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fishnetman
01-15-2004, 10:30 AM
is there anyone with experance in 4 stroke trimmers ect.

Avery
01-15-2004, 01:03 PM
We switched to Stihl's new 4 Mix last year. No complaints so far.

P&C Lawn Care
01-15-2004, 01:10 PM
Never bought any hand held 4 stroke equipment due to it being so darn heavy. Couldn't see working all day with a heavy trimmer. I have a little Honda 4 stroke tiller that is great however I do not have to carry it. Good power, starts on first pull. It is nice not mixing gas for this.

GTLC
01-15-2004, 01:19 PM
Hey Avery, i got a question for you- are the 4-mixes 2-strokes or 4's b/c the ad for them says that they use a fuel mixture?

NEPSJay
01-15-2004, 01:23 PM
I have had a Honda 4 stroke trimmer for 2 years now and havent had any problems with it. However, this is a very heavy trimmer. I have heard from my dealer that there were some problems with the 4 strokes when they were turned 90 degrees and used as an "edger". The oil in the pan wasnt being picked up and thus a few units siezed up. But then again, I dont know who was using them or how well they were maintained. I just keep mine in the trailer for a back-up and stick with the lighter 2 stroke ones.

NEPSJay
01-15-2004, 01:37 PM
n1alx, According to Stihl, the 4-mix is a 4 stroke that runs on standard 2 stroke 50:1 mix. This eliminates the need for the seperate oil chamber. It weighs slightly more than the 2 stroke, but is said to offer 5% more horsepower, 17% more torque, and 15% less vibration.

quiet
01-15-2004, 01:37 PM
I use the Honda trimmer and Edger. Smooth, quiet, powerful, but heavy.

NCSULandscaper
01-15-2004, 02:08 PM
Personally i just do not see the advantages of having hand held 4-stroke equipment. Much more maintenance it seems like and would be too heavy. I would always stay with 2 cycle personally. I have demoed a few 4 stroke trimmers and just did nto like them very much.

NCSULandscaper
01-15-2004, 02:12 PM
Originally posted by NEPSJay
n1alx, According to Stihl, the 4-mix is a 4 stroke that runs on standard 2 stroke 50:1 mix. This eliminates the need for the seperate oil chamber. It weighs slightly more than the 2 stroke, but is said to offer 5% more horsepower, 17% more torque, and 15% less vibration.

What would be the point in that then. You still have to mix fuel. That defeats the purpose of a 4 stroke. For a little more horsepower, i cant say ive had a problem with the power a 2 cycle gives.

Grassmechanic
01-15-2004, 03:33 PM
NCSU - the purpose is to make an engine that burns cleaner.

SCAPEASAURUSREX
01-15-2004, 03:37 PM
Not only do they burn cleaner , they dont gum up like 2 cycle and they will outlast 2 cycle stuff.. Stihl just introduced a new trimmer it's the 110rx which is essentially the same unit only it has the hollow shaft, a half pound lighter than the standard unit , only thing is you cant put blades onto it due to the hollow shaft.. I think we all better get used to this concept cause its' probably the future of equipment...

Avery
01-15-2004, 03:59 PM
Originally posted by NCSULandscaper
What would be the point in that then. You still have to mix fuel. That defeats the purpose of a 4 stroke. For a little more horsepower, i cant say ive had a problem with the power a 2 cycle gives.

The point is you get more power at less RPM's, much better fuel economy, more torque, engine lasts much longer. Try one, you will like it much better than a two stroke.

Mickhippy
01-15-2004, 04:46 PM
I use a Shin T2500 I think its called. It uses the 2stroke mix as well but is much smoother and quieter than most of the 2 stroke equipment I've had. On the down side, It dosnt have near the rev/power of my Kawi 2 stroke in the thick stuff. So basically, the Shin is good for doing edges and light trimming. The Kawi is kick butt at everything from 6'+ grass weeds to the finest of edges. I wish I never spent all that money on the Shin.

Stick to the old 2 stroke IMO!

NCSULandscaper
01-15-2004, 07:01 PM
Originally posted by Avery
engine lasts much longer.

Have you ever witnessed one lasting longer than a conventional 2 stroke motor is is that just something the company that makes the engines claims for advertising. Ive worked around both for a while and just dont buy all the hype over them. But if they work well for you then more power to ya. I am just not interested in what i have seen yet.

