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Florida Gardener
05-22-2012, 05:58 PM
For you guys cutting zoysia @ 4" :laugh::laugh::laugh:
http://i46.tinypic.com/16jgba9.jpg
http://i49.tinypic.com/2yu0l1i.jpg

Landscape Poet
05-22-2012, 06:41 PM
Looks nice Diamond.

Florida Gardener
05-22-2012, 06:53 PM
Looks nice Diamond.

Thx Mike...it needs to be leveled in a lot of areas though. the spray company who is supposed to be slaying the weeds isnt doing that either. I told the owner to fire them, but they are cheaper.....you know how that goes.:dizzy::dizzy:

Landscape Poet
05-22-2012, 06:57 PM
Thx Mike...it needs to be leveled in a lot of areas though. the spray company who is supposed to be slaying the weeds isnt doing that either. I told the owner to fire them, but they are cheaper.....you know how that goes.:dizzy::dizzy:

I have one that looks damn good being cut at 2.75 right now.....I have thought about posting a picture but a portion of the lawn is still recovering from mole cricket damage. When it gets recovered I will post a photo, I think you will like the looks of it. It is a shame because the rest of the lawn is dense and perfect...damn mole crickets.

southernmower
05-26-2012, 09:12 PM
That's a nice looking lawn. I have a couple of questions though. I have a client who just installed Empire Zoysia a few weeks back and I've been cutting it at 3-1/4", is this too high? Also, they've developed one or two brown areas and the install company is telling the client it's from me leaving clippings on the lawn, I don't run a mulching blade, is this possible or are they just trying to pass the buck?

Florida Gardener
05-26-2012, 10:13 PM
That's a nice looking lawn. I have a couple of questions though. I have a client who just installed Empire Zoysia a few weeks back and I've been cutting it at 3-1/4", is this too high? Also, they've developed one or two brown areas and the install company is telling the client it's from me leaving clippings on the lawn, I don't run a mulching blade, is this possible or are they just trying to pass the buck?

Yes, 3.25 is way too high. For empire you can cut at 2", but if you can do 1.5-1.75" while not scalping or having it look like crap, do that. If you are using a rotary you should be using a 21" with a bagger. Don't mulch or discharge, the clippings need to be collected. How long ago was it installed? It could be scalped areas or dog urine. Doubt it's fungus as that usually shows up in winter and if it literally just installed then thatch buildup would probably not be the case.
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Florida Gardener
05-26-2012, 10:17 PM
Oh yea, make sure the blade is SHARP before each cut.
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cgaengineer
05-27-2012, 12:15 AM
Anything taller than 1.5" on warm seaon grass is too high! :) looks good diamond.
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greendoctor
05-27-2012, 01:32 AM
Nice. That picture says a lot. I know Florida is the low baller's paradise. But, do you know any low ballers running a reel on their lawns? I get the shocked looks from transplants when I tell them what it normally costs to have their lawn mowed. Big difference between the fine cut of a reel and shredding a 1/4 acre lawn with a rotary.

A long time ago, I heavily modified my 21" rotary to cut bermuda and zoysia with a semi acceptable finish. The four wheels were removed and the mower rode on 3" rollers. The blade was sharpened on an oilstone every other cut. This was just for my own lawn. Someone in the business would have to have as many blades as they had stops that day and sharpen each one before re using them. In that context, a reel is not that bad. Recently, I found that a 1/2" band file is the best tool for re cutting the relief on reel blades without having to put the mower on a $10,000 machine. If there is a relief angle on the reel, you are able to backlap and run the mower with slight contact between the blades. Let someone grind off all the relief and you have a mower that must be set for zero contact, as well as not being self sharpening.

cgaengineer
05-27-2012, 01:40 AM
Around here greedoc I can get a grind for $80...$50 for a backlap...I need to get the stuff to do my own backlap so I don't have to take it in.
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cgaengineer
05-27-2012, 01:41 AM
Post some pictures of your maintained lawns greendoc...we want to see them.
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greendoctor
05-27-2012, 02:42 AM
$80? is that for a spin grind only? I know of one shop here that does a spin, relief and fine backlap for $125. He does take up to a week or so to get it done. There are many other shops that cost about the same, but it is a spin grind only. Mower is in and out in about 1 day.

