dandelions didn't die.

[Doster's L & L]

I used Trimec Classic, its a 3-way that has 2,4-D, dicamba, and mcpp in it as ai. I started in mid feburary with my applications, my sprayer was calibrated and i thought all was going to do well. The requirements are 1.25-1.5 oz/k so i used 1.35oz. After 2 weeks, the onions were drooping and the other broadleaves were curling. Now over a month later, the dandelions are yellow and ready to seed out. They have been affected by the herbicide because they are shorter and kinda stubby. Well, the stalk for the seed head is shorter and thicker. Also, the onions seem to be coming back to life. I thought Trimec Classic was more residual than this. What's going on? Thanks for your help!!

[dishboy]

What was the tempature when you sprayed? Esters work better in the cold.

[Doster's L & L]

It was in the 40's maybe low 50's Fah.

[Scraper]

A little too cool for uptake of amine based formulation. You'd better reapply.

[Doster's L & L]

I see what you're talking about. In the A.I. list, it mentions Dimethylamine for each of the a.i.'s. If a product were an ester, would it read dimethylester or just ester or what?

What product do you recommend that i use in early feburary for broadleaf? I've heard the trimec 992 is pretty good. Is this an amine or ester? Thanks for the help!

[jt5019]

Gas works well... but if you want to save the grass that might be a bad idea :p

[Doster's L & L]

This is a real thought provoking statement.... Yeah, i wasnt really wanting a burn down effect in the lawns i do. Just wanted a few unwanted weeds to die. Thanks for the help though.

[General Grounds]

:blob3: did it rain soon after the app. go with the super trimec or 3 way ester from lesco. tony

[Doster's L & L]

nah, no rain. To tell you the truth, a week after i sprayed this particular lawn, i sprayed another one and it rained the next morning. I got some really quick results from the onions and other weeds. maybe the rain washed the dicamba down to the roots. I didnt expect anything would die after the rain.

[Runner]

It sounds like you may have just jumped the gun a little bit for the dandelions, and their uptake wasn't where it should been when they were treated. They have to be actively growing to be able to take in the product.

[MOW ED]

I have excellent luck with Speedzone. It costs more but if you are looking for killing power it does it. It is also rainfast in about 3 hours, I know that from experience.

[Doster's L & L]

I have heard of speed zone. I don't have a lesco around here, but hopefully my farmers supply co will be able to get it for me. I'll definitely check on it and see if i can get it.

Runner, if i had used the ester formulation instead of the amine, do you think i would have better results on the dandelions even though i may have gotten the product out before they're actively growing? Truthfully, i think i got it out at the righttime, i just used the wrong formulation.

Does anyone know how long the 2,4-d will remain active in the soil? Maybe a month? thanks for all of your help!

[Gabriel Turf]

40s to 50s are too cold a temps for amines. Use the esters and switch to amines at 75 - 80 degrees.

[MacLawnCo]

Originally posted by Doster's L & L
if i had used the ester formulation instead of the amine, do you think i would have better results on the dandelions even though i may have gotten the product out before they're actively growing?

no matter what you use, if the target isnt growing then nothing is gona happen... no growth = no herbicide uptake.

[kickin sum grass]

amines will stop translocating thru the plant when the temps get to cold. they do not restart and finish moving thru the plant to the roots.
esters will also stop but will restart the following day as the temps warm up. The product will then move down to the root zone.
That is why you seen some curling but then the weeds came back. There was not enough product in the roots to make a complete kill.

[grassguy_]

2-4D has a half life of 7 days in the soil after which soil microbial activity is primarily responsible for its disappearance. Since you used an amine formulation, it probably was hampered by the cooler temps. check the night time temps for that might after you made the application, if you hit below freezing any of those next few nights then the salts in the 2,4D locked up and stopped working within the plants.

[Doster's L & L]

Thanks guys for the valuable information!! I appreciate it alot!!

Good luck to you in '04!!

[get rich]

Lesco doesn't sell speed zone, it's a GORDON product or G.P.I. Check with co-op. It works good in cool weather and warm. A great across the board spray. Although it is exspensive, sometimes it's alright to spray a more costly spray to see the weeds gone in a two days. Great on clover too, so it's better than a cheap three-way. Lesco with sell you on quicksilver and a three way for the speedzone results.

[Doster's L & L]

THANKS get rich!! That's the info i was looking for!!

[grassredneck]

The temperature's have been much cooler than last year, I've noticed the Bermuda is still semi-dormant and I've seen much more weeds this year as compared to last. This has been a very informative forum for me in my first year as a licensed applicator