6" Maples and 20' Pines

[brentsawyer]

I have a job that is fairly large and it also involves moving 10-12 Maples that are 5-6" and 12-14 20' Pines. The trees are located about 1 mile from where they will be transplanted to and I contacted a guy in town that has a 90" spade that is $150/hr. I am wondering about how long it would take per tree to move each tree and as how the best way to sub this out would be?

BTW, these make up a small % of the rest of the job so these are just one part and the trees belong to the owner of the land where I will be landscaping and are in rows that were planted about 7 years ago so he could move later when ready.

[KenH]

I would get the time estimate from the tree spade guy and price accordingly, of course counting in your profit. Is he digging the transplant holes first???

[kris]

Get a firm price from the "sub" then add on your percentage for setting it up etc.... about 15%. What the spade will do is plug a hole, then go bring a tree and set it ... putting the plug from the first hole into the hole the tree came out of.... probably carry on like that until he's finished... your lucky your only 1 mile but it's still going to be quite time consuming depending on how tough the ground is. If your lucky he may do it in one day.

[lbmd1]

Brent,
I think we need a little more info to help you out like Ken asked. At the new site where the trees are going, are you digging the holes or is the spade guy going to? Are you ball & burlapping the trees at the old site for moving to new? I've ordered 10 ft austrian pines from a tree farm before and they dug them right in front of me with a Bobcat mounted spade. They had the burlap ready in the wire baskets right by their side and literally had one dug and wrapped within 10 minutes. So I would wager about 5 -6 trees per hour is possible if prep work is done. Those 20 footers might take a shy longer. I would guestimate that the spade guy would be factored in at $900 for 6 hours of work that it would take for the site where the trees are being dug from , then 2 more additional hours at the new site if he is digging the holes there. ( including travel, prep) Once he's left you've still gotta alot of work planting, aligning, amending soil and such. What equipment are you using to move the trees around at the new and old sites. Those rootballs on those 20's will weigh over 2200 lbs each so jockeying them from the old place to the new will eat up alot of time as well. Tell us what you're using for equip and we can help out a little more with $$$.

Mike

[kris]

Mike ...more than likely the guys spade is truck mounted and he will drive back and forth ...1 tree at a time ... your right though...more info is needed ... our lambur spade will only dig up to 3 "caliper..bobcat mounted ... can easily dig and basket 150 trees a day. When you start talking the caliper he is it's a whole other "animal".

[brentsawyer]

I'll post pics tonight

[brentsawyer]

Thought I would add in the pic. Forgot about it. The one pictured here I measured to be approx 24'2". We will be moving 24 of them w/ 90" spade along entryway to the site. This was one of the larger trees and I didn't get to calibrate it but looks to be 6"

[brentsawyer]

Thought I would add in the pic. Forgot about it. The one pictured here I measured to be approx 24'2". We will be moving 24 of them w/ 90" spade along entryway to the site. This was one of the larger trees and I didn't get to calibrate it but looks to be 6". Since it is mid-winter, the trees dorment enough to move w/ out burlap and will be placed w/ the spade. Only other ? that I have is that I found an old article in L&L that said that decidious trees like maple don't need and are not recommended for staking. If anyone has insight into this, pass it along.

[johnhenry]

It is better to move now while they are dormant. But better have a roootball the size of a pick up truck.I would charge a $100 a caliber inch.I would try somehow to rent a spade to do it myself.$150hr is way too much where you can rent one alot cheaper.That $150hr is cutting way to much into your profits.Transplanting these tree's and having them survive is a massive job.If you never have done this before on this scale I would'nt do it.Because more than likely the sub you will hire hasnt done it or wont take any liabilty in the plantings.Plus the pines be very careful with.This job says run while you can

[brentsawyer]

What? Everything in your post I have to disagree w/ 100%. Why would someone who has a 90" tree spade not know what they are doing. I would certainly hope that if they have made the capital investment to purchase such a piece of equipment like that they would definitely be much more qualified thean I would, which is the #1 reason I am contracting them to do the transplanting. Next, what business would I have renting a spade, if I could, currently there are no 90" tree spades around here for rent that I know of, do you know of any $100,000 tree spades like this that I could rent. To add, $100 per inch that's $600 per tree *24. That's $14,400. This is a job that could will be done in 2 days with that spade. Why would you suggest this is a massive job and wouldn't do it when basically I have nothing to do with it as labor goes. Finally, why on earth would I want to run from a job like this, this is a small part of a $35,000 job. Oh yeah, $150 per hour is way too much. For one, not when it takes less than one hour to transplant each tree and why would I care how much it is, I'm not paying for it.

