haven't got started yet..need help

[pbillings]

Hi. My name is Paul. I am a Police Officer now and have had it with the politics and the B.S. that goes along with nowdays Departments...Anyway, I have always enjoyed working outside on lawns since I was 12 years old and had a k-mart pushmower and had approx. 8 to 10 yards a week. I've been kicking the idea of a lawncare business for years. Now, I think i finally am gonna do it in late winter early spring. My wife thinks it's a good idea also. I am just scared to death to give up my career and fail. I just need help on how to start it. Where to get low priced equipment (for now). How to get ccustomers. Etc. I've spoke with many lawncare owners and what they tell me sounds good and I know there wouldn't be a problem with the work. It's just getting started that worries me.....I would appreciate any ideas or comments on this matter.........

[Green Care]

Welcome to forum Paul I would go as a partimer first to see how things workout.

For equipment check the paper lawnsite ebay and others.

[boxoffire]

Hi Paul, I'm Adam and I'm kicking the idea around also. So much so that I've gone and gotten a license and just called about liability insurance. I made about 400 flyers for fall leaf and debris cleanup and have been selectively throwing them in people's drivesays in freezer baggies with small rock inside to keep them from blowing away. Just met a nice guy to make me some magnetic signs for my jeep and trailer. I only have a JD tractor and push mower and weed eater/blower with assorted yard tools right now, but I think enough to get started. Problem is it's kinda late in season now, but maybe it's better that way. Start slow and learn! Luckily I have that luxary staying with me mom and taking care of her some after her heart surgery. Anyway, people have told me starting out is scary because you may not get many customers early on and will take some time to build them up because you have to get your name out there and network a bit. I've thought about a yellow page ad for next spring but I need to decide by mid October because that's the deadline around here for getting one in on time. Saleslady told me a one liner with name/number is a big waste of money and reccommends I buy a larger ad for obviously larger amounts of money. Can't justify it just yet and is making it a tough call on me. Think I'll call some 1 liners from the yellow pages and ask if it's made any difference for them. I made some business cards on my home computer with supplies from office max. I already had a printer. Also made the flyers myself and saved money there too. I have 0, no clients as of yet. I too think I want to work outside since I've been inside dealing with the politics too for almost 20 years. Don't know if it would be the smartest thing for me to do since I'm not getting any younger these days, but I feel it's now or never. Think I could hang doing it for 10 - 15 years. I think I'd like to target a little commercial and a little bit residential. If I could just get a couple of businesses with a 2-4 acre spread for annual contract, I'd buy me a zero turn wide cutting mower and go for it. I don't think I want the apartment type properties with the hilly terrains and narrow landscape areas to cut to have to use the big walk behind mowers for some reason. Maybe when I was younger, but just doesn't appeal to me as much. But if I'm serious enough, I'd probably take one of those if I got it. Seems like the larger landscape/maintenance companies are getting those however. Churches appeal to me too but they too have somebody doing them obviously. I don't know, I'm trying to put my brain into action to figure something out with help out here from time to time, but haven't really yet. I did think of a friend of my brothers the other day that he once told me own over 40 houses he rents out and thought maybe I should give him a call and see where they are, if he hires people to mow them, and if so, tell him I may want a shot at some of them come next spring for the entire season. Don't know if you are allowed to go door to door around here, but the idea kinda makes me uneasy. I'm not outgoing like some, though my girlfriend says I'm very easy going and easy to talk to and shouldn't scare people when they see me at their door. LOL.... I even feel kinda squimish throwing my flyers in people's driveways. Makes me feel invasive. Ok I've rambled enough I'm sure. I know you wanted info to help you moreso from the experienced guys, just thought I'd share my thoughts too. I did pick up a great used blower (Redmax) from a friend who bought out a dude's equipment getting out of the business. He got all kinds of stuff: trialer, blowers, weeders, hedge trimmers, at a great price. I read out here that Redmax was a good brand and he didn't know any better when I asked if I could get that one from him instead of the echo and stihl he had so I got a steal on it for $35. It is an older EB431 series but man it blows like a hurricane. Look in your paper for guys selling out maybe. Another buddy of mine already in the business goes to flea markets sometimes and last weeks or so he got a pair of Oakley sunglasses for $5 (that's 5 dollars). They were like new. Also got some of those Bose noise reduction headphones for like $20 (think they are about $299 new). Ebay sometimes is good to steal some good stuff cheap. Good luck!

