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View Full Version : mini skid steer and ZTR or ventrac?


JCLawn and more
10-31-2012, 06:17 PM
So the question is pretty simple, would a 31 hp ventrac replace my 26hp diesel kubtoa ztr and a 25hpish diesel mini skid steer or not?

ashgrove landscaping
10-31-2012, 10:36 PM
eh a little but nothing replaces a skid steer really. The machine is just too dynamic.

JCLawn and more
10-31-2012, 10:38 PM
What do you think it won't be able to do besides fit though a 36inch gate?
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White Gardens
10-31-2012, 10:41 PM
What do you think it won't be able to do besides fit though a 36inch gate?
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In comparison to a Ditch Witch or Vermeer, it won't have the dump height, or the speed and maneuverability.

Not sure about the attachments for a Ventrac either. With a mini skid, the attachments are almost endless. My favorite is the back-hoe attachment. Keeps me from having to rent a mini-ex.

Does the ventrac even have a loader?

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JCLawn and more
10-31-2012, 10:45 PM
In comparison to a Ditch Witch or Vermeer, it won't have the dump height, or the speed and maneuverability.

Not sure about the attachments for a Ventrac either. With a mini skid, the attachments are almost endless. My favorite is the back-hoe attachment. Keeps me from having to rent a mini-ex.

Does the ventrac even have a loader?

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Yes, it has 90 percent of everything a mini has, it can go faster same hydrolics but not sure on the gmp but they have a stump grinder that runs off of it. You could adapt the loader and run any mini attachment and run the aux lines to the bucket to run whatever. Also the loader has more reach I'm pretty sure.
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White Gardens
10-31-2012, 11:00 PM
The only thing I could find on the Ventrac web-site is a slip-scoop loader. Really it's just for transporting material and not really loading material.

Here's why I would buy a Ventrac.

1.) If I had massive slopes to mow.
2.) If I had a large acreage to mow.
3.) If I didn't mind being slower than a snail when moving material.

The Ventrac has it's limitations, but is still a good machine. A mini skid is way more productive though in the end.

As for attachments, you can find all the same for a mini skid, including the the stump grinder. Plus you could use a trencher or auger drive.

Hauling a ventrac looks cumbersome also. I can load my mini skid and have it chained down in about 8 minutes.

The dump height is where the mini skid shines, along with maneuvering wayyyyyyyy faster. In one day I move 35 tons of material with my mini. I seriously doubt a ventrac can do that.


EDIT, did just see the versa-loader and trencher attachment. I'm still not sold on it's productivity for producing in high volume work though.

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White Gardens
10-31-2012, 11:17 PM
Hing Pin Height is 80" on the Vermeer S650TX

Hing Pin Height on the Ditch Witch is 81".

So your looking at a 60"+ dump height with both machines. With a 4 in 1 bucket, then you would be close to 80".


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SDLandscapes VT
10-31-2012, 11:45 PM
8 minutes to chain that down white--seems like a long time

we strap the ditch witch and can have it secured in three to four minutes

and to the OP the mini skid will own the ventrac in the more earth moving type applications

ventrac would be good for mowing large and/or steep acreage and frankly would make a heck of a sidewalk machine for snow removal

White Gardens
11-01-2012, 12:06 AM
8 minutes to chain that down white--seems like a long time

we strap the ditch witch and can have it secured in three to four minutes


I was being conservative. ;)

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JCLawn and more
11-01-2012, 09:24 AM
Hing Pin Height is 80" on the Vermeer S650TX

Hing Pin Height on the Ditch Witch is 81".

So your looking at a 60"+ dump height with both machines. With a 4 in 1 bucket, then you would be close to 80".


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Ok not that I am set on this machine but I am keeping you honest here, the lift height is 77inches with the ventrac, the standard bucket is 5cu ft and they have a mulch bucket that is 9cu ft. so a 1/3 yard. I moved 10 yards of top soil, 10 yard of mulch, spread it out, dressed the lawn, blowed the leaves off the lawn, dug out 4 bushes/trees with pos 25hp gas dingo in 10hrs that could hardly lift 500 lbs. I dont know if the rental company limited the lifting power or what, but the engine would not work when the lifting power was maxed out.

