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ManleyLawn
01-23-2004, 09:36 PM
I am 20 and a father of a 7 month old... Last year was my best year out of the previous 3. I thought i was doing my part in taking care of my son "the provider" role... As the season drew to a close i had a coversation involving my sons grandparents and my sons mom... As they saw it my work was getting in the way of their daughter and my son... I think i am doing the best i can with the hand i was dealt but my question is how do you all cope with running your own business and still make time for your family? I make time for my son and his mother but they always want more... When you get older and your business is more stable do things start to ease up as far as family goes??? My relationship with my sons mother has really gone down hill and I believe that because of my dedication to my business and to my work that it may be to much for her... not to sure though do your wives and husbands have a problem with the long hours and working weekends??? i chose this career but never really expected or looked at the family time or lack there of.... thanks

packerbacker
01-23-2004, 09:39 PM
Do you provide a roof over their heads? Do you put food on the table? Do you clothe them?

IF you answer yes to any of those questions then you are doing what your supposed to be doing. As long as you are doing that then everything else fall into place.

bobbygedd
01-23-2004, 09:45 PM
does your wife work? if not, tell her to grab a wacker 3 days a week. running a solo op is rough because you are everything including the mule. she needs to get more involved, and be more supportive. she can do things like billing, customer correspondence, contacing supplyers, etc.

ManleyLawn
01-23-2004, 09:47 PM
i do and i do... they said that i need to be the one getting up in the middle of the night with my son and i need to be feeding him. I understand being a mother is hard but i feel like i'm doing the best i can. i do feed him and get up with him every once in awhile. But, when i wake up i'm out of the house before her and i'm home after they go to bed.. (many nights) For a one man operation i think this is part of the job. i dunno though...thanks

UNISCAPER
01-23-2004, 09:49 PM
Manley:

Tough one there. I was until 2 years ago a single dad, who, worked almost non stop trying to get past the memories of a devastating loss in my life. I had a second chance to evaluluate what I was not doing right and what I would do over when I relocated.

So, I have to ask you...How many hours a week are you working? And, what is taking the time that keeps you from your family? And, further, are yuo budgeting work so you can delegate to others and still pay yourself? Many smaller or one man operations as we were at one time bid and do not figure all salaries and overheads they need and deserve to pay themselves and employees, rather just pay themselves what they should make based off wages when they wroked for others.

There are a number of things I could rattle on about here, but trust me here...The number one thing in your life, the thing that will always be there long after your business has been sold down the river, will be your family.

If you want, write me privately and I can try and help as best I can.

ManleyLawn
01-23-2004, 09:49 PM
bobbygedd, i agree with you 100%. she does come out and work if i am behind. she does work a part time job. i just hate having to hear a bunch of sh*t from her parents. they used that against me. thanks

pcnservices
01-23-2004, 10:01 PM
Originally posted by bobbygedd
does your wife work? if not, tell her to grab a wacker 3 days a week. running a solo op is rough because you are everything including the mule. she needs to get more involved, and be more supportive. she can do things like billing, customer correspondence, contacing supplyers, etc.
Amen to that Bobby!

Manleylawn here' my advise to you: next time your father-in-law is nagging about your "job" you created for yourself to support his daughter and grandson then ask him HIS chequebook and write a cheque in YOUR name for 2000 dollars and get him to sign it. That will shut him up him for a while!

Get your wife involved. She wont have time to sit with her mother and whine!

And while you're at it mowing you can still do you fatherly duties. You have to! Nothing wrong with that.

Good Luck
PC

AMAC
01-23-2004, 10:01 PM
I have been in the same situation and I know that dealing with the in-laws can be difficult. Keep up the hard work and let them know that it will pay off in the long run.

nelbuts
01-23-2004, 10:09 PM
Manley Lawn.

I applaud you for what you are doing. Raising a family at any age is hard work with the greatest of rewards. I am 47 and have a son who will be 16 this Sunday and an 11 year old daughter. I am not nor is any man a perfect father. We can only strive for perfection, that is the challenge.

I usually work daylight to dark five days a week, daylight till 2 on Saturdays and half day doing something on Sundays. Make no mistake about it, it is not easy. If I did not have the best wife in the world (literally) I would not know what I was doing half the time.

I have changed a total of 5 dirty diapers (poopoo) ones! That does not make a father. Neither does just providing a roof over your family's head. Those things contribute to the over all picture. But the single most important thing is TIME. You can be poor, spend time with your kids, love them, do school work with them and they will be happy and turn out great. Or you can make tons of money spend no time with them but visit them in jail when they are older. That choice is yours and you must make the balance. Choose wisely.

bobbygedd
01-23-2004, 10:14 PM
you know what i'd tell him? say, "dad, listen, i get up early, work my butt off in the hot sun, i deal with bees, snakes, rabid racoons, and irate customers. after all that, there is billing, estimating, handling complaints, collections, repairs and maintenence, by the time all that is done, it's past midnight. then, your daughter keeps me up half the night insisting i have sex with her, over, and over, and over again. i'm just worn out!

HOMER
01-23-2004, 10:17 PM
Are you married?

Are you living in the house with your in-laws?

You refer to your sons mother as your sons mother......not your wife.

Evan528
01-23-2004, 10:18 PM
lol Bobby!!!! That ought to shut them up!!!!!:laugh:

Turf Medic
01-23-2004, 10:19 PM
Did you sit down with the wife before you started the business and discuss your goals and if your goals meshed with hers and if she was willing to make a sacrifice to attain them.

