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craigs lawncare
07-04-2004, 12:38 PM
I have about 250 foot of driveway going to my pole barn. Recently I covered it with about three inches of lime-stone. The weeds are already popping through. What is the best way to control weeds besides spraying.

Some time ago I read a post on Lawn Site that questioned how to keep weeds from growing in the dirt in-field areas of the local baseball field. Someone suggested spreading salt.

Would this work?

Any advice would be appreciated.

Craig

dan deutekom
07-04-2004, 01:56 PM
Yes, salt will work. So will gasoline, diesel fuel and used motor oil. But it is more damaging to the enviroment than Roundup. These home remedies are dangerous.

craigs lawncare
07-04-2004, 07:44 PM
Originally posted by dan deutekom
Yes, salt will work. So will gasoline, diesel fuel and used motor oil. But it is more damaging to the enviroment than Roundup. These home remedies are dangerous.

deutekom, Are there other alternatives to salt and chemical weed killer such as round-up, or is salt my best answer.

Craig

Ric
07-04-2004, 08:55 PM
Originally posted by craigs lawncare
deutekom, Are there other alternatives to salt and chemical weed killer such as round-up, or is salt my best answer.

Craig


Excuse Me for I am in pain right now and I am not in the best of modes.

Craig

Read Dan's post and use you head. Don't keep it where the sun doesn't shine. The man told it will work but was not safe for the environment.

You have been a member here long enough to of hear or read the words Pre-Emerge herbicide. If you are not licensed then hire someone who is, or get down on your hands and knees and pull them by hand. In life you earn more with you head than your back

dan deutekom
07-05-2004, 07:18 AM
Horticultural vinegar. Jury's still out on that one for me. Works but it is $$$$$$ and it dosn't kill perrenial weeds

craigs lawncare
07-05-2004, 01:55 PM
Originally posted by Ric
Excuse Me for I am in pain right now and I am not in the best of modes.

Craig

Read Dan's post and use you head. Don't keep it where the sun doesn't shine. The man told it will work but was not safe for the environment.

You have been a member here long enough to of hear or read the words Pre-Emerge herbicide. If you are not licensed then hire someone who is, or get down on your hands and knees and pull them by hand. In life you earn more with you head than your back

Thanks Ric, LawnSite couldn't operate without friendly members such as yourself giving such kind words of wisdom.

Actually I was looking for a response to what would work for killing the weeds in my driveway.
With respect to Dan Deutekom, he gave me nothing environmentally friendly to use. Neither did you. You gave me nothing but a smart a$$ed answer.
Since you seem to have so much time on your hands to respond negatively to posts, maybe you should take a few classes in typing and english 101. :rolleyes:
Judging by your last post to me, you could use a little help.

Craig :)

craigs lawncare
07-05-2004, 02:06 PM
Originally posted by dan deutekom
Horticultural vinegar. Jury's still out on that one for me. Works but it is $$$$$$ and it dosn't kill perrenial weeds

Thanks Dan for the response.
Are there other ways to kill weeds besides horticultural vinegar?

Thanks!

Craig :)

Ric
07-05-2004, 03:15 PM
Craig

You tree Hugger Kill Me. You won't use Roundup because it is an environmentally safe Pesticide, Yet you will put salt into the water table. Hello this is the 21th century. Pesticides are getting safer for the environment each and everyday. However it is the misuse and not the chemical that causes the problem.

Facts be known, you eat more Pesticide each day on your food. In winter when you eat fresh vegetables they more than likely come from Latin America where Chlordane is used on food crops.

Thanks for the English 101 advice. English is my second Language so I am not as skilled with it. However I do not own a calculator.

BTW My eye is feeling better today but I will see the Doctor tomorrow about it. Thanks for asking.

dan deutekom
07-05-2004, 03:25 PM
Steam machine= gasoline motor for water pump + diesel burner to heat water and a lot of time with poor results. Also small motors and uncontrolled burning of fuels are bad for environment.