[johnhenry]

Originally posted by brentsawyer
What? Everything in your post I have to disagree w/ 100%. Why would someone who has a 90" tree spade not know what they are doing. I would certainly hope that if they have made the capital investment to purchase such a piece of equipment like that they would definitely be much more qualified thean I would, which is the #1 reason I am contracting them to do the transplanting. Next, what business would I have renting a spade, if I could, currently there are no 90" tree spades around here for rent that I know of, do you know of any $100,000 tree spades like this that I could rent. To add, $100 per inch that's $600 per tree *24. That's $14,400. This is a job that could will be done in 2 days with that spade. Why would you suggest this is a massive job and wouldn't do it when basically I have nothing to do with it as labor goes. Finally, why on earth would I want to run from a job like this, this is a small part of a $35,000 job. Oh yeah, $150 per hour is way too much. For one, not when it takes less than one hour to transplant each tree and why would I care how much it is, I'm not paying for it.

Wow such class I am offering advice and you take this tone.I sure hope you take a differ tone with your customers.
Second you must no nothing about landscaping if you pose this ?
Third does everyone one who owns say a ztr or a bobcat,grader,dozer know how to operate one. No they do not.When your tree's die from improper transplant you can look at yourself in the mirror.It sounds like you want someone else to do all the work and you stand by.How are you going to treat the pines after you transplant them.Or are you just taking the money and run with it.About this being a massive job. It is if you had to pose this ?.Otherwise you would know how to do this job.

ooo I love your last quote.why would I care how much it is, I'm not paying for it. [/B][/QUOTE]
I'm sure your customers would love to hear this. Lets call them up and see how they feel.

[brentsawyer]

Staying w/in recommended guidelines of 15" per 1" of tree diameter which puts me right on the money, I'm not worried in the least bit about moving these trees in the dead of winter which is when they need to be moved. LOOK IT UP. My last quote is directed as such that I should not be worried about the $150/hour since it is being directly charged to the customer and it is not an expense in the usual matter that I have to sell my time, it is a cost of having the job done the right way. Why does it sound like I want someone to do all the work when I am doing the smart thing and having someone transplant these trees that does this everyday?

Plus, "not everyone who owns a Z, bobcat, grader knows how to operate one" I sure bet that I take 99% of the operators of these pieces of equipment and they can do a much better job than a rookie which is what I'd be if I rented a tree spade of this magnitude, I could only picture myself or anyone w/ no experience operating a 90" spade. I would imagine it being something like someone first using a 200' crane w/ no previous experience of ever seeing one in person. What a mess

Sorry to offend you but what exactly would you suggest I do to Properly transplant these trees so that I can look myself in the mirror. Please, detailed suggestions only with some background info is all that is needed since you seem to be the expert here and I'm a chump over my head. Man you must really know it all and have no questions or answers since this is the first time I've seen a post of yours in the landscaping forum in over six months!

Heck the last post of yours over here was just as ridiculous by recommending someone putting down WEED FABRIC. Know what happens after two seasons of that junk. The decomposed mulch is a perfect bed for the weeds to grow on top of the fabric.

Then another you said that mulch was too much work for you and to stir you can't pay me enough.
I can't even decipher you mean by stir it.

Plus getting $40-42 yard for mulch. Now I understand. It is you that knows nothing about landscaping. Please do me a favor and go back to the commercial mowing forum.

I understand that you were trying to help in but I was only stating that I disagreed w/ you 100%. Read this, I didn't get personal, you did.

You, "You must know nothing about landscaping to post this ?" Also again, why would someone who has a piece of equipment like this never have had done this. Do you think that he just buys equipment and likes everyone to look at it? I would bet everything that I own against everything that you could acquire that it has been used at least once,............................a week for the past 10 years.

BTW. I'm VERY,VERY sure that my customers would be much more confident in me doing it this way it has been done millions of times around the world for $150 hour vs me renting a Bobcat for say which is the largest rental spade w/ a 36" spade which is used on 2.5" trees and smaller. And I'm sure that if you lived here and you were to approach this customer, he would be stunned at what you would have to offer since you'd run as fast as you could from something like this and leave him looking for someone else who would point him in the direction that I have.

