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View Full Version : Where are flyers legal?


proenterprises
10-06-2004, 08:46 PM
Whats the verdict for flyers, I dont think they can go in the mailbox/paper box. Not on the box itself?

I am going to be doing some leaf advertising soon and need to know where it is ok to post them.

Lawnchoice
10-06-2004, 09:26 PM
You can't have them touch any part of the mailbox itself.

We get tacks and rubber bands and attach however possible!

Good luck!

Lawnchoice

olderthandirt
10-06-2004, 09:37 PM
Why Flyers? 4x8 sheet of plywood on each side of truck with cell # and leaf collection written tastefully, and equipment abourd. Just drive slowly around neighborhood and when the call comes your set to work.

Mac

Lawnchoice
10-06-2004, 09:43 PM
Maybe you could have a speaker with music going like the ice cream man too!

Lawnchoice

joburnet
10-06-2004, 10:20 PM
We've done over 10,000 flyers so far for my intial business set up.

We mostly put them on the mailbox between the box itself and the flag thing. I also put them in newspaper box's sometimes if they are there or slip them in the mailbox if the door to it is open.

I haven't gotten any calls or complaints about them yet and probably wouldn't stop this form of advertising unless the police called me.

-Chris

boxoffire
10-06-2004, 11:17 PM
Better watch out with the mailboxes. I live in Raleigh, NC and started putting some out a couple of weeks ago (I'm new to the business) and got busted by the mailman big time. I had put out about 30-40 around an old neighborhood I grew up in and was attaching them to the post underneath BEHIND the mailbox itself (nowhere near it really) with the little pushpins with my flyer and business card inside a little cheap freezer baggy. He said don't put anything on ANY PART OF THE MAILBOX or the SUPPORTING pole(s) of the mailbox. Handed me an official document from Postal Service and let me have it. Really was an a$$hole if you ask me. I told him I called at least before doing it and woman told me it was ok to attach to pole behind mailbox itself but his document said otherwise. I also told him people do it at my house before. He started talking about people getting their mail stolen and then their identities stolen and I looked at him and just said yeah it's a sad world we live in now, but if somebody is gonna do that, then they are going to do it regardless really. He thought I was getting smart but I really wasn't. Like I said a real butthead. So I started backtracking just so I could cover myself and take the 30-40 off the poles I had already done, proceeded to almost break my ankle in one driveway when I rolled it. Luckily it popped back and only got sore for a while. Got I think 99% of the ones I had done and went home. That night in my carport, I was taking all of my baggy flyers and putting some small rocks in them and my cell phone rang. Wouldn't you know it, it was the postmaster calling to warn me not to put flyers on mail posts near the mailboxes. That butthead turned me in. He either found 1 that I missed or took one off the ground NEAR the mailbox where I left some and turned my # into his boss. Anyway, I explained my case and asked for a break and he said he would only warn me this time and asked for my mailing address so he could send me the warning and do his job of getting me that official document the mailman showed me earlier that day. Funny I was stuffing rocks in my baggies at the time too. Anyway asked him what fine was if I did it again and he said min. $100 plus like $1 per flyer per mailbox pole. YIKES! I won't do that again. It was a nice cool day and I didn't mind walking around the neighborhood that day, but now I'm riding around in my Jeep and selectively throwing the flyers in driveways near the paper or whereever, and saving my ankles from being broken and getting all tired walking around.

Just to let you know....

Adam

joburnet
10-06-2004, 11:48 PM
Boxoffire,

Thats very odd, up here people put flyers on mailboxs a lot, its common for me to go to a neighborhood and find that all the mailboxs already have flyers on them.

Also, the general population up here expects flyers on their mailbox's and appreciates them as a means to find services.

If I ran into the problem you did there, I would go with direct mailings. I think you can do that for around $.25-$.27 a piece, also, door hangers wold work too, I don't think they could get you for that.

Also, never underestimate the value of standing your ground, people will complain sometimes, but if I got flack from someone for putting something on their doorknob, I just wouldn't do their house next time.

-Chris

proenterprises
10-07-2004, 11:10 AM
does anyone know if it is fair game to put them inside of the newspaper box?

it seems like that is totally not related to the mail itself (being they are separate businesses?)

I think I will have to go this route if I can, being that most houses have long drives, and walking to doors would waste alot of time.

ANY MORE INPUT PLEASE?

Lawnchoice
10-07-2004, 12:39 PM
Put them right in the newspaper boxes!

As long as there isn't any way that it would be difficult for the newspaperman/woman to deliver, it should be fine!

Lawnchoice

proenterprises
10-07-2004, 01:09 PM
Do you think it would actually get into the peoples hands. I think that it may actually be better this way than getting lost with all the other ad's people dont read which are within the paper anyway.

I think I will try and do it this way.

joburnet
10-07-2004, 05:39 PM
We have had good luck with both newpaper boxes and putting the ads directly in the mailbox's.

