Walker Engines

[Mike Felices]

I am purchasing a new Walker in February. I am located in north Georgia and wanted to know which engine would be the best. 26hp EFI Kohler
24.5hp Gasoline LC Kubota
20.9hp Diesel Kubota
I am still trying to decide whether to run the 42" GHS deck or the 48" GHS deck. Any opinions and/or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

[landscaper3]

We have a 20hp Kohler 1996, 25hp Kohler 1998 and a 26EFI 2001, all GHS models all are great professional machines, my preference is the 26EFI. I love these machines you can clean and sharpen blades in minutes due to tilt up deck, you can change decks in less then 2 minutes and much more options like tail locks, power dumps and more good choice in machines, Go with the 26EFI!!

[Fantasy Lawns]

I agree I have a 25 Kohler on a 98 model ..... but that EFI is the way to go (fuel savings)....I can't say on the diesel but it would seem unless you have a diesel truck the effort might be more than need ..... I like the 42" GHS as that is what I have on 2 mowers ..... small enough to use on most of my jobs that require high quality work ... but I also have other decks to switch with .....God I love my Walker

[BUSHMASTER]

Go with the kubota..............more hours of life,water cooled,more power/tourqe/ and in my opion more reliable than an air cooled.

[Indiana]

Where in north Georgia are you?

I in Murphy, NC just across the state line.

I run a Walker C with a 42"

I would go with the Walker T (20HP) gas and a 48" deck if money is tight. If not, the 26EFI with a 48" the best way to go.

Do you go through any chain link gates? I did for a while and really liked the 42" for that. Now I don't so the 48" would suit me best. 48" is also the size of my walk behind so the stripe would be the same size.

Let me know if what your dealer has priced it as. I know I got a price for a 26EFI at about $8800 new.

[Cleve]

I have a 95' with the diesel. Back then I believe it was rated around 16hp. This one has the 42" deck and is a great machine. I cannot complain at all. About the only thing I miss is the ability to tilt up the deck. They added that feature a year or two after I purchased mine. The only costs since new has been belts and one idler pulley replaced. I change the oil, filter and fuel filter on a regular basis and mow grass. I also like the 42" deck and have only wished I had a 48" on a few occasions. The 42" will go through most gates and that is important. There are many yards where we don't even unload the small mowers.
Cleve....

[Mike Felices]

I only have 1 gate that the 42" would be useful for, otherwise the 48" would fit inside all of my gates. How much maintenance is there on a Diesel? How hard is the maintenance on the Diesel?

[Cleve]

When I got my Walker, I only had one gate that the 42" would fit. But now I have more. A 48" would have cost me quite a few jobs. I would rather get the smaller deck and be able to do all. You can always travel a little faster anyway. I also feel that a 42" gives a little better flat cut without scalping that might occur with the bigger deck.
As far as maintenance, little is required. Just keep the oil and filter changed on a regular basis. Remember, no ignition, no sparkplugs, no carb. My engine has required no repair or maintenance other than the above since new in 1995.
You are going to pay more for the diesel engine but can expect a long and reliable life from it.
Cleve....

[LJ lawn]

i just talked in length to my mechanic today about the EFI kohler engines.this is the deal- IT'S TOO NEW OF A SYSTEM. basically they still haven't gotten the bugs worked out yet.the engine doesn't have a mass air flow sensor and they didn't put the exhaust temp sensors to read each cylinder, they only put it near the muffler.so the computer doesn't know which cylinder is burning lean or not.this dealer spoke of a fellow dealer in the area who got in the new EFI Kohler in an EXMARK z they had a problem with it that they could'nt figure out and Kohler couldn't either so they actually sent the machine back. apparently Kohler has cut some jobs so there is very little dealer support on that end regarding the EFI engines.i would do some serious research before i spent any money on a EFI engine.personally,if i were to buy new, i would buy either the liquid cooled gas or diesel engine.