cgaengineer
05-27-2012, 03:28 AM
3 day turnaround. Relief grind. Ask diamond, he couldn't believe it either...I sent pictures.
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greendoctor
05-27-2012, 05:20 AM
What mower do you have? I know the Tru-Cut mowers use either a 3/4 or 11/16 socket to turn the reel. McLane needs a 1/2" hollow shaft adapter. I actually made a hollow shaft adapter out of pipe fittings and some bolts. Power to turn the reels is provided by a 1/2" reversible drill.

cgaengineer
05-27-2012, 08:11 AM
What mower do you have? I know the Tru-Cut mowers use either a 3/4 or 11/16 socket to turn the reel. McLane needs a 1/2" hollow shaft adapter. I actually made a hollow shaft adapter out of pipe fittings and some bolts. Power to turn the reels is provided by a 1/2" reversible drill.

I have a 30" Legacy which is just like a Trimmer brand.
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Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 09:20 AM
Anything taller than 1.5" on warm seaon grass is too high! :) looks good diamond.
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Hahaha, UNLESS it's floratam. Thanks Chris.
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Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 09:25 AM
Nice. That picture says a lot. I know Florida is the low baller's paradise. But, do you know any low ballers running a reel on their lawns? I get the shocked looks from transplants when I tell them what it normally costs to have their lawn mowed. Big difference between the fine cut of a reel and shredding a 1/4 acre lawn with a rotary.

A long time ago, I heavily modified my 21" rotary to cut bermuda and zoysia with a semi acceptable finish. The four wheels were removed and the mower rode on 3" rollers. The blade was sharpened on an oilstone every other cut. This was just for my own lawn. Someone in the business would have to have as many blades as they had stops that day and sharpen each one before re using them. In that context, a reel is not that bad. Recently, I found that a 1/2" band file is the best tool for re cutting the relief on reel blades without having to put the mower on a $10,000 machine. If there is a relief angle on the reel, you are able to backlap and run the mower with slight contact between the blades. Let someone grind off all the relief and you have a mower that must be set for zero contact, as well as not being self sharpening.

There are a few areas here(super wealthy) that you will find sports turf highly maintained and practically flawless looking. The problem is that empire is being marketed as the "homeowner zoysia" that you can use a rotary on. While I think empire looks pretty good cut with a sharp rotary, it's not he same as a reel. Also, you get people maintaining it at 4". People just don't understand how much it costs to properlly maintain an entire landscape. I saw this company install around 10-15K of celebration Bermuda that they run their huge hustler ztr on and weedeat a lot of areas because a lot of the turf is on hills. The result is a lot of scalping. The customer doesn't know any better and the company can keep the maintenance bc the price isn't outrageous to maintain. I just shake my head and move on.
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Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 09:30 AM
Oh, and that Sylvester in the first pic was done by a "professional ISA certified" tree company here. I'll take a close up and you'll see how crappy the cuts they made near the trunk are. But, you see this company doing work everywhere just bc people see their trucks. Their work on palms and hardwoods flat out sucks.
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ArTurf
05-27-2012, 02:21 PM
That's a nice looking lawn. I have a couple of questions though. I have a client who just installed Empire Zoysia a few weeks back and I've been cutting it at 3-1/4", is this too high? Also, they've developed one or two brown areas and the install company is telling the client it's from me leaving clippings on the lawn, I don't run a mulching blade, is this possible or are they just trying to pass the buck?

Possibly the irrigation system is not sufficiently watering these spots? Just because "some" water is hitting the area does not mean it is enough. Check for proper "head to head" design. I see this all the time.

greendoctor
05-27-2012, 05:21 PM
Oh, and that Sylvester in the first pic was done by a "professional ISA certified" tree company here. I'll take a close up and you'll see how crappy the cuts they made near the trunk are. But, you see this company doing work everywhere just bc people see their trucks. Their work on palms and hardwoods flat out sucks.
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The client would scream if a tree company left that much trash and stubs on the palms. Reason why prices are higher here is that a fast job does not pass.