Propane infra-red burner=uncontrolled burning of petroleum product (bad for environment) and a lot of time and poor results

I would go with the Round up because it is the safest, most cost effective, efficient and envirometally best way. It also has about a 95% to 100% effective kill with proper use.:D

Chemical dosn't mean bad

woodycrest
07-05-2004, 07:23 PM
However it is the misuse and not the chemical that causes the problem.

MISUSE being the key word here...

i agree, a few shots of round-up aint gonna hurt nuthin', except the weeds.

Or even simpler, just go at them with a weedwhacker once in a while, eventually they weeds will croak. just make sure you wear eye protection!

craigs lawncare
07-05-2004, 08:39 PM
Originally posted by woodycrest
MISUSE being the key word here...

i agree, a few shots of round-up aint gonna hurt nuthin', except the weeds.

Or even simpler, just go at them with a weedwhacker once in a while, eventually they weeds will croak. just make sure you wear eye protection!

Right now I use a mixture of round-up and 2-4-D.
Just thought there might be something better out there that might be more environmentally friendly.
Thanks for the reply.

Craig :)

craigs lawncare
07-05-2004, 09:05 PM
Originally posted by Ric
Craig

You tree Hugger Kill Me.

Thanks for the English 101 advice. English is my second Language so I am not as skilled with it. However I do not own a calculator.



:rolleyes:

I think these two sentences pretty much sum up the level of education we are dealing with here.

EARTH TO RIC. If you can't even use proper sentence structure in your posts, then you should probably take a long hard look in the mirror and shut that thing under your nose before taking cheap shots at other members of this forum.
By the way, I would hardly consider myself a tree hugger, but if I can change a procedure to be more environmentally friendly, than you bet I will do it.
After all, the last time I checked, we were both posting in the organic lawn care forum. :rolleyes:

I guess posting in this forum makes us both tree huggers. :rolleyes:

I really do wish you well... I think.

Craig :rolleyes:

Ric
07-05-2004, 09:19 PM
Craig

The big difference between you and I is. Even with my broken English I have horticulture Knowledge to offer. You on the other hand have many questions. If you don't like my English grammar, put me on your ignore list. BTW My spelling is worst but I have spell check.

woodycrest
07-05-2004, 09:25 PM
Knowledge is KEY!!

hoo gives a dam about speling aneeway?

woodycrest
07-05-2004, 09:27 PM
THe subject here is weeds in a driveway, it is not a spelling bee.

craigs lawncare
07-05-2004, 10:14 PM
Originally posted by Ric
Craig

If you don't like my English grammar, put me on your ignore list.

Comprehension is NOT one of your strong points is it Ric. :rolleyes:
I would actually love to ignore you, but because you hi-jacked the thread I started, ignoring you would be a bit difficult right now wouldn't it. Actually you should take your own advice and ignore my posts if you don't want to answer the question.
What level of education do you have Ric?
I don't mean this to sound rude but did you graduate from high school? Seriously... I don't mean it as a jab.

Craig :D

craigs lawncare
07-05-2004, 10:37 PM
Originally posted by Ric
Excuse Me for I am in pain right now and I am not in the best of modes.

Craig

Read Dan's post and use you head. Don't keep it where the sun doesn't shine. The man told it will work but was not safe for the environment.

You have been a member here long enough to of hear or read the words Pre-Emerge herbicide. If you are not licensed then hire someone who is, or get down on your hands and knees and pull them by hand. In life you earn more with you head than your back

Woodycrest, I think you would agree that Ric's post changed the topic of "weeds in the driveway" to the subject of personal intelligence from the beginning of this thread don't you?
Since Ric's posts have the grammatical structure of a fourth grader, he should shut that thing under his nose and mind his own business, if he does not like the content of a thread.
I think there are a lot of people out there who don't have a deep knowledge of organic weed control methods, but would like to know more about the subject.
After all, thats why some of us are here.
Now, instead of answering my question and helping me and probably many other LS members, Ric chose to belittle someone to float his own ego.