Sorry, you just stepped on the wrong toes here w/ someone that dosen't like it when you get personal and they are simply stating that they disagree w/ you from the get go.

[Rtom45]

Don't forget to have the utility companies out to locate their equipment before you dig. A tree spade this size can do a lot of damage in a hurry!

[johnhenry]

Calling out my last name.Thats says alot of you doesn't it.Bringing up past threads must mean your little feelings have been hurt.Ten years of work huh!!! I highly doubt that.So after I stated my post you seem to have all the answers now.So why start the thread?.As far as telling you to stay away from this job.I was wrong go ahead with the job and have a great start with the tree farm to.
Now telling me to go to another forum and stay away from here.Guess you are the boss here and I should go to my corner and not speak. And what give you the right to call MY NAME out

So tell me you have all the answers

[brentsawyer]

Original question from two weeks ago was basically an estimated time per tree to transplant. This was to gather a ballpark figure for the customer to transplant his trees to where they needed to go so that he could have a final job cost. If that question makes me dumb since obviously I have never had to move 24' Maples before and I seriously doubt that you have either, sorry. It dosen't. Further, in no way in your postings did you give any reply to that question. Your attempts to belittle me and say that since I have never done this before, I basically had no business doing which is pretty much what I'm doing, for the actual physical moving part but I have found contractor to the job and I guess only time will tell w/ this projuect and if you want, please remind me later this year so that I can post the pictures for you. If I had infact walked away from this part of the job, this is a guy who can purchase a tree spade himself and have his employees do the job. So, I'll have to agree to disagree with you completely on this one and vow to move on and consider it just two people butting heads. As far as saying that I have no business doing this, that will stay w/ me and will not be forgotten. Finally, sorry that calling you by your name is sooo personal and shows such lack of class. Hey you can call me by name anytime, infact, I prefer it, heck my middle name is Hartnett, sorry, I don't have anything to hide, guess it's not the same for you. Anyways, still haven't heard your recommendations for transplanting the trees, even though that was never aquestion of mine.

BTW I looked up previous posts to see what kind of experience you have in order to be slamming me. It seems to me someone who was suggesting the things you were this past year was not someone I needed to be taking advice from at this point on this particular subject in the matter that you presented. Reading back on the original post of yours, all I can still do is disagree w/ you advice about the contractor who owns such a piece of manchinery not knowing or caring. Also that renting a machine like this is an even, excuse me worse idea to save some money. I'll admit that if I were to do that, the trees would probably have no chance of survival which is why I'm not doing the transplanting myself, instead I'm hiring someone who can do it properly and sucessfully.

[johnhenry]

You are really full of yourself aren't you.Have you went to school for landscaping or do you have a college degree.I dont have anything to hide from or do I run from anything either.Are you suggesting I am a coward by your statement.The only thing you have proved to me is that you are not mature enough and act like a moron.If your feelings are hurt fine.I could care less how you feel about me.But no I will not forget you either. You can count on that.One good thing about the ignore list you will be right on the top.

[Sean Adams]

The information in this thread is good reading. However, the little argument we have going on here is not very good reading....maybe amusing, but not very good reading. Please refrain from using people's names unless they indicate their name themselves, and let's leave the personal attacks out of this....let's just agree that you disagree.

Now back to the matter at hand....

[kris]

Yes the matter at hand .. Brent...was I correct in saying that he would make a trip per tree? Put the spoils from the hole he plugs into the hole the tree came out of? As far as your question on staking... I don't think so ....this root ball will have some weight . There is a whole controversy about staking going on that I don't want to get into.

[brentsawyer]

Moving on. Yes there have been several contradicting opinions as of lately that have questioned the use of staking decidious trees and what I'm thinking now is that the sheer weight of the balls will be more than adequate to not require any staking. The overall shape of the trees is slightly columnar so that should help keep it safer during heavy wind storms. Sorry to get off track earlier and like I said earlier, I agree to disagree.

[AGLA]

Where I am, we hire a 96" tree spade on a fairly regular basis. He charges $600-$1,200 per tree when moving it on site. He excavates the hole, ties back the branches as necessary, digs the tree, puts it in the hole, stakes it, and there is no guaranty.

He does alright for himself to say the least.

.... he does know what he is doing.