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pfeiff
10-08-2004, 09:45 AM
I e-mail exmark the other day asking them there thoughts on double blades. They said that is a very bad idea because it puts double the force of the engine and all the belts. He also said it makes the blades lower to the ground which is bad because you will tend to hit more objects, which buts a toll of the bearings. I wish some one made a lighter double blade unit that is all one blade.

Dave

brentsawyer
10-08-2004, 10:19 AM
I'm sure many will object but I think that doubles are a necessary evil only when there is a ton of growth, ie spring. For one, yes it is more stress on the engine. I kept mine on until mid July this year when they weren't needed as much and upon switching back to regular low lifts only, I noticed a considerable increase in fuel efficientcy from day one. Also, it is much more stress on the clutch to engage the blades. With doubles I must have the throttle at about 1/3 to engage and sometimes more, however with one set of blades, I can engage at idle every time. These two reasons are why I only run doubles when it is necessary since I would rather not spend more than I have to on fuel at the time and would rather sell the mower with the original clutch in good working order rather than spend several hundred on a new one.

pwarren4
10-08-2004, 12:56 PM
WOW! ;) This thread is 3 hours old without a answer from Meg-Mo

jt5019
10-08-2004, 02:25 PM
WOW! ;) This thread is 3 hours old without a answer from Meg-Mo


Dont worry his reply will be coming :p

Gravely_Man
10-08-2004, 02:35 PM
I personally have not had any issues running doubles but if I do it was well worth it. Anything to speed up the cutting of the clients lawn and you end up with a great looking lawn is all that matters.

Gravely_Man

DLCS
10-08-2004, 03:11 PM
WOW! ;) This thread is 3 hours old without a answer from Meg-Mo


Meg Mo can advertise his products all he wants, since he is a paying sponsor. He keeps this site free. :)

gramps
10-08-2004, 03:21 PM
WOW! ;) This thread is 3 hours old without a answer from Meg-Mo
Thats good good laugh :D

chevyman1
10-08-2004, 03:35 PM
we haven't scraped a deck for 7 years :D

Envy Lawn Service
10-08-2004, 05:16 PM
I see no harm in running doubles. Just a little extra strain on the engine is all.

But, what are the various reasons for running doubles anyways?

tiedeman
10-08-2004, 05:42 PM
I really have never noticed a better cut and/or less clumps running doubles so I don't run them at all. I did notice a decrease in HP though running doubles

dcondon
10-08-2004, 06:40 PM
I really have never noticed a better cut and/or less clumps running doubles so I don't run them at all. I did notice a decrease in HP though running doubles


we don't run doubles either. Never see a difference!!!!

MJLsLawnCareNmoreLLC
10-08-2004, 07:46 PM
I noticed a difference running doubles. 1. Sounded like a street sweeper that made my neighbors come out and look (great, as if I don't make enough noise already). 2. Shot the grass clippings even further ("great, now I can hit the beds when Im in the middle of the yards"). 3. The grass also shot about 5-6 feet straight up in the air ("great, now the grass forms a nice UNIFORM layer accross the top of the lawn"). 4. A major loss in hp causing the mower to stall when engaging the blades ("Great, you get the point"). 4. The blades of grass were cut a bit smaller, but with the above differences it just didnt justify running doubles.

Andyinchville2
10-08-2004, 07:54 PM
Still no Meg Mo!!!!!....they must be :sleeping:

bugspit
10-08-2004, 08:37 PM
I ran doubles in the spring, spring grass had more moisture in it and it was a load on my 20hp, also had clumps.
During the past few weeks I went back to doubles, now we have very dry grass and I like it much better, not as much strain on the 20hp plus mulching almost becomes dust.

Likestomow
10-08-2004, 09:22 PM
I tried doubles four years ago and have never stopped being impressed. Four cutting edges are way better than only two. The grass gets chopped up better, thrown further and the turf looks smoother.

Kev's Lawncare
10-09-2004, 10:18 PM
When running double blades do you cross the blades or are they perpendicular with each other?

paponte
10-09-2004, 11:40 PM
I tried the double blade method, and have found that the conditions have to be perfect. Too much growth and/or moisture and it shreds the grass too much = more clumps. Too dry, and you look like pig pen when your done from the "helicopter effect".

