained features and I took it for a 4 minute run around the yard, wow, is the personal pace peppy, almost a jog; very agile with rear wheel drive. Placed it in my garage in the upright handle storage position, very nice feature. Next day opened garage and noticed a strong gas smell. Looked at Toro and saw the gas leak. Check attached photo. It was an intermittent drip onto the carriage from under air filter side of the Brigs engine.

Called my local lawn dealer and he came back to house to see if there was anything jarred loose, but nothing, he did comment that there was no fuel filter. Hmm. The gas had drained out and the bottom of the tank looked like it had particles from the injection molding process. I suggested that since it only ran for 4 minutes, a brand new unit, maybe get another unit and chaulk this up to a poorly manufactured lemon of a Briggs engine. He called Toro dealer and they would not replace the mower, they wanted it repaired. My contact offered full refund, which I accepted. He took the mower back. Again great service. I was a little perturbed in that i still don't have a mower, I liked the Toro especially at this price point and its 30 in size, perfect for me, residential with acre plus lawn.

I called Toro directly, got western Canada, they outsource the call center to 3rd party in Alberta. Asked to elevate to Toro customer service in USA, and got transferred to Minn where I talked to Toro directly. Very nice people. No-one has called about any gas leak issues, or any issue for that matter. Well sure, if its a Briggs issue, it may not be recorded. Basically said it was between the Toro supplier and my lawn care dealer, on how returns are handled, which in this case is to fix the leak. I'll follow up on the leak issue, but I'm happy getting my money back and be out of the loop.

Anyone experience this gas leak?

Richard Martin
04-03-2012, 01:11 PM
There's at least 2 of these mowers here on Lawnsite that have had an issue with fuel leaking out of the carburetor. This in not really a Toro issue. For some reason the float is sticking. When it sticks with the fuel needle in the open position the fuel continues to flow until the tank is empty. Now granted, Toro did decide to put this engine on this mower and they do share the responsibility for that, but it's not something that Toro had anything to do with. This is a crappy Briggs and Stratton engine problem.

fake_usa
04-10-2012, 01:10 PM
I think Home Depot is censoring the reviews on their website.
(There is only two less then 4 star reviews.)

I tried post this 3 star review and they reject it both times.

Here is the exact review I submitted:

___________________________________________________________
First impressions, will follow up with another review when I get my unit exchanged.

Pros:
+Pull start very easy.
+Great size for a bigger yard (up to .75 acre)
+Big deck (No other personal pace type walk behind homeowner machine in this size that I know of.)
+Balanced weight for easy turning.
+Clutch type bade system - Motor continues to run after you release blade handle very convenient.

Cons:
-Off Button does not work, had to pull spark plug like other reviewer. (electrocuted my thumb, USE PLIERS!!) ouch lol
-Motor bogs very bad and sounds like it is going to turn off when you engage the blades. I could see that happening if the motor is not running a 100% (like if it was up there in age it might bog and just turn off)
-Moist grass clumped up under deck pretty bad especially by the bag plug.
-Left a Mohawk type cut on course weeds in my back yard. Had to move a second time off-center to cut then down.
-Tires SUCK no traction on moist grass or hills. They are wider then a 22" walk behind mower which inherently makes them spin out really easier but in addition the tread pattern is awful for traction and they clog with grass/dirt instantly!!
-personal pace handle rattles loud when not being held..

If there were other 30" walk behind mowers (homeowner type) I would probably try another brand considering the issues, but since there is not, I will keep this machine after I exchange for one which actually turns off !! I think this mower will be fine but the tires were a poor choice. I don't know if Toro or Briggs is to blame for the motor not turning off but shame on Quality Control.... how could this machine have shipped? Doesn't someone test these things before they get boxed up?
_____________________________________________________________

Darryl G
05-26-2012, 10:09 AM
You know....last year I asked the lawnsite community what type of mower I should consider purchasing to mow my modest 1/3 acre lawn and nearly everyone said to buy used commercial equipment....exmark, quickie, whatever because residential equipment is so inferior, is cheap, would not hold up...blah, blah, blah.

Now, Toro releases a residential grade 30" mower and all you commercial contractors can't wait to buy one so you can start mowing 15 lawns a week with it. :confused:

Whatever.

Love this post!!!!!!!

willretire@40
05-26-2012, 11:02 AM
I have cut over 40 lawns with mine in the past 2 weeks. No problems so far.
Posted via Mobile Device

sjessen
05-26-2012, 03:54 PM
I have cut over 40 lawns with mine in the past 2 weeks. No problems so far.
Posted via Mobile Device

That is good to hear. Am thinking of getting one next year to cut a couple of yards per week. Should be fine for that.