Avery
01-15-2004, 07:06 PM
It is common knowledge that a 4 stroke will out last a 2 stroke. I have been around engines long enough to know that.

Andrews Lawn
01-15-2004, 09:14 PM
All you guys that are stuck on the 2 stroke equipment are going to get a jolt when they outlaw it all in a couple of years. All that's going to be available is the 4 mix stuff, which isn't a bad thing but I would still rather have a traditional 2 stroke though. You can't beat the power of them. I am going to buy up a bunch of two strokes in the coming years because sooner or later it isn't going to be around.

MudslinginFX4
01-15-2004, 09:26 PM
I agree with NCSU Landscaper, I just don't see the need in buying one... they are much more heavy and don't produce the power of a 2-stroke. Also, 4-strokes aren't meant to be turned up on their sides etc.. Someone that is very high up in a lawn equipment company said that manufactures are being forced to make 4-stroke because of pollution problems and only Echo has a clean running 2-stroke.

Avery
01-15-2004, 10:13 PM
You can turn a Sthil 4 mix on it's side. The oil is mixed in the gas. Also I do not think they are any heavier. And they are much stonger. We clean up areas of wire grass often knee high. The 4 mix goes through it easier than the 2 strokes. We only have two of the 4 mixes so far. My guys race to see who can grab one first.

NCSULandscaper
01-15-2004, 10:14 PM
Originally posted by Andrews Lawn
All you guys that are stuck on the 2 stroke equipment are going to get a jolt when they outlaw it all in a couple of years.


Yea they probably will outlaw them because they work so well, like anything else that seems to work well. Until that happens ill stick to the reliable 2 stroke. Ive had 2 stroke engines 15+ years old that still runs like brand new, so why mess up a good thing and switch now.

DennisF
01-15-2004, 10:55 PM
Originally posted by SCAPEASAURUSREX
Not only do they burn cleaner , they dont gum up like 2 cycle and they will outlast 2 cycle stuff.. Stihl just introduced a new trimmer it's the 110rx which is essentially the same unit only it has the hollow shaft, a half pound lighter than the standard unit , only thing is you cant put blades onto it due to the hollow shaft.. I think we all better get used to this concept cause its' probably the future of equipment...


The EPA is pressing manufacturer's to eliminate 2 stroke engines completely. I've heard that by 2010 that most companies won't be making 2 strokes at all and most are now in the process of converting over to 4 mix. Environmental regulations are the reason.

rotgg
01-16-2004, 01:30 AM
Stihl's new 4 Mix is awsome when the people on the board try them they will all switch

Aleman
01-16-2004, 06:36 AM
4 strokes have taken over the world of motocross racing. Where it was once all two strokes, now with the larger bikes the 4 strokes easily out number the 2 strokes. The new bikes are that good. I would think it will be the same way with other engines also. Weight has become alomost a non factor. The only thing that I would wonder with smaller engines is cc's. For instance, a 450 4 stroke is equal power wise to a 250 two stroke and a 250 the same as a 125 two stroke. With the EPA regs changing, we will probabaly all be using 4 stks in the near future.

LawnMower
01-16-2004, 02:55 PM
I run a Wisconsin Cast Iron on my weed whacker. Got if off the hay bailer. You should see the size of my right arm.

thfireman
01-16-2004, 05:30 PM
I just hope I can afford them.

D Fricks
01-16-2004, 07:07 PM
Have the shindawia T2500 very hard to crank . Dosent have the power the 270 or the 260 has would not recomend one
until they make more improvements.

xcopterdoc
01-16-2004, 08:41 PM
The 2 stroke gasser stuff will suffer the same fate as the 2 stroke diesels... I'll be glad to see em both go!

rotgg
01-16-2004, 11:50 PM
all this post is telling me is that not many people have used a Stihl 4 Mix there is no way if u have used one that u would be bashing them my guys have had fights to use the ones we have and i would never use another two stroke if i didnt have to and i love two strokes the same with the dirt bikes the guy was talking about i loved my two stroke bikes and said i would never buy a four stroke then i rode one lol

BigEd
01-17-2004, 12:08 AM
Originally posted by rotgg
all this post is telling me is that not many people have used a Stihl 4 Mix there is no way if u have used one that u would be bashing them my guys have had fights to use the ones we have and i would never use another two stroke if i didnt have to and i love two strokes the same with the dirt bikes the guy was talking about i loved my two stroke bikes and said i would never buy a four stroke then i rode one lol

I think you may need to put some punctuation in this just to read!

and...

