Turning in scrubs?

[1stclasslawns]

As most of us that use this board either are or will soon be licensed. I am wondering about if you would or would not turn in a person who is not licensed in your area if you saw them applying herbicides?

I will put this in form of a poll so you may remain annomious.

Jim

[Randy Scott]

How would you know if they are licensed or not?

I certainly wouldn't take someone elses word on it and would want 100% proof for my own eyes to believe. You'd look pretty dumb if you turned someone in and it turned out they had a license.

Depends on what they are applying anyways. Straight fert. in WI doesn't need a license.

Lastly, I've got better things to do. If they are applying wthout a license that's BS,but I have other things to worry about than patroling for a pesticide license.

Also, I'd lay odds that 30% of the people on here that say they are licensed probably aren't. Maybe proof should be shown here also.

My vote is I don't care. Dishonest people will eventually get what they deserve, I hope.


:)

[fblandscape]

I don't bother them, if they don't bother me. If they are working on a property I work at and are not certified.. I will go so far as to inform the client, and possibly have words with the applicator.... other than that... live and let live.

[KenH]

Originally posted by Randy Scott
How would you know if they are licensed or not?

I certainly wouldn't take someone elses word on it and would want 100% proof for my own eyes to believe. You'd look pretty dumb if you turned someone in and it turned out they had a license.


:)

If they are liscensed, at least in CT, they need to have their lic. number on their trucks.

[longslawn]

Its the states job to enforce the laws not mine. If they(LCO) don't care enough to be certified, soon or later it will catch up with them. I know that most of the people I see spraying herbicides are not licensed to do so. In NC you can look it up on the internet and see who is and isn't licensed.
I wouldn't feel right turning them in unless I saw something being done the could cause serious damage to either the public or the enviroment.
I have enough to worry about than if someone has the proper license or not.

[1stclasslawns]

In Arkansas you must have company name on the side of your truck. Also as far as I have found out (and I have checked) I am the only LCO with a license, there is a couple PCOs and a landscaper, but no other LCOS.

About 85% of "lawn boys" have a sprayer in the back of their rigs. While talking to the head of the pest control section of the plant board his words were "how do we know who is spraying if we don't get a complant". With the closest inspecter over an hour away he can't very well watch the highway.

In my advertising I am going to mention that if the person you have hired to mow your lawn dosn't have a commercial license he is breaking the law, and the owner can be held liable.

I am not a snitch but a couple of the guys that have done some spraying have killed some lawns and I have had negitive comments directed tward me, such as "I wont have nobody spray and kill my yard like old so&so did to such&suches".

The uneducated don't follow directions and it gives me a bad wrap befor I get started. In this small town word gets around and negitives always talk louder then anything else.

Jim

[Russ]

You may want to turn in scrubs if:

1. You never, ever made an app. before you got your license
2. Your sprayer never ever leaks
3. You always triple rinse
4. You calibrate every day
5. Your records are always perfect and up to date
6. You always use proper ppe
7. You are always exactly on label

OR



You could "let he who is without sin cast the first stone"

[BBALLTURF]

RUSS, THANT IS AN INTERESTING WHY OF LOOKING AT IT BUT IF WE DONT CONTROL WHAT HAPPEN IN THE GREEN INDUSTRY, THE TREE HUGGERS ARE GOING TO MAKE OUR LIFE VERY HARD, TURNING SOMEBODY IN MYBE NOT BUT TO HELP THEM IS A MUST. AT THE RATE LOCAL AND FED. GOVERMENT GOING, WE MIGHT HAVE TO POST THE WHOLE BLOCK JUST TO SPRAY R-UP. THINK ABOUT IT!!!!

[Russ]

If our goal is to improve the industry by action, one may wish to consider joining and becoming active in their own State Lawn Care As. and, or, Turf Foundation. These groups can do far more to educate our lawmakers and the public than most of us know.
The most serious threat we face, in my opinion, is government regulation, not outlaw unlicensed applicatior. Less than 10% of the lawns in Indiana are maintened by persons other than the homeowner. That leaves plenty of room for growth without dragging the industry down.