I'll stick to my singles, and use highlift or gators according to conditions. :)

Supertiger
10-10-2004, 01:01 AM
so since the Megmow thing keep getting mentioned, can anyone tell me about this product. Ive never used double blades, on my 60" lazer with mulching deck how would these Megmow blades do on a mulching deck?

PaulJ
10-10-2004, 01:37 AM
When running double blades do you cross the blades or are they perpendicular with each other?


yes! crossing them and perpendicular is the same thing.

I don't have an exmark but I asked them about doubles back when I was researching for a new mower.
Exmark is one of many mower manufacturers that are AFRAID of double blades. They claim that it might hurt their big strong commercial mower and that nothing can improve their mowers anyway.
They just don't want to do any of their own testing and admit that someone else might have had a better idea. you'll get the same Bla bla warranty disclaimer if you ask them about an ocdc or sulky. Or if you ask some of the other manufacturers.

Every mower reacts differently to doubles in different conditions. and you can use different combinations of doubles to get different results.

I have used doubles on Lesco and on Hustler walkbehinds. ON both mowers they improved the cut, lift, discharge, and bagging. I have not lost any spindles or clutches from doubles. ON both machines I use a gator on top and standard or high lift on the bottom over 90% of the time.

look at all the variables and make your own decision

HOMER
10-10-2004, 09:29 AM
They really help with spring weeds and bahai.........on a normal lawn I don't see the advantage. Of course I run a Dixie and it is tough enough to handle the extra set of blades.

naturescape
10-10-2004, 10:36 AM
I use an ExM 48" TT, 17Kaw. Also, I mulch ALL the leaves on my properties. I can tell you the only way to do this is with doubles. If you don't have enough power to run 'em, buy a different mower. Just doubles for me in early spring, and all through fall.

Try a low-lift blade on the bottom, and a gator on top. You'll prob. have to order the low-lift blade, they are not popular. However, it'll create less strain on the engine, and really helps to reduce blow-out.

Ryan Lightning
10-10-2004, 01:41 PM
I use an ExM 48" TT, 17Kaw. Also, I mulch ALL the leaves on my properties. I can tell you the only way to do this is with doubles. If you don't have enough power to run 'em, buy a different mower. Just doubles for me in early spring, and all through fall.

Try a low-lift blade on the bottom, and a gator on top. You'll prob. have to order the low-lift blade, they are not popular. However, it'll create less strain on the engine, and really helps to reduce blow-out.

Have you tried the Exmark mulch kit? It will turn leaves to dust. I treid doubles and the exmark mulch kit did a better job for me.

CuttingCrew
10-10-2004, 03:16 PM
Low Lift blades and Gators are a popular combination.
Anyone ever try double Gators?

MOW ED
10-10-2004, 03:34 PM
My doubles are on my Walker deck and they are factory. The 52SD is a monster and the clutch is manual which is great for engaging without damage to anything. I used to run doubles on my Toro WB which is a 44" with an electric clutch. Baddd idea as I went thru 2 clutches in a season. One while engaging at full and one at half. I did see benefit in lush growth but otherwise it was a big strain on the mower.

naturescape
10-10-2004, 05:28 PM
Have you tried the Exmark mulch kit? It will turn leaves to dust. I treid doubles and the exmark mulch kit did a better job for me.

Yes, I have tried just about every combination with the Exmark, including the kit.

If things are wet, you will get nowhere with the mulch kit. Also, with doubles and no kit, you can make another pass to disperse and even the mulch/clippings.

Fescue Farmer
10-11-2004, 12:18 AM
To each his own, but I have found running doubles to be very beneficial - I have experimented with doubles on a Hustler Super Mini Z 52"/25 kawasaki.

Here are my results:

Stock hustler single blades - stink! Not enough lift - poor quality of cut and clipping dispersion.

Stock 18" Exmark single blades (moderately high lift with 1/2 moon shaped cut out near sail) - better cut - smoother - better dispersion of clippings.

Stock 18" Exmark double blades - wow! More lift - better looking, crisper stripes with more contrast - throws clippings a loooooong ways - clippings are not very mulched up which means the grass is getting out of the deck quick - noticeable loss in power - harder to engage - they will still engage at just above an idle when the engine is warm though - sweet sound under the deck.

