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View Full Version : Help me buy a truck!


alldayrj
08-24-2012, 05:09 PM
Looking at trucks lately to get around my dilemma of having a massive older international (empty weight 16,500, GVW 25,500 = payload 9000) and wanting something newer, automatic, and better suit for my business. Been shopping for F5fixme's (guessing here but empty weight 10k, GVW 19,5k payload 9.5k) but having a hard time finding an affordable one that isn't beat, old, or high miles and most of them are the 17.5 gvw.

This gem caught my eye. It is currently over CDL but I can re register it under, buy it, and get my CDL and bump it back up later on when I have another driver with a CDL. I can also pull the compressor (don't need it every day but I can drea up all kinds of uses) leave it a skid mount, put it on a trailer, or just sell it! Then build a box wih a ramp and create a mini ETWMAN truck (the ideal hardscaper setup) for brick saws, tampers, wheebarrels, hand tools etc.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1998-IH-4700-10-DUMP-TRUCK-5-7YD-185-PSI-AIR-COMPRESSOR-152K-AUTO-46280-/110935194182?pt=Commercial_Trucks&hash=item19d440ba46

Let me know what you think about the general truck (this is my first air brake truck, auto allison trans etc) and also if you have an idea of what that compressor weighs. Then I can run it over the scale and figure out my realistic payload under CDL. I'm guessing its around 13k without the compressor since its 4 feet shorter than my current truck but its all just speculation.

What I'm currently working with if anyone wants it for mulch/cleanups/etc
new batteries, tires, fluids, brakes etc 1988 - s1900 with the 466 and 5 speed. 17' fold down body with barn doors
http://i274.photobucket.com/albums/jj242/silversuper/dump%20trucks/IMG_20120125_101829.jpg

I appreciate any input as I'm really flying solo here and its a big purchase!

muddywater
08-25-2012, 01:49 PM
Price seems high.

alldayrj
08-25-2012, 02:59 PM
What do you think is fair? Probably buying cash and havent started negotiations yet
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muddywater
08-25-2012, 03:47 PM
What do you think is fair? Probably buying cash and havent started negotiations yet
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10k. My buddy has a 2000 international with 200k miles with a recent motor w 12' dump for 10k, and it is in perfect condition.

alldayrj
08-25-2012, 04:28 PM
Can't see location on mobile but I'm interested. I just got caught up on this truck since i can make an awesome tool carrying area too.
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metro36
08-26-2012, 04:01 PM
Because that truck has air brakes you will still need a cdl regardless of weight. If the truck had hydraulic brakes then you could change the weight and drive it without a cdl. But the listing says that the gross on it is only 23400 so the weight is under cdl. You could drive it with a class c license then.

Its not that hard to get a class B cdl. If you are used to driving that size truck with a manual tranny you will be fine.

alldayrj
08-26-2012, 07:22 PM
every dealer I went to has said that the air brake CDL law is obsolete. not about to start a CDL debate but I will verify and probably get my CDL anyway.

knox gsl
08-26-2012, 08:13 PM
That truck most likely has airbrakes but not what you would need a CDL for. If its air over hydraulic then you would not need a CDL, most likely what this truck has. I would be getting the same style truck if I were you also even with me having a class A CDL.

knox gsl
08-26-2012, 08:18 PM
Another great thing about that truck is that you could do a small project easy with it. Remove the box off the frame install a flatbed that could support a couple of pallets. Load rock in the bed and a dump trailer behind you with sand and a Skid steer.

alldayrj
08-26-2012, 08:46 PM
anything over 2 or 3 pallets I usually get delivered and I pick up the loose materials myself. besides, I can reach 2 pallets deep in the truck with a skid steer and get the third one with a chain. Do it all the time. I like the dump box since its low and long. plenty of SF for different stuff, and easy to load.

Whats a real offer for this truck? with and without compressor?

zak406
08-26-2012, 11:14 PM
Isnt the guy who owns that truck on lawnsite? I believe in the heavy equipment forum??

alldayrj
08-26-2012, 11:19 PM
I found it at a dealer, link to thread?
the picture at the loading dock is my actual truck.

stuvecorp
08-26-2012, 11:34 PM
Just to give you a feel for what my trucks are like, the 550 dump is around 9800 empty, 19500 gvw so you are right on the 10,000 pounds capacity. I also have a 'two ton' Kodiak contractor truck that is 15,600 empty but is good to 33,000 gvw so you have just over 16,000 pounds capacity.