NEPAbowhunter
05-26-2012, 06:07 PM
Bought my Timemaster in late March. I only use it on my lawn. I have used it 11 times so far this year, each time I use it I run it for approximately 1 hour. Cut my lawn with it Thursday, topped it off with gas and put it away. Came home from work Friday and noticed a strong smell of gasoline in garage were mower is stored. Went to my new $1000.00 Toro Timemaster 30" and upon further inspection observed a half empty gas tank and gasoline dripping out of the muffler :eek:.............. :mad:.This mower up until now has performed great on my lawn , more than enough power, mulches and bags great in my opinion. Going to get to see how good the service is from my new dealer that I decided to by the mower from now. I am having a manual gas shut off installed between the tank and carb so I can turn off the gas supply in between cuts just in case it happens again. Everything was running and looking great until this happened.:(

sjessen
05-26-2012, 06:33 PM
Bought my Timemaster in late March. I only use it on my lawn. I have used it 11 times so far this year, each time I use it I run it for approximately 1 hour. Cut my lawn with it Thursday, topped it off with gas and put it away. Came home from work Friday and noticed a strong smell of gasoline in garage were mower is stored. Went to my new $1000.00 Toro Timemaster 30" and upon further inspection observed a half empty gas tank and gasoline dripping out of the muffler :eek:.............. :mad:.This mower up until now has performed great on my lawn , more than enough power, mulches and bags great in my opinion. Going to get to see how good the service is from my new dealer that I decided to by the mower from now. I am having a manual gas shut off installed between the tank and carb so I can turn off the gas supply in between cuts just in case it happens again. Everything was running and looking great until this happened.:(

Others have mentioned this problem. Saw a new unit at HD some time back that looked to be leaking same as yours.

Richard Martin
05-26-2012, 07:17 PM
Doesn't someone test these things before they get boxed up?

Nope. They're assembled and stuffed in a box and shipped out. Let the dealer worry about whether it runs or not.

NEPAbowhunter
06-01-2012, 05:37 PM
Bought my Timemaster in late March. I only use it on my lawn. I have used it 11 times so far this year, each time I use it I run it for approximately 1 hour. Cut my lawn with it Thursday, topped it off with gas and put it away. Came home from work Friday and noticed a strong smell of gasoline in garage were mower is stored. Went to my new $1000.00 Toro Timemaster 30" and upon further inspection observed a half empty gas tank and gasoline dripping out of the muffler :eek:.............. :mad:.This mower up until now has performed great on my lawn , more than enough power, mulches and bags great in my opinion. Going to get to see how good the service is from my new dealer that I decided to by the mower from now. I am having a manual gas shut off installed between the tank and carb so I can turn off the gas supply in between cuts just in case it happens again. Everything was running and looking great until this happened.:(

Just got machine back from dealer. They had to rebuild the carb. blamed it on the ethanol in the fuel. Had to pay out of pocket, not covered under warranty. 2 month old machine. Thanks TORO.

Catmann
06-01-2012, 06:37 PM
I think you got taken. Too many other reports of this issue, even on new (first use) units. I would google info on this and take it back to them and have them file a claim. Does the manual allow for ethanol in the fuel? If so, then it is designed to handle it and it is a design defect.....

OakNut
06-01-2012, 07:08 PM
Just got machine back from dealer. They had to rebuild the carb. blamed it on the ethanol in the fuel. Had to pay out of pocket, not covered under warranty. 2 month old machine. Thanks TORO.

I'm guessing this could be scientifically dis-proven as the cause of your issues.

I'm no expert, but I don't believe ethanol can mess up your carb THAT fast.

Exact Rototilling
06-01-2012, 11:54 PM
Just got machine back from dealer. They had to rebuild the carb. blamed it on the ethanol in the fuel. Had to pay out of pocket, not covered under warranty. 2 month old machine. Thanks TORO.
Um...this is pretty messed up. It just might be your fault if the mower was sitting unused over the winter but last I checked this is late spring and the unit was used more than what a homeowner would. Correct?

Sounds like a dealer issue to me.

I had a Honda 2-stage snow thrower with a tweaked housing that the dealer sold me that basically acted like they were doing me a favor to replace it...under warranty....? I was thinking WTF...? Dealer support what a joke. No wonder that doesn't fly with me.
Posted via Mobile Device

Smallaxe
06-02-2012, 02:50 PM
Ethanol sitting in the tank all winter, isn't good... if they try to start it with the old gas, it can be suicide... I always run the tank dry at the end of the season, out in a little premium for avoiding dry out, then dump it out in the Spring and fill with new gas...

