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MJLsLawnCareNmoreLLC
03-29-2004, 03:52 AM
Hey, I have a 15ft maple that a customer wants ripped out and replaced with a new one. It would have been taller, but it has been hacked down many times. The trunk diameter is like 9-10 inches. Do you guys think its possible to rip it out with a truck? (91' dodge ram 250) How big do you think the root system is? By the way the tree is still somewhat alive.

Lombardi
03-29-2004, 10:25 AM
Your Dodge probably can't handle it, but my Chevy could. Just kidding. You could try. I would cut down all but about 4' of the trunk. Then wrap a chain around a couple of times and pull. If the ground is still wet it would be a good time to try.

sgrprincees
03-29-2004, 10:32 AM
I don't think you can pull it out. 10 inches is pretty wide, my thinking is that if it seems strong enough that you think you could winch off it if you were stuck in the mud, you won't rip it out just by pulling hard.

JohnK
03-29-2004, 12:23 PM
I tried pulling an alder stump that size with my Suburban and couldn't do it, even in 4 low there just wasn't enough traction (285x75 AT tires) to budge it.

It wouldn't hurt to try pulling it, but I doubt you'll get it out with a pickup.

EagleLandscape
03-29-2004, 05:39 PM
A) Dont use chains. You'll kill someone, use straps.
2) Do you have 4 Wheel Drive? (more traction)
C) You won't be able to to pull it out:) Just get a tree spade to come and get it.

polecat63
03-29-2004, 09:42 PM
Cut the tree down and grind the stump. No way you'll pull a 10" tree out with a truck.

landscapingpoolguy
03-29-2004, 10:12 PM
I pulled a 12- 15 ft white pine with the winch on my jeep the other day.....The winch pulled it clean out of the ground with no problems at all......8000lb ramsey rep...ill say the diameter was around 6 - 8 inches tho

Chuck

MJLsLawnCareNmoreLLC
03-30-2004, 02:30 AM
No i dont have 4 wheel drive, but i was planning on using straps instead of chains. I would just grind down the stump, but he wants another maple right in its place. Thanks for the help so far. By the way, do rental places have tree spades? About how much are they to rent?

Randy Scott
03-30-2004, 08:00 AM
No way you're pulling a 10 inch Maple out of the ground. Not without looking like a redneck hillbilly and getting the rear-end of the truck off the ground. I doubt it would come out anyways.

Do it the right way. Cut it down, grind it out. Pulling stumps out of the ground with trucks is what makes this industry display it's "scrub" image.

newleaflandscape
03-30-2004, 03:10 PM
The only other way I would yank it other then cutting and grinding is bringing in a backhoe and digging around it and then hooking up a truck. That way you can cut off major roots. But by the time you do all that it would probly be cheaper to have someone just spade it out.

charlies
03-30-2004, 07:00 PM
i think you should try it. make sure you have someone make a video record it for posterity! (and give me the address and date/time so i can come watch!:D )

this is a true story. this guy that lives close to me. a few years ago. he decides to pull a bush out from a bed at corner of his house. wraps a chain around it, and after much squealing of the wheels, pulls it out.

here's the REALLY good part, he then drives his truck around the neighborhood, dragging his 'trophy' about 10 feet behind him. some kind of primal celebration, i am sure much grunting was involved.

now i am sure that some of the other neighbors, peeking out between the venetian blinds of their house, were flabbergasted. i thought it was most amusing. i wish stuff like that would go on all the time around here. very high entertainment value.

Doster's L & L
03-30-2004, 10:43 PM
Originally posted by Randy Scott
No way you're pulling a 10 inch Maple out of the ground. Not without looking like a redneck hillbilly and getting the rear-end of the truck off the ground. I doubt it would come out anyways.