[Mike Felices]

OK, I will probably go with the Kubota engine now. The question is the LC gasoline or the Diesel engine? Is it really worth the $500 extra for the Diesel over the LC? I have 4 yards with gates. The 42" would fit through 3 of them, and the other one has to be push mowed. The 48" would fit through 2 gated yards, one would be pushed and the other I could get into if I was able to angle the deck up, and drive with the deck angle up around the side of the yard. This way I could get into the back yard with out going through the gate. Only part of the back yard is fenced in. The fenced in part would only take about 2 min. to mow with a push mower. I am starting to think that the 48" would end up being more productive and better in the long run. Has anyone had any problems at all from the Kubota engines?

[Edited by Mike Felices on 01-11-2001 at 06:38 PM]

[LJ lawn]

i haven't experienced any major problems yet with the diesel.i have the d600 16 hp model.you just have to make sure all your filters are clean.i bought mine used. 93 model.so far i have replaced the starter (twice),altenator,voltage regulator,battery,fuel pump.upgraded it with a new 42" flip up deck,speed up kit,and a larger fuel tank.i plan to get the lower pulley on the engine replaced within the next couple of weeks.if you want to conserve on fuel go with the diesel.i used to have a walker with the 20 hp kohler as a backup and i couldn't believe what a pig on gas it was,so i sold it.have you seen the walker website? check out the Walker Talk magazine.

[AB Lawn Care]

Go with either the 24.5 Kabota or the 26 Kohler FI.I Have owned a 11hp,16.5 deisel and 20hp kohler.The 16.5 deisel kabota crapped out at 900hrs.In fact a piston blew.I personally love the 24.5 kabota gas.I have rented them a few times in the past and Man is that a nice engine!!!!If I where you I would take the 24.5 kabota becouse it is water cooled and has a engine life of 5000hrs!!!!!!Take it man!!!!

[Mike Felices]

Here is what I got for pricing from the local dealer. Tell me what you think.

Kubota LC (gas) w/ 48" GHS and 9.5bu hopper $10,286
Kubota Diesel w/ 48" GHS and 9.5 bu hopper $10,244

Are these prices in line or are they cheaper or more expensive than other places? I am thinking about getting the LC (gas) because my properties are smaller and the mower would be turned on and off constantly. It will only run for 10min to 45 min at the and then be turned off, moved to the next job only 30 seconds to 3 min apart and then started back up. Would this hurt the Diesel engine? Or would it be worth getting the Diesel and hust let it idle on the trailer between jobs?

[LJ lawn]

i don't think it would hurt anything,(diesel). only might wear your starter out. this might have caused mine to fail but i think it was the heat buildup that cooked mine.i leave mine running on the trailer some days when it's real cold out.mine takes a while to start when it's cold.what is the torque rating on that l.c. gas engine compared to the diesel?i couldn't believe my little 16hp mowed through some seriously high grass without a problem,stuff that made the 20hp gas job stall out.damn,10 g's for a mower! sure you don't want to find a good used one for half the cost?do you guys down there usually collect the grass?

[southside]

I like the 26 efi motor. Been very strong and economical.

[Mike Felices]

I like to buy new equipment. The torque rating on the LC (gas) is 38.3ft-lbs @2500 rpm, the Diesel is 34 ft-lbs @2600 rpm. We usually bag Bermuda a Zoysia grass, but the Fescue just get mulched.

[Cleve]

Back in 1995, I paid almost that much for my Walker with the diesel and a 42" deck. So, I think you have a good price. And you get the tilt up decks and a bigger collector (along with some other goodies I wish I had).
You might want to see if the dealer will throw in the "curb hopper" that Walker has as an option. Just a wedge that allows you to climb over curbs and will store on the deck when not in use. Handy little gadget. Also see if you can get a copy of their video. It does give some help in learning operation of the controls.
By the way, When jobs are only a short drive away from each other I don't see why you couldn't just leave the engine running. I don't, but only because the engine starts so easily after being used for a while.
Cleve....