I personally like the 550 a lot better but you definitely pay to play with those. I also think having fold down sides is a necessity, you can carry so much stuff(pallets or attachments).

alldayrj
08-27-2012, 12:02 AM
fold down is great, and I was so pumped to have this truck with all the fold downs however I haul a lot of broken concrete and have managed to bend every pin so they can't be folded anymore. I used to cut out the pins and put new ones in but now I don't bother. If I had a lighter truck like a 550 I would probably use it more, but this truck is a hauler.

How long is the bed on the kodiak? diesel? just looking to compare apples to apples.

stuvecorp
08-27-2012, 06:36 PM
fold down is great, and I was so pumped to have this truck with all the fold downs however I haul a lot of broken concrete and have managed to bend every pin so they can't be folded anymore. I used to cut out the pins and put new ones in but now I don't bother. If I had a lighter truck like a 550 I would probably use it more, but this truck is a hauler.

How long is the bed on the kodiak? diesel? just looking to compare apples to apples.

That is the hard part when the truck has to be 'versatile'. I have hauled concrete, boulders and stumps with the box on my 550 but it has been pretty hard on it. The 550 box is 11' and the Kodiak is 13' long. The Kodiaks box is heavy duty for a fold down box, I would have preferred it to be lighter. The only thing that I would change on the Kodiak box would be to have a high lift type tailgate. I've got pictures of it if you want to look for it on here, it is a diesel/auto truck.

I've wondered about going to a truck like the old LowPro Trugreen/Chemlawn trucks with a contractor box like I have on the 550? They don't have 'big' power but would be cheaper maybe?

alldayrj
08-28-2012, 11:09 PM
a couple pics I took when looking at it the other day
very clean cab
http://i274.photobucket.com/albums/jj242/silversuper/49E3A60A-8422-4152-BBF4-0D10CB869862-293-00000026D4E730AE.jpg
some light showing through the floor but the sides and gate are good
http://i274.photobucket.com/albums/jj242/silversuper/F79E4F1A-0039-4F2E-A973-DABDDA42892B-293-00000026CFF80EF5.jpg
showing off the boxes and compressor
http://i274.photobucket.com/albums/jj242/silversuper/9F2CE31D-9115-483D-A9BD-EEEA9384A911-293-00000026D90A12F2.jpg

alldayrj
08-28-2012, 11:14 PM
That is the hard part when the truck has to be 'versatile'. I have hauled concrete, boulders and stumps with the box on my 550 but it has been pretty hard on it. The 550 box is 11' and the Kodiak is 13' long. The Kodiaks box is heavy duty for a fold down box, I would have preferred it to be lighter. The only thing that I would change on the Kodiak box would be to have a high lift type tailgate. I've got pictures of it if you want to look for it on here, it is a diesel/auto truck.

I've wondered about going to a truck like the old LowPro Trugreen/Chemlawn trucks with a contractor box like I have on the 550? They don't have 'big' power but would be cheaper maybe?

I originally went to look at a Lo profile International, this dude
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1998-IH-4700-LOW-PROFILE-9DUMP-TRUCK-4-7YD-69K-6SPD-82562-/110942587527?pt=Commercial_Trucks&hash=item19d4b18a87
Same dt466 motor, 6 speed eaton fuller, and tons of hydro goodies but Its almost too small with all that power! needs like a 12' bed. and I really want an auto. tired of eating a bagel, drinking a snapple, talking on the phone then having to shift

stuvecorp
08-29-2012, 12:15 AM
I personally think automatic trucks are the only way. Seriously, who wants to shift anymore?

That green truck looks 'too' clean to me. I am bothered by trucks(or equipment) that just got a 'fresh' coat of paint, I think it can hide problems/issues.

Out here there alot of mid 90's single axle county trucks for around $10,000. The boxes are usually 10' or 11' though.

alldayrj
09-05-2012, 12:17 AM
are these autos solid or are they on their way out after 150k and thats why they are for sale?
I know it has an allison sticker on it but thats all I really know.

This place paints all their trucks. even inside the dump body lol

stuvecorp
09-05-2012, 12:35 AM
are these autos solid or are they on their way out after 150k and thats why they are for sale?
I know it has an allison sticker on it but thats all I really know.

This place paints all their trucks. even inside the dump body lol

I'm not sure? On ours, we changed the fluid and I think the filter back when we got it. We have never noticed anything weird with it.

alldayrj
09-05-2012, 01:15 AM
is yours also an allison?

stuvecorp
09-05-2012, 02:21 AM
is yours also an allison?

Yes, I think it's a MT653(one of the big boy transmissions). It shifts and then locks up in each gear. I've been told when you have an automatic that you want lots of horsepower because they do 'take' some power. I had a gas tandem Kodiak with the automatic and we didn't like it. It would never shift up, you had to really rev it up.