[Randy J]

Hi Paul, and welcome to Lawnsite. A quick business point - make sure you know your cost of doing business, i.e., take all your fixed costs such as cost of equipment, depreciation, advertising, etc., add your variable costs such as fuel, maintanence, labor, etc., convert to an hourly cost, and add in your desired profit. Now you have an idea of how much you need to charge to make money on this venture. Once you have that, find out what competitors in your area are charging, and tweak your charges accordingly - as long as you are mowing for less than your hourly "minimum".
As for mowers, most on here would recommend that you bypass homeowner's equipment completely and instead go for used commercial - if you can't afford, or don't want to spend for new. A good used walkbehind shouldn't be too expensive.
Good luck with your business Paul

[pbillings]

Welcome to forum Paul I would go as a partimer first to see how things workout.

For equipment check the paper lawnsite ebay and others.
Hello greencare. I know your right about starting parttime. But, The problem I have is the hours I work at the copshop. It will not allow any time for other work and If I did start parttime I would have to quit my current job now.. I'm kind of between a rock and a hard place.. I've got to stay serious about this. I have been online, reading newspapers and talking with many other lawncare owners. They too offer advise about starting parttime.. I have to go full bore. I don't really have a choice...I plan to start putting out my feelers and talking to customers I will have from other lawncare guys who have too much to handle and they say they will give me a few to start and will see what happens....I do have a wife with a great job and excellent health beni's which will help out emencely...I live in Missouri. I don't know much about cutting trees but I do know how to mow grass.....What is a good time to try to advertise? Thanx
Paul

[pbillings]

Hey Adam....It sounds like your about at the same thoughts as me. You have gotten a little farther than I. I'm still in the "kick the tires" stage. But, I'm dead serious about the business. I am trying to get pointers still and I've gotten alot on this website. What I'm afraid of is quitting my current job and taking the chance. I'm trying to figure out what would be the best time to advertise, now or mid winter? I haven't got one piece of equipment yet. I have a friend in the business that will help. Thanx for answering................. Paul

[pbillings]

Hi Paul, and welcome to Lawnsite. A quick business point - make sure you know your cost of doing business, i.e., take all your fixed costs such as cost of equipment, depreciation, advertising, etc., add your variable costs such as fuel, maintanence, labor, etc., convert to an hourly cost, and add in your desired profit. Now you have an idea of how much you need to charge to make money on this venture. Once you have that, find out what competitors in your area are charging, and tweak your charges accordingly - as long as you are mowing for less than your hourly "minimum".
As for mowers, most on here would recommend that you bypass homeowner's equipment completely and instead go for used commercial - if you can't afford, or don't want to spend for new. A good used walkbehind shouldn't be too expensive.
Good luck with your business Paul
Thanx for replying Randy J.,,,,,,,,,, I'll have to have my wife figure all the mathmatical aspects out. I see we're in the same type of area.............How and when do you think I should advertise and put out flyers or whatever? I haven't got equipment yet and was thinking of purchasing equipment this winter? What do you think?
Paul

[HOOLIE]

pbillings,

The nice thing about flyers is, they don't cost much, so if you don't get any responses you didn't lose much. From my experience, its a waste to put any out in the dead of winter (unless you're advertising for snow removal). By late Feb/early March, people start thinking about mulch and spring clean-ups, especially if you're lucky and the weathers a bit warmer than usual.

I would go and check out equipment at your local dealers. If at all possible, do try to stay away from the homeowner stuff. Also, at most (if not all) dealers, you can get financing for equipment purchases. Good if you don't have 5 grand lying around.

I'm just curious why you can't work another job, there are a lot of cops I've met that do this on the side.

