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Bilboy
07-26-2004, 11:24 AM
I just recently purchased a John Deere X485 and can't get any help overriding safety features. Particularly, stepping on the brake shuts off the deck and the seat switch keeps me from adjusting my underwear without doing the same thing. At this rate I'll be replacing the electric clutch about the time the warranty runs out. HELP!

ztrlvr
07-26-2004, 11:48 AM
wear boxers or freeball. Safety switches are very important to you and your loved ones:)

J&R
07-26-2004, 06:10 PM
If i tell you how and you get hurt. I could get sued

CamLand
07-26-2004, 07:21 PM
leave it alone, it's put on the machine for a reason...

cantoo
07-26-2004, 10:21 PM
Sue me, I'm Canadian and our money is worth nothing. To "Test" your safety switches you sometimes need to run a jumper wire across the terminals on plug side to complete the circuit. I have a JD and it's almost impossible to run it unless I put the seat all the way ahead. It appears that the safety switch is too far back in the seat to activate it when I sit in it. I used to run it with a piece of wood under the seat to force me to sit back farther, it was easier to disconnect the switch. This winter I'm going to try to relocate the switch so it works and I can still reach the pedals. I leave the reversing switch hooked up. Maybe JD and others could make the switches adjustable so they work for different body sizes and then they could be left on.

dvmcmrhp52
07-26-2004, 10:26 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by cantoo
[B]Sue me, I'm Canadian and our money is worth nothing.






I am LMAO!:laugh:

specialtylc
07-26-2004, 10:38 PM
Some you can just unplug and others will need a jumper wire.I disconnect the seat switch on all my riders.

Bilboy
07-29-2004, 05:14 PM
OK, OK I know safety switches are there to protect, but cutting out the mower when you step on the brake??? Give me a break!

EastTnLC
07-29-2004, 06:13 PM
All the switch on my WB are all disconnected including the pain in the *** operator presence handle grips.

Rick Jones
07-29-2004, 07:08 PM
This thread reminds me of a guy I used to work for. This was the starting procedure for his walk-behind:

1. Use screwdriver blade to bridge the starter terminals.
2. Once engine starts, quickly pull screwdriver away with enough force to overcome the arc weld that has bonded it to the terminals.
3. Insert jumper wire into OPC wiring harness and start blades.
4. Pray that you don't need the OPC function that day!!

barringtonbrothers
07-29-2004, 07:18 PM
We have a jumper wire given to us by a mechanic at the dealership. woops I bet the owner would have a fit if he knew that one. We used it so we could change th hydro filter and lift it up and let the wheels run with no weight on them. We just left it on there, so far our luck has held.

fixer67
07-29-2004, 11:59 PM
I just put on a new wiring harness ($90) on for a customer who tried bypassing his safety switches and his whole machine went up in flames when it shorted out. I have lost count of the coils I have had to replace because a customer just cut all the wires going to a safety switch and twisted them all together not know that they were sending 12 volts from the battery into the kill lead going to the coil. I am not going to tell any one what to doing with there machines but if you are going to start cutting and splicing wires you had better know what you are doing. When people ask me about how to bypass switches I just tell them that I can not do that because of what may happen. I almost forgot about the man a few years back near here that bypassed the seat switch on his MTD and when he got knock of the thing by a low tree limb he wished he had left it alone. The mower went though the sliding glass door and pushed his big screen TV across the living room. TV was totaled , $3000 TV trashed.

Bilboy
07-30-2004, 12:18 AM
fixer67,
I really do appreciate your input but most of my mowing is on hilly terrain and for JD to shut off my deck when I use the brake is unnacceptable. JD has seen fit to have a reverse shut-off overide but it's useless when you have to stop first

Oldtimer
07-30-2004, 12:45 AM
If a LCO does anything to defeat the interlock system he is just plain stupid and irresponsible. I really don't believe the true professional would alter any safety features on any equipment, however they sometimes allow individual operators to remove the shields from line trimmers.