Stock 18" Exmark blades on bottom with Gator Magnums on top - good clean cut - clippings are being thrown farther than single blades but not nearly as far as the exmark doubles - clippings are finely mulched up.

Manorscape
10-21-2011, 05:38 PM
Doubles kick butt. I find that I dont need the extra lift nor the extra discharge distance, just the shredding effect. So I cut the sail off a set of old medium lift blades and run them on top of a new set of medium lift blades (stock toro SFS blades)

Cut is great, shredding fantastic, doesnt throw clippings 4 rows over like double medium lifts did, and less strain engaging the PTO from reducing the weight at the tips of the upper blades. The SFS deck has always striped well enough as-is for me and that remained the same...plus zero stringers ever.

I have also used raptor style top blades, and the leaf shredding is scary, but the weight and added throw made it less useful to me.

What i REALLY wish is that I could run the top blades a inch diameter longer to cut the tops off high grass ahead of the lower blades finish cut.

jbell36
10-21-2011, 06:23 PM
our honda push mower came with double blades and for bagging it's completely awesome...does awesome on leaves...don't use is much for regular mowing, i like our other push mowers for that, so i guess what i'm saying is double blades don't do that great for grass, but i really don't have a lot of experience with it

our honda will go twice as far as our regular push mowers when bagging leaves...wee also have exmark lazer z's with the ultravac's on them and those are phenomenal when bagging, so no need for double blades there

Darryl G
10-21-2011, 06:34 PM
Yeah I have doubles on my Honda too. It was an option. I've never run it without them. But they're stacked on top of eachother, not arranged in a +

I run doubles on my Turf Tracer HP sometimes and in fact have them on now. To me it's just another tool in my tool box. As far as additional wear, I don't worry about it. Look at it this way, if I can run doubles and cut the lawn once, is that worse than running single blades and cutting it twice? Cutting it twice is clearly twice the wear of cutting it once....is running doubles twice the wear as running single blades...I doubt it. I have run them on my Lazer too but I'd rather have singles on that machine so when I throw on the Ultravac I don't have a ton of blowout.

StanWilhite
10-21-2011, 07:23 PM
yes! crossing them and perpendicular is the same thing.

I don't have an exmark but I asked them about doubles back when I was researching for a new mower.
Exmark is one of many mower manufacturers that are AFRAID of double blades. They claim that it might hurt their big strong commercial mower and that nothing can improve their mowers anyway.
They just don't want to do any of their own testing and admit that someone else might have had a better idea. you'll get the same Bla bla warranty disclaimer if you ask them about an ocdc or sulky. Or if you ask some of the other manufacturers.

Every mower reacts differently to doubles in different conditions. and you can use different combinations of doubles to get different results.

I have used doubles on Lesco and on Hustler walkbehinds. ON both mowers they improved the cut, lift, discharge, and bagging. I have not lost any spindles or clutches from doubles. ON both machines I use a gator on top and standard or high lift on the bottom over 90% of the time.

look at all the variables and make your own decision

yes! crossing them and perpendicular is the same thing.

I think he meant crossing them at 90 degrees (+) or in an "x" formation. I've never run doubles, but from what I've heard it doesn't matter which way you configure them.
Stan

StanWilhite
10-21-2011, 07:44 PM
yes! crossing them and perpendicular is the same thing.

I think he meant crossing them at 90 degrees (+) or in an "x" formation. I've never run doubles, but from what I've heard it doesn't matter which way you configure them.
Stan

PS. Forgot to mention that this answer is referring to decks where the blades that are not "timed"...which is most decks.
Stan

nashguy207
10-23-2011, 09:57 PM
I use an ExM 48" TT, 17Kaw. Also, I mulch ALL the leaves on my properties. I can tell you the only way to do this is with doubles. If you don't have enough power to run 'em, buy a different mower. Just doubles for me in early spring, and all through fall.

Try a low-lift blade on the bottom, and a gator on top. You'll prob. have to order the low-lift blade, they are not popular. However, it'll create less strain on the engine, and really helps to reduce blow-out.

Are you using the mulch kit with double blades??

THEGOLDPRO
10-23-2011, 10:38 PM
Im on my 3rd deck belt on my new lazer, I can only imagine how many i would be on if i ran doubles stressing the crappy 10 foot long deck belts out.