My advice would be to not mess around and put out thousands of flyers. If you only put out a few hundred, expect to get 0 calls. Also don't be afraid of angering some people, some people will complain no matter what you do, it does not matter if you annoy a few people with flyers if you also get a few more new customers.

For houses that are far apart, I bought one of those little motor scooters. Thing goas about 20 miles an hour and I look like a dweeb on it, but it gets the job done in a big way.

-Chris

boxoffire
10-07-2004, 10:51 PM
That's a good idea joburnet, I thought about the scooter or bicycle thing anyway. I guess they are just more strict on the mailbox thing around here, especially in the particular neighborhoods I was targeting. But you are right, I've seen flyers/ads in peoples flag supports on mailboxes around my neighboyhood and never thought twice about it really. As far as people who are not authority on the matter, yeah to heck with them. I won't lose any sleep over a person who has nothing better to do than harass a person trying to make an honest living. None of their business. Sad people really in my opinion. I just said to heck with it and either leave the fler on doorstep or like I said before toss them in driveway with paper with small rock in baggy to hold it there. Not many of those newpaper boxes around here anymore. I'm sure they are fine. Not property of postal service so they shouldn't be able to get you for it. And whoever said a few hundred flyers won't get you any calls must have had bad luck theirself because I made up appox. 400 and have only put out about 150 ot them so far and have had 4 calls. 2 got me jobs and the other one could have to if I wouldn't have blown it. Guy wanted his lawn seeded and wanted a slit seeder used. I hesitated because I don't have one and knew I would just need to rent one (this was my first call by the way, ever!) and told him that and before I could go on he kinda knew I was new at it and figured I wasn't the guy to do it and rudely said, "I'll just do it myself". I said ok, good luck to ya. Anyway another lady called and told me to come by next morning at 8:00 am and then called back about an hour later and left a message while I was cutting my own grass that something came up and that I shouldn't come the next morning but she would be calling me back because she needs me to do some work on her lawn (cut, and other stuff maybe I guess). Anyway, she never called me back and it's been a couple of weeks now. ????? She sounded older so I figured maybe her son advised her not to since she didn't know me possibly?? Thought about calling her back but wasn't sure if that would be appropriate. Other 2, got 1 time cuts and made customer happy and probably helped my name in the biz anyway. Finally back to the point, flyers DO work sometimes obviously and I still have over 200 to pass out promoting FALL LEAF AND DEBRIS cleanup. Also put an ad in local paper for first time this past Sunday that runs 4 Sundays and on internet for 28 days straight. Got first call 3 days later (yesterday) for debris cleanup. Went and did it the last 2 days in pieces and made $160. Underbid a bit, but learned much in the process. Guy was totally happy with job I did and said he would recommend me to his neighbors/friends in the future. he's having a larger landscape company "treat" his lawn and asked what else I do. I'm new, so I wasn't assertive enough to tell him that I could bid on his lawn "treatment". Not sure what all they were going to do really, but he does need drainage problem fixed in his backyard killing his grass. They aren't doing that for him however, as a matter of fact whatever they are doing they are requireing him to blow and rake his lawn completely before they will even touch it. His lawn looked pretty much ok to me. No thatch buildup and grass was already very green in front with no bare spots. Backyard looks like a small creekbed however from his drainage problem. But I just don't know enough to do that yet, so that's what I told him. Enough for now, I could babble all night probably. FLYERS can work to at least get you something. I've almost made my money back on cost to make them anyway.

Team Gopher
10-08-2004, 08:46 PM
Hi Olderthandirt,

4x8 sheet of plywood on each side of truck with cell # and leaf collection written tastefully, and equipment abourd. Just drive slowly around neighborhood and when the call comes your set to work.

That is a great idea! Do you have any pictures of this? I would love to see them!

joburnet
10-08-2004, 09:16 PM
...

Boxoffire, thats fantastic. I wish I could get that kind of turn around per flyer here. Where are you located?

How much did you spend on the flyers? We print them out on a laser printer for about $.01 a piece with toner and paper and all. We even order toner refills for around $20 instead of buying new cartriages.

Its good that you are learning and realizing that you need to be more assertive. You definitly need to be more assetive. Never talk to someone interested in your services without an attempt to "close." Close means set them up for an appointment so towards the end of the conversation discussing your services, you would say something like "I can set you up for an appointment to come do your lawn in the next few days if you would like."

Also, whenever someone calls you, this is called a "lead." Your leads are very valuable and you need to make them go as far as possible. When someone calls you and says they'll call back, they probably won't, thats the nature of people. The person who got the job is the person who waited a few days for her to call and then just called her. "Hey, I just called to let you know I have a slot open for next week if you would like."