Do it the right way. Cut it down, grind it out. Pulling stumps out of the ground with trucks is what makes this industry display it's "scrub" image.


totally agree with this statement. I'm sure you already jkonw this, but just in case, make sure you get all of the trunk shavings out of the hole and fill with dirt. my 2 cents

Del9175
03-30-2004, 11:26 PM
Since its only one stump and not that big of one, I would think a shovel and axe would work nicely. Done it many of times myself.

desertrat
03-31-2004, 08:46 AM
Dig around the stump to expose the roots and then cut as many as you can with a saws-all. Use one those 10"Aggressive tooth blades. They are cheap, so you don't have to worry about it getting in the dirt, just buy a couple extra blades. I use them all the time, rather than messing up my chainsaw. Once the roots are cut, the truck should be able to pull the stump out of the hole, and you can drag it down the street grunting.

polecat63
03-31-2004, 02:21 PM
Or you could save yourself a days labor and do it right. Cut it down and grind it. If some yocal calls OSHA and you're doing tree work without the proper equipment the fines are very severe. Local company was fine $100,000 becuase the weren't using climbing ropes rated at 5400 lbs. Just do it right.

DJL
03-31-2004, 03:01 PM
DON'T use the truck method. One snap of the chain or rope and there goes the innocent bystanders heads, your window, or depending on the location, the house or other cars. At a construction site when I was younger. Guy decided to move a 20 cu. yd. dumpster with a metal chain and his pickup. POW!! the chain pops and there goes the whole back window. Thing shattered like a piece of glass.

For your situation (from what I've read) I don't think you can get away with the stump grinding part. If the homeowner wants another tree planted in that location you need to remove it. You'll have rot and sinkholes in no time at all. Something you can sell the client on (IMO).

I've done it a number of times last year with a small size backhoe. Cut the tree down with about a foot or two of the truck left intact. Dig around the stump a few feet all around it to rip up any roots. Then, grab hold of the stump and work it back and forth. Next, go deep and pull up, usually tap root comes up and all. If you plan it right you can use the backhoe to plant the new tree.

For what it is worth, just my two cents.

MJLsLawnCareNmoreLLC
03-31-2004, 04:54 PM
Originally posted by DJL

For your situation (from what I've read) I don't think you can get away with the stump grinding part. If the homeowner wants another tree planted in that location you need to remove it. You'll have rot and sinkholes in no time at all. Something you can sell the client on (IMO).



Thank You DJL. People like you are willing to help. You read the situation and help accordingly.

I realize everyone else is just trying to help, but the customer wants another in its place. I cant just grind the stump down fill the hole and call it a day. If he didnt want another in its place, not doubt thats the way to do it. Obviously the only way to do it was to cut down everything till a 4 foot stump is left and go from there. I would have to be a moron to pull on a full tree without any branches cut of with a chain and a truck.

crawdad
03-31-2004, 07:37 PM
I'm with DJL on the backhoe idea. I just got some 10" walnut logs a couple days ago, and picturing them, you wouldn't pull something that size out of the ground with a truck. At least, not with a truck that you want to keep.
I wouldn't even do it and I'm a redneck hillbilly with a Ford pickup.
Three of them, actually, one of which has the stars and bars proudly displayed on the front tag.
Crawdad

Kelly's Landscaping
03-31-2004, 08:09 PM
The backhoe is the ideal way to do it. However I think the truck could do it but not the way most would go about chaining it. If you were even crazy enough to attempt it the only way you could do the job was if you were hooked up as high as you could go on the trunk. Preferably 12 feet up or even more then yes the tree would work against its self as a lever and it would rip out. That said itís your transmission and I would think long and hard on that. If you do decide to try it best do it when no ones around it could become very embarrassing.

DJL
03-31-2004, 08:44 PM
On a side note, if you choose to go with the backhoe I would opt for some forks for the front bucket. You could use this to help assist with the planting of the new tree. Now you are using the backhoe to work smarter, not harder.

D Felix
04-01-2004, 07:24 PM
If you could get a good sized grinder, grinding shouldn't be an issue. Grind it deep, and chase roots. Remove all of the chips (you won't have to dig all of them out of the hole if you do it right), and plant the new tree, the correct way.

If you can't find a grinder, you could always call this guy.:D


Dan

MJLsLawnCareNmoreLLC
04-02-2004, 12:59 AM
hey does can you get a backhoe at any common rental place? About how much for a day's rental?

