PDA

View Full Version : Diesel MPG


TheChiefsLawnCare
08-23-2012, 03:52 AM
Im considering getting a ford f250 or f350 to pull a fully loaded 7x16 enclosed tandem axel trailer. Right now I have a 07 GMC sierra 1500 with the flex fuel engine and the gas mileage is killing me. Do yall think I will get that much better mpg with the diesel. If I had to guess i would say im proab getting between 7-10 mpg with the sierra. I would also like the heavier truck for the bigger payload.

BPS##
08-23-2012, 07:05 AM
I pull a heavy trailer with 4' expanded metal sides and 5' expanded metal ramp.

Every one knows that expanded metal pulls hard thru the wind.

Driving a 2000 F250 7.3L diesel with 4x4 and 6 spd manual trans.
I rarely drive over 65 and get 12.8/9 fairly consistently.
Just the truck with no trailer keeping it under 70, 18.5 is totally doable.

TheChiefsLawnCare
08-23-2012, 07:59 AM
better than what im doing when im not pulling any trailer. when that truck when my everyday, before i got my work vehicle, i was getting about 13 mpg. new gas trucks get horrible mpg. my dad got an 08 f250 diesel with camper top and city driving i think he said he was getting 11-12. and he drives slow and dosent let into it. so you still doin better then the new diesels, and you have a much better sounding truck lol

01thump
08-23-2012, 08:24 AM
Diesels will always get better mpg compared to a gas motor TOWING and will tow better power wise and will last longer if taken care of..they are a work motor thats what they are designed for.

ParkWelding
08-23-2012, 08:49 AM
Im considering getting a ford f250 or f350 to pull a fully loaded 7x16 enclosed tandem axel trailer. Do yall think I will get that much better mpg with the diesel.

Yes, you will. But know that not all diesel trucks get great fuel mileage in stock form. Use the search function.

BPS##
08-23-2012, 10:14 AM
better than what im doing when im not pulling any trailer. when that truck when my everyday, before i got my work vehicle, i was getting about 13 mpg. new gas trucks get horrible mpg. my dad got an 08 f250 diesel with camper top and city driving i think he said he was getting 11-12. and he drives slow and dosent let into it. so you still doin better then the new diesels, and you have a much better sounding truck lol





Low mileage 7.3Ls can be found but you can't be in a rush to buy one.
Its one of those start looking things and be ready to jump fast when you do find one. They don't last.

There are a lot in the 200k to 300k miles range.
Those guys seem to think their trucks are worth twice what they are too.

hosejockey2002
08-23-2012, 01:54 PM
The older diesel trucks get better mpg than the newer ones. The old 12 valve Cummins diesels are really good on fuel but don't have the pulling power of the newer ones. The newer diesels will still get better mileage than your current truck and of course pull much better.

Tizzy
08-23-2012, 05:29 PM
ive got an 08 f250 ext cab long bed. its gets about 14 mpg towing the mowing trailer. and empty does 17-21 mpg.

honestly. with it you need to be towing over 12K lbs to really ever know its there. it has so much power.

ParkWelding
08-23-2012, 06:25 PM
ive got an 08 f250 ext cab long bed. its gets about 14 mpg towing the mowing trailer. and empty does 17-21 mpg.

honestly. with it you need to be towing over 12K lbs to really ever know its there. it has so much power.

Is that truck completely stock? I haven't heard of much more than 14MPG from a stock 6.4

TheChiefsLawnCare
08-24-2012, 07:13 AM
yeah. i hate gettin no mpg. but then you also gotta look at the fact that im saving 20 cents or so per gallon so how much are you saving in the long run. not to mention the extra cost of an oil and maintenance in general for a bigger truck.

BPS##
08-24-2012, 07:39 AM
Taking my local prices I'm STILL 0.06 per mile in fuel costs cheaper for diesel vs gas.

And diesel power is far superior to gas power when it comes to towing.

Tizzy
08-24-2012, 11:11 AM
Is that truck completely stock? I haven't heard of much more than 14MPG from a stock 6.4

no, its not stock. its got a AFE cold air intake, EGR delete, DPF delete, H&S XRT pro tuner.

the cold air intake is a must on a 6.4L it is an instant power gain and MPG gain. i did the EGR delete b/c the failure rate of the EGR on the 6.0 and 6.4. is pretty high. so that was done more for bullet proofing but you see a pretty big performance jump once that is done truck becomes significantly more responsive. and the biggest thing was the DPF delete. huge power gain and MPG gain. the tuner was strictly purchased to shut of regen and EGR. if you do a DPF or EGR delete you need a tuner to shut off the function.

Cummins343
08-24-2012, 01:00 PM
In the long run, i think it will. I've got an '06 2500 with the 6.6 duramax and I seem to get right around 19mpg unloaded, and 14 pulling the trailer.

scotts lawn care
08-24-2012, 06:33 PM
I had a 6.0 gas 2500 chevy and only got 7-8 mpg pulling my 24' enclosed with three mowers in it.
Im probably pulling about 10k lbs. Now with my 2004 duramax im getting 13-14 mpg. Ill never go back to a gas as long as im towing.