Craig

Ric
07-05-2004, 10:41 PM
Craig

Para tu informacion yo me gradue de escuels major y tambien certificado en agronomia y en justicio criminal. Yo puedo hablar dos idiomas y tu nadamas sabes uno. Pon eso en tu pipa y fuma. Y tu tampoco eres una persona plecente.

craigs lawncare
07-05-2004, 11:42 PM
Originally posted by Ric
Craig

Para tu informacion yo me gradue de escuels major y tambien certificado en agronomia y en justicio criminal. Yo puedo hablar dos idiomas y tu nadamas sabes uno. Pon eso en tu pipa y fuma. Y tu tampoco eres una persona plecente.

Actually, FOR YOUR INFORMATION... I would say you can only fluently speak one and one third languages. The one third being English of course. So, I won't put that in my pipe and smoke it.
Oh, and by the way, I am just a person asking for simple advice on a great site.


:)

Cheers

Craig

cenlo
07-07-2004, 06:43 AM
Horticultural vinegar. Jury's still out on that one for me. Works but it is $$$$$$ and it dosn't kill perennial weeds

I don't understand why you think the vinegar won't kill "all" weeds, (perennial or annual)? I have been spraying diluted vinegar all season and the stuff kills everything it touches!

And........in my opinion "everybody" should stop bashing everyone else on this site and try to keep on topic! I respect the opinions of "all" members (that what it is all about). Increasing customer satisfaction increases your profit!

I do agree that the organic site gets a lot of input for various chemicals. I don't understand why, but that's just me!

Hope everyone has a great year, and thanks for the input, Don

craigs lawncare
07-07-2004, 07:48 AM
Originally posted by cenlo
I don't understand why you think the vinegar won't kill "all" weeds, (perennial or annual)? I have been spraying diluted vinegar all season and the stuff kills everything it touches!

And........in my opinion "everybody" should stop bashing everyone else on this site and try to keep on topic! I respect the opinions of "all" members (that what it is all about). Increasing customer satisfaction increases your profit!

I do agree that the organic site gets a lot of input for various chemicals. I don't understand why, but that's just me!

Hope everyone has a great year, and thanks for the input, Don

Thanks cenlo for adding some CONSTRUCTIVE INPUT to this thread. Yes, posts like this are what makes LawnSite a great place to come to.

Thanks again cenlo.

Craig :) :)

dan deutekom
07-07-2004, 05:12 PM
The vinegar burns off the tops of the perennial weeds but they grow back real fast. It is like when you just pull the top off of a dandelion and don't get the root. With roundup you get a complete kill while the vinegar really just ******s the growth. With repeated applications you will eventually kill perennial weeds but I have found that for established plants it takes quite a few. This is even admitted on the label of horticultural vinegar. I don't remember the exact wording but it lists the annual weeds that it controls and the perennial weeds that it only "slows the development of"

dan deutekom
07-08-2004, 06:05 PM
The word for the perennial weeds is suppression

cenlo
07-09-2004, 06:11 AM
The word for the perennial weeds is suppression

Hey Dan, so are you saying it does kill some? And if not, how could you kill off an area prior to overseeding or sodding? (herbicide free)

Thanks, Don

dan deutekom
07-09-2004, 05:17 PM
Well Don.... that is the problem with the vinegar it only suppresses perennial weeds. If you were persistent and kept spraying every time they sprout back up eventually the root would starve and die. I do not know of any non herbicide way of killing off all of the weeds other than covering the area with black plastic for 3 or 4 weeks and letting the heat of the sun and the lack of light kill off everything. Not a very practical system for a large area. Another way is to rototill the soil and then keep rototilling every time the weeds sprout until all have been killed. Again very labour intensive and time consuming. The reason herbicides were invented was to save time, labour, money and to be able to plant in a clean area in the same season.

Lawn Sharks
07-21-2004, 11:31 PM
The use of Roundup is inappropriate for an Organic Forum. If you wish to learn about the effects of Roundup on freshwater fishes please read the MSD for Roundup.

For weed control consider vinegar (acetic acid) in concentrations high enough to kill the weed.