AWJ Services
09-05-2012, 04:48 PM
I have been looking for another truck and I narrowed it down too a F650 Flatbed dump with an auto. Most all of these trucks willl have a 5.9 cummins or a C7 Cat engine. The Internationals will mostly have a DT466. What I am finding is the 90 model trucks are not nearly as comfortable too operate as the 2000 and up trucks. I personally like the Ford interiors. As have been said get as much HP as possible. I drive on average 40 miles one way to jobs all back roads so the older trucks are just too much work. Expect too pay 20k for a nice early 2000 truck. If you can deal with the older trucks then stick with an early international pre electronics. The power on those trucks can easily be raised. The allisons are very reliable. They rate them in series 1000, 2000, 3000 etc. The 1000 comes behind chevy 2500/3500 trucks.

alldayrj
09-05-2012, 04:54 PM
Both my dumps are in the 80's. Moving to the 90's would be incredible. The only other option for me is a 1999+ 550 but they seem to be made of gold. I got my 2003 lariat crew cab 250 for 10g cash. I can't understand why i can't get a stripped out work truck 550 for 15g cash.
This international seemed like a good compromise and a great platform to build a nasty hardscape machine like etwmans rigs.
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AWJ Services
09-05-2012, 07:38 PM
You can get plenty of F550 trucks, regular cab with decent miles 99-03 for around 10k or less where I live.

willretire@40
09-05-2012, 08:16 PM
Look on truckpaper com
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Landrus2
09-05-2012, 08:16 PM
You can get plenty of F550 trucks, regular cab with decent miles 99-03 for around 10k or less where I live.

With dump body dam I'm getting my trucks there. Do you have any dealer names. Thanks:drinkup:

alldayrj
09-05-2012, 09:19 PM
lets carpool joesimoes LOL

post some links, I'll drive or fly for the right truck!

stuvecorp
09-05-2012, 09:26 PM
I have been looking for another truck and I narrowed it down too a F650 Flatbed dump with an auto. Most all of these trucks willl have a 5.9 cummins or a C7 Cat engine. The Internationals will mostly have a DT466. What I am finding is the 90 model trucks are not nearly as comfortable too operate as the 2000 and up trucks. I personally like the Ford interiors. As have been said get as much HP as possible. I drive on average 40 miles one way to jobs all back roads so the older trucks are just too much work. Expect too pay 20k for a nice early 2000 truck. If you can deal with the older trucks then stick with an early international pre electronics. The power on those trucks can easily be raised. The allisons are very reliable. They rate them in series 1000, 2000, 3000 etc. The 1000 comes behind chevy 2500/3500 trucks.

I really thought those newer F650/750 Fords could have been great, not sure why they didn't catch on? Was it Ford or the dealers that just didn't work out?

Both my dumps are in the 80's. Moving to the 90's would be incredible. The only other option for me is a 1999+ 550 but they seem to be made of gold. I got my 2003 lariat crew cab 250 for 10g cash. I can't understand why i can't get a stripped out work truck 550 for 15g cash.
This international seemed like a good compromise and a great platform to build a nasty hardscape machine like etwmans rigs.
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I would think you could get a 550 for the $15,000? You have a good budget I think.

alldayrj
09-05-2012, 09:30 PM
what do you guys think of this one? I actually looked at it in person, need to go back and double check the oil pan. no rust on bed or body but 190k on the clock. owned by a supply yard delivering mulch sand rock etc. wants 13.5, I think 10k or 12k cash gets it though
http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/cto/3246200095.html

alldayrj
09-05-2012, 09:40 PM
I would think you could get a 550 for the $15,000? You have a good budget I think.

not up here man, or they sell in 12 hrs. need to have the cash in the truck ready to book it there and fight for it.

also on the table ( but a manual :( )
http://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/3206452181.html
might keep the decals :cool2:

stuvecorp
09-05-2012, 10:06 PM
not up here man, or they sell in 12 hrs. need to have the cash in the truck ready to book it there and fight for it.

also on the table ( but a manual :( )
http://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/3206452181.html
might keep the decals :cool2:

Wow, I should ship my stuff out there then. :laugh:

There is a low pro IH out here like your 'smooth operator' but they are asking $9800 and it was an auto...

stuvecorp
09-05-2012, 10:09 PM
One thing I forgot to mention about the 550's - always check the gvw! There is a fair amount that are only 17500 gvw instead of 19500. Guys may not care about the 'official' rating but if you get scaled loaded you will want that 19500 rating...

alldayrj
09-05-2012, 10:15 PM
yea most I find are 17.5. besides the mileage, its the second nail in that trucks coffin. 2k lbs is a huge difference on a truck this size.

what are you selling?