PlantscapeSolutions
08-25-2012, 12:03 AM
Im considering getting a ford f250 or f350 to pull a fully loaded 7x16 enclosed tandem axel trailer. Right now I have a 07 GMC sierra 1500 with the flex fuel engine and the gas mileage is killing me. Do yall think I will get that much better mpg with the diesel. If I had to guess i would say im proab getting between 7-10 mpg with the sierra. I would also like the heavier truck for the bigger payload.

I have an 09' Ram 3500 dually 4x4 deleted and last year I managed 17.6 mpg's on a 400 mile at 65 mph trip empty. I changed to 4.10's and on a recent 350 mile trip at 55 mph it was down to 15.1 mpg's. I want to install a Dynatrac free spin kit and hopefully I can gain back 1.5-2 mpg's like I did on my last truck.

Gas trucks with a moderately heavy load will always get horrible fuel millage. The Hemi and other with fuel saving features only save fuel when empty. Once you load it down the millage tanks.

If your buying a truck you plan to run the hell out of delete it right away if you can do that in your area. The fuel saving long term will really pay off. I deleted my truck at 20K and the only warranty thing I've had to foot the bill for after 60k of driving was a water pump that crapped out prematurely.

If your going to delete I would do it with a truck with a very proven record like the Cummins or even the Duramax if your going to be under warranty still. There is a reason about four companies make kits to put Cummins engines in Fords but nobody makes kits to put Powerstrokes or even Duramaxes in other trucks. For longevity the Cummins is the most popular Diesel engine swap and has the most parts support for mounts, ECU's, trans adaptors, and everything else. If your a Ford fan you should ask yourself why Ford puts same engine used in the Dodges under the hood of it's big F650 & F750. Hmmm.

TheChiefsLawnCare
08-25-2012, 06:34 AM
I have an 09' Ram 3500 dually 4x4 deleted and last year I managed 17.6 mpg's on a 400 mile at 65 mph trip empty. I changed to 4.10's and on a recent 350 mile trip at 55 mph it was down to 15.1 mpg's. I want to install a Dynatrac free spin kit and hopefully I can gain back 1.5-2 mpg's like I did on my last truck.

Gas trucks with a moderately heavy load will always get horrible fuel millage. The Hemi and other with fuel saving features only save fuel when empty. Once you load it down the millage tanks.

If your buying a truck you plan to run the hell out of delete it right away if you can do that in your area. The fuel saving long term will really pay off. I deleted my truck at 20K and the only warranty thing I've had to foot the bill for after 60k of driving was a water pump that crapped out prematurely.

If your going to delete I would do it with a truck with a very proven record like the Cummins or even the Duramax if your going to be under warranty still. There is a reason about four companies make kits to put Cummins engines in Fords but nobody makes kits to put Powerstrokes or even Duramaxes in other trucks. For longevity the Cummins is the most popular Diesel engine swap and has the most parts support for mounts, ECU's, trans adaptors, and everything else. If your a Ford fan you should ask yourself why Ford puts same engine used in the Dodges under the hood of it's big F650 & F750. Hmmm.


thats some funny **** about the cummins. i think its so true. id be happy with a cummins or a power stroke. i dont hear to much about the dmax. its all ford and dodge.

im checking the mpg this weekend so ill let yall know the final outcome.

Grumpydave
08-25-2012, 08:56 AM
How many miles a year? pulling vs. empty? Do you have other diesel equipment? Yes you can get higher mpg with a diesel but maintenance can be higher and repairs are higher. I ran a 2001 1st gen D-Max for years and while it was running it was awesome...but when it was broke, and it was broke a lot, it was just an expensive boat anchor. Got rid of it for an 09 F350 with a Triton V-10. Yes empty the ford gets a little better mileage than the chebbie got towing but its a much nicer truck for personal use and I can live with the fuel costs... and I guess you don't have to worry about finding a diesel pump at 2am in the middle of a blizzard. Good luck with your choice.

jvanvliet
08-25-2012, 10:54 AM
Low mileage 7.3Ls can be found but you can't be in a rush to buy one.
Its one of those start looking things and be ready to jump fast when you do find one. They don't last.

There are a lot in the 200k to 300k miles range.
Those guys seem to think their trucks are worth twice what they are too.

If you find a 7.3 with low miles better bring a diesel mechanic. If it doesn't have close to 200K or more on it, it's probably been sitting on blocks cause it doesn't run.

New diesels don't do all that well on the MPG's and diesel fuel is more than premium these days.

It's hard to justify a price premium for a new diesel given the gasoline engines get nearly as many MPG's, have the same load capacity and cost thousands of dollars less. Also, I don't believe the new HP numbers since they have new formulas for calculating them.

We have:

1 1997 F350 7.3 ltr International, about 300K gets about 12 mpg pulling 22ft enclosed trailer (loaded, 3 machines , etc.) we don't drive it like a race car.

1 1999 Dodge 3500 5.9 Cummings, about 200K gets about 16 mpg pulling same type of trailer.

Both in very good condition and neither one has problems pulling a load; Ford is an automatic & the Dodge is standard shift.

I keep my eye out for these warhorses, if I find one that meets my specs, I'll probably buy it and keep it as a backup. They don't make em that tough anymore.

