Fertilize and over seed at the same time?

[Joel B.]

Can I put down a spring fertilizer/crabgrass preventer right after I over seed or will that deter the seed from growing?

Thank you,

Joel B.

[turfsolutions]

If you don't know the answer to that question then I don't think you are qualified to put down any pesticide. Just out of curiousity, are you liscenced to do this or are you a home owner asking advice. I hope the latter.

[Joel B.]

At least I can spell licensed. If I knew the answer, I wouldn't be asking it, would I?

Can anybody offer some helpful advice?

[turfsolutions]

No you can't seed after putting down a pre emergant. A prem will keep the grass seed from germinating.

Did I spell OK for you this time?:blush: :blob3: :blob4: :blob1: :confused: :alien: :mad: :rolleyes: ;) :D :cool: :) :( :o :eek: :angel: :sleeping:

[Lombardi]

Joel, you should not put down the crabgrass preventer after overseeding as it is a pre-emergence and will deter the growth of any new seed. If you need to overseed, do so, and then apply some straight fertilizer. I have been using 19-8-8 on any overseedings this year.

[TSM]

Joel, the only crabgrass preventer on the market that you CAN use with new seed is Tupersan. It is a bit pricey. I would recommend you follow the advice given above by Lombardi.

you could then apply a post emergent crabgrass control in the summer or, allow some crabgrass this season and apply your preemergent control next spring.

good luck

[Joel B.]

Thank you Lombardi and TSM.

Would I be better off using the crabgrass preventer in the spring and overseeding in the fall?

I've never really had a problem with crabgrass but don't know if that is due to the fact I use the preventer or there just isn't a lot of crabgrass in my yard to begin with.

Can a yard be overseeded in the spring AND in the fall of the same year?

Thanks again,

Joel B.

[timturf]

How many lawns do you fert and apply herbicides to???
You didn't answer the question, do you have a state pesticide licensed?

I'll respect you for seeking help!!

If turf density poor, overseed, apply tupersan, wait @ 4 weeks and apply pre emerge. Probable consider overseeding in fall again.

Tim

[TSM]

Joel, I would answer your question like this....it depends
:)

if you have areas that need to be seeded due to last seasons heat/drought and/or areas that suffered from insect activity, then I'd say overseed in spring. This way you won't have to deal with a 'dust bowl' when summer heat comes around.

If you just want to improve the density of your lawn or want to introduce a more favorable variety of turf, then I'd say wait to seed in the fall.

Chances are, if you seed in spring, you will still have to spot seed in fall. Fall is a much better time to seed.

thats my opinion.

timturf also gave good advice. IF you do seed in spring and still want to control crabgrass use tupersan (it is expensive) then reapply a more conventional preemergent (i'd recommend dimension) about 4 weeks later.

[Joel B.]

Thanks again, guys.

No I don't have any pesticide/fertilizer licenses and am not doing any applicating commercially, just my own lawn. I hope I wouldn't be asking these questions if was licensed!!

I'm just a guy with a lawn mowing/snow plowing business that would like his own thin lawn to look nicer. I'm also looking into a sprinkler system.

Joel B.

[muddstopper]

You can over seed first and after the new grass has been mowed at least 4 times then apply the prem. By then the new grass should have developed enough root system to survive the weed killer. Although you might still have some kill off.

[turfsolutions]

I am glad to hear it is for your lawn. I just hate to see guys out spreading pesticides without a license. Its potentially bad for the environment, and gives the industry a bad name. Good luck with the lawn Joel, I hope it brings some new clients.

[Joel B.]

Thanks turfsolutions.

[bobbygedd]

save yourself the headache, and seed at the right time, mid september-early october. sure u can get grass to grow now, and then pull your hair out trying to get rid of the crab and weeds. LICENSE? u need a license to put this stuff down? man, u guys aint gonna rat me out, are ya?

[timturf]

Again, we know fall is best, but if he needs to improve density and willing to care for new seedling , go for it!

I seed new lawns all year and with PROPER CARE I'm sucessfull!
It all depends on proper prep, quality seed, right seed for client, and correct soil chemistry>

[HBFOXJr]

why labels on products are not read or understood. And if the label is not understood or the product useage is not understood, why are questions directed here? Why not ask the product manufacturer or the person or company selling the product?

This type of question occurs all the time on this site along with "what does xxxxx cost". Why don't people go to a direct source of information?

Good info is available here, knowledgeable people are members of this site. But a person asking these questions here is getting answers from people he/she doesn't have any idea of how accurate the info is they are getting back.

[timturf]

great post hbfoxjr!!

soil test and read labels!!!!!!!!!

[bobbygedd]

the people who work at the places that are selling the products are not always knowledgable. a friend of mine went to a popular garden center and asked the floorperson advice on growing a lawn, last spring. the guy sold him 100 lbs of lime, 100 lbs of starter fert, and 50 lbs of seed. told him to put it all down with a drop spreader, and water. well, the grass that did come up(not much) died, and he has a field of weeds. its tough to get good advice, and opinions vary sometimes. good luck.