No matter what anyone says YOU have to decide what is most important to you, your business or your wife. If you both have the same goals, the both of you will have to sit down with her parents and tell them to back off.

nelbuts
01-23-2004, 10:20 PM
Not a bad idea bobby. Say father-in-law you will not believe what a sex machine she is. I have to work so hard just to be able to afford the rubbers!

bobbygedd
01-23-2004, 10:29 PM
yea,by about 2 am, it smells like an 18 wheeler that was doin 80 and slammed on the breaks

NCSULandscaper
01-23-2004, 10:30 PM
Originally posted by ManleyLawn
i just hate having to hear a bunch of sh*t from her parents. they used that against me. thanks

I think that would be on the verge of a "shut the hell up and try my job out for a few weeks" kind of situation. You seem to be doing what a father should for their child, provide food, shelter, clothing, and still trying to spend time with your kid. Tell them to accept yalls lifestyle, or butt out of your business.

Turfdude
01-23-2004, 10:32 PM
If you can find very reliable help, you can work more normal hours. I have tried everything within reason from screening potential employees to offering them healthcare, vacation, sick & holiday pay (as well as accelerated snow pay rates) This year, For every three employees needed, I will hire 4. This way when 1 -3 call out, I'm not screwed. This is my plan for now to try to work less hours & spend more time w/ wife & kids.

pjslawncare/landscap
01-23-2004, 10:38 PM
First of all , I would let the father inlaw know he is sticking his nose where he shouldnt. He should have a life of his own to run and you have your life to run. Two seperate lives, period. Now if you were sitting a the bar from 5:00 to 11:00 every nite your wife would have reason for complaining, but your earning a living for your family and you balance time you have as you see neccesary. Young couples are faced with dificult challenges and times are harder when money is scarse. Simply put, this is between two people. You and your wife. Refuse to talk about it to father inlaw.

ManleyLawn
01-23-2004, 10:51 PM
homer... i am not married and yes i did live with the in-laws for a little over a year. i just moved back home while i look for a permanent living situation... i started my business in high school long before i ever met my sons mother. i don't want to say wife but she pretty much is... i like the answers you guys have suggested even the funny ones. for christmas i got her a dildo as a little joke b/c i hadn't been around to much. everyone laughed thought it was hilarious her parents acted like i had killed someone. On a more serious note me and my in-laws had a very heated discussion about the situation and one of the comments he made really took me by surprise and really has ruined our relationship...he said "how would you like it if Tony started calling me dad because you are not around" i took that to heart and as a man i thought once as a father figure to me is now nobody... sorry, i don't mean to get off-topic but this does have a direct effect on my business and everyday life in general thanks everyone for your opinions and light hearteness. thanks

PLI1
01-23-2004, 10:58 PM
Give your in-laws 2 choices.
a. you'll quit your lawn gig and become unemployed and they'll
support the 3 of you so you'll have plenty of time with your
family.

or....


b. if they don't like choice a, shut the he(( up, you're working
your butt off to put a roof over your heads, food on the
table and clothes on your back!! Pretty darn honorable I
think.

It sounds to me like you are not going to win with the in-laws no matter what. So you might as well do what you feel is right for you and your family.

In my experience, I had a lot of problems with my wife in the beginning. I spelled everything out to her since the beginning. I will be very busy in the Spring and Fall! During the summer, there will be busy weeks and some will be normal, ie. 40 hrs. During the winter, I will be not working most the time except when it snows. I do not punch a clock. We start out the day and when we're done, we're done. We don't leave jobs half done just because it's 5:00. It took her it seemed forever and probably 50 arguments to finally figure out that I wasn't kidding! This is the life of a landscaper. You can take that 9-5 idealism and chuck it out the window!

olderthandirt
01-23-2004, 11:00 PM
I would tell the father in law and his daughter that his daughter chose me to have a baby with and if she's not happy with the life I can provide for her you can have her back. And I'll see you in court to find out what days I get my child and how much support I have to pay. Thats the real world. Your wife needs to decide whether she wants to be married or with you as an adult or live at home and let daddy and mommy take care of her

Mac

NCSULandscaper
01-23-2004, 11:00 PM
Originally posted by ManleyLawn
...he said "how would you like it if Tony started calling me dad because you are not around" i took that to heart and as a man i thought once as a father figure to me is now nobody...


thats nothing a swift kick in the ass wont take care of. best thing you could have done is move out from their house. does your "wife" know the things that he says to you. if not tell her what he is saying and im positive she can handle her father.

Try not to let it bother you, you are doing everything you can for your family, its ashame some jackass has to ruin it.

Good luck

J & J Mowing
01-23-2004, 11:05 PM
ManleyLawn
The HONEYMOON phase is over, now is the time to tell
THE OUTLAWS TO BUTT OUT.
Remind them their daughter lived with them for the first
18 years, but for the next 60 years she is going to live
with you.
GOOD LUCK
:blob3:

olderthandirt
01-23-2004, 11:11 PM
Originally posted by ManleyLawn
homer... i am not married and yes i did live with the in-laws for a little over a year. i just moved back home while i look for a permanent living situation... i started my business in high school long before i ever met my sons mother. i don't want to say wife but she pretty much is... i like the answers you guys have suggested even the funny ones. for christmas i got her a dildo as a little joke b/c i hadn't been around to much. everyone laughed thought it was hilarious her parents acted like i had killed someone. On a more serious note me and my in-laws had a very heated discussion about the situation and one of the comments he made really took me by surprise and really has ruined our relationship...he said "how would you like it if Tony started calling me dad because you are not around" i took that to heart and as a man i thought once as a father figure to me is now nobody... sorry, i don't mean to get off-topic but this does have a direct effect on my business and everyday life in general thanks everyone for your opinions and light hearteness. thanks

Now that changes everything you're living in this mans house he's paying the bills and probably taking care of your baby when his daughter is to tired to. Did she move out with you or did you go alone. You make a baby you should be able and willing to support it immediatly and you should be having a baby with a woman that you have discussed your life dreams and hopes. It sounds to me that your homones took over one time and now you want to blame someone else when you were not prepared to have a baby.

