Need Engine Vote

[RhettMan]

I am Buying a new Dixie Chopper, i am getting a xw series 60", and i need a vote on which Engine to get ,got any ideas?

[Edited by RhettMan on 01-08-2001 at 09:21 PM]

[HOMER]

If money ain't an issue I would surely buy the diesel. One of mine has a 22 Kohler and the other has the dreaded 25 Kohler, neither of which has given me any trouble.

That deeeeeeeezzzzzzzzzzeeellllllllllll is bad though!!!!!!!!!:D

[lawrence stone]

What size deck?

[Eric ELM]

My first choice is the 26 HP Yanmar diesel, second choice would be a 24 HP Honda, and the third choice would be the 23 HP Kohler

[Ricky]

I have a diesel and I love it. The diesel should pay for itself in fuel savings alone and should outlast the gas engines. Mine burns 3/4 of a gal. of fuel per hour. Plenty of power, I have cut grass that should have been cut with a bush hog with no problem.

[John DiMartino]

Get the new 24hp honda ,the deisel is nice,but its really loud,(wouldnt bother me,but neighbors and customers wouldnt like it)and very rear heavy,trim capabilitys aret quite as good as he narrower gas models.The diesel has a 64" track width with a 60" cut,so the deck will go thru a tight spot ,but you'll get stuck on the wheels.trimming isnt to good like that either.They needed to make it that wide,so the wheel motors could clear the oil pan on the diesel.If your doing open area's mostly,by all means buy the diesel.Do not under any circumstances buy the 25Hp kohler.I would take the 23 kawi,23 kohler in that order after the honda.I have the Kohler 25,big,big mistake.its a clattering fool,lifters start tapping like crazy at least twice a week,,and has a low power problem,head gaskets blew, drinks way to much oil for having 170 hrs on it.another thing,my diesels start better in the cold than this thing,its very hard to crank over,and even when it does,it wont fire right up,itll run on one cyl for about 5 minutes,then clear out.All these things are normal too,says Kohler and the dealer.Ive got the "good" updated one too,the one with all the problems fixed. LOL

[guntruck]

John your scaring me again about the 25 horror stories(lol). My new updated one has been peeeeerfect so far but still very new, im just praying. Just wanted to say though honda motors are so so excellent quiet very dependable and much power, excellent choice.

[Davis TLC]

I'd go with the diesel as first choice. Second choice would be the Honda, the the 23 Hp Kohler. I have the 25 Kohler which has been trouble free so far. The diesel will pay for itself in the fuel savings, plus it has higher torque reserve than the gas engines.

[turfquip]

Interesting point John made about the heaviness of the diesel. By the way John congrats for achieving the 1000th post.

Since I am considering a 72" chopper, definately a diesel, possibly the big one, I am wondering about weight distribution especially on hills.

Eric or anyone else, what should I keep in mind when making the decision with regards to overall weight as far as performance/handling?

Will the 50 HP diesel be too heavy for some applications? I need complete flexibility to mow anything, anytime (within reason). Too heavy for say, athletic field use?

[Eric ELM]

Ed, first of all, John tested an older diesel Chopper that wasn't balanced like the new models. The 2001 like I have, has a solid bar steel front piece on the front of the frame and a solid rod bumper for extra front wieght to counter balance. My machine weighs less than some other MFG's gas model. I have not had any problem with any hills on any properties I have. It is as stable as my gas Chopper. Don't take my word for it, demo them and see for yourself.

If you rev it all the way up and push the levers forward, you can bring the front end off the ground, but the torque of that engine is unreal. I also can do this same thing with the gas engine. I tested an older Diesel Chopper and it was lighter on the front and did have a problem on hills compared to the 2001. The 72" has a heavier deck on it and should be even more stable, but I haven't tested one. Check them out and decide for yourself. Most dealers will let you take them out on your properties to see how they perform and that would be the best thing for you to do.

As far as noisy, I've never had a customer complain. I have had them say that they was surprised that it was as quiet as it is for a diesel. Once I rev them double blades up, that's about all I hear and with my hearing protectors in place, that FM stereo is about all I hear.

The economy of the diesel is great. The 60" holds 9 gallon of fuel which is 12 hours of fuel on board and the 50 HP has 12 gallons on board.

Chris from Norcott Inc in Maine bought 2 of the 72" 26HP Choppers last spring to do sports fields and likes his. I hope this helps Ed. Do the demo thing and then you will know.

[John DiMartino]

Eric i didnt mean to sway anyone away fro mthe diesel,I love Yanmars especially,but it is very rear heavy,the machine i demo'd was the exact same as yours,in wheelbase width ,and size,the only difference is yours has about 30 lbs more on the front end.I can tell you from having the weight kit on mine with the bagger 30 lbs isnt even noticable,that is a rear heavy machine,doesnt make it a bad machine,just one that needs to be treated with respect as to hills and such.I think the diesel is a grea choice for open area's ,i wsh i had bought one,when i was looking they wanted sticker for it,and it is nice,but certainly ,no 60" rotary mower is worth 13K,just to much for that 5 ft cut.