There is absolutely nothing to gain by attempting to operate equipment with the interlock comprimised.

The person who bypassed the system will be the only one liable for damages if someone is injured or property is destroyed. All professional LCO's understand the risks and potential losses and will always do everything possible to limit their risks.

The statement that went something like "sue me, I'm Canadian" is not a statement one would expect from a professional LCO. If anyone thinks he is smarter than the people who designed the equipment then why isn't he rich instead of trying to make a living mowing grass, using dangerous chemicals and putting up with the problems associated with operating a small business.

We inform our service customers that the interlock system will be operating properly when the equipment leaves our shop. If they don't agree then we don't service the equipment. I will admit we are a bit lax concerning guards on line trimmers and should tighten up.

Oldtimer

Bilboy
07-30-2004, 12:56 AM
No, you should "lighten up"

Envy Lawn Service
07-30-2004, 03:30 AM
John Deere... when will they learn?

I used to run their lawn & garden tractors. What a PITA!!! I was happier and more productive with the Murrays they replaced. I went back.

You could bounce, lean into a hill ect and the seat safety would kill it or make it sputter. The PTO kicks off for everything. You couldn't even back up with the deck running on mine, that is unless you used one hand to hold the button up.

Safety features are for a good reason. But JD just takes it too dang far and the switches are too sensitive.

A jumper wire will take care of the seat. But the rest involving the brake/reverse/PTO I don't know about. I was afraid to mess with that. So I dumped the Deere's... problem solved!

They are nice machines, but the safety system drove me nuts. It slowed me down, I couldn't get anything done. I adapted to it somewhat after a while. But you can just imagine trying to back up, turn the steering one armed while holding the PTO button up. Here and there you would have to let go or forget to hold it up and we all know what happens when it's damp and the deck kicks off on a lawn. COW PIES!

Moral of the story, get adapted, get used to multi-tasking, get used to holding the PTO button up while reversing or putting on the brake... or pay someone knowlegable to re-wire it... or do what I did and get rid of it.

Envy Lawn Service
07-30-2004, 03:32 AM
.

shortgut
07-30-2004, 04:15 AM
we have a New holland TN75 tractor that the seat beeper is screwed up and it beeps almost all the time at 1st we thought that it was because of my light weight but when my boy sat that it was beeping with him to then we knew that it had problems good reason not to trade old stuff for new stuff at least old stuff did not have all the electronics on it

naturescape
07-30-2004, 09:01 AM
DON'T disconnect your safeties.

The more people who do this, the more accidents will happen. Then, we are all going to be paying a lot more for FOOLPROOF, TAMPERPROOF safety systems on mowers.

Envy Lawn Service
07-30-2004, 09:12 AM
I'm telling you guys.... you just don't understand. Safety stuff is all good. But Deere just takes it too far. Think of it like this... imagine if the deck on your ZTR or WB kicked off every time you reversed a wheel...

Bilboy,

Did you try the method I spoke of, holding the PTO up? Try it when applying the brake. Pull it up before you brake and release after you let off the brake. Also, do you have a small yellow button anywhere on the dash? Some of them now have an overide button you can press in rather than holding up the PTO button.

GreenMonster
07-30-2004, 09:32 AM
Originally posted by Envy Lawn Service
You could bounce, lean into a hill ect and the seat safety would kill it or make it sputter. The PTO kicks off for everything. You couldn't even back up with the deck running on mine, that is unless you used one hand to hold the button up.

Safety features are for a good reason. But JD just takes it too dang far and the switches are too sensitive.


Wow. I like Deere's and had an older (90's) LX lawn and garden. Thank God it didn't have that many safety devices then.

I agree that these operator presence safety devices are too sensitive. If I lean forward to adjust the deck height on my grasshopper, it will want to die. Same with bumps. It really can be a bit much.