Mac

leadarrows
01-23-2004, 11:14 PM
I can't help but wonder what the background of the parents is.
Do they come from money or have they there own successful careers? Why are they so out of touch with what it takes to run a business. People who are willing to settle for 9 to 5 jobs that pay OK but have little or no chance for any greater success resent others that have the ability and the gumption to make it as a small business owner sometimes. Maybe there some jealousy going on. Just a wild guess on my part with out more facts to go on. The way you describe it sure makes it sound like they have no faith-in or respect for you. If I'M totally wrong here theres always Bobby's I dea. I like it a lot. LOL :)
"your daughter keeps me up half the night insisting i have sex with her, over, and over, and over again."

ManleyLawn
01-23-2004, 11:35 PM
hey guys thanks for the opinions... older than dirt yes i did live with her parents but i paid for food, clothing, diapers, baby formula, her car payment and ins, rent every month and i even removed trees for them landscaped the front of the house fertilized their lawn and helped with the install and tearout of a fence. and on top of that i mowed their lawn every week. so i def. believe i did my part as far as that goes. who am i blaming for anything??? did you read the posts??? i have no one to blame anything on... i do not think that that i have in anyway ran away from the situation at all... your making it sound like i am some punk kid that does not want to deal with his choices.consequences. When in all reality i have done everything i can to show that i appreciated them (in-laws) and was not stepping on anyones toes... as far as discussing dreams and goals yes we talked about them, but who are you to say it was my hormones that got in the way? i appreciate your post and your opinion on the matter but b/f you go and start typing, think about what your typing before you hit the submit reply...thanks

leadarrows no they did not come from money but i think there take on our situation is the 9-5 job. they have said that they think it would be best in the families interest for me to sell the bus. and move on. they are in no way blue collar people, that is why i think it is so hard for them to understand. bobbys idea was funny. :)

olderthandirt
01-23-2004, 11:54 PM
ManleyLawn
Everything you did for them did not cover living expenses. And what I said goes, that is why people get married yea I'm old fashioned. If you had talked everything over with your girl then whats the trouble? You explained that you would be working long hrs. and would be getting home late and that there would not be much of a family life until you established your biz and she agreed right I mean she would of had to agree and all this would have been discussed before she got pregnant and you moved into her parents house so why the trouble now? I applaud you for stepping up to the plate and wanting to take care of your child you should. But don't try to tell me that all this other stuff was discussed before hand becuase if it was your girl would have backed you up and told her father to mind his own business. I wish you well in your relationship

Mac

Turf Medic
01-24-2004, 12:02 AM
Are your in-laws bitching because of their own observations or is your wife complaining to them?

If she is on your side, she needs to sit down with you and them and make them aware that she has made her choice on how she wants to live. At that point they can either support her in her decision or get over it

However if she is not on your side, you both have a tough road ahead of you, and you will more than likely be forced to choose between her and the business.

fcl01
01-24-2004, 12:15 AM
kids always come first. if you leave in the morning before they get up and dont get home til after they're asleep, she and your in-laws have a right to bi!!h. i would too! after being in business for three years and working all those hours, why are you "in between places" between your in-laws and your parents? i dont think we heard the whole story

ManleyLawn
01-24-2004, 12:18 AM
yes older than dirt things happen and yes we all make mistakes. we discussed futur plans after the fact but thats just the way it goes.


turf medic i think it was them bitching mainly from there own observations but i am sure that my "wife" did at times complain to them. i think it would be hard not to if your partner wasn't around all the time. she has said before she is not picking sides, i don't want it to be like that but i don't want to feel like she is not backing me. its a complicated situation. and the more i think about it the more complicated it gets. i really need to have a talk with all of them i guess.thanks

ManleyLawn
01-24-2004, 12:34 AM
fcl01....??? i think i am understanding what you said... the money i have made from the first few years got put right back into the business new trucks and trailers mowers etc. did not plan on getting my own house until about a year ago... and a year is not enough time to save up enough money for a nice downpayment on a nice home.. what else of the story am i missing???

nelbuts
01-24-2004, 12:34 AM
Ok just a little fact that was left out here. I still think that you are doing the manly thing and taking care of your child. But marry the girl! You ever think that maybe just maybe the reason the in-laws are so upset but they don't say it is because you aren't married? Maybe if you were then they may take your side a little more. Maybe girlfriend won't say it either but thinks you should get married. And then there is the work side. I know there were times that I wanted to work longer than go home. You know, the day is quiet no one to bother you and then you get home and BAMB!!!! seems like all hell breaks loose. It gets a little hectic for sure. Even as old as my kids are the house is a zoo when everyone gets home at the same time. Anyway, think about the marriage thing it just may be the cause of all of this and they don't even know it.

ManleyLawn
01-24-2004, 12:37 AM
ok. i never looked at it that way before. maybe thanks for the reply. :)

Turf Medic
01-24-2004, 12:48 AM
If the woman is to be a part of your life she HAS to take sides in this matter. It's her parents causing the problem, it would be different if it was your parents in your ass, then she would have the choice of not taking sides. There is no way to get the in-laws off of your back if she is going to follow you and complain to them. There can't be any fence sitting by your partner when you are trying to build a business.