Best of luck

[pbillings]

Thanx for responding Hoolie.......The reason I cannot work parttime while at my present job is, right now we are on a 12 hr. a day, everyday, 5 and 6 days a week. The dept. I work for is falling apart. We are losing guys left and right. It only leaves 2 days a week off which switches every week. The chief can't figure out why guys are leaving. It's not hard to figure that evrybody there is burned out..I too know cops that work parttime jobs. Where I'm at, it couldn't be done. It would make lawn customers mad because I wouldn't have any idea when I could mow their grass with my days off ( if I get a day off). It switches week to week....I'm just spinning my wheels there. I haven't got a raise in 2 years.........Anyway, enough of the sob story. I'm ready to make money on my own terms, and I would have nobody else to blame but myself if it didn't work out.

[ALarsh]

If I were you, I would wait until late February/early march to quit your job and hit the advertising HARD. Get a nice sized yellow page ad and distribute tons of door hangers. I would not get just a one line setup in the yellow pages, a dollar bill sized ad will be much more sufficient.

Make sure you have equipment before you hit the advertising though. Also, with the yellow pages you’re going to get calls from a large area.

Once you hit the advertising hard, the phone should be ringing off the hook.

Good Luck.

[Team Gopher]

Hi pbillings,

Think of services you could start offering today and not wait until next spring. For instance potentially offer holiday lighting services. Keep thinking and there is no doubt you will be successful.

[nriddle77]

Paul, the best suggestion I can give you is to learn as much as you can before starting out on your own. That way you'll have less unpleasant suprises. Spend your time reading lawnsite archives, theres tons of useful ideas and suggestions. Check out the section called "tell your story", it will give you inspriration. You might even find someone who had a similar situation to yours (very full time job, etc.). Welcome to lawnsite! :)

[pbillings]

Thanx for replying Alarsh.........My plan is to quit my job in early Feb. and hit the streets hard. A yellow pages add sounds good, but I need to find out what it costs. I will be operating in a huge area. Probably 75 miles around where I live. I will be picking up equipment from now till Feb. I will be ready by the time the season starts. I think looking for equipment now and during early winter would be best for lower prices....This is an awsome website. I've only been on it for a few days and I've already learned alot from people that do the job....Thanx to everybody that has responded!
Paul

[pbillings]

Thanx for your reply nriddle77.....I've been enjoying the stories on "tell your story". I have learned alot.............Thanx again
Paul

[pbillings]

Thanx team gopher!........ The problem I have right now is that I am in a full time job now as a Police Officer. I have to give it a few more months before I quit. Then I'm gonna put every minute I have into starting this business. I'm hoping it will take off. My wife has an excellent job with excellent benefits like health ins. and life ins.. That makes me feel abit more secure if the business take off slow. I have other good income coming in.......I've never thought about holiday lighting as a moneymaker. I'm sure your right. there's alot of elderly out there that can't climb onto the roof or climb ladders anymore. Maybe if my summer business does well, I can incorperate that into my winter work.......Thanx for the great idea and all the other help that team gopher provides....Thanx again
Paul

[Frosty_03]

Paul I know it is scary, but just remember if you don't do it now you might have regrets in the future. I would put it down on paper and establish a flow chart and have some what if's. Follow your dreams you can make in this business if you want. Maintain a good reputation and give it 100% everyday cause I want lie to you there will be days that you will asked yourself if all of this is worht it and the answer should be YES!!!! :cool2:

[pbillings]

Thanx frosy....You got that right. I think in every business there is alot of thought about if you made the right decision. I'm hardheaded and i know how to talk to people. I've learned how to keep my cool having to deal with the idiots I've dealt with being a cop. You learn alot from the bad streets of america. I know I can make this work... But, I'm ready if the business doesn't start off like I would like it to....I guess it will leave me more time to go out and hit the neighborhoods harder.....I do have a friend that has been doing it for years and he tells me the money is in these ritzy areas he works in. He is working hard in these areas and they all love him. He does everything. He says he charges $30.00 to even screw in a lightbulb. He does everything.......He's rockin and rollin! That's what I am going to do. My friend is going to point me in the right direction.....Thanx again
Paul

[chris28]

Paul,
Im a cop in New Jersey. Im thinking of going full time. I recommend that you make fliers, mail some out or go to developments you want to cut in and leave a "curb-side estimate" on them. This way the potential customer already has an idea on what the price will be...saving them a step on calling you for an approximate price(people are lazy!). Because you put a curb-side estimate you also have some wiggle room to change the price once you walke the entire lawn. Get insurance and the best equipment you can afford. Newspaper ads in local papers. Business cards in local diners and stores. And best of all...word of mouth. Learn all you can on the industry.