Here is the reason why i ask this question. A new diesel ztr is 15 grand and new 31hp mini is about 25-28 grand. A ventrac would be 20 plus attachments. So for 28 grand I could have a 72 mower, a loader, and a stump grinder and I think would be easier on the lawn doing mulch than a mini, but I don't know if the venctrac would have the lifting power. The ventrac would be an awesome mowing machine but I don't know if if can keep up with a ztr but I saw a video with mowing at 10mph so I dont know. I also plan on using it in the winter time but bother machine would work just as well, I think the mini skid I could drive it onto a flat bed to it would be easier to haul. The ventrac would have more power on every attachment because it don't use the hydros except for the post hole digger. It only has a 9.5 gpm aux pump so I could run quite a bit of stuff but not as much as a mini but it would even run a brush hog off the aux http://www.quickattach.com/shop-by-department/mini-skid-steers/mowers/products/brush-buster-mini/ so ya, those are my thoughts.

JCLawn and more
11-01-2012, 09:25 AM
I was being conservative. ;)

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your guys are slow haha I could do it in 60 seconds or less with 2 straps.

orangemower
11-01-2012, 10:00 AM
Get the Ventrac. It WILL NOT tear turf when turning and more then likely will not rut on softer turf (if you opt for the dual tires) like a mini would. I don't own one so my advice could be taken with a grain of salt. However, I've done a ton of research on the Ventrac and if I could afford it, I'd own one and a large assortment of attachments. They are very solid machines and very well built. I think a mini is more limited to specific jobs and isn't a versatile as the Ventrac.

SDLandscapes VT
11-01-2012, 06:12 PM
If you are just schlepping mulch and edging spoils across lawns--by all means get the ventrac, but we landscape with our mini and I know the ventrac couldnt keep up. I have a 31HP turbo diesel Ditch Witch SK650 that I didnt even pay close to what you estimated in your previous post. Not all mini's are created equal and the ditch Witch and vermeer lead the pack. Can't wait to try out the new SK755

White Gardens
11-01-2012, 09:49 PM
Not all mini's are created equal and the ditch Witch and vermeer lead the pack. Can't wait to try out the new SK755

Unfortunately a Dingo isn't even in the same category as the Vermeer or Ditch Witch.

I got to try the S800TX from Vermeer. Nice unit for sure. Little on the big side though.

The S650TX is a great step up from my S600TX with the extra pump and more power. But I'm waiting till Vermeer Redesigns the S650 with the triangle track setup where the sprocket is out of the dirt before I ever upgrade. Too bad they've done it with the S450TX and The S800TX.

I also wish that DW had a dealer closer to me. There's one in Springfield which is an hour drive and the Vermeer dealer is only 15 minutes away. If I ever have issues with my machine, it's a quick trip to the shop.

The Ventrac has it's place, and if it fits in your business model, then go for it. It just doesn't fit in ours.


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JCLawn and more
11-01-2012, 09:53 PM
If you are just schlepping mulch and edging spoils across lawns--by all means get the ventrac, but we landscape with our mini and I know the ventrac couldnt keep up. I have a 31HP turbo diesel Ditch Witch SK650 that I didnt even pay close to what you estimated in your previous post. Not all mini's are created equal and the ditch Witch and vermeer lead the pack. Can't wait to try out the new SK755

How much is the ditch which? I can't find a msrp on it. I know the vermeer made me about go into shock.
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SDLandscapes VT
11-01-2012, 09:56 PM
well I m not sure now since they just released updated Sk750 and Sk755 machines

but the Sk650 was MSRP at $20Kish and they had a special for $19,400

White Gardens
11-01-2012, 10:03 PM
How much is the ditch which? I can't find a msrp on it. I know the vermeer made me about go into shock.
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Talk to the Vermeer dealer and see about a used rental unit. Usually they get up to 400 hours and then they sell them off for half the price of new.