[AB Lawn Care]

Agian I would go for the Gas kabota.I say that becouse I owned the 16.5 Diesel and have used the 24.5 kabota gas and the Gas is much better!!!!!The gas engine has massive power purrs like a kitten,super quiet(great for early morning work in residential areas),no deisel smoke and smell.As far as engine life goes I think the diesel version will be the same if not less than the gas.An other thing I like about running gas engines is that you don't need seprate gas cans for the walker and if you spill any diesel fuel on yourself it really smells.Also from what my dealer has told me(Ontario's largest walker dealer)the deisel engines have a weak starter in them.When I owned my little deisel I hated having to idle the machine down for 30+ seconds before shuting it down.Don't get me wrong diesels are great for commercial cutting,but I feel that the gas is a much better choice.

[pcs]

Who is ontario's largest walker dealer?

[Mike Felices]

How fuel efficient is the LC (gas) Kubota? How come everyone has had to replace the starter? I think the LC (gas) might be better, but the Diesel will have a better resale value. The Diesel mowers are like Diesel trucks, they are built to be run for long periods of time, not short intervals. The Diesel would work better if I just let it idle on the trailer between jobs. How hard is the maintenance on the Diesel? Are the Diesel engines more complicated to work on than the LC (gas) engines?

[John DiMartino]

I had 2 kubota 16.5's too,the are one of the worst diesels ever made,absolutely gutless,and very hard to start.Most other diesels blow them away.If that is your only diesel you had,i dont blame you for wanting the gas engine.Most diesels that stay around 3000rpm's max get double the fuel economy of a gasser at 3600,but make same power and a lot more torque,they weigh more though.If price was reasonble id buy the 20.9 diesel.

[Edited by John DiMartino on 01-14-2001 at 02:35 PM]

[Cleve]

My, My, John, I don't know where you got your disels or how you treated them, but my walker with the 16.5 Kubota has done just fine since new (actually made in 94'). I believe with correct maint. a diesel will run years with nothing more than oil and filter changes. Never had problem starting. I know I have started it after sitting in less than 30 deg. weather and never had problems with the starter. And I get NO smoke or diesel smell when running.
I believe the newer Walkers also have a little larger fuel tank and the thing probably will run just about all day after filling. And I have yet to run into anything that would tend to bog down the 42" cut at any speed. The only problem I have is filling up the catcher too quickly. Although on most residential yards (4--5k sq ft),you will find that you probably can do a couple of them before having to empty the catcher. Just love it when leaves are down. Best mulch you ever saw. Walker seems to grind them down into small pieces. Cleve....

[John DiMartino]

My 16.5's were the ZB600C twin cyl.They are garbage,i changed oil+filters at 50 hrs-the yrecommended 100,the machine had top notch maintance,the were on greensmowers which gety much better maintance than your lawn mowing equipment.The one had low compression by 1400 hrs,and they doth wept oil from every seal by then too,as you know you cannot have a leaky engine and go on greens,the engines have to be tip top,and i always had one apart resealing something.The radiators went on the 89 at 600 hrs-cost over 600 bucks.I have several deisels,I know how th treat them and they all run great,I traded those junkers in this yr.

[AB Lawn Care]

My 16.5 Kabota diesel was trouble prone too.I bought it when It had about 900hrs on it.It worked great no problems.But once the winter hit it started to fall apart.It was smoking like crazy,to the point that we where almost barfing in the snow banks.We took it to our local kabota dealer.They replaced all 3 injectors as well as the glow plugs.Also the starter went,so that was replaced as well.A short time later we had a kabota that was smoking(still) and a $900 bill.Diesel parts cost $$$$$$.We realized that with the amount of money we put into that thing we could have been paying the same amount of money on a new model in lease payments.So we went and bought a 20hp kohler Walker.We traded in the old walker in on the lease and found out a while later from our dealer that the guy who bought it had a hole pile of problems with that engine.They took the engine apart and a piston fell right out!!!!