I do however, think guys are nuts to override the safety on a w/b!

barringtonbrothers
07-30-2004, 10:05 AM
My fathers new deer has that goddamn back up kill switch on it. Its such a pain in the ass to go from my Z to his Deer when Im helping him around his yard. As far as Im concerned if you cant pay attention long enough to back up a mower with the blades running, you have no business on that mower. Im so sick of stupid people making the rest of us live in a bubble. Some idiot got drunk and backed over his kid - sued deer and won- now we all have to suffer cause of idiots like this. Every ones a freaking victim - no one can take responsibility for their own mistakes, so we all pay for them. Ain't the modern world great? If you dont believe me look at your insurance rates.

Bilboy
07-30-2004, 12:13 PM
I've been digesting all these comments about how no one should disconect ANY safety devices on their mowers and I have these thoughts. First: the guy who got knocked off his mower and ruined his TV...trim your dang trees! If he hadn't disconnected his seat safety, it would only have stopped the blades not his mower. He obviously didn't have a hydrostat or it would have stopped on it's own. Second: These safety devices are inspired by lawyers who probably don't mow their own lawns. The person who engineered that device wasn't asked if he thought it was a good idea, he was just told to do it. I'm sick and tired of the worn out liberal message " Well if it saves just one life' If they really believed that we'd all be walking. Power equipment is inherently dangerous and good judgement should be used when operating any of it. If your going to get off your mower then TURN THE BLADES OFF. There's a switch provided for just that purpose. End of rant.

sbvfd592
07-30-2004, 12:45 PM
god this is a thread wow if u dont like it dont buy it

barringtonbrothers
07-30-2004, 03:21 PM
Dont get me wrong. I am really impressed with his john deer. It has a really nice cut, is comfortable and has a really nice liq cooled kawi on it. it has a nicer engine than my Z and its just a lawn tractor. And is very quiet. I just get pissed at the fact its been dumbed down cause of a few stupid greedy morons - and im just talking about lawyers right now :angry: I think this all could be solved by making people take a IQ test before they are allowed to have children. :jester:

burnandreturn
07-30-2004, 04:06 PM
I think Kerry and all the liberals are responsible for the saftety switches. It's just government doing what they always do. They think they can run our lives better than we can. I understand why the manufacturerers put the switches on, they have to protect their butts, but I also know why I disconect them, so my butt can be more productive. There are very few "true" accidents, mostly stupid people doing careless things. I refuse to run my life by the standards set by stupid people. I like the concept of survival of the fittest. Dumbasses should get mulched by their own mowers. The world would be better off!!!!!!!

Oldtimer
07-30-2004, 04:26 PM
This web site will explain everything!


http://jibjab.com/

KCON1
07-30-2004, 04:28 PM
I HAVE A NEW DEERE X485 AND THE REVERSE SAFETY SWITCH IS ALITTLE AGGRAVATING TO GET USED TO BUT BETTER SAFE THAN SORRY AS FOR IT CUTTING THE BLADES OFF WHEN YOU DEPRESS THE BRAKE THA T ISN'T A SAFETY FEATURE ON MINE UNLESS THERE ARE TWO DIFFERENT MODELS YOU MIGHT WANT TO CHECK ON THAT AND WHY WOULD YOU DEPRESS THE BRAKE WHEN YOU TAKE YOUR FOOT OFF OF THE FORWARD OR REVERSE HYDRO PEDALS IT ISN'T GOING TO MOVE UNTIL YOU DEPRESS ONE OR THE OTHER AGAIN NO MATTER WHAT HILL IT IS ON

barringtonbrothers
07-30-2004, 04:29 PM
Thats classic :laugh:

leadarrows
07-30-2004, 07:04 PM
Install a toggle switch instead of a jumper wire and only use it when it is safe to have the safety disabled. Like picking up trash or because of the way you sit not activating the safety. If your going to mow on a hill or an employee is using it throw the switch ...safty is on. Need it off turn it off. Simple and now you have te best of both worlds. There problem solved Who's next? LOL

CapnDean
07-30-2004, 07:25 PM
Common Sense does not prevail.