Good luck,
Chris28 :drinkup:

[PMLAWN]

pbillings. Just a few thoughts, If a lot of people are leaving the force what are they doing. If they are all buying mowers and going to work how much is out there?
You state that you will work in a 75 mile area. The farthest job from my shop is 3 miles and I think that is too far. 75 miles will kill you in windshield time and in this job time is money. you only make money if the blades are turning and not on the trailer.
Use the fliers and target an area so you can get as many jobs as close to each other as possable. (drop tailgate and cut 4 ) I do not use the Yellow Pages as I do not want a bunch of price shoppers calling. What is your personal network like. I only work by word of mouth and I can not keep up with the work. 3rd year and I have over 160 hours of mowing per week,Still working aeration and have done 187 so far this year. 75% of my income is year round now. Also do a lot of light landscape. Starting ponds next year.
BUT I live in an area of heavy growth and lots of building. I am a boy scout leader with a troop of over 80 boys. I am on the HOA board. I am on my church board. I am a member of the local Chamber. I sponsor a lot of things at my kids school (over 800 kids) and am a member of the PTO. All of these things keep my name out in front of these people all the time. My name is on all the trucks and inclosed trailers. All our stuff is the same color.
My training is in sales and marketing and I feel that is the most important part of the business. Take some sales classes or get some training tapes. Do not spread yourself to thin. Do one thing and do it well, Than grow to another. do it well and grow again.
Be sure you can live cheap for a few years as it will take time to get off the ground and you will have to put a lot of money back into the business.
Do a business plan. Talk to others about what they pay to have the grass cut. Go to different areas in your city and see what the going rates are.
Go to a commerical equipment shop and see what a total rig will cost. Figure what it will cost you to be in and stay in business ( insurance-gas-blades-trimmer line-edger blades-oil-maintenance-blade sharpening-interest-accounting costs-advertizing-billing,paper,stamps,printer-the cost of running you business(time on the computer)-YOUR PAY-profit-truck-trailer-licence-TAXES) and I am sure that I missed a lot as it is late at night.
You will find a lot of talk on this site of making great money and the cool trucks and the easy outdoor life. This is hard work, It is hot in the summer and you will be wet with sweat and the grass will stick to you like glue. A lot of the easy money guys are young and still living at home. $25-$35K a year to them is a lot of money. If you have a house-car-kids than you can not get by on that. You can make a lot more but you have to run a tight business and be smart. PLAN PLAN PLAN. There are a lot of out of work people who now cut grass and there are a lot of people who use to cut grass that are now out of work. This is a job just like all other that will take a lot of effort and hard work to be sucsessful. It can be done and it is a great feeling when you get there. Just be careful and think hard about giving up the job you have now.

[KINGjosh]

I disagree with getting an ad in the yellow pages, because of the fact you get such a large area of customers. The drive time to get to one after the other will totally kill you! Do the yellow page thing once you got your bussiness up and running. I put an ad in the local neighborhood news weekly, and its been a good thing so far. all the people who respond are locally and in your area. AS for going in full steam ahead, I say if your wife can support the household for at least a year on her own, then you can do it. Otherwise it would be like jumping in a lake and learning how to swim for the first time! As for equipment, I always buy brandnew, that way you start out fresh. And you dont have to worry about whats the real reason this guys selling this piece of shiit mower!

[wdb]

What I'm afraid of is quitting my current job and taking the chance. I'm trying to figure out what would be the best time to advertise, now or mid winter? I haven't got one piece of equipment yet. I have a friend in the business that will help.