I have decided I don't want the hassle of a diesel engine anymore and will only buy gas from now on.Yes diesel engines can be rebuilt over and over agian,but it will cost you big bucks!!!!!Up here in canada to rebuild a deisel engine it will cost you $3000.I could go and buy a new 20hp engine for that price!Sorry but I won't touch a diesel agian.

PCS-Kitchner Tractor is.They have the most sales in ontario.Ask Cantoo he knows what I mean when I say they are the best dealer out there.They have just about any part for your walker in there parts selection.No wait a few days garbage!!!They actually may be canada's largest dealer,I'm not shure.

[Cleve]

The engines on the Walkers are three cylinder engines. I have no idea about the ones you had. So, probably shouldn't be comparing apples to oranges either.
Your greens are no more important than my customer's yards either. And there is no way your machines are getting any better maintenance than my machines.
I spent many years in a heavy industrial plant and know from experience that most failures of equipment end up being from "lack of proper maintenance". Soooo.... Take it John.;)
Cleve....

[accuratelawn]

Not an engine comment!
Some are trying to make a choice between a 42 and 48 inch deck. Can a Walker be driven without a deck installed?
If so why not buy the 48 inch deck. For the tight gates remove the deck, slidethe deck through the gate and reinstall on the other side. Might be a pain, but why be limited at a 42 inch deck for all your accounts?

[Cleve]

Good suggestion.
Except with one like I have. My Walker has the square shaft to drive the deck. Gets kinda tough for one person to put back on. I do believe the newer units have a splined drive shaft and that would have to be much easier. It still might be hard for one peraon to handle the deck on anything but hard surfaces (moving it around might be hard on the ground). Just my opinion but would like to hear from folks that have the newer units.
Cleve....

[cantoo]

The reason my starter went on my diesel was a wiring problem, it fried and kept power to the starter until it melted.
Kitchener Tractor is one of the best dealers that I found before I bought my newest Walker, I went to all the dealers in a 100 mile radius and asked to go into their repair shops. The mechanics knew what they were talking about and had the parts to repair almost anything in stock. Another sign of how good a dealer they are is that the guys who were there getting repairs or spare parts were from all over the place. I actually drive by two other dealers to go to Kitchener Tractor. Another dealer who I found about after I bought was Compact Sod, they also sell lots of Walkers but I have never been there yet to see the shop. They were also a little more expensive than Kitchener Tractor.
The newer models have splined shafts but the square ones aren't too bad to put together by yourself, just put some red paint on the matching parts of the splines to make lining up easier.
As for going thru small gates if the 42" deck will go straight thru than you can get the 48" thru by aproaching the gate from the side and making a right hand turn kepping the front drive wheel tight to the edge of the gate. It's just like getting a easy boy chair thru a tight door.

[LJ lawn]

do you think the time spent making one or two extra passes on a lawn is less aggravation than not being able to fit through a gate? i do.i took my 48" deck off and put on the new 42" just so i would have a more useable machine.ok so it takes an extra minute or two to make the extra pass,but now i have a machine that fits on smaller lawns,and fits better on my trailer.ever get a lawn that has a small front yard but has a big back yard and has a 42"-44" gate? using a smaller (36") walk behind just wasn't productive (time=money).if i need speed or a wider cut on the bigger lawns i do it with my z rider.

[Mike Felices]

I talked to the mechanic up at the dealer's today. He said Diesel engines are made to run for long periods of time, the longer you run it the better.

[Mike Felices]

I am going to pick up a 2001 Model MD with the 20.9hp Diesel engine, 9.5bu hopper, and a 48" GHS deck on February 7th at Pro-Day. His regular price is $10,244. I should be able to get this mower dirt cheap Pro-Day with another $400 - $500 off.