[Eric ELM]

It all depends on how long you plan to keep a machine like this. If you are going to trade them off after 2 years, they probably aren't worth the extra money, but if you plan on keeping it for many years and getting the full benifits of a diesel, they will save you enough on fuel alone to about pay for it, plus the engines if taken care of can outlast more than one gas engine. After using my gas engined Chopper for 6 years, I already know the longevity of the hydros and spindles, so all I needed was an engine with longevity for what I figure is a great combinatoin. I already know that the Yanmar has that since I have one in my 10 year old JD 430. I'm not saying a diesel is for everyone, but for me, it's the perfect combo I feel. If any ZTR has a problem on hills, it's not a big deal to put suitcase weights on the front to hold them down. I've never had to, but I could if I needed to. I don't see a big problem with a diesel and I'm very satisfied with mine. If I had it to do over, I would still get a diesel.

[turfquip]

Now all this talk about weight distribution has me rethinking a chopper purchase. Nothing against chopper or Eric but wonder if the engineering is 'cutting edge'.

I don't know, something inside of me cringes when I consider having to bolt on a weight bar or some other bandaid type fix to conteract a lack of forethought.

I agree, I need to go test one but wondering now if a Lazer 72" w/27 HP LC Kawasaki might be a better engineered product overall.

I got what I believe to be a great price at 9,100.

[bob]

Thats easy. If you like diesel get the Yanmar. If you perfer gas get the Honda.

[Ricky]

My Chopper is a '99 model. That is the one that had the hollow front bumper. When I first got it, I had some concerns about the front end being a little light. I thought that I could pull the caps off of the bumper and pour in some lead shot that I have for reloading shotgun shells. I live on a very steep hill and can pull the front wheels if i'm not careful (But I could do the same thing with my 12 hp. Dixon). After a few hours experience and getting used to the extra power of the engine and the responsiveness of the control levers, I didn't see any need, although that is still an option. I think that I could get at least 2 bags of lead shot in the bumper that would be 50# at least. John is probably right about the track width, I don't know, I do know that the tires don't stick out past the mowing deck. The cutting width is 60" but the deck is always wider than the cut on any mower. As for the weight they are heavy. I checked that too. Mine weighed 70# more than a Exmark, but the Exmark wasn't liquid cooled. These commercial machines are very powerful and heavy and should be respected no mater what you purchase.

[Eric ELM]

2 of us that have posted here have the diesel. We both like them, another 2 that have posted here I have met. I watched them demo a diesel in Nashville and they have both said they are getting one some day. I watched them test it on hills in Tennessee and so did I. It was the older one that isn't as stable as the new one I have. We had no problems at all, but I could tell the older model was lighter in the front than my 2001 model. As I said in the above post, any mower with at least 20 HP or more and is a ZTR, I can make it do wheelies. I have had no problem with mine on hills, but go demo them your self. I sure wouldn't buy one without demoing them. At least you can make up your own mind what you like best. You might like the Exmark best, but you won't know until you try them.

[Mark]

Eric do you think that the yanmar 2v78v vertical shaft is enough power to cut well? It comes in ratings from 16.1 to 20hp, that generates 2800to3600 rpms. A local dealer told me the 20 would work just fine, what are the rpms on your 26? Just courious. I agree i do like the kawasaki, and i have a Robin thats bullet proof, I also like the Briggs&Stratton Vangards Ive been running a 16hp on a walkbehind now for 7yr with no prob==just normal maintance. I to have the dreaded 25hp Kholer, but so far no problems at 276hrs,but im praying that it gives me manymore hrs.

[Eric ELM]

Mark, from what I've heard, the 20 HP Yanmar verticle shaft engine is supposed to be a good one. I talked to a guy at DC when I went on the factory tour, that had taken the prototype home and used it.

They don't put a tach on the diesel machine, just an hour meter. From what I have heard, the RPM's are set at 3750 on the 26 HP Yanmar for Dixie Chopper at the Yanmar factory to get the blade tip speed up there. I'm not sure if this was done before they went to a bigger pulley on the mule drive to increase the blade speed or not. I do know that the blades are spinning at the maximum on the diesel. I have started up the blades on the 22 HP gas engined Chopper and wound them up to 3750 rpm's and then did the same on the diesel. I have to back the diesel off a bit to have the blades harmonic's sound the same on the two.

I do know the cut of the diesel is much better than the older one, but I think it has to do with the new design of the new decks. I am going to weld the same baffle system in the old deck to improve it too.

[bdemir]

Eric,


Where can you get baffles for a better cut. Or would you move them around or what would you do. My older deck cuts terrible. Can i get them through dixie Chopper?


Bedros

[weve]

I also have a 60" Dixie Chopper with the 26HP Yanmar engine.It's a 2000 year model with the solid front bumper. I have had no problems with the extra weight or the weight distribution. My previous Choppers had the 25HP and 22hp Kohler Command,and the 20HP Kohler Magnum (all on 60 inch decks). Rainfall the past two seasons in central Illinois was about the same. On one job,(a health clinic on two acres), the 26HP Yanmar averaged 8 percent less time per mowing than the 25HP Kohler for first half of each season. It also used 1/3 less fuel.

[Eric ELM]

Bdemir, the extra piece that the new decks have is on the right side of each blade that is just a small piece of metal bent in a 90 degree angle and welded to the deck. I would just go to a dealer and look at a new deck. This is the only thing I can see different from my old deck and what a difference it makes.

If your dealer is to far away to go to, I'll take a picture when I get the Choppers out so you can see it. You could just buy some 1/4 X 1.5" flat stock and make your own. I think that is about the size of it. I will let you know more if you need more info.