If you want to talk about Roundup go to the Chemical/Fert forum.

trying 2b organic
07-22-2004, 01:10 AM
Horticultural vinegar works good. You should be able to buy a drum from somewhere. Selling for service I have to use Ecoclear brand vinegear because it is registered. My supplier has cheap larger quantities of no name brand vinegar that you could use.
Cenlo, what ever happend with your franchisor and your decision not to use the 3 way Trillion.
Some of my customers who didnt read my literature want to know why their lawn is not "fixed", I assume you run into the same thing. You can hand pull broadleaf but what do you and the Moose do with clover for the organic customers who expect the same monocrop the traditional guys can deliver.

Also I dont mind if chemicals are discussed in organic thread, I like how we can have an organic forum which discusses best management practices and practical solutions without exclusivity or eliteism. IPM people should feel comfortable here and I welcome thier input.

craigs lawncare
07-24-2004, 11:55 PM
Originally posted by trying 2b organic

Also I dont mind if chemicals are discussed in organic thread, I like how we can have an organic forum which discusses best management practices and practical solutions without exclusivity or eliteism. IPM people should feel comfortable here and I welcome thier input.

I couldn't agree more. :)

Craig

Lawn Sharks
07-25-2004, 11:12 PM
Okay, let's talk Roundup then......

A recent study by eminent oncologists Dr. Leonard Hardell and Dr. Mikael Eriksson of Sweden, has revealed clear links between one of the world’s biggest selling herbicide, glyphosate (commonly known as Roundup, marketed by Monsanto), to non-Hodgkins lymphoma, a form of cancer - NHL. There are even requests for permits for higher residues on genetically engineered foods because they are highly resistant to herbicides, instead of reducing herbicide use, glyphosate resistant crops may result in increased residues. They are already on sale. Farmers knowing that their crop will tolerate or resist being killed off by the herbicides will tend to use them more liberally. There have been no risk/benefit analysis carried out, so the regulatory authorities have failed to implement the precautionary principle with respect to GMOs.
(“Herbicide Tolerance,” New Study Links Monsanto’s Roundup to cancer,” www.biotech-info.net/glyphosate_cancer.html - June 2001)


The Women’s Cancer Resource Center (WCRC) and CHOSE (Coalition for a Healthy Oakland School Environment), showed that chemicals such as Round-Up (glyphosate) can result in reproductive damage as well as damage to the kidney and liver, and some studies show a link between the chemical and cancer.
(Chemical Injury Network, June 2001)


Glyphosate (Roundup) is one of the most toxic herbicides, and is the third most commonly reported cause of pesticide related illness among agricultural workers. Products containing glyphosate also contain other compounds, which can be toxic. Glyphosate is technically extremely difficult to measure in environmental samples, which means that data is often lacking on residue levels in food and the environment, and existent data may not be reliable.
(“Greenpeace Report - Not ready for Roundup: Glyphosate Fact Sheet,” greenpeace.org - April 1997)


Glyphosate is found in weed killers and may cause cardiovascular, gastrointestinal, nerve, and respiratory damage.
(“Special Report: what you need to know about pest control,” Natural Health Magazine, May/June 2001)


Roundup: Label - Keep out of reach of children, harmful if swallowed, avoid contact with eyes or prolonged contact with skin. Remove clothing if contaminated. Spray solutions of this product should be mixed, stored and applied only in stainless steel, aluminum, fiberglass, plastic and plastic-lined steel containers. This product or spray solutions of this product react with such containers and tanks to produce hydrogen gas that may form a highly combustible gas mixture. This gas mixture could flash or explode, causing serious personal injury, if ignited by open flame, spark, welder’s torch, lighted cigarette or other ignition source. Avoid direct applications to any body of water. Do not contaminate water by disposal of waste or cleaning of equipment. Avoid contamination of seed, feed, and foodstuffs. Soak up a small amounts of spill with absorbent clay. Do not reuse container for any other purpose.
(Roundup - Label, farmcentral.com - June 2001)




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Monsano’s advertising campaigns have convinced many people that Roundup is safe, but the facts just don’t support this. Independent scientific studies have shown that Roundup is toxic to earthworms, beneficial insects, birds and mammals, plus it destroys the vegetation on which they depend for food and shelter. Although Monsanto claims that Roundup breaks down into harmless substances, it has been found to be extremely persistent, with residue absorbed by subsequent crops over a year after application. Roundup shows adverse effects in all standard categories of toxicological testing, including medium-term toxicity, long-term toxicity, genetic damage, effects on reproduction, and carcinogenicity.


