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View Full Version : Anyone use Rainbird SST-outdoor


ArTurf
06-20-2012, 11:56 PM
I have been installing the Hunter Pro-C for the last few years since I figured it simpler to program than the Rainbird ESP 's. But several customers cannot get the Pro-C figured out and probably never will. So I replaced a Pro-C with a rainbird sst on some customers. I know this is not a professional grade model but at least the homeowner can operate it. I plan on using it on the right customers. The STP model is listed under the professional products but it does not have an outdoor model with a cabinet and looks cheap.

The only problem with the SST is the WR-2 rain sensor will not hook up to it without using an outside transformer. I tried looking for the 24V wire but did not want to tear up anything by pulling off the faceplate. Anyone ever give these a look? Any suggestions on hooking up the WR-2 without using an outside transformer?

mitchgo
06-21-2012, 12:16 AM
I've contemplated this myself for these controllers and others as we install wireless rain sensors out the ying yang.

A dedicated transformer for the sensor sounds like a good idea to me- alas not to my boss. Whenever we come across these kind of controllers we suggest a hard wired sensor

Shame on you for installing them!

Wet_Boots
06-21-2012, 06:30 AM
Install the Pro-C and lock the cover and keep the keys

Sprinkus
06-21-2012, 09:11 AM
I replaced one recently where the umbdass installer connected the wireless rain sensor receiver to the 110 going into the controller. Burned up the inside of the receiver pretty good.
I'd rather use a Pro-C than the SST, but if the homeowner likes the SST more let 'em have it. :hammerhead:

ArTurf
06-21-2012, 10:29 AM
I've contemplated this myself for these controllers and others as we install wireless rain sensors out the ying yang.

A dedicated transformer for the sensor sounds like a good idea to me- alas not to my boss. Whenever we come across these kind of controllers we suggest a hard wired sensor

Shame on you for installing them!

I've got nothing against hard wired sensors but in many cases it is not practical to run the wire to where the sensor needs to be mounted.

I would rather not use these contollers but if the customer cannot operate anything else you gotta do what works. The SST outdoor is really not a bad looking unit. The indoor models without a cabinet look cheap however.

ArTurf
06-21-2012, 10:34 AM
Install the Pro-C and lock the cover and keep the keys

The settings would need to be adjusted according to weather patterns and it would be impossible to run around and set the controllers myself even if I charged for such a service.

irrig8r
06-21-2012, 11:54 AM
The settings would need to be adjusted according to weather patterns and it would be impossible to run around and set the controllers myself even if I charged for such a service.

So install the Solar Sync with it?

ArTurf
06-21-2012, 12:32 PM
So install the Solar Sync with it?

I tried the solar sync and was very disapointed. I guess I disagree with smart controls that adjust run times vs frequency. Although I know most of the less expensive ones work this way.

muddywater
06-21-2012, 09:09 PM
I think the ESP is easier on older folks and most folks in general. The Hunter Xcore is really hard to see for them. I have had two XC clocks that have froze up this year and have had to hit the reset button.

I have seen an SST once, I think the guy bought it at Lowes and he had no problem figuring it out on his own.

I wish they still made the rainbird rc clocks. I have a few running that must be 20 years old.

grassman177
06-21-2012, 09:29 PM
it is too bad, cus the pro c is the best controller imo. the fewest issues i have seen overall, and the most versitile and easy to use .

irritation
06-21-2012, 09:46 PM
Shame on you for installing them!

I agree! :wall

FIMCO-MEISTER
06-21-2012, 10:25 PM
Use the ESPM not the SST. Why install a clock that is a pia to install a pigtail on?

muddywater
06-21-2012, 11:12 PM
Ok lets say you do an install for an elderly couple. You spend 20 minutes educating them on the clock and leave the owners manual with them. Do you charge them the next time they need programming help? When do you start charging them? I have done 3 trips for some elderly clients without charging. I could see them having an easier time with an sst.

ArTurf
06-22-2012, 04:07 PM
Ok lets say you do an install for an elderly couple. You spend 20 minutes educating them on the clock and leave the owners manual with them. Do you charge them the next time they need programming help? When do you start charging them? I have done 3 trips for some elderly clients without charging. I could see them having an easier time with an sst.

This is exactly what I experience. I'm glad you understand. The bad part is not all of these are elderly. Some are doctors, lawyers or people you would think are smart.

grassman,
I'm a fan of the Pro C but some of my customers are not.

Fimco
I figured out how to install the pigtails with no problems. PM if you want to know.

I tried the ESP's a few times but they seemed to be more confusing than the Pro C.