You sound like me. I am working in a dead end job for an office machine company that is totally mismanaged and has gone profit crazy. Needless to say, I have had it with them. I am looking at two different businesses. One being the
repair of vintage as well as modern high end hi-fi equipment and the other being a lawn care business. I too am frightened of having to make a change. I have come to rely on a reliable paycheck for 26 years. It is hard to throw that to the wind and start out on my own. I am not fortunate enough to have a wife with a good enough job that can cover all the bills so I MUST make a go of whatever I decide to do reasonably quickly.
One thing, though. If you still have your day job. Hang on to it and buy the equipment you will need. I already own a 14' trailer, a Hustler 44" mini-Z ZTR mower, two Maruyama trimmers, a Husquevarna back pack blower, three Toro two cycle push mowers, a Maruyama hedge trimmer, and several hand tools. I also have a lot of tools so I can service my machinery myself. I do all my own maintenance. Oh, I also own a good Jonsereds 18" chain saw.
My total investment was under $10,000. While most guys my age were out buying sports cars and driving down the interstate at 20 mph below the speed limit in the left lane, I decided to invest in something like my lawn care equipment and several meters and electronic tools for my hi-fi servicing and building interests. I built a garage so I can store my equipment out of the weather as well as to have a nice dry place to service the equipment.
In my case, I not only need to own the equipment, I need enough in the bank to keep me going till I can build up a customer base. There is a lot of competition out there. My suggestion is to buy the equipment first, then to have at least three months pay in the bank. Once you own the equipment and have some cash in the bank, then you should be in a fairly secure position to start out without having to live those first couple months in constant fear of loosing everything. Now, one person said their wife has a good job. Man, you are lucky. I envy you! But in my case, and probably in the case of many others, we are not that lucky. So a bit of financial preparation is certainly in order. Most businesses fail because of initial cash flow problems. They never have a chance to build up a customer base because they don't have enough available cash to ride out the first few lean months.

[pbillings]

PMLAWN.....Hi.....I appreciate your reply. I know the distance seems like overkill. But, to get to the neighborhoods that will pay top notch for lawn service I have to drive the distance. I live in a rural area. I am hooked up with aguy that has been in the business for many years. He knows what area will best suit the needs to make everything worth the drive. Where I work now at the Police Dept I drive almost an hour drive everyday for 40k a year. Talk about not worth it! I get up every morning while on day shift at 03:15 in the morning. The areas I'm trying to get have noise ordinances before 08:00 in the morning. I have to be at my present job at 06:30 am. I think I can handle the drive and be there with pleny of time left over.That's not a problem. my buddy already has tons of existing customers and is willing to help me get started with some of his customers that he wants to drop due to an excess of customers. It will be a scratch my back and i'll scratch yours. You are 100% right about figuring costs of everything. I haven't got to see the reality of all that yet. My buddy is trying to square me away on that and is willing to help in anyway he can to move me forward. I hope it works out. Thanx so much for your reply!!!!!

[pbillings]

all lawns and landcare....thanx for the reply....I plan on staying in one area, I hope. well the jumping in full steam reason, is with the screwed up hours that I work doesn't leave any room for the part time gig. If I go with the lawn biz, I have to quit my present job. No I don't agree with a yellow pages ad and don't plan on it. I am being told not to buy a used mower. I rode a DIXIE CHOPPER and played around with it. MAN, you talk about a sweet mower. I wish I had 10k laying around.......

[pbillings]

wdb..THanx for your reply......Yep, you got that right, I't is scary to drop a secure job to take the chance....With the hours I work, I could not start part time. I'm on swing shifts, 8 to 12 hrs. a day. and 2 days off a week that switch every 2 weeks. I couldn't get a customer and tell them that this week I'll mow your lawn on wednesday and next week i'll mow thursday and so on. I think they would get pissed. If I'm gonna do it, I have to jump in it, PERIOD. Yes, I'm lucky my wife has a good job and beni's. But it won't cover everything. I also have 3 kids. You all might think I'm crazy, But it has to be done. I have never quit anything and I will make this work! Or find a big oak tree and a rope, HA, HA....

[KINGjosh]

sometimes in life you just have to ask yourself are you happy doing what your doing?

[wdb]

. I couldn't get a customer and tell them that this week I'll mow your lawn on wednesday and next week i'll mow thursday and so on. I think they would get pissed. If I'm gonna do it, I have to jump in it, PERIOD.