Nick's Lawn Care
09-05-2012, 10:21 PM
I think that 7.3 f550 that you posted is a bit high in price, I picked up a 2000 F450, 7.3L, 2wd, 12' flat bed dump, little to no rust, 120k miles, with a like new snow plow for $11k with tax and title.

Heres some pretty good deals:
http://cincinnati.craigslist.org/cto/3160890889.html

http://swmi.craigslist.org/cto/3225428291.html

alldayrj
09-05-2012, 10:41 PM
he 550 i posted also has 3k more payload, fold down sides but what do you think is fair? 10?

international is a bit old, even with low miles.

that ford is cool but he has no price. plus that bed is a monster! probably eats that extra 2k of payload lol

I can search CL and ebay all day and find great deals in Cali but I think to be realistic I can search as far south as WV (my best friend is in school at WVU and is a mechanic so he can pre-screen for me) as far north as Mass, and as far west as PA.\

anyone in that area have any inside scoops?

Nick's Lawn Care
09-05-2012, 10:48 PM
The Ford you posted looks to be in great condition so I would personally pay more than normal because it looks like it was taken care of. The milage is the only thing that would scare me. I know it is a 7.3 but still, parts are expensive, injectors are around $4500. I would get it checked out up, down, left and right. If everything checks out good I would pay up to $12k for it, I would start around $9.5k - $10k though.

alldayrj
09-05-2012, 10:53 PM
is there a way to up the gvwr? I know you can drop it but can it go the other way? that trucks gvw is the second biggest hangup

I have a really good family friend mechanic who just redid the whole front end on my f250 so he could probably check it over.

AWJ Services
09-05-2012, 11:07 PM
With dump body dam I'm getting my trucks there. Do you have any dealer names. Thanks:drinkup:



http://atlanta.craigslist.org/eat/cto/3224738190.html

Took about 15 seconds too find.:drinkup:

Nick's Lawn Care
09-05-2012, 11:10 PM
I dont think you can go up, i think it is set like that from the factory, now you could add a set of air bags. Would be something worth looking into, it wouldn't fix your problem though.

I usually take the trucks I'm looking at buying to a diesel tech shop. There should be one in your area, a full size semi shop should be able to point you in the right direction. I don't know if your buddy has a lot of experience on working on these diesels but I would highly recommend taking it to someone to have them look at it. I gladly spend a few hundred dollars for someone to full look over a truck before I buy it to see what I'm getting into.

AWJ Services
09-05-2012, 11:15 PM
The negative about an F550 as a dump is it will never really be able too utilized as a dumptruck unless you are hauling sand, mulch, etc. 4 tons is not very much weight. A flatbed dump will be much more versatile. You can load from the sides, fab up any sides, use it too haul job boxes etc, I could go on and on. With a 26k gvwr it will haul about 8 tons. Step it up too 33k and it will go about 10 tons payload. If you really need a dedicated dump too haul a bunch then get a tandem.

alldayrj
09-05-2012, 11:23 PM
no frail landscaper dumps please! (just kinda joking about the frail)

this will be my smaller hauler but we frequently haul broken concrete so I need something rugged. almost don't want fold down sides after seeing what happens with my current truck but they are great for working curbside, cleanups, and loading when there is no skid steer on a job.

most of my palletized materials are delivered except when its 2 or 3 which inst really a problem off the back. also 4 tons of stone, sand , w/e is ok for me at this point in my business. I have friends with 10 wheelers and 20 yarders for the real big jobs plus a 550 can fit in more places more easily than my internationals(taller, wider, longer)

Nick's Lawn Care
09-05-2012, 11:27 PM
Hey I was looking at your website, you guys do some nice work!

alldayrj
09-05-2012, 11:47 PM
Thanks nick. Trying to take it to the next level this year and its been fun. Check out the facebook for some more pictures.
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Duffster
09-13-2012, 10:53 AM
Because that truck has air brakes you will still need a cdl regardless of weight.

In what country? Because that sure ain't the case in the US.


But the listing says that the gross on it is only 23400 so the weight is under cdl. You could drive it with a class c license then.

Could I drive it with a class D?

alldayrj
09-13-2012, 11:20 AM
Yea the salesman rocked my world when they said you don't need a cdl to drive with air brakes. Aparenty its been that way for years?
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alldayrj
09-19-2012, 01:23 PM
Thoughts on this truck? My only gripes are its the first year of the 6.br0 (which i have in my pickup and know how to work on) and the cab to axle looks a little short because o the tool box
Check out this

Ford : Other XL SUPER DUTY

I found with eBay motors for iPhone

http://bit.ly/Riibz5
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