Wet_Boots
06-22-2012, 06:22 PM
the real question here is just what are the customers trying to do with their controllers - it should be fairly easy to help a homeowner accomplish any reasonable goal

Mike Leary
06-22-2012, 06:34 PM
the real question here is just what are the customers trying to do with their controllers - it should be fairly easy to help a homeowner accomplish any reasonable goal
We've been through this a number of times: a pro should run the show. Hubby can mix the magaritas for the crew at 4.30. :drinkup:

1idejim
06-22-2012, 06:53 PM
[QUOTE=ArTurf;4450319] Fimco
I figured out how to install the pigtails with no problems. PM if you want to know. [QUOTE]

Now that's funny :laugh::laugh::laugh:

Wet_Boots
06-22-2012, 07:33 PM
We've been through this a number of times: a pro should run the show. Hubby can mix the magaritas for the crew at 4.30. :drinkup:I rather liked the up-down buttons on the old Pro-C for adjusting global runtime percentages, not because it was the best way to manage watering, but because it might have served to keep homeowners from fiddling further.

muddywater
06-22-2012, 08:34 PM
We've been through this a number of times: a pro should run the show. Hubby can mix the magaritas for the crew at 4.30. :drinkup:

So bill the sweet old elderly couple a service call everytime you have to go make a change to the controller? or knowing your prices, you billed about 10 free service calls into the installation?

Mike Leary
06-22-2012, 09:22 PM
or knowing your prices, you billed about 10 free service calls into the installation?

No, I billed it out to the megas so I could take care of the indigents for free.

muddywater
06-23-2012, 06:51 PM
Ok guys get ready to flame me! I have been installing several small irrigation jobs lately.

The more I think about this the more I think of the SST in a positive light. Although I try to install the best materials and give my clients the best bang for the buck, isn't the end result trying to create a user friendly solution for the client? Is it really in the best interest for the clients to never be able to set their controller? Imagine the service calls over a 10-year period. These are not landscapes with hundreds of thousands of dollars in plant material. Usually it is 5000 sq ft of turf.

What are the disadvanatages of having an sst for 9 rotors? Reliability? But aren't all these clocks are made in china. And I have seen some SSTs that seem to outlast Hunters SRC or Xcore.

Flame on!!!

muddywater
06-23-2012, 06:52 PM
No, I billed it out to the megas so I could take care of the indigents for free.

Socialism meets irrigation.

irritation
06-23-2012, 07:01 PM
Installing a SST is no better than installing a a Rainbird 42SA or any other crap the big box stores offer.:hammerhead:

ArTurf
06-23-2012, 10:40 PM
Ok guys get ready to flame me! I have been installing several small irrigation jobs lately.

The more I think about this the more I think of the SST in a positive light. Although I try to install the best materials and give my clients the best bang for the buck, isn't the end result trying to create a user friendly solution for the client? Is it really in the best interest for the clients to never be able to set their controller? Imagine the service calls over a 10-year period. These are not landscapes with hundreds of thousands of dollars in plant material. Usually it is 5000 sq ft of turf.

What are the disadvanatages of having an sst for 9 rotors? Reliability? But aren't all these clocks are made in china. And I have seen some SSTs that seem to outlast Hunters SRC or Xcore.

Flame on!!!

Muddy
Thanks for backing me on this. The SST carries a 3-year warranty vs a Pro-C 5-year. The difference in price is about $25 for me. So that is not enough to make or break any deal. This is about serving the customer with a product they are happy with. I wish all my customers were smart enough to operate a Pro C or ESP, but that is not the case.

Wet_Boots
06-24-2012, 06:54 AM
Any sprinkler contractor should be able to print out the one or two pages that cover the adjustments a homeowner might make.

Kiril
06-24-2012, 12:17 PM
The SST is a limited POS, and quite frankly I fail to see how it is any "easier" than any other controller. Just because you have buttons instead of using arrow buttons doesn't remove the need to understand what the hell you are doing. If you can't RTFM, then hire someone who knows what they are doing!!!!!

muddywater
06-24-2012, 01:23 PM
The SST is a limited POS, and quite frankly I fail to see how it is any "easier" than any other controller. Just because you have buttons instead of using arrow buttons doesn't remove the need to understand what the hell you are doing. If you can't RTFM, then hire someone who knows what they are doing!!!!!

Poor grandma. What more do you really need for 5000 sq ft of turf???

I agree they need to read the manual, but i think older people still struggle.

But your prob right. They do need to rtfm! They are being lazy if they dont do that, and should be billed if they dont rtfm.
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Kiril
06-24-2012, 01:28 PM
Poor grandma. What more do you really need for 5000 sq ft of turf???