If you wish to disconnect your safety switches, please do so with the Capn's blessing.

Those switches are there because the manufacturer HAS to put them there or be held liable when some moron does something stupid. For the sake of argument: Imagine that a chap on an exmark backs over someone else's foot with the mower running and whacks up the unlucky fellows foot. In court, the slick lawyer will sue exmark and point out that JOHN DEERE saw fit to put a cut off switch on there mower to prevent that from happening.

BAM: Exmark takes a lick and winds up forking over major bucks for something stupid.

The lawyer gets money, the LCO winds up (ultimately) paying more for any new exmark mower he buys.... Everybody loses except the lawyer and perhaps the victim - -.

Sad but true. SOME safety devices are sensible E.G. can't start mower in gear, but others? Sheesh can't back up and mow? That is stupid.

I say disconnect em. My unit stops if I fall off of it because it's hydrostatic so why do I have to have my fanny on the seat to start it? Another no brainer safety.

Bilboy
07-30-2004, 07:59 PM
I just got back from the JD dealership where we crawled under an X485. There are four wires hooked to a plunger on the brake.
You have to have it enabled to start the tractor & disabled to keep the blades turning when applying the brake. Looks like a test light & a toggle switch are in order.

Envy Lawn Service
07-30-2004, 10:29 PM
Yeah, they get ya both ways there. I guess it completes the starter circuit when depressed on one and completes the circuit for the PTO when it's not. I bet if you unpluged the wire from the plunger and inserted a loop for both wires you would be good to go. PTO would not kick off when you put on the brake and it would start without applying the brake.

By the way, can you mow in reverse?

Also did you opt for the turf tires or those all-trail looking ones?

Oldtimer
07-30-2004, 10:48 PM
The interlock system for homeowner equipment such as the JD X485 is more restrictive than it is for professional equipment. I sell eXmark, Walker and Snapper consumer mowers and the Snapper riders are the only riders with a restriction of backing up with the blades engaged.

Oldtimer

Envy Lawn Service
07-30-2004, 11:22 PM
That's not true for all homeowner equipment though. Safety restrictions on my old Murray is pretty much equal to that of commercial equipment, actually just slightly less. It's just that JD takes it a little far is all.

Also, to many it may not, but machines near the caliber of the X485 qualify a bit higher on the scale than homeowner equipment.

Bilboy
07-30-2004, 11:46 PM
Envy,
JD saw fit to put a reverse shut-off overide on the dash, before you hit the reverse peddle you have to pull up on the PTO engage lever. I think I can get used to it. As for tires, on my previous tractor I had bar type tires plus fluid. On the Deere I went with turf tires & no fluid because of its substantial weight and the lockable rear end & find that it works just fine. The problem with the more aggressive tires was digging a major divet when they did spin. With the turf tires I just get a little grass burn.

Envy Lawn Service
07-31-2004, 12:06 AM
OK, now what all do you use the X-tractor for? Just mowing? What do you mow with it? What size deck? And what sold you on the X485? You have what, atleast 10K invested?

Sooner or later I'm probably going to have to make a purchase somewhere between a garden tractor and a sub-compact tractor.

fixer67
07-31-2004, 12:20 AM
Originally posted by Bilboy
fixer67,
I really do appreciate your input but most of my mowing is on hilly terrain and for JD to shut off my deck when I use the brake is unnacceptable. JD has seen fit to have a reverse shut-off overide but it's useless when you have to stop first

The point of my reply may have been misunderstood. My point was two fold. One, know what you are doing when bypassing safety switches or you could damage your machine. If you do not know for sure how to do it get someone who does. Point number two, take in full account what may happen by doing so.