Carb problems can be just about anything... so only deal with people you can trust...

Mark Oomkes
06-02-2012, 03:32 PM
There's at least 2 of these mowers here on Lawnsite that have had an issue with fuel leaking out of the carburetor. This in not really a Toro issue. For some reason the float is sticking. When it sticks with the fuel needle in the open position the fuel continues to flow until the tank is empty. Now granted, Toro did decide to put this engine on this mower and they do share the responsibility for that, but it's not something that Toro had anything to do with. This is a crappy Briggs and Stratton engine problem.

Bought my Timemaster in late March. I only use it on my lawn. I have used it 11 times so far this year, each time I use it I run it for approximately 1 hour. Cut my lawn with it Thursday, topped it off with gas and put it away. Came home from work Friday and noticed a strong smell of gasoline in garage were mower is stored. Went to my new $1000.00 Toro Timemaster 30" and upon further inspection observed a half empty gas tank and gasoline dripping out of the muffler :eek:.............. :mad:.This mower up until now has performed great on my lawn , more than enough power, mulches and bags great in my opinion. Going to get to see how good the service is from my new dealer that I decided to by the mower from now. I am having a manual gas shut off installed between the tank and carb so I can turn off the gas supply in between cuts just in case it happens again. Everything was running and looking great until this happened.:(

Just got machine back from dealer. They had to rebuild the carb. blamed it on the ethanol in the fuel. Had to pay out of pocket, not covered under warranty. 2 month old machine. Thanks TORO.

Holy crapola, B&S had this problem 30+ years ago and people are still screwing around with it?

This is why Briggs and ScrapIron is the last resort engine for me to buy on anything. Honda is always first choice. Kaws and Kohlers are a distant second. And if I never buy another B&S, it will be too soon.

Mark Oomkes
06-02-2012, 03:53 PM
Briggs and Stratton has been junk ever since their 'strike' years ago... I do not buy B&S engines for the business anymore... I even quit buying them for personal use...

Nothing to do with the strike, was long before that.

The last component I would of expected to fail is the engine. Briggs and Stratton have always made good engines but I guess now they are slacking and a "cheap" company just trying to make a quick dollar and not caring about if their engines last!

Huh, where you been? Briggs never made good engines, they made OK engines. The governor surging as well as the float sticking have been problems for 30+ years. Off and on.

And that diesel they partnered with Daihatsu on for Exmarks? Another catastrophic failure.

stansoph
07-03-2012, 12:20 PM
The B&S Manual for the engine on page 6 under Fuel Recommendations.

Quote--"A minimum of 87 octane/87AKI (91 RON). High altitude use, see below."

Quote--"Gasoline with up to 10% ethanol is acceptable (gasohol) or up to 15% MTBE (methyl tertiary butyl ether) is acceptable."

Show them this and argue that manual states this as acceptable. In short-- try and get reimbursed for something that should have been warranty work.

I hope this helps.

lwelve
07-23-2012, 06:31 PM
I recently purchased a new 30" Timemaster and so far I am not impressed.
First it has a difficult time getting through tall wet grass and mulching.
The drive system needs something, especially on hills and going up any inclined surface, it does not seem to have very much pull for inclined areas. my dealer told me it has a differential type drive that engages both wheels if the right drive wheel starts spinning, to date I have not been able to see this, my left rear just sits there and does not drive at all.
The only good thing I have seen is it`s bagging results.
I do not bag that much and mulch more, this deck and blade system leaves something to be desired in quality of cut and no buildup under deck.
Not that impressed.

MJB
07-23-2012, 06:50 PM
I recently purchased a new 30" Timemaster and so far I am not impressed.
First it has a difficult time getting through tall wet grass and mulching.
The drive system needs something, especially on hills and going up any inclined surface, it does not seem to have very much pull for inclined areas. my dealer told me it has a differential type drive that engages both wheels if the right drive wheel starts spinning, to date I have not been able to see this, my left rear just sits there and does not drive at all.
The only good thing I have seen is it`s bagging results.
I do not bag that much and mulch more, this deck and blade system leaves something to be desired in quality of cut and no buildup under deck.
Not that impressed.

Several of us that use them have warned not to use in tall wet grass. I mulch everyday cutting off around 1 to 1 1/2 inch with little problems. The mower flys so sometimes you have to slow it down too. No walkbehind mulches tall wet grass worth a crap anyway. So use it where it works best.
I mulch damp grass but not dripping wet. The dryer the better.