Studies have shown that Roundup’s active ingredient, glyphosate, made bean plants more susceptible to disease, and reduces the growth of beneficial soil-dwelling mycorrhizal fungi. In rabbits exposed to glyphosate, sperm production was diminished by 50%, and caused genetic damage in the livers and kidneys of mice exposed to the herbicide. Monsano does not have to reveal the precise composition of Roundup.
(“Common Weed Killer (Roundup) Shows Evidence of Environmental and Health Problems,” Organic Gardening, July 2000 - in www.chem-tox.com - 2002)


Good topic for an organic thread. "A little Roundup won't hurt anything". LOL

Ric
07-26-2004, 08:34 AM
Keith

A much older study has shown excessive water can cause death by drowning. I suggest that you stop using water as well as the Roundup.

dan deutekom
07-26-2004, 04:57 PM
Just about everything will cause cancer, birth defects, warts and death if you test it in a lab. All of the lab tests seem to use poor little animals and feed them so much chemical that they don't stand a chance. The label on Horticultural vinegar is even scarier than Round-up and I Know For A Fact that my lungs have been irritated using Vinegar for weed control but never by Round up.

Tree huggers need to get a life. We don't live in the 1700's any more.

Ric is right. We should ban Water. Water Kills and is bad for your health:blob2:

woodycrest
07-26-2004, 07:20 PM
but ..... but, if we ban water we will be unemployed....

i agree 100% water is very dangerous....just ask my daughter...it didnt kill her , just kept oxygen from getting to her brain...the long term affects of inhaling water are significant!

where did the term 'tree hugger ' originate anyway?

dan deutekom
07-26-2004, 07:26 PM
I am not sure but I think it goes back to the Hippie days when people would chain themselves to trees so that they couldn't be bulldozed down to make way for shopping malls and such.

Lawn Sharks
07-26-2004, 08:44 PM
While I don't proclaim myself to be a tree hugger I find it funny that pro-synthetic LCO's would hang out scanning threads in an organic oriented forum trying to intimidate those that are looking for organic solutions to common problems.

I thank Ric and Dan for their educational comments regarding their use of organics. Tomorrow I will switch all of my organic clients to the Scotts 4 Step program. It may be 5 steps now since I am sure the marketing people at Scotts have decided they need yet another stream of revenue. Your comments are educational and within the spirit of this organic thread.

Keth
" A little Roundup never hurts!" (My new slogan)

Ric
07-26-2004, 09:34 PM
Originally posted by woodycrest
where did the term 'tree hugger ' originate anyway?
Woodycrest

As a former flower child I will agree with Dan about Tree Huggers coming from the early 60's. It was however the forests of Northern Calif to Washington that they chained them selves to. Of course then came the Save the Whales. The war in Nam re-directed the social awareness groups to anti war. However after the war, Tree Hugger became a common term for all environmental concern groups. As a week end Flower Child I never got involved with the Tree Hugger movement or the Anti War movement. I did however serve in the Military as a Forward Air Controller. Unlike Bill Clinton I did inhale. :D However that was the 60's a very unique period in the history of modern man.

Originally posted by Keth
While I don't proclaim myself to be a tree hugger I find it funny that pro-synthetic LCO's would hang out scanning threads in an organic oriented forum trying to intimidate those that are looking for organic solutions to common problems.

I thank Ric and Dan for their educational comments regarding their use of organics. Tomorrow I will switch all of my organic clients to the Scotts 4 Step program. It may be 5 steps now since I am sure the marketing people at Scotts have decided they need yet another stream of revenue. Your comments are educational and within the spirit of this organic thread.