[HBFOXJr]

That same advice could have come from this site and that is my point. Your uninformed friend was being led by an uninformed sales clerk. He might as well have asked Mr Goodwrench. He bought at a "garden center" a "retailer". He wasn't buying from a supplier to GI professionals.

An analogy to our regional friends, would be having your wife go into a WAWA convenience store, buy a Tasty Cake snack and ask the clerk how to bake a pie. Then she'd wonder about the advice when the pie is unedible.

[bobbygedd]

thats right

[TSM]

So Harold,
What type of questions would you like to see here??

Or, should we all just puff up our egos and explain why each of us feel we are better than everyone else?

I have been around for many years, probably like yourself, i do get a kick out of some of the questions in here and many scare me to death! Personally I'd rather have the inexperienced ask there questions on this type of forum.

but, thats just me

[timturf]

I'd like to see questions ask, but lets give enough info some you can get good advice!!!!

[HBFOXJr]

My question was
why labels on products are not read or understood. And if the label is not understood or the product useage is not understood, why are questions directed here? Why not ask the product manufacturer or the person or company selling the product?

Why don't people go to a direct source of information?

My additional comment was
Good info is available here, knowledgeable people are members of this site. But a person asking these questions here is getting answers from people he/she doesn't have any idea of how accurate the info is they are getting back.

The question is legit and no ego is involved. Why would LawnSite be the first place of choice to ask a question about a product that has directions, cautions and contact information on the bag or container?

[TSM]

Harold,
why do I feel like you are scolding me?

I didn't mean to imply anything about your ego.

But you did not answer my question, 'What type of questions would you like to see here?'

[HBFOXJr]

It is not about what kind of questions do I want to see here, it is about why are some questions asked here or asked here first as opposed to going to a more direct source.

My question is a human interest question. It is a question of how brains function or we perceive, process and comprehend certain things.

If a member asks a question like "what experience have you guys had using pendmethalin compared to dimension and what rates and how many times per season did you apply it", I fully understand the person wants info on practical experience.

In this case the question was technical about product use. Products like this contain information on the bag. Perhaps the member has not purchased the product and knows nothing about pre-emergent annual grassy weed control. Perhaps he did purchase and read the bag but was unsure wether the product worked differently on "weed grass" as opposed to "good grass". The member did know enough from somewhere to initiate the question.

This members question is not an unreasonable question. However many similar questions are asked on LawnSite and I wonder why go to a secondary (not to be construed as second rate) information source for certain questions?

What are your comments or ideas?

[TSM]

Harold,
I believe folks come to these forums to ask questions rather than going to a more direct source simply because here they are anonymous. I could be all wrong, but there is no embarrassment here.

Of course this is also the lazy mans way of getting answers. Why read or do any type of investigation when a person can just type away at a keyboard and wait for the more informed to solve their dilemmas.

Then there is the egomaniac, you know, the guy who just likes putting people down. I feel those folks are sitting in some dark room all alone and rather than reaching out with a helping hand they take out their loneliness on others.

Personally, I check in for a few of reasons.
1) helps keep my mind active during the off season (we start up full speed next week, chances are I won't be coming around very often)

2) amusement, some comments, whether in the form of a question or an answer, really make me chuckle.

3) I also like to feed off of the enthusiasm of some in here. This particular forum seems to have many members who are just starting their business. Their enthusiasm help keep me energized some what.

And I'm not to proud to say I have learned a thing or two.

But, I do, at times, get frustrated with this cyber communicating because we (humans) tend to want to read between the lines or we insert an emotion into the sentence that the writer did not intend.

With all that being said, time for me to turn in for the night.

[Mike Bradbury]

Originally posted by Joel B.
Thanks again, guys.

No I don't have any pesticide/fertilizer licenses and am not doing any applicating commercially, just my own lawn. I hope I wouldn't be asking these questions if was licensed!!

I'm just a guy with a lawn mowing/snow plowing business that would like his own thin lawn to look nicer. I'm also looking into a sprinkler system.

Joel B.

Mowing high will usually eliminate crab grass within 2 seasons.
A thriving, healthy lawn shouldn't need crab grass control. if you don't have a problem, forget it and do your seeding.

[HOMER]

I had something to say but I'll hold onto it til a later date.

[timturf]

come on homer, quit teasing us!

[lordohturf]

Gents: Just to confuse the matter a little farther, there is a
relatively new product called Drive 75 DF Herbicide that can
be used as a pre/post ( more post ) for crabgrass, and done
at the same time as seeding. Not really effective right now, but
could be used in May or June as conditions are right for crabgrass
and other grassy weeds. Better yet, it controls dandelions, clover
and several other broadleaf weeds. Perfect for Athletic Turf
Maintenance programs where you are forced to seed in the Spring. Sorry but it won't control goosegrass.