I have a drivers license, but I don't turn in unlicensed drivers
I don't speed, but I dont turn in speeders
My dog has a license, but I dont turn in unlicensed dogs
My trucks have license plates, but I don't turn in people without them

Do you guys? Whats the difference?

Those who chose to operate without a license do so at their own risk. It's all I can do to mind my own business-----I'm not about to try to mind someone elses

[dhicks]

I asked my Maryland Dept. of Agriculture inspector about this and this is what he told me: by the time it's reported, and the time they can send an inspector out to take photos of the unlicensed applicators, they are usually done with the job and are gone.

Unless THEY can witness the unlicensed applicator and have photos there's nothing that can be done. Of course, if there is enough complaints they can send an inspector to follow these dudes around and wait for them to mess-up. But like most state agencies, they are under funded and under staffed.

In MD they catch about 65 cases per year and those that are caught are referred to the State Attorney General (AG) for prosecution. Even if you are licensed, any infraction that is Witnessed is reported to the AG.

[crawdad]

Originally posted by Russ
......I have a drivers license, but I don't turn in unlicensed drivers
I don't speed, but I dont turn in speeders
My dog has a license, but I dont turn in unlicensed dogs
My trucks have license plates, but I don't turn in people without them

Do you guys? Whats the difference?

Those who chose to operate without a license do so at their own risk. It's all I can do to mind my own business-----I'm not about to try to mind someone elses

You said it best, Russ.
Wow, so far, 14 out of 25 have voted to "turn 'em in" yet not ONE of these wannabe snitches has posted his intent. I find that very interesting. Watch your backs, boys, your "friends" are ready to "drop the dime," so you'd better have your papers in order.
Crawdad

[ant]

i am with fblandscape

i was a scab at one time like most of us..a friend apps. lawns with out proper licenses and he does a good job..there are times were i get help from him ...
being a slob is one thing...

anthony

[goose]

So when it comes to the nut cutting its live and let live. But look at all the other post over the last 3 years and someone ask for help , the first thing out of the responders mouth is ......Well first thing are you licensed if not dont ask silly questions!!!!!!! Hell yes turn them in , they will eventually find them!!!! These are the same guys who want to do your job without being licensed .You got to have a fishing and hunting license for some unknown reason , money!!!!! , you would turn in a drug dealer , If it wasnt for these people I might do 3 million this year , you might do $100,000 or whatever sounds good to you. Hell if he dont have to do what I have to do , maybe he shouldnt have to pay taxes. I mean he doesnt have a license , so what. Oh forget it this was on an old thread , nobody will see this anyway.

[f350]

i'm a business owner not a gumshoe. i focus on what i need to do and thats it.. why sweat the small stuff and it's all small stuff..

[GarPA]

this might not make any sense....but I would rat on someone not paying taxes, collecting and not remitting sales tax, keeping 2 sets of books...b4 I would rat a non licensed applicator...he's going to find out the hard way when they confiscate his equipment (that can be the fine here in PA)....but with working under the table, he directly adversely impacts market prices for our services by his illegal actions.....and that can impact MY wallet....I think working under the table is the true definition of a scrub/scab/slimeball

now ask me how I REALLY feel about this!!!! heh heh

[GroundKprs]

Perhaps this is why our profession is not looked on by the general population as a "profession."

How could Joe Blow be a professional with his Spray Doc tank and K-Mart weedkiller, and no education on how to apply?

And how professional is it for those who consider themselves "professional" to ignore this riffraff that drags the industry down? Oh, yeah. My pocketbook is full enough, let the sharks rip off anyone else, BUT NOT ONE OF MY CUSTOMERS!

I can get a list of all licensed applicators by county in my state. And I do, because I like to know who is legit. It would be ignorant to report someone you suspect, without knowing what he is applying and whether he's licensed. But when a definite violation is apparent, I feel I would be letting the trade down if I did not report.