BmxDirtbag
07-31-2004, 12:36 AM
I've got a JD x485 aws and agree that the toggle to back up with the blades on is a bit ******ed, but this is an issue that is easliy overcome. All it takes is a simple clothes-pin! When you engage the blades, lift the switch into the reverse position and slide the pin underneath... perfect fit. Make sure to use the wooden kind though, I think the plastic ones would be a smidge too wide.

This was actually recomended by the dealer, so I don't find it to be bad at all. I'm all for OPC (and this model is the first one I haven't had trouble with) and they are all intact and in working order on all of my mowers (with the exception of a 15 year old homelite push mower that isn't used anymore).

How many of you guys with ZTR's would be pissed if you couldn't back up a bit with the blades on? Give us JD guys a break:p

Bilboy
07-31-2004, 12:52 AM
Envy,
We have two dealers in our area renowned for service after the sale. One sells JD & the other sells Massey(Simplicity). The JD had fuel injection, liquid cooling, back-up lights(I'm serious)switched power source(CD player, cell phone), a much better seat suspension system, 62" deck(for tighter trimming), better servicability, quick connect system up front. All for about the same price ($8800) plus they had $300 worth of JD accessories free with purchase on top of 0 down, 0 interest, 0 payments for 12 months. So you see, if I unhook all the saftey devices & kill myself before July, 2005 I'm home free!!!

fixer67
07-31-2004, 12:54 AM
Originally posted by naturescape
DON'T disconnect your safeties.

The more people who do this, the more accidents will happen. Then, we are all going to be paying a lot more for FOOLPROOF, TAMPERPROOF safety systems on mowers.

Too late, they already have. There are machines coming out now that use layered interlock systems meaning if you by pass one it messes them all up and you will have to by pass all of them. They have even gone to the point of using a small computer "black box" deal on some machines that make it not possible to just by pass a few switches but the whole machine has to be rewired to get rid of it. The reason for all of this mess is people not taking responsibly for there actions. Like the fat people suing fast food places saying it is there fault that they are fat. When was the last time you seen some one holding a gun to some ones head making them eat a Big Mac? There is a story that I heard about Toro being sued that really started this mess and I e-mail Toro when I heard the story and they said it was true. The story goes that two college students( does not say much for the college) decided to trim the hedges so they thought it would be a good idea to use the lawn mower. There plain was to start it use then pick it up and hold it on top of the hedges and walk down the hedges with one on each side. Well needles to say as soon as they put they hand under the running mower deck they got them chopped up good. They sued and WON Toro saying that there were no warning labels saying not to put there hands under the deck while it was running. Mark my word there will be a day coming when you will have to sign a release form when you buy a hammer saying that if you hit your finger you will not sue the manufacturer or store. The courts awarding stupid law sues is the reason all that safety mess is on the mowers. Suing has became the national pass time in this country. I was at Home Depot about two months back and got my finger smashed between two tool boxes.It was almost worth getting hurt seeing the whole store freaking out scared sh**less I was going to sue them. If you want to blame anyone for this mess blame the courts.

Envy Lawn Service
07-31-2004, 01:07 AM
Originally posted by BmxDirtbag
I've got a JD x485 aws and agree that the toggle to back up with the blades on is a bit ******ed, but this is an issue that is easliy overcome. All it takes is a simple clothes-pin! When you engage the blades, lift the switch into the reverse position and slide the pin underneath... perfect fit. Make sure to use the wooden kind though, I think the plastic ones would be a smidge too wide.

How many of you guys with ZTR's would be pissed if you couldn't back up a bit with the blades on? Give us JD guys a break:p

Clothes-pin, priceless!!! LOL!!! #@%*!!!! Wonder if that would have worked on mine?

The other bold part is exactly what I was trying to say before!!!