PlantscapeSolutions
08-25-2012, 11:21 AM
How many miles a year? pulling vs. empty? Do you have other diesel equipment? Yes you can get higher mpg with a diesel but maintenance can be higher and repairs are higher. I ran a 2001 1st gen D-Max for years and while it was running it was awesome...but when it was broke, and it was broke a lot, it was just an expensive boat anchor. Got rid of it for an 09 F350 with a Triton V-10. Yes empty the ford gets a little better mileage than the chebbie got towing but its a much nicer truck for personal use and I can live with the fuel costs... and I guess you don't have to worry about finding a diesel pump at 2am in the middle of a blizzard. Good luck with your choice.

I'm assuming your biggest problem was injector related since you had an 01'. GM was first to the table with the common rail injection and had some issues. Just like Dodge/Cummins was first to the table with the DPF to meet the higher emissions standards in 2007.5 and had to deal with issues.

Yankee land is not very Diesel friendly. I'm from Maine but live in Texas and it's very fuel friendly down here. Up there gasser HD's are the norm but down here there like a pink elephant. You have oil field guys, catlle guys, and a host of other contractors that need to pull 20K+ loads that only a Diesel can easily handle. Once your accustomed to 400 HP and 800 ft lbs of torque (at 1600 rpms) for towing heavy loads it would be pretty disappointing to go back to spark plugs again.

Grumpydave
08-25-2012, 01:38 PM
"I'm assuming your biggest problem was injector related since you had an 01'."

Yup. two full sets in 25k and a set of heads and gaskets. Started at 117k but 6 months past warranty and GM was declaring bankruptcy.No help from them. That was enough for me. Hope the next guy had better luck. You are correct, for daily heavy pulling you can't beat a diesel but most of us don't pull more than two or three ZTRs or a tractor. Gas will work fine for that...

BPS##
08-26-2012, 02:53 PM
If you find a 7.3 with low miles better bring a diesel mechanic. If it doesn't have close to 200K or more on it, it's probably been sitting on blocks cause it doesn't run.







Rarely.



Much more likely is that it was a geezer truck that sat in the garage a lot staying like new.

BPS##
08-26-2012, 02:57 PM
You are correct, for daily heavy pulling you can't beat a diesel but most of us don't pull more than two or three ZTRs or a tractor. Gas will work fine for that...





For some folks maybe, for me I have 20 miles up hill against the wind to get to my primary work area. In the evening its 20 miles down hill generally with the wind behind me.

Depending on the wind the diesel will work pretty hard to pull an expanded metal sided trailer against the wind.
I have little doubt that my v10 would work a heck of a lot harder and a lot slower than what the diesel does.
(haven't tried it on the v10 because thats a backup truck, boss man's truck)

PlantscapeSolutions
08-26-2012, 03:32 PM
Low mileage 7.3Ls can be found but you can't be in a rush to buy one.
Its one of those start looking things and be ready to jump fast when you do find one. They don't last.

There are a lot in the 200k to 300k miles range.
Those guys seem to think their trucks are worth twice what they are too.

Do your research if your buying a high millage 7.3 because some years had powdered metal rods that were know to fail at about 200K. The 7.3 was a good motor by Powerstroke standards (I had a 97 F250) but the 12 valve & 24 valve 5.9's were much stronger engines. The block, pistons, crank, and just about everything else is much stronger and could handle 1000 HP with no internal mods. Just throw a better lift pump or FASS system on one of those 5.9's and they will last longer and have less issues.

BPS##
08-26-2012, 07:14 PM
Do your research if your buying a high millage 7.3 because some years had powdered metal rods that were know to fail at about 200K.





I think that started in 02 and continued into 03 until the 7.3 was replaced with the disaster that became known as 6.0shit.

"0shit" coming from what happened when that engine sh(t the bed along the side of the road.

ParkWelding
08-26-2012, 08:06 PM
If you keep it stock, the PM rods last.

PlantscapeSolutions
08-26-2012, 08:52 PM
If you keep it stock, the PM rods last.

I never had a problem with my rods but my crank started to walk back in forth in the block. The thrust bearing failed and allowed end play on the crank shaft. The engine still ran fine but it was only a matter of times before the engine was going to blow and the core would be ruined. I swapped in another long block and said adios Ford.

If lots of Ford guys are putting Cummins 5.9's in place of their 6.0's and even 6.4's then why not buy a truck that comes with one? You have to give it to Ford that they build a nicer looking truck but when it comes to what's under the hood the track record of the Cummins beats all. If Dodge hadn't gotten smart in 89' and partnered with Cummins Dodge HD trucks might have become extinct.

ParkWelding
08-26-2012, 10:01 PM
I agree that the cummins 5.9 is an excellent engine. I have one and a ford 7.3. The only thing I like better on the dodge is the engine. Even that has had numerous problems in 110Kmi though.

BPS##
08-26-2012, 10:01 PM
I never had a problem with my rods but my crank started to walk back in forth in the block. The thrust bearing failed and allowed end play on the crank shaft. The engine still ran fine but it was only a matter of times before the engine was going to blow and the core would be ruined. I swapped in another long block and said adios Ford.

If lots of Ford guys are putting Cummins 5.9's in place of their 6.0's and even 6.4's then why not buy a truck that comes with one? You have to give it to Ford that they build a nicer looking truck but when it comes to what's under the hood the track record of the Cummins beats all. If Dodge hadn't gotten smart in 89' and partnered with Cummins Dodge HD trucks might have become extinct.