Darryl G
10-23-2011, 10:43 PM
Im on my 3rd deck belt on my new lazer, I can only imagine how many i would be on if i ran doubles stressing the crappy 10 foot long deck belts out.

Dang...how many hours on the machine? Isn't it only months old?

THEGOLDPRO
10-23-2011, 10:45 PM
lol yea bought it in the spring, It has like 350+ - hours on it.

Darryl G
10-23-2011, 10:51 PM
lol yea bought it in the spring, It has like 350+ - hours on it.

I can't imagine you're happy about that. I'm not sure doubles would make much of a difference though. Personally, I'm willing to risk a little more wear and tear for the increased productivity of doubles.

THEGOLDPRO
10-23-2011, 10:55 PM
I can't imagine you're happy about that. I'm not sure doubles would make much of a difference though. Personally, I'm willing to risk a little more wear and tear for the increased productivity of doubles.

Yea im not too happy to say the least. I would consider running doubles if the belt didn't cost $100 bucks each time it broke.

GravelyGuy
10-23-2011, 10:58 PM
Goldpro, you need to figure out what is chewing through the belts. Something isn't right. I have over 1000 hrs on my original belt and it shows no signs of breaking.
Posted via Mobile Device

THEGOLDPRO
10-23-2011, 11:06 PM
They had it in the shop last time it broke and checked the entire machine and said it must be something im doing because everything looks fine, Then the mechanic wrote a lenghtly description on the ticket saying my blades were real dull and that it appears i engage my blades while in transit etc etc, I almost choke slammed him for trying to pass it off on me.

I told the owner to put in a dispute ticket to exmark because they wern't going to cover a belt that had like 150 hours on it.

I then reminded him i have 2000 hours on my 2007 lazer with all original belts and not a single issue as well as all my walkbehinds with not a single problem.

Darryl G
10-23-2011, 11:17 PM
I'm guessing you're getting some slap when you engage the PTO but that's just a guess.

GravelyGuy
10-23-2011, 11:32 PM
That sounds pretty annoying. Sounds like my dealers.
Posted via Mobile Device

THEGOLDPRO
10-24-2011, 04:08 PM
I basically told them, I have been buying Exmark for almost 10 years, have bought multiple z-mowers as well as multiple walkbehinds,as well as countless thousands worth of handhelds over the years from the same dealer, I said if this belt issue is going to be a problem and they are not going to make it right then my next mower will not be another Exmark.

yardguy28
10-24-2011, 07:24 PM
I'm sure many will object but I think that doubles are a necessary evil only when there is a ton of growth, ie spring. For one, yes it is more stress on the engine. I kept mine on until mid July this year when they weren't needed as much and upon switching back to regular low lifts only, I noticed a considerable increase in fuel efficientcy from day one. Also, it is much more stress on the clutch to engage the blades. With doubles I must have the throttle at about 1/3 to engage and sometimes more, however with one set of blades, I can engage at idle every time. These two reasons are why I only run doubles when it is necessary since I would rather not spend more than I have to on fuel at the time and would rather sell the mower with the original clutch in good working order rather than spend several hundred on a new one.

i'll be the one to disagree. i see your in KY, well i'm in IN so conditions should be similar.

i handle the spring growth just fine with one set of blades. it's called a grass catcher and i spend maybe 15 min. more bagging a lawn than side discharging the lawn.

height of cut also plays a factor in this. i cut my lawns high. never below 3" and usually higher than 3".

by the time summer is around and the dryer weather kicks in i'm up to 4-4.5" on most of my accounts.

Father&Daughter Lawn care
10-24-2011, 07:40 PM
How do doubles compare to mulching blades. Can someone post some pictures of how they install the doubles?

StihlMechanic
10-24-2011, 09:15 PM
Im on my 3rd deck belt on my new lazer, I can only imagine how many i would be on if i ran doubles stressing the crappy 10 foot long deck belts out.

What model Lazer? Next Laser? Deck Size?

THEGOLDPRO
10-24-2011, 10:41 PM
2011 lazer, 60 inch deck.

Darryl G
10-24-2011, 11:49 PM
How do doubles compare to mulching blades. Can someone post some pictures of how they install the doubles?

Doubles mulch better and throw more air. You just arange them in a plus pattern, one on top of the other and bolt on. If you have a blade bracket you may have to adapt something. If not just bolt on like + but make sure your bolts are long enough. There are different combinations of blades you can run. I'm running a gator on the top and high lifts on the bottom on my Turf Tracer HP now. I wouldn't recommend them if you're running a mulch kit.