And the married not married thing may or not make a difference, my wife and I lived together for 12 years before we got married. Her parents attitude hasn't changed either way, but she decided 12 years ago where she wanted to be and let them know it. Our interaction with them is very limited but she doesn't have a problem with that.

fcl01
01-24-2004, 12:55 AM
Originally posted by ManleyLawn
fcl01....??? i think i am understanding what you said... the money i have made from the first few years got put right back into the business new trucks and trailers mowers etc. did not plan on getting my own house until about a year ago... and a year is not enough time to save up enough money for a nice downpayment on a nice home.. what else of the story am i missing???


i wasnt trying to step on your toes. i dont know what kind of money you make and i dont care. but you have a child with this girl. by what you wrote, i got the feeling that you were having trouble making it in this business. if thats the case, i think it would be best to concentrate more on family than work. even if that means getting a different job and doing this part-time

best of luck

olderthandirt
01-24-2004, 01:16 AM
ManleyLawn
I want you to look at it from the father in laws point of view.
You got his little girl pregnant, you are noy married, you have not put a roof over your family's head. Now the man probably looking forward to spending time with his wife after having raised his family and instead he now has another baby in the house his daughter not going anywhere soon and your not there to help becuase your working. Just try to imagine it from his point of view and maybe you will understand why hes not real happy. And Turf Medic 100% right your girl got to get off the fence and decide who she wants to be with.

Mac

burnandreturn
01-24-2004, 03:38 AM
Sometimes we get so wraped up in things we can't see the forest for the trees, if you know what I mean. You have a tough situation on your hands. Making the right choices in an emotionally charged situation is one of the hardest things in life. If you can't talk with your girlfriend, you had better learn too. If she's too young and immature to talk to you and sit down and have a real heart to heart, you better get some outside help that you both trust.

It sounds to me as if everyone is so charged up that you all are just bumping heads.

jeffex
01-24-2004, 06:09 AM
There is some good advise here Manley! I am 46 and my wife still gets mad when I work too much. I work full time as well as run my lawn and pressure washing business. My wife has been stay at home mom for the last 15 yrs. I taught her to run all the equipment and take her with me whenever I can. Hire a sitter and bring your girl with you one day . I don't know her age but all she wants is your attention . just like all women whatever age. I know my wife has waited all day for me to get home and she wants to be the first to see me . Sounds like you have the responsibility part covered in your like. It is the RELATIONSHIP part that us men have difficulty with. I've been married 18 yrs and still trying to figure it out. Go to a counselor or to a church and ask to talk to a priest. I'm no holly roller but without a little help most of us would just F our lives up! nothing to be ashamed of

Envy Lawn Service
01-24-2004, 06:15 AM
Originally posted by burnandreturn
Sometimes we get so wraped up in things we can't see the forest for the trees, if you know what I mean. You have a tough situation on your hands. Making the right choices in an emotionally charged situation is one of the hardest things in life. If you can't talk with your girlfriend, you had better learn too. If she's too young and immature to talk to you and sit down and have a real heart to heart, you better get some outside help that you both trust.

It sounds to me as if everyone is so charged up that you all are just bumping heads.

Bingo!!!!!!

With that said, let me add this....and listen good....there has been a lot mentioned about marriage....

MARRIAGE is not magic

However, marriage will magnify any existing problems you already have and it sounds like you have plenty of those to go around. Marriage will just add fuel to the fire.

The cold hard truth is that our job is not the root of the problem. Forgetting about the marital issue, the two of you do NOT have the relationship to go along with the point you are in life right now. That's the root of the problem. Your relationship was not ready for a baby. So it's only natural to be in such a position now.

If you look at this from the outside you will see that your job is a convenient excuse for everyone involved, including yourself, and there are way too many people 'involved' to boot. Plus there is an innocent child stuck in the middle of all this that certainly deserves better.

Now back to the job, baby and relationship. The baby is already here and there is nothing that can be changed there. You need the job to support your baby regardless of what happens unless you can walk right out of it into a 9-5 that makes you happy and pays better. As for the relationship, there will always be one, good or bad, as long s both of you are involved in your child's life.

So the relationship is about the only thing that can change. SO you need to work just as hard at growing that relationship as you are to grow your business. Both of you need to LEAVE your father and mother, CLING TOGETHER and become one. IF the TWO of you can do that, these problems won't exist, you'll be ready for marriage and your relationship will be caught up with everything else that has happened.

You and her need to sit down and talk about this, identify all the REAL issues and make a commitment to come together. Then both of you need to do your part.

goodbeus
01-24-2004, 07:16 AM
I know a few pastors and they say the same thing...poor families have less stress with their family than richer families...why? The richer family, 1 or both of the parents are working long hours, making money, and not spending quality time with their kids...the poorer family, most of the time, their devotion is to their kids and not money...think about it, one day when you're on your death bed, what are you going to reflect upon? All those hours you spent on Mrs. Wilson's lawn OR the time spent with your family...

KenH
01-24-2004, 07:20 AM
I really think you need to honestly ask yourself if you think are spending enough time with your family. Any'body' can put food, etc on the table, but it take a man to raise a family.

BTW, I have 2 small boys and am the only provider.

A1 Lawn@Landscapes
01-24-2004, 08:33 AM
There is something missing here..............

Are the inlaws upset because you work long hours with little income because you are still growing ?

What about days you can not work due to weather ? What do you do then ?