DJL
04-02-2004, 08:41 AM
Prices will vary depending on the establishment. However, for instance, I rent from a local Kubota/Case guy. It's $190/8hrs for the Kubota B21 (haven't rented that yet) and $210/8hrs for the Kubota L35. I then opt for the insurance which tacks on 10%. So, basically for the L35 I'm looking at around 250 per eight hours. I believe the Case skid steer is somewhere around $200-$225/8hrs for just the bucket.

Now, I like renting it on a Saturday because they allow you to return it on Monday since they aren't open on Sunday. As long as the engine hour meter doens't go over 8 hours, I'm fine. So, I get work lined up for clients and do that on Saturday and do stuff at my residence on Sunday (saved me my back a number of times). Works great if you can line up all your ducks in a row.

DJL
04-02-2004, 08:49 AM
D Felix,

I'm just wondering about your statement about the "correct way"...Is there any reason why your method is better than the backhoe method?

I dunno, to be honest I hate stump grinders. I think they are more dangerous that tractors (IMO). Hit one rock and your asking for trouble. Seems with the stump grinder I have to stop every few minutes to rake the shavings back and dig around to expose the roots (to do a good job). Just seems like more work.

Not trying to be sarcastic, but could you enlighten me? Perhaps I was doing something wrong? Maybe you are referring to much larger stumps not the 8-10" diameter one that was being discussed here?.?.?.

landscapingpoolguy
04-03-2004, 12:40 AM
Back hoe is the best way you can carry the new 2 - 3 inch caliber tree with it to the new hole you dig with it...back hoe should run u 250 to 285 a day....

Chuck

Katwalk
04-03-2004, 05:36 PM
Oh yeah....use the truck. Make sure not to hook it up to the bumper though. Wrap the chain around the rear axle and just smash the gas pedal.....that puppy will come right out......the rear axle that is!! Expose all roots and grind the stump into the ground, remove chips, and plant as normal. If you are able to cut the tree down yourself, you could probably get someone to come grind the stump for around $100 or so. The backhoe, IMO, will cost you more than $100 unless you own it.

D Felix
04-04-2004, 11:44 AM
What I meant by "if you do it right" was that you should end up with a hole already in the ground to plant the new tree into, one that you should not have to do much digging to get the chips out.

Now that I think about it more though, you will want to remove the chips if you grind the stump. Not removing the chips will cause a drastic decrease in available nitrogen as the chips start to decompose. My recommendation would be either remove the chips or add some triple-12 every month or so.

Either way (backhoe or grinder) will work. Just pick one and have at it. I think it's pretty clear that no one here thinks you will be able to pull it out with the truck (myself included). Check on the rental rates locally, I bet the grinder will be cheaper. Here, a grinder will run around $100/day, whereas a Terramite or a small mini-ex will run around $160/day.

If you use the grinder, MAKE SURE you wear safety glasses, long pants, and hearing protection. A face shield of some sort wouldn't be a bad idea either... And heavy boots.... I haven't ever had a big rock kick out of the hole, most of the time it's been chips and smaller stuff that gets past the guards.

HTH.


Dan

DJL
04-04-2004, 09:31 PM
D Felix,

Thanks for the response. I agree a grinder would be the cheaper way to go.

I dunno, those grinders just scare the crap out of me. I also find that rental yards seem to never have sharp enough teeth on the grinder, which I was told (don't know from experience) makes a world of difference.

MJLsLawnCareNmoreLLC
04-05-2004, 03:27 AM
thanks for the input guys, let you know how it works out.

grassredneck
04-05-2004, 08:32 PM
That Maple and the Pine root entirely differently (at least here in Ga) The Maple will have a root system at least 2x's the size of the crown of the tree-I know my truck wouldn't be able to handle it-GMC 2500hd with 6.0 gas engine, I have torn out a few pines though because they're just crappy trees and the root system doesn't spread out nearly as aggressively-I must admit that my knowledge on the root systems is just what the local arborist guy told me but I've found him to be pretty straight in the past

Rebel7695
04-20-2004, 11:18 AM
On using your truck... I really doubt that the payment for this job is good enough to justify the wear and tear on your trans and gears.. when pulling on stuff like that you can break teeth off of your gears, you wont necessarily know it right then but it will become a problem later...