I might ask why buy some thing that is only valuable because of the engine?

For what ever reason dodge seats don't fit me.
Very uncomfortable.

01thump
08-26-2012, 10:22 PM
I have found that most people who bash on diesels never drove one so really have no input on the matter and i have found most people who are die hard ford and chevy guys have not drove a cummins dodge before yet you find people putting the cummins in chevys and fords that says something about the motor...please show me one person who put a power stroke in a dodge or chevy ..I am sure it is WAY more rare than the other way around..I own a 2004 dodge with the cummins and to be honest I would buy what ever truck came with a cummins I am all about the motor great mpg and power...my 2 cents..

BPS##
08-26-2012, 10:29 PM
I have found that most people who bash on diesels never drove one so really have no input on the matter and i have found most people who are die hard ford and chevy guys have not drove a cummins dodge before yet you find people putting the cummins in chevys and fords that says something about the motor...please show me one person who put a power stroke in a dodge or chevy ..I am sure it is WAY more rare than the other way around..I own a 2004 dodge with the cummins and to be honest I would buy what ever truck came with a cummins I am all about the motor great mpg and power...my 2 cents..





No one is arguing that the cummins isn't a good engine.


But I will not buy a dodge simply and only for the engine.

01thump
08-26-2012, 10:37 PM
No one is arguing that the cummins isn't a good engine.


But I will not buy a dodge simply and only for the engine.

Yes you just stated that the seats are not right for you on the Dodge so you buy a truck for the comfort of the seats ?

BPS##
08-26-2012, 10:44 PM
Lucky for me Ford seats are comfortable and the rest of the vehicle does a damn fine job of getting the job done.

01thump
08-26-2012, 10:55 PM
Lucky for me Ford seats are comfortable and the rest of the vehicle does a damn fine job of getting the job done.

Yes you are very lucky......

ParkWelding
08-26-2012, 11:00 PM
The Dodge I have, compared to the Ford, has had a higher cost of ownership per mile. For work trucks, thats all that matters in the end.

PlantscapeSolutions
08-27-2012, 02:25 AM
No one is arguing that the cummins isn't a good engine.


But I will not buy a dodge simply and only for the engine.

I had a boss years ago who was die hard Ford all the way. He and his family had at least three Fords and he talked smack about my 02' Ram 2500. Then he got his first taste of one of those 6.0's and his tune began to change.

He was driving from Alaska back to Texas and his 6.0 did one of it's classic HG blowouts. He had run into other issues as well where he was less then pleased with the warranty support. He had to rent a Dodge with a Cummins in it and that was all she wrote. He sold every Ford the family owned and went all in on Dodges.

I would have to say the 6.0 and even the 6.4 made a lot of guys into buy it for the engine type guys. It sounds like Fords new baby called the 6.7 may be the best oil burner they ever put in one of their trucks but their track record sucks so much it's going to take many years to lure back most of the truck owners they ran off with the prior engines. I would have to say the 6.0 & 6.4 was better for GM and Dodge truck sales then any advertising they ever could have done.

I'm down here in Texas the HD pickup (and 1/2 ton) capital of the U.S. and I've truly been amazed at how few Fords I've seen running around with the hard to miss 6.7 door logo's. You'd think Ford guys would be dumping 6.0's & 6.4's to grab up the much better 6.7's but it seems everyone is taking a wait and see approach big time.

BPS##
08-27-2012, 10:50 AM
One thing thats holding down sales if you're in an area thats struggling economically is the price tag.

Around $50k for a pickup?????????????????????



I see a lot of them in my area tho.


As for your boss and his 6.0...... I was smart enough to never buy one of those. The problem reports started early and kept coming.
Didn't take me long to stay set on the 7.3.

I had a perfectly fine 7.3 that was wrecked last summer.
I found a replacement out of N Texas with 96,000 miles for $10,500.
Since then I've seen trucks with less miles than that, they don't sit around long. And they bring good money.

LibertyFarmLandscaping
08-27-2012, 11:00 AM
I had a boss years ago who was die hard Ford all the way. He and his family had at least three Fords and he talked smack about my 02' Ram 2500. Then he got his first taste of one of those 6.0's and his tune began to change.

He was driving from Alaska back to Texas and his 6.0 did one of it's classic HG blowouts. He had run into other issues as well where he was less then pleased with the warranty support. He had to rent a Dodge with a Cummins in it and that was all she wrote. He sold every Ford the family owned and went all in on Dodges.

I would have to say the 6.0 and even the 6.4 made a lot of guys into buy it for the engine type guys. It sounds like Fords new baby called the 6.7 may be the best oil burner they ever put in one of their trucks but their track record sucks so much it's going to take many years to lure back most of the truck owners they ran off with the prior engines. I would have to say the 6.0 & 6.4 was better for GM and Dodge truck sales then any advertising they ever could have done.

I'm down here in Texas the HD pickup (and 1/2 ton) capital of the U.S. and I've truly been amazed at how few Fords I've seen running around with the hard to miss 6.7 door logo's. You'd think Ford guys would be dumping 6.0's & 6.4's to grab up the much better 6.7's but it seems everyone is taking a wait and see approach big time.