I think you need to sit down and talk to someone close to you like your parents or sibling. Ask them what they think. Regardless you need to spend time with your child.

I have an understanding with my wife. We have 4 great kids that need parents to be involved in their life. She works 20 hours a week as a nurse for steady income and benefits. This also gets her out of the house and gets me some family time as we do not use day care. I work as much as possible during my peak times. Make hay while the sun shines. Even during peak I make time for day trips to the beach, pick your own apple orchard, school plays and such. Many times I have had my crew drop me off at little league games to be picked up when it is done. The look on a boys face when he sees his DAD in the crowd witness his homerun is priceless and something that will stay with he and I forever. Unfortunatly, its a shame to see parents drop their kids off. The kid gets a hit and hangs his head because no one is there to give him a high five. The kid feels neglected and rightfully so.

You need to communicate with your girl and get on the same page. Balance is the key word. You need to balance the need for income and family time. Sit down alone with her and work this out now before its too late

lx665
01-24-2004, 08:50 AM
If you want advice on marriage or relationships, don't come to Lawnsite. The last time I checked this site was dedicated to lawn care and landscaping. If you are serious about your family, get some professional help.

John

leadarrows
01-24-2004, 09:20 AM
Sure thats good advise if he has insurance. I'll bet as soon as his insurance or cash runs out they will tell him all his problems are solved. Been there done that what a waste of money. I don't need some self righteous idiot telling me how to solve my problems by asking me how I FEEL about that. You don't think any of us have ever had to solve family problems? There are some idiots in any walk of life thats for sure but that doesn't mean he can't get any ideas from any of us about how he might handle this. Were a community of people trying to help each other here. It's not just about lawn care. Please don't sell us so short.

rodfather
01-24-2004, 09:58 AM
Originally posted by PLI1
In my experience, I had a lot of problems with my wife in the beginning. I spelled everything out to her since the beginning. I will be very busy in the Spring and Fall! During the summer, there will be busy weeks and some will be normal, ie. 40 hrs. During the winter, I will be not working most the time except when it snows. I do not punch a clock. We start out the day and when we're done, we're done. We don't leave jobs half done just because it's 5:00. It took her it seemed forever and probably 50 arguments to finally figure out that I wasn't kidding! This is the life of a landscaper. You can take that 9-5 idealism and chuck it out the window!


Very good advice...I basically had to same the very thing to my wife 14 years ago.

HOMER
01-24-2004, 10:12 AM
ML,

It's my opinion (not professional either) that at this time you and your son's mother need to get away from the in-laws.....go out to eat or go to a park or something. Sit her down and calmly ask her where her heart is. Do you love her, does she truly love you. This is where it all starts. Yes, mistakes were made.......we all make em and we all have to live with them but you have to look at the here and now.....today. There is a child involved and he is the most important player in all of this. If your doing all you can but it's with a heavy heart.....one that you feel obligated to due to the situation........it's never really gonna work the way you want it to. If you truly love her and can see spending the rest of your life with her and she feels the same way then you two have to make some decisions and plans on how to break away from Ozzie and Harriet!

On the other hand........if your doing all of this out of guilt/obligation then you also need to look at the rest of your life. The boys gonna be there and I think you should be a part of his life. That doesn't mean you have to marry his mother..........if she doesn't truly whole heartedly love you and want to spend her life with you then she needs to tell the hard truth about this matter. When you said she didn't want to take sides it left me with the impression that there was true commitment lacking on her part. You haven't said how old she was. I have a 22 year old daughter and an 18 year old. If this were to happen to either one of them I could relate somewhat to your girlfriends Dad. He wants what's best.........you should want what's best and the mother of the child should want what's best. There is the question you should answer first to yourself........then she has to answer it...........leave her parents out of it. This is you and her and the baby. If you can't get the correct answers and your heart and hers can't connect then it's time to move on.....set up visitation rights and whatever child support needs to be paid. Live your life and let her live hers but be a part of your childs life forever.

Remember.........this isn't her parents decision and group talks will not work. You and her alone without any interference. I know my wife loves me........she has in the past told her Dad where his opinions could go........she made the choice long ago and there was no mistake about it. Until you can reach that point in a relationship there isn't much hope for it.

Choose wisely but do it soon. Lifes short.

GrassBustersLawn
01-24-2004, 10:40 AM
I think ENVY LAWN said it well!

Also, I didn't see any mention in any posts, but when you are done working, what are you doing in your "free" time? Are you running with your buddies? Or are you going home - (wherever that is 'cause it sounds like she lives with her parents & not with you) and being with her and the baby? If not, that could be the problem. Between this job and family there isn't much time left for "other stuff".

I've got a 4 yr old girl and 4 month old son. Between work and family that eats up the time. We PLAN to see friends one or two nights a month.

I think maturity (on both parts) has a lot to do with it. I wouldn't want to be tied down with these responsibilities at your age.


Mike

dishboy
01-24-2004, 10:43 AM
My question and advice would be; your talking about this with us but shouldn't you be having this conversation with your partner. My guess is that you need to change what your doing some and and she needs to change her attitude some. So if you you and she can sit down and come to a comprimise that you both agree on I believe you will have a much better chance holding off the inlaws. Amos 3;3 "How can two walk together unless the agree".

bobbygedd
01-24-2004, 11:29 AM
tell the old man he's a mullet head

Charles
01-24-2004, 11:50 AM
I cut back along time ago and don't work weekends no matter what. This way you can plan time with your loved ones. Beside that, one or 2 extra days are not going to make you that much more money but it may put you in a earlier grave. Your body and mind needs time to recuperate. Plus you need time to balance life with your family. All work and no play..... Life is too short for that IMO

burnandreturn
01-24-2004, 12:10 PM
Don't confuse activity with progress!!! Read that again.
Most people are working too hard to make real money.

pcnservices
01-24-2004, 12:51 PM
Originally posted by lx665
If you want advice on marriage or relationships, don't come to Lawnsite.
John, Let me give you a wake up call in the real world.
This is what lawnsite is all about. A community of heart warming, loving, caring, hardass businessmen / women and hardworking professionals who care about their wifes and children, Lawnsite.com and it's members, the people they work with, their clients and fellow lco's.
They are here to help, advise, lead and care on any related issue whether it be business, lawns, clients, family, relationship or marriage.