Jimslawncareservice
07-23-2012, 07:41 PM
I think the problem is those crappy atomic blades that come on them. I had similar problems with my.exmark 21. I put a toro straight blade on it. It cuts way different. I can mulch sopping wet grass now. Not real fast but doable. Before it would kill it in 2 ft. I cam mulch damp grass as fast as it will go or I'm willing to walk. Not sure if there's a different blade available yet since they are so new.
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joed
07-23-2012, 08:45 PM
It's disappointing to see that so many people are having so many issues with the Toro Timemaster 30. I hope Toro can figure out a solution to these issues for the next model year. It sounds like they need to work on the blades, the engine, and other mechanical issues too. It reminds me of when Exmark first brought out the Metro 26" in 2005. I was one of those unlucky people that was the first to buy it. It had numerous issues. Exmark kept sending update kits. These addressed some of the mechanical issues but the lack of horsepower was never solved. So, they eventually gave me an Exmark Metro 21" in its place. I still have that machine and it works great. Anybody know if Toro is still planning to bring out a 30" commercial version of the timemaster next year?

MJB
07-23-2012, 09:33 PM
It's disappointing to see that so many people are having so many issues with the Toro Timemaster 30. I hope Toro can figure out a solution to these issues for the next model year. It sounds like they need to work on the blades, the engine, and other mechanical issues too. It reminds me of when Exmark first brought out the Metro 26" in 2005. I was one of those unlucky people that was the first to buy it. It had numerous issues. Exmark kept sending update kits. These addressed some of the mechanical issues but the lack of horsepower was never solved. So, they eventually gave me an Exmark Metro 21" in its place. I still have that machine and it works great. Anybody know if Toro is still planning to bring out a 30" commercial version of the timemaster next year?

My dealer sold over 30 this yr, he sells the pull start instead of the key. This may be where most of the issues were. Its the easiest starting pull start I own. My Hondas are not near as easy. I have not even sharpened the blades yet after 25 hrs. Cuts fine if you don't use it trying to mulch 2 plus inches. Bags well and I have cut my time by 40% on the lawns I use it on.
I love it, but again I don't over fertilize, I put on enough to green it up but not so much I got to cart it off.

bucko
07-27-2012, 12:23 AM
This mower is adequate for weekly mowing . Here is my experience.
On flat yards. Dry grass. It does what it should in perfect conditions.
I have used one for almost one week and it is way underpowered.
The thing looks good and sounds awesome until it hits some thick grass.
Deck clogs and throws clumps so much it is embarassing .
I have some steep hills to take care of. Noticed transmission or belt vibration after 10 hrs on the thing. Doesnt seem as strong on the climbs after some use. The deck gets clogged very easily, requiring me to stop the blades and reach down to pull out clogged grass from chute. Engine bogs easily.
On my personal yard it works magic. but we are talking low growth dry flat ground.
I dont undersand why Toro went through the engineering of this thing and did not have briggs design a motor for it, and just threw on a 875 series with 6.5 hp . 40 percent more blade area than a 21 incher should be given 40 percent more power to compensate.

MJB
07-27-2012, 12:32 AM
This mower is adequate for weekly mowing . Here is my experience.
On flat yards. Dry grass. It does what it should in perfect conditions.
I have used one for almost one week and it is way underpowered.
The thing looks good and sounds awesome until it hits some thick grass.
Deck clogs and throws clumps so much it is embarassing .
I have some steep hills to take care of. Noticed transmission or belt vibration after 10 hrs on the thing. Doesnt seem as strong on the climbs after some use. The deck gets clogged very easily, requiring me to stop the blades and reach down to pull out clogged grass from chute. Engine bogs easily.
On my personal yard it works magic. but we are talking low growth dry flat ground.
I dont undersand why Toro went through the engineering of this thing and did not have briggs design a motor for it, and just threw on a 875 series with 6.5 hp . 40 percent more blade area than a 21 incher should be given 40 percent more power to compensate.
What height setting are you mowing at? Im just curious I cut most lawns here on the 4th hole, if the grass is so long it bogs I go up 1 notch, but Im mulching most of the time. I bag dry grass with no issues I think this mower will go to fast , slowing down in thick grass helps.

