View Full Version : Pump help.
06-17-2004, 05:02 PM
I'm gonna build a pond about 7x 5 and 3 deep. I know how it all goes, but I need a pump and filtration system for the waterfall, (filter because they want to have fish in there).
This will be my first one, and theyve got all the stone I could ever dream of, (left over from this nice garage thjey just built). ANyways....
Theyve got a typical 120v wall outlet, is that what I would use for the pump? (never done one of these before). If so, can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks. This project wil;l be complete in a month, I'll show pics once I get going on this.
06-17-2004, 07:49 PM
So you're gonna take the plunge and build your first pond huh? That's great! If you're gonna build a pond that size, I'd recommend using a Vor-Tec 3500 filter. You can find one at http://www.azponds.com/.
That filter is a little big for the pond you're gonna build, but you'll find that customers that "plan" on having a few fish, wind up having lots of fish before too long. Most people fall into the trap of if a little is good, why not have more. They often don't stop and think about the fact that fish grow. The 10 small koi they think look so neat in their pond, will some day grow into adult koi. Those 10 adult koi will stress the filtration system many times over what they did as sub-adults.
As far as pumps go, I'd recommend a Sequence 3600SEQ12. You'll be able to dial that puump back to the 900 to 1000 GPH that filter I recommended calls for.
I'd highly recommend setting up the pump for gravity feed operation (placing the pump after the filter). I also can stress the importance of using a bottom drain. I'd never build a fish pond like yours without one.
If you have any more questions, let me know. Hope I helped you.
06-18-2004, 10:16 PM
check local garden center for classes on installation - PRO-Installer seminars - not just the guy in the pond department - we have enuff to handle with DIY without giving the 'pro's' advice too. Jump in to watergardens with both feet not just one time shot - a bad pond for the first pond ought to be in your backyard not a customers.
06-18-2004, 11:54 PM
I would not ever hook up the elec part unless you are certified. I f you would burn down the house, it is your fault, if you have a certified elec, then you will be out of the picture.
Just a suggestion.
06-19-2004, 01:36 AM
Isn't it just a plug, hes got GFCI and crap when he added n to his garage. So dealing around water isnt a problem. Isn't it just a regular edison(sp?) plug for the filter? Or is a straight wire tie in to a breaker, (i can do that, did that with 120v 3phase 200amp breakers all last summer).
06-19-2004, 01:41 AM
It sure is just a plug. All of the components you can buy for your pond come ready to pug into an outlet. Your 120v GFCI outlet is all you need. You're in business.
06-19-2004, 01:45 AM
The filter doesn't have a plug. It is just a place for water to flow through. A pump, or gravity send water through your filter. It's best to let gravity send water through. That way your pump is only exposed to clean water. This is called a "gravity feed system."
06-19-2004, 10:08 PM
Ok, so in order from the bottom of the pond, how do I place stuff? Filter, pump, and then out it comes? Pump is in the water right? Or is there a hose that goes down into the water?
Forgive me guys, but I'm new at this. Atleast I'm asking from people that know what they're doing:-D
What is a good filter? These psycho people will overload this thing with fish, I'm sure of that.
I've got a great eye for what looks natual, but they insist I use the stone they already have.
06-20-2004, 08:26 AM
I'd use the filter and pump I mentioned above. If the pond owners are going to overload this pond like you said, you'll be glad you did.
As far as designing the pond goes, you're going to want to install a bottom drain in the middle of the pond floor. Be sure to shape the floor so that it slopes down towards the drain. DO NOT PUT ROCKS ON THE POND FLOOR!!!!
Run pipe from this drain (probably 3" pipe) to a vault you'll dig next to the pond (close to where your waterfall will be). Run this pipe through the wall of your vault and to the inlet of the filter. When you make the vault, keep in mind that the water in the pond and the filter, will seek the same level. Because of this, you're going need to take some careful measurements of the filter before you make the vault. Designing the pond this way will cause the filter and consequently the pump, to be gravity fed. This way, the pump will be self priming too.