Can't you hear Manley's cry for help?? How cold hearted are you? Whether he like it or not, he's getting some good help and advise here from guys that has been there and faced an unreasonable father-in-law before. If he need to take it to a next level of help he can go see a councillor.

PC

lx665
01-24-2004, 05:17 PM
pncservices posted: How cold hearted are you?

As you can see I don't post often. If I did not care I would not have replied to this thread. I posted what I feel would be the best for him. Nothing said I was right. Take my advice for what it's worth.

There has been some good advice and a lot of bad advice in this thread. My family is number one. If I'm having a serious family problem I'm going to get the best help I can get. I'm sorry but some of the advice given here will make the problem much worse. If you deathly ill, are you coming here? Or would you go to the hospital? There is a wealth of great information on this site relating to lawn care and landscaping. For family problems I would go elsewhere.

John

leadarrows
01-24-2004, 05:38 PM
"Or are you going home - (wherever that is 'cause it sounds like she lives with her parents & not with you) and being with her and the baby? If not, that could be the problem. "

Was wondering about this myself. How about it?
It's a common mistake a lot of guys make. Once upon a time long .....long ago I made that mistake. Cost me every thing I cared about.
I suspect it would be hard for you to air the whole story your mistakes and all. Would be for anyone. I don't feel like I have enough facts to give you any specific advise.

brentsawyer
01-24-2004, 06:02 PM
I'm not married yet and hopefully several years away from any 'little ones' but here is how it works around my house with my fiance.

Spring to summer, I am not available for squat except for work and laying on the couch when I get home and on Sundays. This means please wash my clothes and get them to the guest room so that I have something to wear the next day. It only gets put in the closet if we have company that needs to sleep in the room. Same goes for cleaning the house, I can do it on Sunday but I will probably be really pissed off if I have to. Leaving town for anything is probably not going to happen unless a member of my or her immediate family dies and that will only be for the funeral days, had to miss her grandfathers funeral 10 hours away 2nd week into last spring. Fall I have a little more time and a little better to live with. Winter I have plenty of time even though that is lessening every year and this is my time to help with washing clothes,etc, I usually do alot of the house cleaning and other stuff from, Dec-March. So throughout the year, I will work an average of 2000 hours like a 9-5 job but I don't have the luxury of having that constant schedule. If I were you, I would be putting in as many hours with the family and baby as possible and do as much as I could now and make it understood that you are giving all your available time to the two you can and when spring comes along, that is your time so that you can make up for it later.

greensummer
01-24-2004, 06:38 PM
I have read a number of respones, all very good and since I'm no expert, I would like to suggest that all family members get "involved" in some form with your business. Allow me to give you an example: Too make a long story short, I went out and worked a day with a lawn technician, It was quite the "experience"!

Once all family members get a "grasp" of exactly what you do on a daily basis will they "comprend" your situation!

My friend you have such a great future ahead of you, this is just but a very minor bump in the road.............

Good Luck!

Tommy, CBR 600 F4i. ;)

ManleyLawn
01-24-2004, 07:35 PM
lx655 this thread was started on the simple question of how do you make the time for family after working... not asking for marital or relationship info. i posted a simple question and people respond to it... I agree that we are off topic but i can't help what goes on with the thread of you don't like it don't read it. thanks everyone for your thoughts and opinions..

mtdman
01-25-2004, 04:42 AM
Originally posted by Envy Lawn Service
Bingo!!!!!!

With that said, let me add this....and listen good....there has been a lot mentioned about marriage....

MARRIAGE is not magic

However, marriage will magnify any existing problems you already have and it sounds like you have plenty of those to go around. Marriage will just add fuel to the fire.

I have to agree. If you're having problems with her and the parents now, marrying the girl isn't going to help.

First, it sounds like her parents are nosey and need to butt out. I can understand their concern for their daughter and grandchild, but it's your kid and they have no right to be telling you how to raise her. And if the mother is complaining to the parents, then that's a huge problem in itself and you need to deal with that situation as well.

Secondly, I don't think you ever said how much time you are working vs how much time you spend with the child. And if she works. That's kind of important to understanding the issue.

Third, is your business successful? Do you make $$? Are you profitable? Can you grow? If you are on the right track, and you feel good about the business, forget what the parents are saying. Many people that never had the balls or motivation to start their own business do not understand what it takes to run one. Lots of people think everyone should be 9 to 5, don't understand what an effort it is to be on your own. Nor do they understand the mindset of a businessman that devotes his time and energy to the business. If your business isn't going anywhere and you are busting your ass just to keep afloat, maybe it isn't bad advice?

Starting a business is a time consuming effort. It's tough to do it. Having a relationship and starting a new family and being young on top of all that just adds to the pressures. If you are serious about the business and want to make it work, you have to ignore those outside influences that would see you fail. You'll have to learn to live with these problems and overcome them. Being a dedicated businessman is a tough job, so is starting a family. I don't envy your position.