A controller that is capable of irrigating on intervals. Further, how many irrigated landscapes do you see that only irrigate the turf? I'll tell you how many I see .............

0

grassman177
06-24-2012, 01:38 PM
turf only is the most common here by far and large.

i am not familiar with the sst, cuz i have not seen one in an install yet, and only personally deal with the pro c. i love the interval settings and many dif programming options it gives.

muddywater
06-24-2012, 02:31 PM
A controller that is capable of irrigating on intervals. Further, how many irrigated landscapes do you see that only irrigate the turf? I'll tell you how many I see .............

0

I see alot of turf only sprinkler systems and i install alot of turf only systems. People just dont want to irrigate established plant material. Prob 60-75% are turf only

What do you mean by interval watering? The sst wont do that?
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muddywater
06-25-2012, 09:50 AM
What about stp-900i?

http://rainbird.com/landscape/products/controllers/STPi.htm
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Wet_Boots
06-25-2012, 10:29 AM
why not Orbit?

muddywater
06-25-2012, 10:41 AM
why not Orbit?

This stp was same price as an esp without modules at jdl. Same warranty. Its got to be better than those pos xcore. I have already warranty replaced 5 this year.
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Kiril
06-25-2012, 10:58 AM
I see alot of turf only sprinkler systems and i install alot of turf only systems. People just dont want to irrigate established plant material. Prob 60-75% are turf only

What do you mean by interval watering? The sst wont do that?

What happens when you have an irrigation interval that is > 7 days? What if I need more than 4 start times to prevent runoff? What if you want control over start times other than the first one?

I will say this however, despite the steps back this controller takes, it takes one major step forward by removing the idiot "programs" and making each zone valve independently programmable.

Here is an example schedule for a simple landscape that was generated by one of my old spreadsheets. Can you program the sst to do this?

ArTurf
06-25-2012, 12:06 PM
What about stp-900i?

http://rainbird.com/landscape/products/controllers/STPi.htm
Posted via Mobile Device

The stp series is pretty much identical to the SST's. The STP is designated under the professional category by Rainbird. Just a marketing thing as far as I can see. The reason I chose the SST-outdoor is the cabinet simply has a much better appearance. For whatever reason the STP's do not come in a cabinet model. Strange to me since they are marketed as a professional grade product. Go figure.

muddywater
06-25-2012, 02:23 PM
What happens when you have an irrigation interval that is > 7 days? What if I need more than 4 start times to prevent runoff? What if you want control over start times other than the first one?

I will say this however, despite the steps back this controller takes, it takes one major step forward by removing the idiot "programs" and making each zone valve independently programmable.

Here is an example schedule for a simple landscape that was generated by one of my old spreadsheets. Can you program the sst to do this?

I am JUST talking about elderly folks that will never get it. And i am really not trying to argue... But i am very interested in your opinion. Some of your posts have helped me in the past.

And these folks usually just water 3 times a week.
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Kiril
06-25-2012, 02:30 PM
It says it has multiple start times, but just two programs.

It has one start time, which the controller will automatically split into 2,3 or 4 if you set it that way. You only have control over the initial start.

There are no programs for the SST, which is the best feature of the controller, and what makes it simpler to use.

And these folks usually just water 3 times a week.

I am not here to tell you to use or not use this controller. That said, I would not install this controller. If the client cannot understand how operate the controller and is incapable of reading and understanding the manual, then they should hire someone to hold their hand.

EBHC
06-28-2012, 11:30 PM
You can alter the delay between cycles!
You are not limited by what the controller first displays.
I cant remember which button you press and hold for a second then press the button multiple times to pick your option of delay between cycles.
It's in the instructions

muddywater
06-28-2012, 11:31 PM
I installed an SSP today. The client had an ancient RC400 that finally croaked, and they wanted a simple easy controller to water 2 zones. They told me they had a toro digital controller at another property and they hated it. I brought a Rainbird ESP and the SSP and gave them the choice. They picked the SSP, and after installing it and going over it with them for 3 minutes, they understood how to operate the controller.

I think they all have their place whether it is a SSP, ESP, ESP SMT, or a Calsense. I think if I would have installed an ESP they would have not have been as happy.

muddywater
06-28-2012, 11:32 PM
What happens when you have an irrigation interval that is > 7 days? What if I need more than 4 start times to prevent runoff? What if you want control over start times other than the first one?

I will say this however, despite the steps back this controller takes, it takes one major step forward by removing the idiot "programs" and making each zone valve independently programmable.

Here is an example schedule for a simple landscape that was generated by one of my old spreadsheets. Can you program the sst to do this?

I think I would install a ESP SMT and skip the spreadsheet!