Duekster
05-27-2012, 05:48 PM
Most of the time is is a price issue because not everyone is blessed with slow growing turf like Hawaii

There is no way to cut low in southern lower 48 unless you use Primo or cut twice a week or more.

Cut frequency = (mowing height /2) / growth rate in inches. You can use a little simple algebra and determine the cut height based on weekly mowing. We typically assume 1/4" per day but it is likely 3/16ths from May through Sept when a good fertilization and irrigation program.Excessive irrigation and water will push the growth more.

greendoctor
05-27-2012, 05:52 PM
How true. There is no way I would suggest keeping zoysia at 1/2" in the lower 48. 1" or 11/2" would be doable because you're not taking off too much at once. There are some lawns that I hit with Primo Max because the soil is better than average and the client does not mind watering. In most cases, I am under pressure to keep the lawn as dry as possible without killing it. Water is expensive here.

Duekster
05-27-2012, 06:02 PM
How true. There is no way I would suggest keeping zoysia at 1/2" in the lower 48. 1" or 11/2" would be doable because you're not taking off too much at once. There are some lawns that I hit with Primo Max because the soil is better than average and the client does not mind watering. In most cases, I am under pressure to keep the lawn as dry as possible without killing it. Water is expensive here.

There is also the fallacy that short grass uses more water. Bigger blade uses more water. I have that beat into my head in Irrigation Audit school. I know it is not what most of us are taught. Water frequency has more to do with root depth. Primo directs plant energy to the roots.

I like to rely more on XXtra Iron and nitrogen fixing biologicals for color. I feed on the bottom end of the nitrogen recommendations of 3 pounds per year.

Disclaimer, I am more experianced with Bermuda not Zoysia so I am comparing notes and hoping to learn something.

Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 06:02 PM
Most of the time is is a price issue because not everyone is blessed with slow growing turf like Hawaii

There is no way to cut low in southern lower 48 unless you use Primo or cut twice a week or more.

Cut frequency = (mowing height /2) / growth rate in inches. You can use a little simple algebra and determine the cut height based on weekly mowing. We typically assume 1/4" per day but it is likely 3/16ths from May through Sept when a good fertilization and irrigation program.Excessive irrigation and water will push the growth more.
There are plenty of homes around here that get cut 2x/week and kept at .5-.75". I'm not saying its a majority, but it's not scarce.
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Duekster
05-27-2012, 06:09 PM
There are plenty of homes around here that get cut 2x/week and kept at .5-.75". I'm not saying its a majority, but it's not scarce.
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That is fantastic, you have educated homeowners with money. People say reel cutting is more expensive. Is that really the case or is it the fact to keep it cut low you have to cut twice a week.

In reality, when the muching mowers first came out, the recommendation was to mow twice a week. Few did it, they just raised the mowers.

St Augustine takes a bad rap for being more water intensive but you can mow it less frequently, and keep it higher.

It is a trade off.

Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 06:22 PM
That is fantastic, you have educated homeowners with money. People say reel cutting is more expensive. Is that really the case or is it the fact to keep it cut low you have to cut twice a week.

In reality, when the muching mowers first came out, the recommendation was to mow twice a week. Few did it, they just raised the mowers.

St Augustine takes a bad rap for being more water intensive but you can mow it less frequently, and keep it higher.

It is a trade off.

It's the cost of maintenance which costs more to run them. I double the cost if I have to use my reel. So a $25 lawn is now a $50 lawn. If I have to cut twice a week b/c it needs to be kept at <1", it is just a $50 lawn 2x/week.

Like I said before, you CAN cut empire with a SHARP rotary, but it should be kept at 1.5-2". Most 21" mowers will leave a sloppy cut at 1.5", so that may not be acceptable.