A majority of the 6.0's still on the road here in NE TX that I have seen had the aftermarket mods to make them reliable.
Posted via Mobile Device

Bautieri
08-27-2012, 11:41 AM
yeah. i hate gettin no mpg. but then you also gotta look at the fact that im saving 20 cents or so per gallon so how much are you saving in the long run. not to mention the extra cost of an oil and maintenance in general for a bigger truck.

Bingo.

You don't save much, if any money by running a diesel. You run a diesel because you want/need the extra towing power, or because you really like the rumble. Based on your post, you're looking at doing this to save money in fuel. Let's do some math (rounded off to make things easier).

Lets say for giggles that a new truck pulling (gaser) will get 10mpg. Might be generous, might not. Lets go with ten. Gasoline is currently $3.65 in my area, local markets may vary. That means your cost to drive the vehicle is 36.5 cents per mile.

A diesel pulling the same trailer gets 15 (again, pulling a number out of my rectum to illustrate a point), diesel is currently $4.15, local markets may varry. The cost to drive per mile is 27.6 cents.

Price will fluctuate one way or another, but using these prices as a constant, we can break it down in today's costs. Now, a diesel engine is a 7-8K option right off the bat. At a cost difference of 8.9 cents per mile to drive, you will need to drive...84,269.6 miles to make up the cost difference in the engine option alone. That's to say nothing of any add ons to get better MPG or the price difference in maintenance items of diesel vs a gas engine. It also doesn't count whatever the additional interest on the higher payment would cost. I could figure it out, but I'm sure by now you're getting the idea.

This scenario is for a new truck only, but does illustrate that diesels don't save a tremendous amount of money over comparable gas engines, and even then, not until you've driven 84k miles to reach the break even point. Buy a diesel because you need the capacity, not to save on fuel.

I agree with previous posters, look for a mid 90s 7.3 with a manual tranny.

ParkWelding
08-27-2012, 03:01 PM
Bingo.

You don't save much, if any money by running a diesel. You run a diesel because you want/need the extra towing power, or because you really like the rumble. Based on your post, you're looking at doing this to save money in fuel. Let's do some math (rounded off to make things easier).

Lets say for giggles that a new truck pulling (gaser) will get 10mpg. Might be generous, might not. Lets go with ten. Gasoline is currently $3.65 in my area, local markets may vary. That means your cost to drive the vehicle is 36.5 cents per mile.

A diesel pulling the same trailer gets 15 (again, pulling a number out of my rectum to illustrate a point), diesel is currently $4.15, local markets may varry. The cost to drive per mile is 27.6 cents.

Price will fluctuate one way or another, but using these prices as a constant, we can break it down in today's costs. Now, a diesel engine is a 7-8K option right off the bat. At a cost difference of 8.9 cents per mile to drive, you will need to drive...84,269.6 miles to make up the cost difference in the engine option alone. That's to say nothing of any add ons to get better MPG or the price difference in maintenance items of diesel vs a gas engine. It also doesn't count whatever the additional interest on the higher payment would cost. I could figure it out, but I'm sure by now you're getting the idea.

This scenario is for a new truck only, but does illustrate that diesels don't save a tremendous amount of money over comparable gas engines, and even then, not until you've driven 84k miles to reach the break even point. Buy a diesel because you need the capacity, not to save on fuel.

I agree with previous posters, look for a mid 90s 7.3 with a manual tranny.

One thing you have to add to those calculations when thinking of new trucks, is that the resale value of the diesel truck, above and beyond the gas truck (in most cases) is high enough to offset the original premium for the diesel upgrade by maybe 50%. So at the 84,xxx mile mark, if you were to sell the truck you'd be ahead by probably $3000 or more over the same gas engine truck. Even factoring in the extra expense of diesel oil/filters, extra fuel filter changes etc. you're money ahead and you've had the extra power available over a gas truck for those 84K miles.

That being said, if I had to consider buying one new truck for my use I'm not sure whether it would be a gas or diesel. Unless I was sure it would be sold before the warranty was up on the engine/transmission.

justanotherlawnguy
08-29-2012, 12:45 AM
I had a 6.0 gas 2500 chevy and only got 7-8 mpg pulling my 24' enclosed with three mowers in it.
Im probably pulling about 10k lbs. Now with my 2004 duramax im getting 13-14 mpg. Ill never go back to a gas as long as im towing.
Ditto!!
Went from a 6.0 in the 1500hd pulling 16" loaded enclosed or 14" dump getting 7.5mpg to a 2004 6.6 duramax getting 13-14 loaded!!!
It's nice getting fuel every 10 days vs every 3.5!!!
Posted via Mobile Device

slowleak1
08-29-2012, 01:31 AM
Do your research if your buying a high millage 7.3 because some years had powdered metal rods that were know to fail at about 200K. The 7.3 was a good motor by Powerstroke standards (I had a 97 F250) but the 12 valve & 24 valve 5.9's were much stronger engines. The block, pistons, crank, and just about everything else is much stronger and could handle 1000 HP with no internal mods. Just throw a better lift pump or FASS system on one of those 5.9's and they will last longer and have less issues.

BAHAHHAHAHA

This post is hilarious. So funny I didnt even read the rest of the thread. PMR's wont fail at 200k. Completely untrue. PMR's fail due to advanced timing and running anything north of 400 HP, which I doubt the OP will do.