You are right, and don't apologize for wanting to toss the day job. My company wanted me on a 24 hour call out rotation. So, every couple weeks
I would be on call for 24 hours a day for a week. This would totally screw up any business. When I told my boss that I was going to start doing this lawn care thing, he sent me a real curt email stating that company policy states that I can't have a personal business if it is going to interfere with my job in any way, then he underlined and put in quotes 'after hours call out'. When I read the email, I became furious. It was then I decided to get out. You are a police officer and I know what many areas ask of their officers. Some have regular 8 hour shifts and 40 hour weeks, but other less well managed areas have their guys working unbelievable numbers of hours a week. You just can not keep that up with out burning out. I am a copier / printer service tech and you talk about a thankless job! Man. I mean, think of what piece of equipment in any office is the brunt of more jokes then a copier. Then add to it the fact that this company, who I will not mention but who was once a fortune 500 company that fell from grace, has you accountable for more things that you have no control over then Carter has liver pills and you can see why I have put in my paper work to take an early out. Half the people I work with are on anti depressants and tranquilizers. Nothing is worth that.
So believe me, I can fully understand your reasoning for leaving and really respect you for having the courage to take a crack at something else. I watched several of my coworkers work their lives away only to end up having blood pressure problems, strokes, and heart attacks, all of which were due to stress related problems. I'm really frightened about my economic future. But at least I won't have to worry about falling asleep at the wheel at 3:00 am while driving home from an after hours service call like a coworker who almost killed himself in a wreck did.

[Phoenix Lawncare]

I've been a lurker on the board for a few days and have learned a great deal from the nice folks here who are so willing to share their experience. So, to start off with, thanks a bunch to everyone here. :waving:

My situation is actually very similar to yours. I run the Loss Prevention department for a large department store. Brutal hours, mind-numbing policies and procedures, inept management, etc. I had what I like to call "the moment" when I woke up one morning about two weeks ago and decided threre is simply no way that I could do this for the rest of my life.

I've always enjoyed yard work so I decided to research the idea of going and doing it for a living. Happily, I ran across this website from a link from Hustler Turf Equipment (thanks guys), and have been reading as much as time permits.

In my case, I have a few thousand dollars that I can use and have arranged to purchase a nice Toro Proline Hydro 36 walk behind. I already own an Echo PE-311 stick edger, a Ryobi string trimmer on which I installed an Echo 2 Line Rapid Loader Head, an Echo PB-230 blower, a Cub Cadet 21 self propelled and a old Craftsman hedge trimmer.

The only advantage on my end is one set day off per week which I'll be able to go out and get the blades spinning. My other day off rotates all over but I'll use that for some guerilla marketing in my area (small) since I'm concerned my poor Altima with 218,000 miles on it will be unhappy about hauling around even 1000 lbs. I'm planning on doing the part-time gig until my wife finishes nursing school and then hit it full time.

Anyhow...enough babbling. I would concur with some of the other excellent advise already given out here. Use the money from your job to purchase the best possible mower which is appropriate to your target lawn and other accessories that you'll need. Have at least three months of living AND operating expenses tucked away safely in the bank. You'll feel a whole lot better knowing if you have a couple of thin months starting out that your bills will be taken care of.

I wish you the very best of success.

[pbillings]

Thanx everybody for responding..It is a good feeling knowing that there are people out there that feel and understand the way I do....Yes, a thankless job. I'm tired of worrying about wether the crackhead who robbed and punched out an 80 year old woman is going to get me indicted for giving him a little education, street style! I'm tired of not getting a raise for 2 years! Police isn't what it used to be. You try to do your job the best you can and before you know it your being dragged into the chiefs office because some a-hole who's teenaged kids have carjacked a car and used it in a robbery and you have to chase it as they're firing shots at you. So they crash into a bridge embankment and you end up being the bad guy. It ain't what you watch on COPS. If I can get this lawn biz goin. At least I can feel a little safer..