That's how I got mine and couldn't be happier. Had to do some small repairs, but when you save close to 10k over new, then that's a great tradeoff.

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White Gardens
11-01-2012, 10:06 PM
How much is the ditch which? I can't find a msrp on it. I know the vermeer made me about go into shock.
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One of the reasons they are so expensive is because they say that it takes the place of 1-1.5 laborers.

My mini shows up for work on time, doesn't complain, and does everything I ask of it.

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JCLawn and more
11-01-2012, 10:06 PM
I wish I had one right now. Unloading 10yrds of leaves mulched into a fine dust is not fun off a trailer.
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White Gardens
11-01-2012, 10:08 PM
I wish I had one right now. Unloading 10yrds of leaves mulched into a fine dust is not fun off a trailer.
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Put a good canvas tarp down first. Find a post or a tree and tie the tarp to it, then pull away.

That or tie it to a mini skid and pull. ;)



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JCLawn and more
11-01-2012, 10:11 PM
I would and I did but it weighed from my guess close to 2000 lbs, I would of ripped my hooks lol

White Gardens
11-01-2012, 10:18 PM
Sounds like you might need a dump trailer first.



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JCLawn and more
11-01-2012, 10:22 PM
This is true........
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SDLandscapes VT
11-01-2012, 10:24 PM
my ditch witch dealer has a used vermeer 600 for sale

JCLawn and more
11-01-2012, 10:35 PM
Ya I had 14ft of my 18ft trailer covered in 4ft of mulched 3times leaves and then I drove my old woods/ 721d grasshopper loaded with leaves ontop of the leaves, strapped her down and tarped it up and down the road I went haha the neighbors to the house I was working at got a laugh out of what it looked like. A mini would of been nice with a big buket it. Now I got to pick up some junk on a curb from a house eviction, also a mini would come in handy for....... And that wood I need to move... And that tree I need to take out....
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bayfish
01-06-2013, 11:48 AM
The Ventrac provides a lot of options for a landscaper or lawn care operation. The footprint is lighter than a skidsteer or mini skid. Aeration, parking lot maintenance with the broom or blower, brush clearing etc... If you do snow removal of large properties like a hospital or nursing homes as we do and retirement communities, it would kill sidewalks with the broom and allow you to use fewer people who you have to try to keep track of. I have been looking hard at this machine and considering trading in a MF 1428 compact tractor on a 4000 model with the broom and may be a bucket and another attachment or 2. The tractor is too cumbersome, awkward and feels like it wants to roll over all the time. The tractor sits in the garage most of the time. The Ventrac would get more use because of it's compact nature and versatility.

docjones
01-07-2013, 10:49 AM
I own a 4200 series Ventrac and I agree 100% with Bayfish. I think in most applications a landscaper would get much more use out of a Ventrac. These machines seem to be written off way too quickly by most guys...especially skidsteer guys and traditional tractor guys. They either have never seen one, used one, or owned one. Are there applications better suited for a skid or mini skid? Absolutely. Are ZTR mowers going to be quicker and more manuevarable on certain properties? Yes. But, herein lies the difference....no other machine that I know of has the versatility and capability of these Ventracs all while feeling safe on slopes, easy on turf and just fun to run. The slip scoop is severely under rated. It is not for lifting and loading a truck. It is absolutely indispensible though when it comes to light material handling. We use it for bulk mulch jobs filling beds. It makes it a pleasure to do this all while not tearing the crap out of yards. On large open properties, I would mow with this machine all day. It leaves a better stripe than any exmark any day. And talk about slope mowing. How many of you have pucker marks on your ZTR seat from your butt hanging on for dear life while going down or across slopes?No thanks! These Ventracs are absolutely the most stable machine you wil ever get on...bar none! If you have any questions or reservations about these machines, feel free to ask away. I don't work for Ventrac nor am I compensated in any way by them.....just an owner of one and will likely own two by the years' end! I didn't even mention it's versatility in snow removal! Sheesh! Go look up Ventrac on youtube videos. These machines are amazing. No kidding.

JCLawn and more
02-06-2013, 01:38 PM
wow I made the email