Now, if you really aren't spending enough time with the kid and mother, and are breaking yourself just to keep up in the business, it may be time to hire some help to keep things going and free yourself up. You can't kill yourself forever keeping the business going on your own, eventually you'll fail. You might not see an increase in profit from having a helper, but if you're looking for more free time that may be the way to go.

I got lucky. My wife doesn't complain too much about my business. And if I'm spending too much time working or at the shop, she'll come and find me or call and drag me home. She understood what I did before we started dating and I made sure she knew that I was devoted to it.

Jimbo
01-25-2004, 05:53 AM
Envy said it best!

It seems strange to me that you are posting this now during the winter. Are you having problems while your in the off/slow season?


My thoughts on this. BTW- I am a few years older than you but I have a 3 year old and a 5 month old and I have been in this biz through all of it.


1. I would not marry to make this problem go away... It wont happen. Marriage creates more stress initially (especially the getting married part).

2. If you love this girl you need to get her and you out of and away from her parents house. I would recommend an apartment for at least a year so that you are sure you can live together before buying a home, and getting married.

3. I would talk to you girlfriend and tell her all of this. Many women just want to know your human! Tell her your thought, dreams, and fears (Throw in a few tears when you hit the part about how her parents hurt your feelings).

As far as I am concerned my wife is very supportive. Her parents probably think I am gone too much (mostly for their family gatherings etc., but hell they are always doing something). One thing is for sure they cant say I am a lazy bum.
I have always done my fair share of the work with the kids, and around the house. Dirty diapers (I cant count that high), staying up late to hold them when they are sick, bath time, dropping off and picking up at daycare.
I have done this from day one and my wife still feels like I am not around enough during the summer. She really likes it when we get to take a nice vacation with the money I have brought in!
One of the things that helps in our relationship is that I am willing to sacrifice myself as much as possible. Even if I have to get up in the middle of the night and then get up at 5:30 to get the trailer loaded; I do it. I am the man of our house and I will do what needs to be done regardless of how tired I am.

Good luck

Jimbo

P.S. Are you making good money or is your business failing? If your making money you need to spend some on your girl. She might feel like shes doing all the work and not getting anything in return. Spread the love and the wealth.
If your business isnt doing so well maybe you should get a 9-5 job (steady income), get your life in order, and then run the biz on the side in a few years. If things work out you could always go full-time at that point.

Jimbo
01-25-2004, 06:06 AM
In response to what most are saying about her parents let me say this.

The majority of parents only want what is best for their children and grandchildren. I dont think her parents are bad. Yes, they are going to be nosey when their baby is involved.
They have most likely made many mistakes themselve and dont want their little girl and future son-in-law to follow in the same tracks.
This doesnt make their advice right, but they are intitled to an opinion.

One thing is for sure....dont ever try to get a girl to side against her parents. Dont say bad things about them etc. Just tell her you love her parents, but we need to chose your own path in life.

Oh yeah, when you discuss future plans make sure you say "WE" and try to avoid "I". She wants to be part of it you know.

Jimbo

Creative Lawn Care
01-25-2004, 09:17 AM
Went through almost the same thing a couple years ago. I am 26, been married for 7 yrs. and have a 6 yr old, 5 yr old and 2 yr old. I have been fulltime solo for 5 yrs. My wife does not work. Actually she works very hard taking care of our kids and our home. She understands what I do and helps out as she can. However no matter how much she understands that doesnt mean she want to be home alone with the kids from 6 a.m. until 9 p.m. everynight. Things I have done are this. I dont start work until after I drop my daughter off at school. I do this everday and it has not really changed my producivity that much. Also if I leave and my other two kids are not up yet, I call back home around 9 to talk to them. Its a simple thing but they enjoy it and it shows the wife you are thinking about them and care. Most nights I am home by 6-7. Its important for a family to eat supper together in my opinion. I try to spend at least 30 min a night playing with the kids after supper and then help in getting them to bed. Also on friday nights we go out to eat as a family. On saturday night I stay home with the kids and my wife goes out with friends. She deserves this and needs to get out of the house somtimes without the kids. Of course on sunday we go to church and sunday afternoon we usually take it easy. I usually work about 50-55 hours a week. This is just the way I do it. I dont know your specific situation so maybe it wont work for you. In the end that baby will be grown in a few years and you cant get that time back. I choose to spend my time now with my kids. If the business doesnt grow or I dont get rich then so be it. I am doing what I feel is most important at this time in my life.

griffin16
01-25-2004, 09:41 AM
Manly,
DROP EVERYTHING AND MOVE AWAY FROM THE INLAWS.
You will never be good enough for their little girl, ( although it sounds like you are doing everything right ) Good luck son.

lawnworker
01-25-2004, 09:29 PM
Manly, I charge enough per lawn that I don't have to work 70 hours a week. Also, I probably live off of far less money then most people on lawn site. In my opinion Working all the time just sucks, but I know you gotta do what you gotta do to make it. Good luck to you.