Also, if I was you, I'd just go ahead and hire a few employees and send them out to do the work. Just be assertive with them and make sure they do the job right. If you handed out less than 400 flyers and got 3 calls, that is very good. I can hand out about 1000 flyers in an 8 hour day if I know where I'm going. That means you could go out one day and get 5-10 jobs from that single day of advertising. If you had employees you could send them out to do the jobs while you advertised more. Just remember that you need to charge at least twice as much as it costs you to pay the employees.

-Chris

boxoffire
10-08-2004, 10:01 PM
joburnet,

I went through a black and color cartridge on my deskjet printer $50, and one ream of paper ($5), and did the flyer with Word on my pc. I spent about $12 on the big cheap freezer baggies, and spent $24 on 500 Avery 8731 white business cards at Office Max and made up some of my own cards with help from out here on how to do it in Word from a nice fellow lawn guy in the biz. So grand total of about $91 to make up 400 flyers. Not too bad really, and there were in color. Kinkos quoated me best price for color copies at .49 for order of at least 500. Office max and Staples were way too high. Also found a local guy to make me some car sign magnets for my jeep at only $45 a pair (one for each side) and when he saw how needy I was since I'm just starting out, he said he would give me one of his 2X2 I believe he said, aluminum sign I could attach to back of my trailer. He then also said I could go get some tee shirts and go back to office max and get this special printing material called "reverse printing paper" maybe, can't remember for sure, but he has a stamper for printing logos and company names on shirts so I could look more professional that way also. Nice guy. However that was last week and havne't heard back from him. I should call right? I'm going to.

Thanks for the advice, man. I'll get there hopefully. I'm already feeling like I"m learning. You have to when you are new at this. Even the guy who I did the debris cleanup for said his neighboy had a TON of debris (mostly old lumber and firewood) that was just too much for me and my little trailer (5X8) utility. He said you should hire out some cheaper labor (he mentioned mexicans) and rent a big truck and bid on the job and get them to do it and make some money that way. Makes alot of sense, just don't think I'm ready for that just yet. I really just want to learn the lawn care business and cut grass, but learn how to take good care of a lawn in the process and make people happy and like my work. Hopefully get a few commercial cuts to help with the big bills one day. I'm hearing it can be feast or famine in this business. Gotta keep you eyes and ears open it appears. I just don't want stress of dealing with employees right now. Maybe after I learn the business. I do believe though you need to diversity your skills some though, since grass cutting isn't a year round money maker. Debris cleanup is a good one sinec I can do that, and I was thinking of maybe advertising cleaning out some gutters as well. Buy me a long ladder and give it a shot, ya know. Maybe even get me a power washer down the road and do a little of that. Take any work you can get cause when your out there on your own, you want to stay that way and succeed. I fear failure like most any ordinary person I guess. I'm lucky I have my mom still since I'm not married, to help me with a place to stay.

Peace bro!

Later...

By the way, I'm in Raleigh, NC....

joburnet
10-08-2004, 11:05 PM
...

Boxoffire,

We use our laser printer. We don't buy cartriages for it, we actually order the toner itself for $12 a refill as opposed to paying for $75 for cartriages.

The refill will print off roughly 4000-5000 flyers. We also buy paper in boxe's of 5000 sheets on special from office stores, we typically pay $20 for 5000 sheets, but usually you have to buy at least 2 boxes. So we usually pay about $2 for reams that you paid $5 for.

That brings us to around $.01 a flyer, they are black and white.

I've bought baggies before, I got the cheep sandwich baggies for less than $.01 a piece.

We buy our business cards in lots of 5000 from www.onlineprinthouse.com, these are bright colored, high definition graphics with UV glossy coating cards. We pay 2.5 cents a peice for them and put them on cars to advertise with. These business cards look very good and are very catchy. Our primary business is a car detailing business, so this may not work for lawn care.

If you are using an inkjet printer, I suggest printing in black and white and setting the print setting to "draft" this saves a horrendous amount of ink. I also suggest not buying new ink cartriages, but buying inkjet refills from these people: http://www.distribution-online.com/home.htm

Color or not, if I had to pay $91 for 400 flyers I would not be in business right now.

The car sign magnets are a good deal from what I have seen, we still need to order some and will will probably pay $100 for a pair. Its very good to have those signs up, that kind of advertising is invaluable.

We have uniforms as well, we got embroidered colored shirts for about $15 a piece.

Yes, you should definitly call the guy back.

For the guys neighbor, seems like you could take two trips with the truck? I don't have a truck, but have to haul a 32 foot ladder around, so I took out all the seats except the drivers seat in my Grand Prix and shove the thing in through the trunk.

Its good to try to get a feel for the work before you hire people. You must know how to do it before you can tell someone else to do it. But you can also hire people to help you. Sounds like the market is ripe in your area. Though to me employees releive stress, they do all the work so I can sit around and think about how I'm gonna make more money.

By the way, one of my good friends lives in Raleigh, good luck with everything.

-Chris