And a 5.9 making 1000 hp on stock internals? Keep dreaming. It's been done but it is no where near reliable. You should do some more research and put down the diesel power magazine.

My 7.3 (01 with 320k miles) with PMR's runs like a champ, gets 20+ mpg unloaded on the highway and 12-14 depending on what I am towing.

My 05 6.0 got about the same mileage but had alot more towing power. It was a blast to drive and never gave me any issues in the 20k miles I put on it.

I know several people with reliable 5.9 cummins that have the same power and get the same mileage.

Pick what truck you like, test drive the $hit out of it and get it. Once you go diesel you will never go back to gas.

PlantscapeSolutions
08-29-2012, 02:05 AM
A majority of the 6.0's still on the road here in NE TX that I have seen had the aftermarket mods to make them reliable.
Posted via Mobile Device

My neighbors 6.0 work truck has 300K on it but they had to deal with clogged EGR's, blown HG's, warped heads, and other stuff. The big headache for guys under warranty was Ford would just put the same failure prone parts right back on the truck. Some guys didn't get their truck back for a month when the cab had to come off for an HG. Some guys had their truck in the shop more then on the road.

If you can get a 6.0 for cheap it's not a bad deal but if you have to foot the bill for the HG, EGR, FICM, turbo, injectors, oil cooler screen or after market cooler, coolant filter, head studs, and so on it's likely not a good deal.

I don't mind dropping four grand to get my 09' Ram truck deleted, Smarty programmed, 5" TBE, Air dogged, AFE Pro equiped, ARP 625 studded, Edge gauge equipped and so on. I just would hate to drop that kind of cash to make a truck dependable at the stock power level. Even then it's no where near as good as the Cummins or Duramax. This is why so many guys chose to have Destroked or other companies drop in a Cummins 5.9 12 valve, 24 valve, or CR.

LibertyFarmLandscaping
08-29-2012, 06:46 AM
My neighbors 6.0 work truck has 300K on it but they had to deal with clogged EGR's, blown HG's, warped heads, and other stuff. The big headache for guys under warranty was Ford would just put the same failure prone parts right back on the truck. Some guys didn't get their truck back for a month when the cab had to come off for an HG. Some guys had their truck in the shop more then on the road.

If you can get a 6.0 for cheap it's not a bad deal but if you have to foot the bill for the HG, EGR, FICM, turbo, injectors, oil cooler screen or after market cooler, coolant filter, head studs, and so on it's likely not a good deal.

I don't mind dropping four grand to get my 09' Ram truck deleted, Smarty programmed, 5" TBE, Air dogged, AFE Pro equiped, ARP 625 studded, Edge gauge equipped and so on. I just would hate to drop that kind of cash to make a truck dependable at the stock power level. Even then it's no where near as good as the Cummins or Duramax. This is why so many guys chose to have Destroked or other companies drop in a Cummins 5.9 12 valve, 24 valve, or CR.

I realize all that. I'm a cummins guy like you. I have no intentions of buying a 6.0 that's for d$@m sure. I have an 11' 2500 CCSB G56 3:42 rear, 5" tbe, XRT pro, sinister egr/cooler delete. I've had a 90', 97', 04', and current CTD.

My brother builds metal buildings with a 6 man crew. They run 3 trucks. He bought a 6.0 c&c cc f350 in 05' so I got to hear all about it first hand. I was simply saying what I have observed about the 6.0 trucks still on the road in my local area.
Posted via Mobile Device

PlantscapeSolutions
08-29-2012, 10:35 AM
BAHAHHAHAHA

This post is hilarious. So funny I didnt even read the rest of the thread. PMR's wont fail at 200k. Completely untrue. PMR's fail due to advanced timing and running anything north of 400 HP, which I doubt the OP will do.

And a 5.9 making 1000 hp on stock internals? Keep dreaming. It's been done but it is no where near reliable. You should do some more research and put down the diesel power magazine.

My 7.3 (01 with 320k miles) with PMR's runs like a champ, gets 20+ mpg unloaded on the highway and 12-14 depending on what I am towing.

My 05 6.0 got about the same mileage but had alot more towing power. It was a blast to drive and never gave me any issues in the 20k miles I put on it.

I know several people with reliable 5.9 cummins that have the same power and get the same mileage.

Pick what truck you like, test drive the $hit out of it and get it. Once you go diesel you will never go back to gas.

I agree 100% that it would really suck to go back to plugs after burning oil in the newer 600-800 ft lbs trucks. It would be like willingly castrating yourself.

This http://www.dieselpowermag.com/tech/ford/1005dp_complete_73_power_stroke_long_block_rebuild/viewall.html is a different Diesel Power article but it touches of the performance failures as well as the occasional high millage stress cracking failure due to the rods being cheaper PMR's rods versus better quality forged rods used in the Cummins.

I may have misquoted the other article. The other article I had read listed all the issues with the various Powerstroke engines and mentioned 200K as being no problem for reliability but to be careful after that when thinking about purchasing one. My 7.3 died at 74K so I moved on to engines that were built to higher standards. I realize 174K is not the norm for failure.

It's easier to find decent used Diesels in Texas now that have six in a row. But back in the early 2000's it was just about impossible to find a used Cummins in the 120K-160K range. The wholesale auctions where dealers unload their trade ins had nothing worth buying. One of the trucks I saw was a 24 valve with 512,000 miles on it. Most guys who bought the earlier year Dodge truck drove them until the body rotted off the frame.