twins_lawn_care
01-25-2004, 09:57 PM
Very interesting post, and I think a lot of us have been there. I am the proud father of twins (17 months old) and have felt the need to be home more, the only thing is it is harder to feed 4 people than just 2. So what I was doing, was working a part time job when everyone was asleep 3am to 6am. This way the only thing I was missing was sleep, and I can deal with that. Come home from that, then have breakfast with the family, and off to the full time job. Then come home, and do the part time LCO until it got dark.
Hard, yes. Tiring, yes. Worth it, definitely!
I truly believe it is rough, and with 2 at a time, it is not any easier. But to be able to have mom stay home with the boys is more than worth the extra work, and the little bit of sleep I miss. The payoff is not the money, so don't ever try to fool yourself. Yeah, you need money to survive, plain and simple, but think about this.
Fifteen years from now, your son will not remember how many hours you worked, or how much money you had in your bank account, but be dam sure they'll remember if you never spent any time with them. It is the most important thing you can do, is to be there, so that they learn from you as they grow up.
True, you have to work to pay the bills, but you should also try and find ways to pay the bills, and be home as much as you can.
You have to sacrifice that little extra to be able to spend time with them. Like on my lunch break at my full time job, I get an hour break. I some days will drive 25 minutes each way, just to say hi for that 10 minutes I have left. Do I like driving that extra time, no, but those 10 minutes more than make up for the stuff I don't like to do.
It's all about sacrificing for them. I take it to be a natural decision in being a father. I would give up anything for my boys if I had to to help them out.
I would think long and hard about ways to be home more when it is important. You will be amazed at how much better your life will go when you spend time with your kids.
When you come home from a rough days work, with blood coming from your bare hands, and your back aching, after sweating all day long, it's amazing how quickly all that goes away when you see your sons' smile at you, and run to the door when they hear you coming.
Take care of your family, they are there forever. Lots of times in-laws are doing just that, looking out for their own family, so keep that in the back of your mind.
Good luck with your situation. Things will get better when you try to all work together, and realize you are all in it for the long haul together.

twins_lawn_care
01-25-2004, 10:05 PM
Here's a picture I keep to remind me of who I am working for. I title it

Leaders come in all shapes and sizes


Sort of helps get through those rough times. I am sure you have a picture which does the same for you.

Yard Perfect
01-25-2004, 10:12 PM
You speak of your wife as your in-laws daughter and your sons mother. First thing is, she is your wife, and unlike Packerbacker suggests, providing for a roof and food, the most important thing you must provide or give is "love", then all those other things fall in place or do not matter. My opinion is that your wife is more important than the child, the child will grow up and leave and you than have your wife. Trying to help her find a job that at least pays for the day care would be my primary goal. I wouldn't even respond to the inlaws. They are only part of your life if you let them in.

Dave Kent

Evan528
01-25-2004, 10:29 PM
They have a right to voice there opinion as long as The baby is living in there house. If he dosnt like there opinion he should be providing a roof for his daughter and girlfriend. DONT HAVE A BABY IF YOU CANT PROVIDE FOR IT!:rolleyes:

ManleyLawn
01-27-2004, 01:51 AM
Evan528 i hate pricks like you come in and try to talk about something you have no clue about. though i do agree with you about her father having an opinion the "DONT HAVE A BABY IF YOU CANT PROVIDE FOR IT!" what the hell is that???? who said i was not providing for my kid he's taken care of.

yard perfect- she is not my wife and i am not married but i do agree with you...

ManleyLawn
01-27-2004, 02:04 AM
i appreciate everyones thoughts and opinions on my particular situation.i really do, but the topic was how do you make time for family after working. not my life story. i would have no problem telling you guys my life story but thats not why i started this thread so if you post i would appreciate it if we stuck with the topic. the only reason i am saying this is because people are posting and makeing me out to be some dead beat dad peice of sh*t that doesn't know what his responsibilities are. and thats not me. i gave everyone a very breif summary of whats going on in my life that would help everyone understand my particular question a little better.thanks

Envy Lawn Service
01-27-2004, 09:44 PM
Originally posted by ManleyLawn
the topic was how do you make time for family

Well... it would be nice if we could 'make' time, but we can't. You have to TAKE time and take is a nasty little word when there is already not enough hours in the day. But the time as got to come from somewhere.

I guess the key is balance between all things. But don't ask me how to balance things because honestly, I've been trying to figure that one out for myself for a while. What I've learned about myself is I don't know the meaning of the word balance.

To me, you can't devote enough time to providing for your family, while at the same time you can never devote enough time to spending quality time with family. But when you are trying to grow a business and provide for a family all alone, it seems balance blows right out the window. It's easy to find yourself gone all the time and when you are there, your so tired that you're not really 'there'.

This is not a good situation for a young family or a young business. At this point it's almost certain sacrifices are going to have to be made in order to achieve any sort of balance. So I don't know. But I am hashing out a few ideas to cut my hours down. But rather they will work or not is yet to be seen.....

Evan528
01-27-2004, 11:05 PM
Originally posted by ManleyLawn
Evan528 i hate pricks like you come in and try to talk about something you have no clue about. though i do agree with you about her father having an opinion the "DONT HAVE A BABY IF YOU CANT PROVIDE FOR IT!" what the hell is that???? who said i was not providing for my kid he's taken care of.

yard perfect- she is not my wife and i am not married but i do agree with you...

I do know what birth control is and beleave in using it if you cant support a kid 100%.

HOMER
01-27-2004, 11:40 PM
Manley,

I'd still find some quiet time with your girlfriend and map out your future.

Listen to the latest song from Kenny Chesney too. Things happen for a reason............gotta believe that and move forward.

ManleyLawn
01-28-2004, 12:40 AM
Evan528... i support my kid... now your beliefs are your beleifs but don't post if you don't know the situation...thanks

we had a serious talk today and it seems that she wants things to work out just as bad as i do. She is willing (and so am i) to really work hard on this relationship... We both agreed that communication was another peice of the puzzle that was missing. So things are working out a little better and i appreciate everyones thoughts, ideas and opinions thanks.