Unless the homeowner is really picky, St. Augustine should not need to be cut more than 1x/week, and this is coming from someone who lives in rainland in the summer. Floratam should be kept at 4"+, so if you are cutting lower than that, you are doing a major disservice. Dwarf varieties can be cut shorter, but again, no need for 2x/week. If it does really need that, there is too much water(from the system on top of rain) and nitrogen being put down. Which is usually from a dumb homeowner.

greendoctor
05-27-2012, 06:23 PM
There is also the fallacy that short grass uses more water. Bigger blade uses more water. I have that beat into my head in Irrigation Audit school. I know it is not what most of us are taught. Water frequency has more to do with root depth. Primo directs plant energy to the roots.

I like to rely more on XXtra Iron and nitrogen fixing biologicals for color. I feed on the bottom end of the nitrogen recommendations of 3 pounds per year.

Disclaimer, I am more experianced with Bermuda not Zoysia so I am comparing notes and hoping to learn something.

Too much N, as in more than 1/2 lb per month of growing season just causes problems in zoysia unless the grass needs it to maintain growth. My N rates are variable according to the site. If I do not need high N to maintain color and growth, I do not use it. My soils must be just bad for growing grass because even with constant irrigation, there are many sites where the grass does not grow more than 3/4" in 14 days unless I am fertilizing. Otherwise, my color comes from chelated micronutrients and the non fertilizer biostimulants as is used on golf greens. This is yet another reason for going to all liquids. I would have to keep 5 or more analysis and hope that one of them fits the site conditions. Urea is notorious for pushing lots of soft, drought prone top growth. My preference is for ammonium nitrogen, specifically ammonium sulfate. Grass gets greener on lower total N with that.

I also notice that correctly mowed st augustine is a real water conserver. If I have zoysia and st augustine in the same neighborhood and on the same soil. Zoysia wilts first if it is dry or hot. If people would stop doing things backazzwards and mow zoysia low, st augustine high, things would be great.

greendoctor
05-27-2012, 06:25 PM
It's the cost of maintenance which costs more to run them. I double the cost if I have to use my reel. So a $25 lawn is now a $50 lawn. If I have to cut twice a week b/c it needs to be kept at <1", it is just a $50 lawn 2x/week.

Like I said before, you CAN cut empire with a SHARP rotary, but it should be kept at 1.5-2". Most 21" mowers will leave a sloppy cut at 1.5", so that may not be acceptable.

Unless the homeowner is really picky, St. Augustine should not need to be cut more than 1x/week, and this is coming from someone who lives in rainland in the summer. Floratam should be kept at 4"+, so if you are cutting lower than that, you are doing a major disservice. Dwarf varieties can be cut shorter, but again, no need for 2x/week. If it does really need that, there is too much water(from the system on top of rain) and nitrogen being put down. Which is usually from a dumb homeowner.

Which is why the mowing prices I get are not comparable to the lower 48. Apples to oranges are being compared. $50 a cut sounds in line with what I see for lawns under 2,500 sq ft.

Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 06:27 PM
Too much N, as in more than 1/2 lb per month of growing season just causes problems in zoysia unless the grass needs it to maintain growth. My N rates are variable according to the site. If I do not need high N to maintain color and growth, I do not use it. My soils must be just bad for growing grass because even with constant irrigation, there are many sites where the grass does not grow more than 3/4" in 14 days unless I am fertilizing. Otherwise, my color comes from chelated micronutrients and the non fertilizer biostimulants as is used on golf greens. This is yet another reason for going to all liquids. I would have to keep 5 or more analysis and hope that one of them fits the site conditions. Urea is notorious for pushing lots of soft, drought prone top growth. My preference is for ammonium nitrogen, specifically ammonium sulfate. Grass gets greener on lower total N with that.

I also notice that correctly mowed st augustine is a real water conserver. If I have zoysia and st augustine in the same neighborhood and on the same soil. Zoysia wilts first if it is dry or hot. If people would stop doing things backazzwards and mow zoysia low, st augustine high, things would be great.

Totally agree. I use that same logic(cutting St. Aug high) with freezes. The guys cutting lower than what they should would have crappy looking St. Aug for weeks. The places that get cut high bounce back right away. Obviously, if we have freeze after freeze, not the case. But if it's just one freeze, what I said has worked for me.