I figure if the Cummins is the #1 engine choice used to repower 6.0's, used in the new F650 & F750, and used more in repowering many older makes and models of vehicles then any other Diesel engine then they must be doing something better then the competition. If Chrysler had gone belly up and the Cummins had ended up in all the Ford trucks I would have had to suck it up and buy another truck with a blue oval. Thank you Obama :laugh:.

JDGlandscape
08-30-2012, 06:09 PM
All the posts talking about how great the cummins is because people will put them in fords but they wont put powerstrokes in Dodges is hilarious... That is because who would want a dodge over a ford if it didnt have the cummins??

I will admit, the cummins is a great engine, but I would never own one again because i would never want the Sh!t dodge truck and powertrain around it. If i were to ever have a cummins it would be in a ford body.

I have met a few people who did this swap, and they did it because they liked the cummins but hated all their previous dodge truck bodies. Up here plowing the commercial companies had to replace almost every single front end part EVERY YEAR. and transmissions all the time too.

JDGlandscape
08-30-2012, 06:12 PM
the 7.3 and 5.9 are both great engines. The 5.9 in my experience has gotten slightly better mpgs, but didnt own it long enough to base reliability against the powerstroke.

5.9 cummins= great motor
7.3 Powerstroke= great motor
dodge truck= crap
ford truck= much much better

Do the math, that is why people put cummins in fords but not powerstrokes in dodges. If the dodge was just as good as the ford then there would be powerstoke fans putting them in dodges.

Why take a good engine out of a great truck and put the good engine in the crappy truck? it wouldnt be an improvement it would be worse. Whereas the cummins going into the ford is an improvement for the cummins

ParkWelding
08-30-2012, 06:34 PM
the 7.3 and 5.9 are both great engines. The 5.9 in my experience has gotten slightly better mpgs, but didnt own it long enough to base reliability against the powerstroke.

5.9 cummins= great motor
7.3 Powerstroke= great motor
dodge truck= crap
ford truck= much much better

Do the math, that is why people put cummins in fords but not powerstrokes in dodges. If the dodge was just as good as the ford then there would be powerstoke fans putting them in dodges.

Why take a good engine out of a great truck and put the good engine in the crappy truck? it wouldnt be an improvement it would be worse. Whereas the cummins going into the ford is an improvement for the cummins

Yuuppp.

Thumbs Up

devinraptor
09-06-2012, 09:38 PM
I'd take my dodge any day. Only reason I buy fords in my fleet is because there cheap. I also trade often them quickly because they quickly live up to their name FIX OR REPAIR DAILY. My dodges consistently are more reliable then the fords in my fleet.
Posted via Mobile Device

PlantscapeSolutions
09-06-2012, 10:03 PM
Pretty truck= Ford
Work truck durability= Dodge
Pretty work truck= Fummins

I would have to agree the Dodges from the 70's thru 93 had crap bodies but the Fords were not much better. You rarely see old Fords on the road much. You see more old GM trucks on the road then Ford and Dodge combined.

As the 7.3's all die out I think you'll be finding more old 5.9 Dodges on the roads then anything else. The new Ford 6.7's may be very good engines but only time will tell. Fords biggest issue is they ran off a lot of die hard blue oval guys to the Cummins and Duramax powered trucks and getting then back is not going to be as easy as running them off. I'm in Texas the number one state for trucks and I'm not seeing a lot of 6.7 emblems running around.

LibertyFarmLandscaping
09-06-2012, 10:08 PM
3 of my customers have the new Ford 6.7. 1 of them works it hard pulling a 32' cattle trailer. He only has 31k on it though. No problems yet. As you say time will tell.
Posted via Mobile Device

TheChiefsLawnCare
09-11-2012, 04:22 AM
well after finally catching up for the hurricane and recovering from my other job of working so many days straight with hardly any sleep, i can tell you the verdict. 8 mpg with my sierra and that's a mixture of city and highway. im looking at a 6.0 now. 2006 f250 king ranch. only thing that worries me is that its was sold in jan of 06 so its one of the earlier 6.0s which had more known proabs then the late 06 6.0s. according to car fax, its never had the heads done, just other minor stuff. its has 50k on the dash. and then reading the 6.0 vs 6.4 on the various forum sites out there. its the same mixed reviews. some say theve never had proabs some say its been nothing but a headache and some say yeah its been a decent truck lol. so i guess its just luck of the draw and what you want. 6.4 gets worse gas mileage, sounds like a danm truck until you roll the window down and accelerate. 250s with the 6.0 looks bad ass and so do the trucks with the 6.4 in them. the new 2012 trucks with the new 6.7 for one sound like complete s^^^ and look like complete s^^^. my dads got the 08 f250 with the 6.4 and only have the radiator hose break (known issue) and something in the steering colum with wiring go bad. hes got 56k on the dash. so i mean, its luck of the draw but isnt it with any vehicle lol. one person will tell you they wouldnt touch it with your dick and some will till you thell touch it with theirs lol.

TheChiefsLawnCare
09-11-2012, 04:24 AM
and then the other things is, they sell the egr delete which is one of the real bigger issues then the heads on the 6.0 and that will supposedly fix all the issues. supposedly that's the root of 95% of the issues with the 6.0. that and people tune them with chips and do it wrong and it over works the engine which ends blowing the heads.