Keth
" A little Roundup never hurts!" (My new slogan)


Keth

Organic Fertilizer has its place in modern Horticulture and should be practiced as an other IPM tool. BMP is really what I believe in. BMP is Best Management Practices which goes a step be on IPM. Because it includes preventive chemical applications on area that are know to have problems. Now an ex sample might be an area know to have White Grubs each year. Knowing the life cycles of the Grub and that, they live in wet soil would mean treating the area with Merit. Merit a relative environmental safe pesticide because of it attraction and chemical bond to any organic matter. Plant absorb Merit and it does not leach into ground water etc. As a Certified Pesticide Applicator I do believe in being Environmentally concerned. However WE do live in the 21th Century.

Lawn Sharks
07-26-2004, 09:39 PM
Okay, let's approach this one step at a time. Does Merit kill earthworms. Yes or No are the only available answers.

GreenMonster
07-26-2004, 09:45 PM
Hope I'm not intruding (or coming across as completely stupid) on a subject that seems to have gone a little off-tangent, but back to the original question:

For spot weed treatment in an area like a driveway (no desireable turfgrass in the area) has anyone ever used a propane weedburner for the exact application that it's name implies?

dan deutekom
07-26-2004, 09:56 PM
GreenMonster

The answer is yes, I have. It is impractical. You just burn the top of the weed and then the roots grow back. It takes a lot of heat to kill the root in the soil. Dandelion roots go down as much as 30"! If you don't get it all it comes back twice as strong. Think of natures huge forest fires and how soon the forest regenerates. If you think you are saving the environment think about how much hydrocarbons and carcinogens are created making propane and then burning it in a non emissions controlled device.

craigs lawncare
07-26-2004, 10:01 PM
Originally posted by GreenMonster
Hope I'm not intruding (or coming across as completely stupid) on a subject that seems to have gone a little off-tangent, but back to the original question:

For spot weed treatment in an area like a driveway (no desireable turfgrass in the area) has anyone ever used a propane weedburner for the exact application that it's name implies?

GreenMonster, I have heard of the technique but never seen the results it produces.
By the way. I love your picture on your post. Kind of sums this thread up doesn't it. :D :D

Craig

GreenMonster
07-26-2004, 10:05 PM
Originally posted by dan deutekom
GreenMonster

If you think you are saving the environment think about how much hydrocarbons and carcinogens are created making propane and then burning it in a non emissions controlled device.

truthfully, I didn't think much about it at all. Just sort of jumped into my little mind.

Thought it might be a solution for the unlicensed tree hugger:p

GreenMonster
07-26-2004, 10:06 PM
Originally posted by craigs lawncare
GreenMonster, I have heard of the technique but never seen the results it produces.
By the way. I love your picture on your post. Kind of sums this thread up doesn't it. :D :D

Craig

sums up a lot of lawnsite threads :( :rolleyes:

craigs lawncare
07-26-2004, 10:12 PM
Originally posted by GreenMonster
sums up a lot of lawnsite threads :( :rolleyes:


LMAO ! ! :D :D :D

dan deutekom
07-26-2004, 10:17 PM
Isn't this the whole point. Lively, friendly discussion:D
It sure would be boring if we all agreed!

Lawn Sharks
07-26-2004, 10:18 PM
Well I certainly don't wish to compare an organic discussion with a Yankees/Red Sox game. A post was presented in an Organic Forum not a Pesticide forum and we have people suggesting the use of Merit, Roundup among other things. If you wish to have a non-organic solution I don't begrudge those in other forums but if the question is posted in an Organic forum I don't believe an appropriate response is "try Merit or Roundup, they arent that bad".

Truly, Merit and Roundup are not the worst the synthetic world has to offer but I thought this was an organic thread. If the discussion of using non-organics is appropriate for someone looking for an organic solution than I misunderstood.