Run pipe from the output of the filter, to the intake of the pump (1 1/2", or 2" pipe). The pump will be in the vault with the filter. Just be sure to mount the pump below the output of the filter. The pump is an external pump (the case of it stays dry). Extenal pumps are generally more reliable and more energy efficient than submersible pumps.
From the output of the pump, I would personally run pipe to an ultraviolet sterilizer. Whether you buy a sterilizer, or not is up to you. All I can tell you is that any pond that has my name on it, will have an ultraviolet sterilizer.
If you elect to use a sterilizer, run pipe from it to the waterfall. If you don't use a sterilizer, then you'll run pipe from the pump, straight to the waterfall.
I'd recommend installing a surface skimmer too. If you install a skimmer. It should be positioned across from your waterfall. This way water will flow across the surface in one direction and push floating debris into the skimmer. If you use a skimmer that has it's own pump (inside the skimmer itself). You can run pipe from the skimmer output, straight to your waterfall.
In the floor of the vault, I'd have a sump, complete with a sump pump (slope the floor of the vault very slightly towards the sump, so that any water on the floor, will drain into it). That way you can make an overflow system to keep the pond level from getting too high during hard rains. When water overflows into this sump, it will be automatically pumped out into the garden, or yard that way. You can also run the vortex chamber drain of the filter, to the sump. That way cleaning your vortex will be as easy as turning off power to your pump and sterilizer. Closing valves before and after your filter and opening the valve for your vortex drain. As you can see, you're going to want to have a lot of valves. You'll want to place a valve at the entrance to the filter. Put one at the output of the filter. Put one after the pump too. After the pump, you're also going to want to install a check valve. Running an external pump dry and letting water back-flow into a pump, are the two quickest ways to ruin a pump. You're also going to thank yourself if you use bulkhead fittings in places that will allow you to remove the pump, the filter and the sterilizer very easily.
There's a reason for all of the recommendations I gave you above. Keep in mind Jwing that that's all they are (my recommendations). I recommend building your pond this way with ease of maintenance, convenience and water quality in mind. Like I said earlier. This is a gravity-fed filter set up. There are other ways to build a pond though. For example. You could go with a pressure-fed filter set up. In a pressure-fed filter set up, the pump is installed before the filter. Water is pumped from the pump into the filter and back into the pond. There are disadvantages to this design that I just don't like. The biggest reason why I don't like pressure-fed filter set ups is the fact that waste has to go through the pump (blender) before the filter has a chance to do anything with it. It's a fact that the smaller a particle is, the harder it will be for the filter to trap it. If you think about it. Would it be easier to get an intact olive out of a glass of water, or an olive that has been through a blender first? See what I mean? Pressure-fed filter set ups are normally easier to install, but do you want to install the easiest system, or the IMHO the best, most effective system?
Before you begin construction though. I'd recommend you do a lot more reading. You're definitely doing the right thing by asking these questions BEFORE you design your pond. There are a lot of design mistakes that will be very hard to correct if you make them. Many wouldn't be evident untill long after the pond is completed.
You're also going to want to read as much as you can about Pond ecology. When your customers get into the question stage, and believe me. They will. You're going to want to be able to correctly answer those questions. It's not enough to just know how to properly build a pond. You also need to know how to deal with algae blooms, string algae and a miriad of other common problems that tend to crop up. By knowing the answers to these questions, you'll give your customers peace of mind. They will be much more confident in your abilites and that in turn will make things much easier for you.
If there are any other questions I can help you with buddy, be sure to let me know. Good luck and be sure to enjoy yourself while you're building it!
06-20-2004, 11:01 AM
The Sequence pump I recommended flows 3600 GPH at 0' of head, but the filter I recommended is rated at 1000 GPH. To dial the flow of the pump down to between 900 and 1000 GPH you're going to need to use the valve after the pump to restrict the flow. Simply use a bucket to determine how much flow you're getting. If you flow water through your filter too fast, the beneficial bacteria in there won't have sufficient time to remove pollutants from the water. This would make your water quality take a nose dive. Remember that a pretty pond isn't necessarily a healthy pond and an unsightly pond isn't automatically a clean one.
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