Duekster
05-27-2012, 06:29 PM
Urea is super cheap and it does not produce good color in my book. Having said that, I do use it at low rates as we discussed here and there.

Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 06:29 PM
Which is why the mowing prices I get are not comparable to the lower 48. Apples to oranges are being compared. $50 a cut sounds in line with what I see for lawns under 2,500 sq ft.

Is that for reel mowing or rotary? I actually made a mistake. A weekly $25 lawn gets cut 2x/mo in the winter, so it's really a $33 lawn on a monthly basis.

Duekster
05-27-2012, 06:35 PM
It's the cost of maintenance which costs more to run them. I double the cost if I have to use my reel. So a $25 lawn is now a $50 lawn. If I have to cut twice a week b/c it needs to be kept at <1", it is just a $50 lawn 2x/week.

Like I said before, you CAN cut empire with a SHARP rotary, but it should be kept at 1.5-2". Most 21" mowers will leave a sloppy cut at 1.5", so that may not be acceptable.

Unless the homeowner is really picky, St. Augustine should not need to be cut more than 1x/week, and this is coming from someone who lives in rainland in the summer. Floratam should be kept at 4"+, so if you are cutting lower than that, you are doing a major disservice. Dwarf varieties can be cut shorter, but again, no need for 2x/week. If it does really need that, there is too much water(from the system on top of rain) and nitrogen being put down. Which is usually from a dumb homeowner.

So you charge more for a reel cut per cut and get twice the cuts. Sweet!

Do you treat too? I am considering a monthly rate where we cut once but also treat and use Primo. I will have to try hard because I do not see this as being normal plan where I live. I think it would be a good improvement.

Say I mow at 1.5" / 2 = 0.75 If I use primo and it grows just under 1/8" I could cut it every 7 days with little problem.

Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 06:40 PM
So you charge more for a reel cut per cut and get twice the cuts. Sweet!

Do you treat too? I am considering a monthly rate where we cut once but also treat and use Primo. I will have to try hard because I do not see this as being normal plan where I live. I think it would be a good improvement.

Say I mow at 1.5" / 2 = 0.75 If I use primo and it grows just under 1/8" I could cut it every 7 days with little problem.

I don't cut any 2x/week, because they are maintained at 1"+.

Duekster
05-27-2012, 06:58 PM
I don't cut any 2x/week, because they are maintained at 1"+.

How fast does Zoysia grow?, clearly not as fast a bermuda.

cgaengineer
05-27-2012, 07:00 PM
There is also the fallacy that short grass uses more water. Bigger blade uses more water. I have that beat into my head in Irrigation Audit school. I know it is not what most of us are taught. Water frequency has more to do with root depth. Primo directs plant energy to the roots.

I like to rely more on XXtra Iron and nitrogen fixing biologicals for color. I feed on the bottom end of the nitrogen recommendations of 3 pounds per year.

Disclaimer, I am more experianced with Bermuda not Zoysia so I am comparing notes and hoping to learn something.

I am so glad someone else agrees about grass height and water usage/drought resistance...I'm tired of hearing "cut it taller so it can take the heat" good god almighty, it's Bermuda not fescue...it loves heat...but it likes food an water too.
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cgaengineer
05-27-2012, 07:02 PM
The more green leaves the larger the water demand...it also looks like trash.
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Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 07:09 PM
How fast does Zoysia grow?, clearly not as fast a bermuda.

Depends on cultivar. Empire grows faster than a Diamond Zoysia lawn I maintain.

Duekster
05-27-2012, 07:20 PM
I am so glad someone else agrees about grass height and water usage/drought resistance...I'm tired of hearing "cut it taller so it can take the heat" good god almighty, it's Bermuda not fescue...it loves heat...but it likes food an water too.
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Others will say taller grass shades the soil and reduces weed seed germination. Not sure that is actually offset by a dense turf.

Duekster
05-27-2012, 07:22 PM
Depends on cultivar. Empire grows faster than a Diamond Zoysia lawn I maintain.

Same could be said for Bermuda as well.

Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 07:32 PM
Others will say taller grass shades the soil and reduces weed seed germination. Not sure that is actually offset by a dense turf.