StihlMechanic
10-25-2011, 01:11 AM
2011 lazer, 60 inch deck.

We both use the same $100-120 belt. I havent had a problem and when I was in shop never saw a problem. I would look very carefully at the pulleys, the smallest nick can shred a new belt pretty quick. I have 125 hrs on my machine and the belt looks new. Sorry you have had so many belts fail, especially since they cost so much.

jkingrph
10-25-2011, 07:25 AM
Has anyone ever run doubles using as the lower blades, those that are the standard size for your deck and as upper blades, a smaller set?

clc19chase
10-25-2011, 08:15 AM
it would help some with the rotating mass. not sure if it would effect performance though.

Groomer
10-25-2011, 08:48 AM
gold, sent you a pm. I had the same belt issue with my exmark Z 48". Been through 5 belts at 550 hrs. My dealer has been more than fair, and the last time, a few weeks ago, they really checked everyting. Replaced a pulley, tightened another piece, rechecked the alignment. Told me to start engaging at full throttle, seems to be working so far.

THEGOLDPRO
10-25-2011, 07:55 PM
So i decided to try the double blades today in spite of my belt issues lol, I will say this, The cut was amazing, best i have seen all year, no clumping, no need to double cut to spread the clipping out more, the double blades really demolish the grass clippings. and threw them forever.

One the flip side it really slowed the mower down, Even with my 29efi kohler it was a slug, You could tell the engine was working to spin the blades and keep momentum on hills and stuff. It also didn't sound too good for the clutch, When you would engage the blades it would pretty much have to work up to speed to get the blades moving.

Althoe it was a good test and i liked the results i think for the sake of the machine and the added wear ill stick with singles.

Darryl G
10-25-2011, 10:00 PM
I imagine you had double high lifts on....they are a load for sure. I have tried them before and my mower sounded like a frakin helicopter and they do pull the engine down. Highlifts and Gators are what I'm running.

Snapper Jack
10-25-2011, 10:56 PM
So i decided to try the double blades today in spite of my belt issues lol, I will say this, The cut was amazing, best i have seen all year, no clumping, no need to double cut to spread the clipping out more, the double blades really demolish the grass clippings. and threw them forever.

One the flip side it really slowed the mower down, Even with my 29efi kohler it was a slug, You could tell the engine was working to spin the blades and keep momentum on hills and stuff. It also didn't sound too good for the clutch, When you would engage the blades it would pretty much have to work up to speed to get the blades moving.

Althoe it was a good test and i liked the results i think for the sake of the machine and the added wear ill stick with singles.
Those doubles sure do snap the life of the engine,that and it's next to impossible to get that mass group to balance out,at least that's my experience.What was the width of your blades and lift,these two alone have a huge impact on performance. It's great to see others chime in who are experiencing the exact results as you.

Sammy
10-26-2011, 01:29 AM
High Lift on top, Low Lift on the bottom.
Been running them on one of my mowers for 10 years.
Thanks goes to Eric Elm for them.

THEGOLDPRO
10-26-2011, 10:34 AM
Those doubles sure do snap the life of the engine,that and it's next to impossible to get that mass group to balance out,at least that's my experience.What was the width of your blades and lift,these two alone have a huge impact on performance. It's great to see others chime in who are experiencing the exact results as you.

I was running 2 sets of high lifts. i dont own any other kind of blade. the mower is a 60inch so whatever size blades those are. I didnt notice any difference in vibration due to balance it seemed fine.

THEGOLDPRO
10-26-2011, 10:37 AM
maybe in the spring time i will buy a set of mulching blades and try the highlifts on bottom mulchers on top and see if that changes my mind.

Darryl G
10-26-2011, 10:51 AM
Yeah, 2 sets of high lifts is pretty extreme. It's not a bad idea to pick up a set of low lifts either. They're great for summer use when it's dry and dusty.

JDiepstra
10-26-2011, 11:47 AM
I read a post from one of the blade manufacturers that running high lift blades costs your mower 3 horsepower over a regular blade. Running 2 sets is costing 6 horsepower I imagine. Now I am not sure what type of blades this was compared to exactly.