And a report should include locations of application, name (if available) and vehicle license number, and any other useful info.

[MacLawnCo]

I was reading last night in the OH pest guides, that if fert is left where it is not suposed to be(which i implied as in the beds, on drives and walks) the applicator can be fined. HEHE, i cant wait to make the competition go brole next year. None of them blow anything off...They are sitting ducks! :D

[Weedburner]

I do spray work for golf courses, which the department of Agriculture visits every season. They in turn send the inspector to see me. I meet the inspector in the local coffee shop and we visit over lunch or breakfest. They ask about a rinse pad, license etc. The next time I'm in one of the locals will always ask who that guy was. I tell them (in a group if possible) that was the department of Ag checking my spray records. Mention that they are rather strict on lawn folks. It doesn't talk long for word to spread in a small town. I would never turn anyone in, but I think the inspectors presents in town really makes others gun shy.

[xpnd]

Eliminatating the so called scrubs in the weed control/pesticide business is simple and easy. State law should require that all wholesale dealers restrict sales to liscensed entities. 90% or more of what we use (at least in TX) can legally be obtained off the shelf at HD, Wally World of feed stores by anyone. 2,4-D at the feed store is lined up like Gatorade at Albertsons. Anyone can buy it even though it is a regulated herbicide in TX. But when comparing % active ingredient and retail cost of this product, to say Trimec at wholesale, the feed store cost is astronomical. So why doesn't the state enact this legislation? Lobbyists and money. If wholesalers could not sell to "scrubs", their sales would plummet and the "scrubs" could not price wise compete with the legit applicators. It all rolls up or down to the dollar.

[SWD]

I would turn a unlicensed applicator in. I have been toxically exposed to a restricted pesticide by an unlicensed applicator. You betcha he got turned in.
Do I follow the laws, label - etc? Yep.
Am I without sin as a previous poster explained? - Nope.
However, this industry is viewed as little more than three moe's and a joe with their truck. Provided we want a professional industry reputation, we have to police our own.
I am not a lco, I don't use the name or accronym in my speech or business cards.
I am an Agronomist, and I maintain turfgrass.
Professional services and professional prices.
Oh, and Xpnd - the reason why Home Depot and other seed stores can carry state restricted pesticides is due to the current Texas state law. An unlicensed private person is allowed to possess less than one quart quantities of ordinarily restricted items solely for personal use. In addition, depending upon the chemical, the active ingredient percentage for these over the counter pesticides are also readicaly diminished.

[bobbygedd]

there was a guy who had a son. dad and son always went fishing, and to the field to throw the ball around, it was hot, and dad always had a bottle of soda in the backseat readily available , and the son always knew this. dad dropped son off at the little league field to play in his game, then drove over to a nearby friends house . during the visit, the man mentioned to his friend that he had some rodents he couldnt get rid of. the friend reccomended some "stuff" he used that killed them mice and rats dead, instantlly. " i have some here, let me find u a container, ill pour some in for u." dad said wait, i have an empty soda bottle in the back seat of my car. they filled the bottle with the poison, and dad went back to the field to pick up his son. as dad was talking with one of the other dads, son ran to the car to get a drink of soda, he knew that soda bottle was always there. he guzzled the liquid so quickly, it was too late by the time he realized it wasnt soda........ less than 3 min later the boy was dead. I am a licensed applicator. i personally think the tests i took to get this license was not hard enough. i didnt study for more than one hour total, and was still able to pass the test. pestides and herbs. should not be sold "over the counter". people who are not qualified should not be handling them. i knew a young guy who got " a new job". he went to work everyday and sometimes i ran into him after work. his legs, and sneakers were yellow all the time(it was summer, he wore shorts without socks) so his feet were yellow too. i never even asked. one day, i just had to ask. dave, where are u working? "well bob, i got this great new job with this fertilizing company, they give me 8 bucks an hour, all i have to do is take the list of addresses, and go to the houses, and pour this " stuff" into a spreader, and put it on the lawn." long story short, seems dave got a job with a local fert company(big chain) they gave him one day training, then sent him solo to apply everything from pre ems to merit and dilox. he did not have a clue as to what he was doing, what he was using, safety attire, nothing. he was applying in shorts and sneakers, probably in swimming pools, dogs drinking bowls, who knows. if u saw a man harming a child, would u do something to stop it? or would u mind your own business? it is our job as human beings to report people to the proper athorities if they are doing something that can be harmful to others. two yrs ago i may have said to leave these unlicensed guys alone. now, i dont know. am i rambling on? sorry. im bored