[AB Lawn Care]

NOOOOOOO!!!!!Just kidding!I think you will do just fine with your diesel,I hope so anyways!Let us know how it goes!Maby the 20.5 diesel kabota is better built then the 16.5.If not LOOK OUT!!!!!

[Cleve]

Mike, congratulations and good choice in mowers. I have enjoyed this post and going back and forth with some of the other folks. You won't regret getting the diesel that Walker uses. It will serve you well for many years.
I notice from your profile that you are 15. I'm glad to see someone your age doing so well. You sound like you know what you are doing and will profit from that. Treat your customers well and you will be turning down business. :)
By the way, who is your dealer? And what part of GA are you in, N, S, Mid? Just curious. I have to drive a little ways to get to mine and am always looking for new suppliers. Thanks,
Cleve....

[John DiMartino]

Cleve,my greens are no more important than a customers lawn?Whatever dude,you have no clue as to how or what goes into maintaining or building a green then.I spend more money on 1 acre of greens each year than on the 135 acres around them.If they were no more important and difficult,every one would have a pratice green in their back yard.You can get away with oil seaping on a lawnmower,a hydralic line blowing is just a nuisance,on a green a blown hydro line means thousands in damage and downtime.

[bob]

I've got 2 of the Kubota 24.5hp engines on my Grasshoppers. Never had any kind on engine trouble. As for deck size, get the biggest one that will fit your needs.

[Cleve]

Originally posted by John DiMartino
Cleve,my greens are no more important than a customers lawn?Whatever dude,you have no clue as to how or what goes into maintaining or building a green then.I spend more money on 1 acre of greens each year than on the 135 acres around them.If they were no more important and difficult,every one would have a pratice green in their back yard.You can get away with oil seaping on a lawnmower,a hydralic line blowing is just a nuisance,on a green a blown hydro line means thousands in damage and downtime.

John, what makes you think I have no idea as to keeping up greens? I don't believe I made any reference to that. I simply said that my customers lawns are just as important as your greens. And I said that your equipment maintenance could not be any better than mine. I stand by both statements. Why try to make anyone else look bad? And I don't tolerate any spills on my customers lawns. They don't, because it will kill the grass. I hold myself responsible for how these lawns look and always work to make them look better than their neighbors. (WHATEVER DUDE, I think you are the one that doesn't have a clue).:confused:

Cleve....

[Mike Felices]

Cleve, I am in North GA, about 1 hr north of Atlanta. My dealer is Bell's Ferry Ace Hardware in Woodstock, GA. They are the largest Walker dealer in the South East.

[scottdclark]

Guys -

Just thought I'd offer up one suggestion to the diesel owners out there: it's a misconception that you can leave a diesel idling all day long.

Especially later model, Direct Injection diesels. The engines are so efficient that, when idling for more than a few minutes, the combustion chamber temps decrease - thus not burning the fule completely... then the unburned fuel scratches the cylinder walls, and this causes loss of compression.

I know, I know - you hear trucks at the rest area idling for 8 hours at a time - being a Cummins owner, ther is a lot of debate on the newsgroups about this. But Cummins recommends idling no ore than 5 minutes on the ISB engine, and in my Kubota manual it had a small blurb about not idling too long, or idling at 1000+ RPM for longer periods to keep combustion temps up.

Maybe this is why some of them are having problems with smoking. Me, I got 4200 hrs. from a Kubota B7200 (late eighties model) before I sold it. It wasn't burning a drop of oil, or smoking, and I only had to replace a radiator hose and voltage regulator (and alternator) in the 10 years I owned it...

-Scott

[hoagie]

I have a neat little trick that will fit a 48" deck through a 44" gate, IF there is enough room on either side of the opening!

Very simple. Flip the deck up and pull in perpendicular to the opening, put one side of the deck in first then the other. This trick has saved me quite a few passes w/ a 21.