K

dan deutekom
07-26-2004, 10:30 PM
Originally posted by Keth
Well I certainly don't wish to compare an organic discussion with a Yankees/Red Sox game. A post was presented in an Organic Forum not a Pesticide forum and we have people suggesting the use of Merit, Roundup among other things. If you wish to have a non-organic solution I don't begrudge those in other forums but if the question is posted in an Organic forum I don't believe an appropriate response is "try Merit or Roundup, they arent that bad".

Truly, Merit and Roundup are not the worst the synthetic world has to offer but I thought this was an organic thread. If the discussion of using non-organics is appropriate for someone looking for an organic solution than I misunderstood.

K

There is always someone who gets bent out of shape when the conversation dosn't go their way.

:cry: a river, build a bridge and get over it

Lawn Sharks
07-27-2004, 06:49 AM
No one bent out of shape here. Enjoying the repartee. But, you never answered my question. Does Merit kill earthworms?

Ric
07-27-2004, 07:07 AM
N0000000000OOOOO

Lawn Sharks
07-27-2004, 07:32 AM
Imidacloprid (Merit) is acutely toxic to earthworms, for example the LC50 (the lethal concentration required to kill 50% of a test population) of the species Eisenia fetida is between 2 and 4 ppm in the soil. While extremely low doses of
0.2ppm and 0.5ppm have been shown to cause deformed sperm and DNA damage respectively.


Zang, Y. et al. 2000. Genotoxicity of two novel pesticides on earthworm, Eisenia foetida. Chemosphere 39:2347-
2356.

cenlo
07-27-2004, 08:01 AM
No one bent out of shape here. Enjoying the repartee. But, you never answered my question. Does Merit kill earthworms

Please be honest with your replies, Ric. Just take a short Internet search and you will find that, yes, Merit kills grubs along with earthworms, fish, birds, etc. (even at small dosages). I understand the IPM approach at believe it may be required in certain applications but please don't think that the " multi million dollar government testing" on these products is that viable!! The government can spend a billion dollars in their sleep! When it comes to chemicals it is all about money! Large companies like Bayer can afford to keep their products "looking" safe. And comparing water to Round-up is ridiculous. I agree with Kieth, this is an organic forum for people looking for organic solutions and has nothing to do with being a "tree hugger". I don't mind input from other guys (even if it is a chemical option) but lets not always take the easy way out!

Again, this is a great site and I love reading the imput from everyone. I use this site as a major resource in my daily practices. (There is always more to learn!):)

Lawn Sharks
07-27-2004, 08:21 AM
Well said Cenlo. If we always believed large corporations it is kinda like using one eye. For the real story one must go to academia for answers to many of these questions. Blowing up two Chevy pickups that were supposed to be "Like a Rock" is a case in point.

woodycrest
07-27-2004, 04:34 PM
So ....
Craig,

are those weeds still growing in the driveway?

craigs lawncare
07-29-2004, 01:06 PM
Originally posted by woodycrest
So ....
Craig,

are those weeds still growing in the driveway?


Yup !!! :D
I was thinking of dumping some group A carcinogens on my drive to kill them... :D :D :D (just kidding of course)
There are a few very knowledgeable individuals in my area that I am going to consult with before I do anything.
I have been using round-up and 2-4-D but want to try something different.


Craig

dylan
08-08-2004, 10:55 PM
Have you got access to a small tractor and a grader blade? Make a few shallow passes to uproot the weeds several times a year. My local township grades the sides of the roads each year and that seems to keep the weeds in the ditches not on the shoulder. I love the smell of diesel fumes in the morning!

craigs lawncare
08-13-2004, 10:05 AM
Originally posted by dylan
Have you got access to a small tractor and a grader blade? Make a few shallow passes to uproot the weeds several times a year. My local township grades the sides of the roads each year and that seems to keep the weeds in the ditches not on the shoulder. I love the smell of diesel fumes in the morning!

Hi Dylan... :)

Yes, this would probably work except earlier this summer I spread a three inch layer of decorative limestone in my driveway. I would have a heck of a mess if I graded it back up to suppress the weeds. If I do decide to avoid chemicals, I would consider using a few tarps to cover up the driveway. My drive is pretty long so it would have to be covered up sections at a time.

Craig:) :) :)