[philk17088]

I would turn them in if I got a chance, Iwouldn't sit around and wait to catch them but..
I didn't do a single application until I had a pesticide liscence. In PA that means carrying a certain amount of liability and keeping your applicator's liscense current. Those are expenses I have to pay for! Why the hell should Joe Scrub get a pass and under cut my pricing. If your going to be in this profession do it right! If you short cut these regulations what else are you cheating at?

There is no excuse for being a scrub!
PK

[HBFOXJr]

If your not part of the solution then you are part of the problem. It is that simple. And you better be sure your own house is in order and kept that way before you dime out another.

I regard people that do things competively illegally as thieves stealing food from my mouth. I don't like it.

[bubble boy]

before being licenced, had i done an app and screwed up, and found the watchdogs were watching...

who could i blame but me?

i love how we hammer "lowballers", who break no law. but when it comes to apps all the bleeding hearts come out of the woodwork. why?

if i was sure of a person doing apps unlicenced, i would turn them in. and i would tell them to their face. and i would feel no gulit.

it's like anything else. if i speed and get a ticket, i don't get mad at the police. how can people get mad when they are guilty? take your medicine and move on.

[strickdad]

Originally posted by longslawn
Its the states job to enforce the laws not mine. If they(LCO) don't care enough to be certified, soon or later it will catch up with them. I know that most of the people I see spraying herbicides are not licensed to do so. In NC you can look it up on the internet and see who is and isn't licensed.
I wouldn't feel right turning them in unless I saw something being done the could cause serious damage to either the public or the enviroment.
I have enough to worry about than if someone has the proper license or not. were is this internet site at that you can see info on who is licensed??

[longslawn]

http://www.ncagr.com/aspzine/Fooddrug/data/dirsearch2.asp?..

[bob]

Thought about it before, but probably wouldn't do it.

[Lawn Tek]

You would not mind going to a Dr. who has no license would you ?
Would you turn him in ?
They are getting a free ride , no expesive insurance , and can harm your community ,or some one you know .

I can tell by some of the responses here , a lot of people are spraying without a license .

Lets all compete on equal ground , and no doubt about it if they know better , they are turned in

[GrazerZ]

I would turn them in without hesitation. I worked hard to get my liscence. I don't want some fool trying to do something that will hurt me, others, the enviroment,Or this industry. There are enough problems with idiots with liscences, the ones who don't have them are that much worse. In fact, I think that there should be a bounty for every person doing illigal apps that gets turned in.
"live and let live", give me a break!

[Mowin4cash]

We have lots of guys around my neck of the woods who have big spray rigs that are not licensed. This I know for a fact, because they've told me. Anyway, this is the approach I think we as licensed applicators should take. Talk to these folks, try to help them LEARN what they need to know. Most don't realize you have to be licensed. Help them become truly professional and responsible. Most will want to come into compliance. BUT, on the other hand, if they want to be arrogant and uncooperative, then put the man on them. At least we can say, we tried to help you, but you didn't listen. Just my 2 cents worth.

Mike

[strickdad]

Originally posted by longslawn
http://www.ncagr.com/aspzine/Fooddrug/data/dirsearch2.asp?.. thanks, longslawn. i never new that was there...