lawnkingforever
07-27-2012, 12:35 AM
This mower is adequate for weekly mowing . Here is my experience.
On flat yards. Dry grass. It does what it should in perfect conditions.
I have used one for almost one week and it is way underpowered.
The thing looks good and sounds awesome until it hits some thick grass.
Deck clogs and throws clumps so much it is embarassing .
I have some steep hills to take care of. Noticed transmission or belt vibration after 10 hrs on the thing. Doesnt seem as strong on the climbs after some use. The deck gets clogged very easily, requiring me to stop the blades and reach down to pull out clogged grass from chute. Engine bogs easily.
On my personal yard it works magic. but we are talking low growth dry flat ground.
I dont undersand why Toro went through the engineering of this thing and did not have briggs design a motor for it, and just threw on a 875 series with 6.5 hp . 40 percent more blade area than a 21 incher should be given 40 percent more power to compensate.

Good review. Glad I did not buy one for the reasons you mentioned. I gave up on buying a 30"-32" mower. I will just continue using my Sr4 on my few gated yards.
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bucko
07-27-2012, 01:22 AM
What height setting are you mowing at? Im just curious I cut most lawns here on the 4th hole, if the grass is so long it bogs I go up 1 notch, but Im mulching most of the time. I bag dry grass with no issues I think this mower will go to fast , slowing down in thick grass helps.

I think i usually am in the 3 or 4 th, moving up as the symptoms appear.
I have experimented with everything. level, higher in the front, higher in the rear. overlap more, slow walking etc.
but the clumping and deck packing happens with moderate moist dense grass.
I have been raising the deck as much as i think the owner wont notice and complain.
I just think that more power would definetly help with my delima.
and also think a different profile blade to push the grass out.

MJB
07-27-2012, 01:37 AM
Toro needs to come out with a regular blade for wet grass instead of the gator only because you lose that extra lift for packing the bag with wet grass.

bucko
07-30-2012, 12:13 AM
i am finishing up on first week of use with this machine.
the drier conditions since my last post are definetely helping out.
it is cutting better than earlier this wk.

i am getting to know this animal better now and understanding its quirks.
at first i just thought it needed more power. which it does , but the blades are killing the overall performance.
the machine is trying to mulch everything up. while doing so it is unable to move the clippings out. either side discharge or into bag. not enough hp.
so it is chocking the deck up with processed grass that is not being moved out. the blades are so flat that there is not much air movement .
toro advertises a 40 percent timesaving over a 21 incher.
well for this thing to work without clogging up the deck or leaving chunks or blowing chunks out the discharge, you will need to mow at a slower pace. i mean a crawling pace . or yoy can overlap by say 40 percent which works well for me. so there goes the 40 percent time saving.

MJB
07-30-2012, 12:42 AM
i am finishing up on first week of use with this machine.
the drier conditions since my last post are definetely helping out.
it is cutting better than earlier this wk.

i am getting to know this animal better now and understanding its quirks.
at first i just thought it needed more power. which it does , but the blades are killing the overall performance.
the machine is trying to mulch everything up. while doing so it is unable to move the clippings out. either side discharge or into bag. not enough hp.
so it is chocking the deck up with processed grass that is not being moved out. the blades are so flat that there is not much air movement .
toro advertises a 40 percent timesaving over a 21 incher.
well for this thing to work without clogging up the deck or leaving chunks or blowing chunks out the discharge, you will need to mow at a slower pace. i mean a crawling pace . or yoy can overlap by say 40 percent which works well for me. so there goes the 40 percent time saving.

It really shines cutting up to 1.5 inches of dry grass if you are cutting more get out your old mower. For me this mower is working great but like I've said in the past, people are cutting prices, so I am cutting back on fertilizer and making it easier on me so I can mulch 90 percent of my yards. So far no complaints. So use this mower accordingly and you like it because time is money.

rbljack
08-28-2012, 12:26 PM
Any updates on reliabitily? Most of the thread was posted in March, now that its august, Im curious to hear how well this mower is holding up over time. I mow about 10 lawns a week, and this could be a big time saver because most of my lawns are currently 21 inch mower lawns.

Im really interested to hear how well (or not) this mower has performed. I wont bash anyone for spending the money on this mower if it didnt work out. Time is money, and for some (like me) I can see the advantages of this mower if its holding up and capable of completing 10-15 lawns for a few years in a row. Sounds like its not up to the task though....lets hear it? the good the bad and the ugly

petscanning
08-28-2012, 12:59 PM
i BOUGHT A NEW SNAPPER PRO 36 ztr yesterday and asked the dealer about how the timemaster was doing. He said he has only had complaints of it clumping up up and bogging down. glad he let me trade for a commercial honda. Timemaster would have been a time waster.