TheChiefsLawnCare
09-11-2012, 04:27 AM
Yuuppp.

Thumbs Up

i think the fact that ford puts the cummins only in their f650 and up dosent make any sense. i wish they put them in all their units. i love the sound the 5.9. best sounding diesel out there.

LibertyFarmLandscaping
09-11-2012, 11:00 AM
They can't cuz Dodge has the rights to the Cummins in a pickup.
Posted via Mobile Device

slowleak1
09-11-2012, 11:53 AM
well after finally catching up for the hurricane and recovering from my other job of working so many days straight with hardly any sleep, i can tell you the verdict. 8 mpg with my sierra and that's a mixture of city and highway. im looking at a 6.0 now. 2006 f250 king ranch. only thing that worries me is that its was sold in jan of 06 so its one of the earlier 6.0s which had more known proabs then the late 06 6.0s. according to car fax, its never had the heads done, just other minor stuff. its has 50k on the dash. and then reading the 6.0 vs 6.4 on the various forum sites out there. its the same mixed reviews. some say theve never had proabs some say its been nothing but a headache and some say yeah its been a decent truck lol. so i guess its just luck of the draw and what you want. 6.4 gets worse gas mileage, sounds like a danm truck until you roll the window down and accelerate. 250s with the 6.0 looks bad ass and so do the trucks with the 6.4 in them. the new 2012 trucks with the new 6.7 for one sound like complete s^^^ and look like complete s^^^. my dads got the 08 f250 with the 6.4 and only have the radiator hose break (known issue) and something in the steering colum with wiring go bad. hes got 56k on the dash. so i mean, its luck of the draw but isnt it with any vehicle lol. one person will tell you they wouldnt touch it with your dick and some will till you thell touch it with theirs lol.

If you are handy with tools, you can fix anything on a 6.0. EGR delete is simple, and tuning has come a long way in the last 2 years. I had an 05 with tunes only, which turned off the EGR...I NEVER had any issues with it and it ran 13.9 in the 1/4 mile; CCSB 4x4 at 8k pounds. As for towing the trailer, I didnt even feel it back there.

If you need any help with anything ford diesel, let me know. I have alot of experience with 7.3's and 6.0's.

PlantscapeSolutions
09-11-2012, 07:07 PM
If you are handy with tools, you can fix anything on a 6.0. EGR delete is simple, and tuning has come a long way in the last 2 years. I had an 05 with tunes only, which turned off the EGR...I NEVER had any issues with it and it ran 13.9 in the 1/4 mile; CCSB 4x4 at 8k pounds. As for towing the trailer, I didnt even feel it back there.

If you need any help with anything ford diesel, let me know. I have alot of experience with 7.3's and 6.0's.

If you didn't have head studs and never blew an HG or warped a head your lucky. It's usually not a matter of if it will happen but when. Increasing the power just puts more strain on the HG.

TheChiefsLawnCare
09-18-2012, 10:40 PM
Well just an update, I purchased an 06 f250 with the 6.0. Went from atlanta to new orleans in one tank of gas. got 16.5 mpg on the highway. Its all stock. With my sierra, i filled up 3 times and got 18 mpg. Not much better. I plan on doing exhaust, gauges egr delete and a tune and i should be able to get that number up to 20 on the highway. pulling my trailer is a breeze, i dont even feel it behind me.

chuck@nri
09-18-2012, 10:49 PM
hey men
i found that the 6.0 and 6.4 ford international diesel getting 8-10 around town towing and hauling, on open road gettin beter 12-15 mpg. still rough being diesel is 4.15 to 4.39 p gallong.
1980 ford ln 7000 with cat 3208
2002 ford f-250 with 5.4 v8
2000 ford f-650 with 6cyl cat
2006 ford f-550 with 6.0 international
2008 ford f-550 with 6.4 international
2010 ford f-250 with 6.4 international
bobcats etc. etc. etc.

BPS##
09-21-2012, 09:57 AM
Shoulda got a 7.3L


I get 12/13 in town and up to 18.5 on the road no trailer.

DQL10
11-08-2012, 11:18 AM
Im in the same boat on this topic. Trailer loaded weights like 4k pounds and my 06 F150 only gets like 9 mpg. Can go 240 something miles on a 27 gal tank! Really breaks the bank when you are filling up your tank every other day.

D&F lawnmaster
11-14-2012, 09:40 PM
yeah. i hate gettin no mpg. but then you also gotta look at the fact that im saving 20 cents or so per gallon so how much are you saving in the long run. not to mention the extra cost of an oil and maintenance in general for a bigger truck.

I pull a 24' enclosed v-nose trailer with this 2012 Ford 350, 6.7 and i am getting 14mpg. I had a 6.4 was only getting 8 mpg. This 6.7 is the way to go if you are pulling anything. Just saying


2012 Ford F350, FX4
2012 Bad Boy Outlaw XP 61"
2010 Exmark New Lazer Z (JUNK) 60"
2009 Exmark Lazer Z 60"
2008 Horton Hauler 24' Enclosed Trailer
2-Red Max Blowers
2-Red Max Weed Eaters
2-Red Max Edgers