[HOOLIE]

Some people might not like this idea, but if you own your own home, I'd consider opening a line of credit to have around as an emergency back-up for those times when the cash flow is trickling. The time to do so is now, BEFORE you quit and go full-time. When you're self-employed the banks won't touch you until you have several years tax returns under your belt. And even then its an iffy proposition.

Best of luck to everybody.

[pbillings]

Thanx again Hoolie......You've always givin good advise. Line of credit would be a good idea...I do own my own home with acreage. I will check into it..............

[Jordan River]

Paul, when you said you were going to quit policing, I first tried to reach through the puter, an' grab you by the neck and scream NO!!! at the top of my lungs. I am a copper as well and quit one time after being hurt seriously in a bad vehicle accident. I left Memphis, packed my family up, and moved to Louisiana with great expectations of working for Fedex. After two years of being miserable, having no money, watching my family suffer, I moved back, got my job back, and vow NEVER to leave again without proper planning. Billings, I don't live, eat and breathe policing, but I work with some great folks and somehow we survive the bullsh!t from the administration. It's in my blood. Do you know what I mean??Now, are you frustrated with being a policeman, or are you stressed out about your terrible working conditions? By the way, your chief is CRAZY!! Twelve hour shifts rotating every two weeks??? No wonder he can't retain officers. Before you completely leave the badge on the desk, consider this. Get a job with another department with normal working conditions AND a quiet environment(Catch my drift?). Work the midnight shift, and start mowing parttime, or work for someone with a company. That's basically what I'm doing. I am learning and working very hard. I am at peace when I am mowing!! People think I'm crazy, but I love it. I am finding that I do love the yards as much as I thought I did. Will you??? If you can mow 8 hrs a day, and work midnights, then yeah, you definitely got the bug, and if you work at something you love to do, you will automatically do good work and the money will come. What a run-on sentence! Anyway, I ask you again, why are you wanting to stop being a copper? I am NOT trying to discourage you! I just would hate to see a fellow policeman make the error I made. Like I said, it ain't the police work, it's the people I work with that I enjoy. Sure, we have the bullsh!t from the administration, but I don't let it get to me. I live to mow!! My children love to help, and we spend lots of time together. Please consider trying a different department before you completely quit. And if you've just "had it", then don't ever look back...if you do, the lines you mow won't be straight!! HaHa! I'm sorry I rambled, and I hope you get something you can use from this. Good luck, brother.

[pbillings]

Jordan River....I was wondering if there was someone out there that knows what I am talking about. No, you didn't ramble on. You hit it right on the head. Yes, It is in my blood to be a copper. My father was a 40 year veteran with the St. louis P.D.. My brother was a secret service agent and retired after 20 years. several uncles, cousins, and alot of my friends are and were coppers. I'm 4th generation Police. My family goes back to the mid 1800s as Police officers. Yes it is built in for me to be a copper. I am good at it. My father and other family members tell me that once your a cop and you quit, you'll try to get back to be a cop. I know what you are saying. My dept. is a piece of crap. The only thing good about it is my buddies I work with. I am burnt out. Yes you are right about getting on with a different dept. that is quieter. It's gotten to the point where i began to hate people. I'm tired of going on a call that is of no emergency importance, speak with them, and get a complaint from them that I called them the "N" word and other profane things. Then I have to sit down with my idiot chief and explain that I did none of the things that they said. The complaints that we get are from people who hate the Police and just enjoy making our lifes more miserable than they already are. These are bad days to be a cop. I don't want to sound like I'm whining, but I have had it..........I do work on my days off with a friend that has his own lawncare biz. YES, I am at peace when I'm mowing or blowing leaves. I think of good easy things when i am out there. I am not sitting in that patrol car cussing and pissed off because I caught a a-hole in an old ladies home who had just burglarized it and beat the crap out of her just for being there. Good job huh? Yeah, right.....After some street education to the a-hole, He is now suing me and the dept. He's not gonna get nuthin but I still sit and worry about it. Now I'm the bad guy. I should have shot the bastard. I would be in a better situation......Anyway, I'm rambling.....I am gonna go through with this. I am getting on with a small dept. by my house and work parttime there to keep my certification up just in case........Believe me, I know what you are saying. I think hard about it every day...............
Thanx for the thought
Paul