The longest run on sentence award goes too.....

s&wlawncare
01-17-2004, 01:39 AM
use a stihl 4 mix and you wont ever want to use another 2 cycle (so much smoother)

Sam-Ohio
01-17-2004, 01:42 AM
The problem with 2 stroke is that when the piston comes down to the bottom of the cylander and the ports are uncovered, the air/fuel mix blasts into the combustion chamber. At the same moment the exaust port is also uncovered and the burned fuel mix is supposed to go out there.

A certain amount of the new fuel/air mix shoots right across the piston top and goes out with the exausting gasses.

They have tried running less oil in the gas, they have leaned down the carbs so much that some 2 strokes got hard to start, and the power is just not there when you run a 2 stroke so lean. They have tried stratified charge, and re-directing the incoming air upward in the cyl. and catalytic comb. don't work good, cause there is so much fresh air and fuel going out that the exaust on a 2 stroke is chilled down to below the ignition temp that the combuster needs to light off. The blue smoke you see in the air behind a 2 stroke is caused by UNBURNED fuel and oil blasting out with the exaust.

A 4 stroke, with its valves and extra 2 cycles keeps all the air/fuel mix inside and burns it completly enough that you don't see any smoking unburned fuel. This is where it picks up the extra power from - it actually uses the fuel you paid for to make HP + torque instead of pi$$ing it away.

The problem with 4 stroke of course is the weight with any hand held tool. Stihl figured out that most of this weight was the 1/2 pint of oil, the great big sump to hold the oil, and all the baffles used to keep the oil suspended and not break the piston to pieces if the engine is held upside down while running, and an oil pump.

What they have managed to do is gain back most of the lighter weight by lubricating with fuel mix as in a 2 stroke, but burning fuel more efficiently and completely with their 4 stroke upper end of the engine.

Unless the other companies that make gas powered hand tools can come up with some miracle to make full 2 strokes run as efficiently and cleanly as Stihl does ,in a couple more years, they are going to be forking up big bucks to Stihl to get licensed to use Stihls patents.
.

BW4486
02-14-2004, 03:50 PM
Everyone complains about weight, but its not a big difference
fs85- 11.00 lbs 1.27 base horse power
fs110-11.70 lbs 1.30 base horse power

Fareway Lawncare
02-14-2004, 04:46 PM
The new Sthl 4stroke 4mix TurboCharged Blower Should Blow the Sox off the competition

rlmelton
02-15-2004, 12:01 AM
I,m going to wait till the last minute to go the 4 stroke route, that way I might get all the latest technology. Kinda like the first Ryobi and Honda 4 stroke trimmers were compared to all the new ones on the market now.

specialtylc
02-20-2004, 02:19 AM
the sthil 4mix is good machine. less wheight than regular 4 stroke.a little heavier than 2 stroke.has quite a bit more torque than 2 stroke.i have had one for about 5 months of last season.will have to see if it lasts longer than 2 stroke.

Mark Lawncare
02-20-2004, 11:36 AM
4 stroke motors will last longer but they are more expensive to rebuild compared to a 2 stroke. Are there any 4 stroke backpack blowers out there?

naturescape
02-21-2004, 11:05 AM
After reading these posts, I'm going to get a Stihl 4mix edger this year. If I like it, I will get a Stihl 4mix trimmer also.

I'm considering using a shoulder strap on my trimmer and edger this year (where ever I have a lot of trimming or edging to do), so weight should not be as much of an issue. I hope.

dkeisala
02-21-2004, 12:38 PM
Originally posted by Aleman
4 strokes have taken over the world of motocross racing. Where it was once all two strokes, now with the larger bikes the 4 strokes easily out number the 2 strokes. The new bikes are that good. I would think it will be the same way with other engines also. Weight has become alomost a non factor. The only thing that I would wonder with smaller engines is cc's. For instance, a 450 4 stroke is equal power wise to a 250 two stroke and a 250 the same as a 125 two stroke. With the EPA regs changing, we will probabaly all be using 4 stks in the near future. I have a client whose business is to build and repair 2-stroke motorcross engines. He said the same exact thing when we were talking about my new Stihl 4-mix.

J Hageman
02-22-2004, 01:02 AM
I have a new Stihl KM110 with a edger and trimmer for this year. It hasthe 4 Mix engine on it. I can use brush knife and blades on it.