For zoysia and bermuda, yes. For St. Augustine, ESPECIALLY Floratam, not the case. Floratam just doesn't get that dense enough to choke out weeds. It needs to be cut higher, and as a result, reduces the amount of weed germination.

Duekster
05-27-2012, 07:35 PM
For zoysia and bermuda, yes. For St. Augustine, ESPECIALLY Floratam, not the case. Floratam just doesn't get that dense enough to choke out weeds. It needs to be cut higher, and as a result, reduces the amount of weed germination.

Good enough. I think we are on the same page for the most part. ST Augstine is just different but does not deserve the bad rap it often gets.

Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 07:39 PM
Good enough. I think we are on the same page for the most part. ST Augstine is just different but does not deserve the bad rap it often gets.

Bad rap? Not sure why it gets that. It is a lot cheaper to fully maintain compared to zoysia and hybrid bermuda. The ONLY thing I hate about it is not being able to kill grassy weeds. Once crabgrass gets in, your done. I have NEVER had problems with chinch bugs, which leads me to fully believe that chinch damage is due to homeowners over-fertilizing and/or watering, and it getting cut too short. I really like Seville. It is more dense and you can cut it a little shorter.

Duekster
05-27-2012, 07:55 PM
Bad rap? Not sure why it gets that. It is a lot cheaper to fully maintain compared to zoysia and hybrid Bermuda. The ONLY thing I hate about it is not being able to kill grassy weeds. Once crabgrass gets in, your done. I have NEVER had problems with chinch bugs, which leads me to fully believe that chinch damage is due to homeowners over-fertilizing and/or watering, and it getting cut too short. I really like Seville. It is more dense and you can cut it a little shorter.

Green Doctor can tell you more about grassy weeds than I but it seems we are now seeing some better solutions for all grass types. Historically crab grass was best controlled with Pre-Emergents.

The big problem in Texas is SA dies if not watered where as the others go dormant. Some parts of this state do not allow SA to be planted or the watering restrictions will kill it.

Not really sure how others keep Zoysia and Bermuda green with their watering restrictions. Buffalo would be much better but harder to establish in a short time.

Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 08:01 PM
Green Doctor can tell you more about grassy weeds than I but it seems we are now seeing some better solutions for all grass types. Historically crab grass was best controlled with Pre-Emergents.

The big problem in Texas is SA dies if not watered where as the others go dormant. Some parts of this state do not allow SA to be planted or the watering restrictions will kill it.

Not really sure how others keep Zoysia and Bermuda green with their watering restrictions. Buffalo would be much better but harder to establish in a short time.

That's the big difference. We have a 5-6 month rainy season. We have weeks were it will rain 4 or 5 times. Even if it gets dry, we have irrigation 2x/week.

Duekster
05-27-2012, 08:05 PM
That's the big difference. We have a 5-6 month rainy season. We have weeks were it will rain 4 or 5 times. Even if it gets dry, we have irrigation 2x/week.
Yep. We still have the long germination period for crab grass but less natural water for the turf.

cgaengineer
05-27-2012, 08:37 PM
Others will say taller grass shades the soil and reduces weed seed germination. Not sure that is actually offset by a dense turf.

My lawn: 1/2" and not a single weed.
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Duekster
05-27-2012, 08:42 PM
My lawn: 1/2" and not a single weed.
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No argument from me. Unless it is St Augustine :laugh:

cgaengineer
05-27-2012, 09:17 PM
No argument from me. Unless it is St Augustine :laugh:

People just think tall Bermuda is thick...short reel mowed Bermuda is dense...lacks brown stems. It would be fun to bring a cool season fellow to GA that has a lawn business.
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cgaengineer
05-27-2012, 10:21 PM
My lawn: 1/2" and not a single weed.
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Ok...I do have just about a 6" sq patch of spurge...
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Duekster
05-27-2012, 10:23 PM
Ok...I do have just about a 6" sq patch of spurge...
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This is not confession, that is over on the do you work on sunday thread. :laugh:

Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 10:35 PM
This is not confession, that is over on the do you work on sunday thread. :laugh:

Lololololol
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cgaengineer
05-27-2012, 10:50 PM
This is not confession, that is over on the do you work on sunday thread. :laugh:

Hell yeah I work on Sunday...at home!
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cgaengineer
05-27-2012, 10:53 PM
I think I'm going to send my 20" TC in for service this week...The ole 3.5 B&S won't die. Somebody care to donate a roller kit to me?
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Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 10:57 PM
I think I'm going to send my 20" TC in for service this week...The ole 3.5 B&S won't die. Somebody care to donate a roller kit to me?
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Always good to have a ready to go backup and for what they charge for service up there it's a no brainer.
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cgaengineer
05-27-2012, 11:36 PM
So who's cutting on memorial day? :)
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Florida Gardener
05-27-2012, 11:39 PM
So who's cutting on memorial day? :)
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Unfortunately, me. But, Im sleeping in and starting late.

Ira
05-31-2012, 03:37 AM
This yard is about 25K sqft of palisades zoysia, sodded solid about five years ago. The picture was taken about six weeks ago after the third or fourth cut for the year, so it hadn't completely greened up yet. It's cut about 1.5" high with a 27" Tru-Cut, once a week during first two and last two months of season, and twice a week during the middle of the season. Until last year, it was mowed with a JD ZTR (commercial quality). Used the Tru-Cut all last year. Incredible difference in "look and feel" of the lawn.

I'm considering buying a used Toro fairway reel mower (3100D) so I can double the amount of zoysia and not die trying to keep it mowed.

http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/2300/14240782.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/694/14240782.jpg/)

greendoctor
05-31-2012, 03:59 AM
25,000 sq ft of zoysia would call for a fairway or at least a National Triplex mower already. For me, 1/4 acre would be as much as I would want to mow on foot unless there were too many obstacles to drive a mower through the place.

Ira
05-31-2012, 04:36 AM
25,000 sq ft of zoysia would call for a fairway or at least a National Triplex mower already. For me, 1/4 acre would be as much as I would want to mow on foot unless there were too many obstacles to drive a mower through the place.

It takes me up to 1.5 hours to mow it with the 27" Tru-Cut, depending on how hot/humid it is. Once a week isn't too bad, but twice a week is really pushing the limit of what I'm willing to do.

The 3100D I'm looking at has three 27" reels, for a 72" cut, plus the reels can shift left/right up to 24". The lawn area is pretty open (especially if I double the size of it), so the 3100D would do all of it in about 30 minutes.

cgaengineer
05-31-2012, 06:33 AM
It takes me up to 1.5 hours to mow it with the 27" Tru-Cut, depending on how hot/humid it is. Once a week isn't too bad, but twice a week is really pushing the limit of what I'm willing to do.

The 3100D I'm looking at has three 27" reels, for a 72" cut, plus the reels can shift left/right up to 24". The lawn area is pretty open (especially if I double the size of it), so the 3100D would do all of it in about 30 minutes.

Talk to DaveK on this forum before buying a Triplex...he had a Toro and sold it to get a JD. Both were nice mowers. He has 26k of Emerald.
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Florida Gardener
05-31-2012, 09:06 AM
Here is a Diamond Zoysia lawn that I maintain. It was recently leveled and sanded and will scalped and sanded again within the next week or so. I didn't do any of that, I just cut it and take care of the landscape. The pics don't do justice, it looks awesome. It's getting cut at 1.25" now, but hopefully will be able to cut lower than 1" after renovation.
http://i46.tinypic.com/1pv3w9.jpg
http://i49.tinypic.com/34gpy81.jpg

cgaengineer
05-31-2012, 10:20 PM
Hijack:

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e223/cgaengineer/d82c85fe.jpg

My Bermuda at 5/8" yes I removed my shutters for painting...
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Florida Gardener
05-31-2012, 10:24 PM
A welcomed and approved hijack
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cgaengineer
05-31-2012, 10:33 PM
Thank you!
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Patriot Services
06-01-2012, 08:49 PM
Just couldn't decide between a half or 3/4s could you?
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cgaengineer
06-01-2012, 09:55 PM
Just couldn't decide between a half or 3/4s could you?
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Well I need to topdress....1/2" is too low, 5/8 is just right!
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Ira
06-02-2012, 02:02 AM
Three questions about topdressing...