Bilboy
07-31-2004, 01:16 AM
BmxDirtbag,
Thanks for the clothes pin tip. Have you figured out how to override the brake/mower deck switch?
Bilboy

BmxDirtbag
07-31-2004, 01:29 AM
To tell you the truth, I've never even thought about it. The only time I ever use the brake is when I'm setting the parking brake, so the blades aren't running anyway. What kind of situations are you getting into where you would need it mowing? If you want/need to stop on a hill light pressure on the reverse pedal is all you need. For me it's easier to hit reverse than the brake anyway.

I think if I got into some panic situation where I'd be stabbing at the brake to stop, I'd most likely want the blades to stop too.

Envy:
I'm pretty sure that a clothes pin would work on any JD that has the big plate you pull up to engage the blades. It might even work on the older ones with the yellow knob.

Envy Lawn Service
07-31-2004, 03:05 AM
Originally posted by BmxDirtbag
To tell you the truth, I've never even thought about it. The only time I ever use the brake is when I'm setting the parking brake, so the blades aren't running anyway. What kind of situations are you getting into where you would need it mowing? If you want/need to stop on a hill light pressure on the reverse pedal is all you need. For me it's easier to hit reverse than the brake anyway.

I think if I got into some panic situation where I'd be stabbing at the brake to stop, I'd most likely want the blades to stop too.

Envy:
I'm pretty sure that a clothes pin would work on any JD that has the big plate you pull up to engage the blades. It might even work on the older ones with the yellow knob.

Same here, don't even know if any of mine had that. Never touched the brakes after starting or before shutting off.

Mine had that yellow knob on the dash, under the steering wheel, a pain to have to hold up by hand...

Envy Lawn Service
07-31-2004, 03:29 AM
Originally posted by Bilboy
Envy,
We have two dealers in our area renowned for service after the sale. One sells JD & the other sells Massey(Simplicity). The JD had fuel injection, liquid cooling, back-up lights(I'm serious)switched power source(CD player, cell phone), a much better seat suspension system, 62" deck(for tighter trimming), better servicability, quick connect system up front. All for about the same price ($8800) plus they had $300 worth of JD accessories free with purchase on top of 0 down, 0 interest, 0 payments for 12 months. So you see, if I unhook all the saftey devices & kill myself before July, 2005 I'm home free!!!
Well now... that's ironic...

Been eyeballing the new Massey 2927 L/C 4x4 60" cut online.
Not sure about price.... 55" turning raidus....ugh!... 32" 2X4...

It's offered in diesel thru Simplicity.

I like the 9mph speed, ACT & diff lock.

But most of all I like the simplicity cut quality. Not to take anything away from any other mower or anything... but they are in a league of their own in total overall cut quality on any terrain.

I could use the utility and small implements, plus the 60" cut. But I can still get diff-lock, 54" cut and a choice of suspended or free float mowing on the next size down. Plus the turn radius is like 18" or so. It would suit most of my needs better than the big one.

I need to get price shopping sometime on the X and others.

Overall though.... I'm just wondering when kubota is going to wake up and stick a Pro Deck under a BX22 w/shorty tires?????? That would be awesome for the money. Full blown mini tractor, commercial grade deck!!!!!!!!!!

Hey they owe me money now if they use my idea (patented)

payup

naturescape
07-31-2004, 08:02 AM
As usual, in this thread is the expected talk of how "liberals" have necessated safety systems. As though a "conservative" never sues someone, SURE.......... "Conservatives" are the first whiners out there.

I bought the parts necessary to reinstall my safety on a used Scag WB I bought years ago, as the prior bonehead LCO had it removed. The slightest slip without a safety can mean life or death! Hydro WBs weigh 600lbs and more, darn right I want a safety on it.

Now I WILL admit some manufacturers go too far with them, or poorly design them, that is a different matter for discussion.

odin
07-31-2004, 10:22 AM
on a walkbehind for instance were a turning rod could come loose and cause it to go crazy ..i want a safty system to.

Some of the reply's im reading here are as stupid as somebody trying to s h i t while they have their ass on a fire plug.