1. How well does it work if the soil is heavy clay (gumbo)?

2. How "deep" can the topdressing be, i.e., is there a limit as to how much should be put on in a given time period?

3. Good or bad idea to plug aerate before topdressing?

Even though cutting at 1.5" and using a roller on my TruCut hides it, my lawn is pretty uneven.

Ira

cgaengineer
06-02-2012, 04:39 AM
Three questions about topdressing...

1. How well does it work if the soil is heavy clay (gumbo)?

2. How "deep" can the topdressing be, i.e., is there a limit as to how much should be put on in a given time period?

3. Good or bad idea to plug aerate before topdressing?

Even though cutting at 1.5" and using a roller on my TruCut hides it, my lawn is pretty uneven.

Ira

Works just fine on clay and I suggest core aeration prior to topdressing as well...they say no deeper than 1/2" but Bermuda is some tough stuff...it will find the light. Clay soil is all we have around here and topdressing is popular. Contrary to what people have said on this forum, my other lawn did not turn into concrete with the addition of 1/2" sand, If it turned to concrete I don't know how my lawn and everyone else's topdressed clay lawns looks so great. My current lawn has not been topdressed but I did power rake it this spring...two passes at 90 degree angles so it is very smooth. I plan to apply about 1/4" this season and again next season.
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chaser2587
06-02-2012, 09:23 PM
Well I need to topdress....1/2" is too low, 5/8 is just right!
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What are you doing at 5/8??? I'm still at a 1/2"

http://i806.photobucket.com/albums/yy348/chaser2587/20120602_185126.jpg

cgaengineer
06-02-2012, 11:46 PM
What are you doing at 5/8??? I'm still at a 1/2"

http://i806.photobucket.com/albums/yy348/chaser2587/20120602_185126.jpg

Looking great Chase! I can't do 1/2"...lawn is to rough.
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Duekster
06-03-2012, 04:59 AM
$0.02 aerate and top dress with compost is best AND first but use sand for fine leveling.

Ira
06-03-2012, 03:07 PM
Asked the guy that does my lawn fert stuff about this. They are a fairly large company (state-wide but not nation-wide). He said it would cost about $350 to do 8000 sqft (about 1/3 of the lawn) as a "trial run". That's for aeration and top dressing with compost. He said the compost won't level the yard. He said if I water quite a bit to soften the lawn up before they aerate, the plugs would be about 1/4" to 1" long, depending on soil compaction. Does all that sound about right? Does the lawn look pretty bad (due to the plugs and compost) for a while? How soon can you mow afterwards?

Still need to find someone in the Houston area that will top dress my lawn to level it out. I don't think top dressing for lawn leveling is very common around here.

Duekster
06-03-2012, 03:22 PM
Asked the guy that does my lawn fert stuff about this. They are a fairly large company (state-wide but not nation-wide). He said it would cost about $350 to do 8000 sqft (about 1/3 of the lawn) as a "trial run". That's for aeration and top dressing with compost. He said the compost won't level the yard. He said if I water quite a bit to soften the lawn up before they aerate, the plugs would be about 1/4" to 1" long, depending on soil compaction. Does all that sound about right? Does the lawn look pretty bad (due to the plugs and compost) for a while? How soon can you mow afterwards?

Still need to find someone in the Houston area that will top dress my lawn to level it out. I don't think top dressing for lawn leveling is very common around here.

The price sounds fair but the plugs should be 2 to 3" long. How much compost? 1/4" for 8000 SF is 6 yards.... so I doubt they are adding much.

Some people rake up the plugs, others let them dry out them mow them to distrubute the top soil.

chaser2587
06-03-2012, 08:33 PM
Looking great Chase! I can't do 1/2"...lawn is to rough.
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Thanks Chris! Oh c'mon yours looks smooth as glass another 1/8" wont hurt. Seriously though your lawn looks awesome no matter what height your cutting at!
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