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View Full Version : Emark or Dixie Chopper


Mack
12-09-2004, 07:34 PM
I did some research and I have a Exmark 52, have been looking at the Snapper 61 with the 27hp. The other day I went to the Dixie Chopper dealer and I really like how they look and feel. In my area they are cheeper then anything else. My question is does anyone like the Dixie Chopper and how they cut. I am really happy with my Exmark and performance and would like to stick with them but might jump ship.

Travis Followell
12-09-2004, 07:45 PM
The Dixie's are very good mowers IMO. They have a great cut from what i've heard and its impossible to get them to clump the grass. They just won't do it and thats something that simply can't be said about a lot of other mowers. They have many good features that make them superior to other mowers. Something intersting about them is that only 6% of Dixie Choppers profits come from selling parts for their mowers and this came right off of their website. Thats proof of the quality of these machines. I bet a lot more than 6% of Exmarks profits come from parts. I'm sure you will not be dissapointed with a Dixie.

Mico Landscaping design
12-09-2004, 07:47 PM
EXMARK FOR in my eyes! :cool2:

YardPro
12-09-2004, 07:50 PM
never used a dixie, but after seeing them at the gie they are alot more complex than the exmark.
i have had exmark and they were flawless.

generally i follow the kiss principal.

s and s mowing
12-09-2004, 08:28 PM
exmark, for sure. i cant get past the indoor-outoor carpet on the slopper.

Sir mowsalot
12-09-2004, 08:35 PM
I have a dixie chopper and i love it. Never had an exmark so i cant compare the two. Its cut is awesome, and rides great. Very durable. If any mower deck belts break it is a snap to fix. Just remove two wing nuts and the whole floor lifts off and they are right there. As a matter of fact, that is one big reason i like them, they are basic, which means if they need to go into the shop, its less labor time, because theres nothing in the way to first remove, for the most part. Maybe the other brands are like that too, i dont know.

Travis Followell
12-09-2004, 09:22 PM
Dixie's can be repaired in half the time of any other mowers because of their simple design where all componets are easily accessable.

Eric 1
12-09-2004, 10:29 PM
I like my chopper. :cool: It is simple to work on, cuts good rides nice, the VTC makes it real responsive, the ocdc id aw some and the stainless body panels are easy to keep clean. My only complaint with it is that it is not as good on hills as i would like. 20-22* is all it can take (safely :D )

Eric 1
12-09-2004, 10:30 PM
exmark, for sure. i cant get past the indoor-outoor carpet on the slopper.

:rolleyes: Take it off! :rolleyes:

Lawn-Scapes
12-09-2004, 10:43 PM
I owned a 60" Lazer for 3 years prior to this past year. I own two 72" Choppers now and could not be happier. Well... maybe I could.. if they were diesels. :)

RedWingsDet
12-09-2004, 10:46 PM
I owned a 60" Lazer for 3 years prior to this past year. I own two 72" Choppers now and could not be happier. Well... maybe I could.. if they were diesels. :)

Hey, I used to own a 50" Dixie, loved it...

But hey, not to be disrecpectful in anyway, as i Like the dixies, when I look in that pic you have in your sig, it looks like it doesnt chop the grass up fine enough and leaves clippings all over the lawn?

Is it like that alot? Or was it just wayyyy to tall? Or am I seeing things?

Lawn-Scapes
12-09-2004, 10:54 PM
That's my daughter in that picture and it is a reminder of how lucky I am to have her in my life.

That lawn was 8+ inches tall that day. It was double cut.

Here's a better one for ya.. The lawn was cut in this direction for the first time when picture was taken.

RedWingsDet
12-09-2004, 10:56 PM
That's my daughter in that picture and it is a reminder of how lucky I am to have her in my life.

That lawn was 8+ inches tall that day. It was double cut.

Here's a better one for ya.. The lawn was cut in this direction for the first time when picture was taken.

WOW. Thats awsome, both how much you love your daughter, and those stripes. I didnt think dixies could stripe that well, mine sure didnt!

Anyways, thats awsome, and man, dixie has really proved their quality to me :)

Have a Good one and Merry X-Mas!

Richard Martin
12-10-2004, 04:16 AM
never used a dixie, but after seeing them at the gie they are alot more complex than the exmark.
i have had exmark and they were flawless.

generally i follow the kiss principal.

Which Dixie were you looking at? I have 2 of them and they don't get any simpler.

I was at my Dixie dealer last week and they said they were going to start selling Ferris walkbehinds just so they could make some money on parts. "Belts, blades and filters, that all we ever sell"

In 1250 hours of use on my first Dixie I have replaced 1 throttle cable and 1 brake cable. It even has the original belts on it.

YardPro
12-10-2004, 08:38 AM
the ones at the gie.
the chain deck hangers, lots of things going every which way....

LakeMurrayLawns
12-10-2004, 10:00 AM
John Deere Green, the only way to cut !!!

65hoss
12-10-2004, 11:04 AM
John Deere Green, the only way to cut !!!
Next time I need to paint a deck I will remember that. Paint it green will make it cut better. :waving:

Just kidding ya!

Richard Martin
12-10-2004, 11:05 AM
the ones at the gie.
the chain deck hangers, lots of things going every which way....

What's complex about the chain deck hangers? They give the Dixie Chopper about the easiest to adjust deck there is. You loosen the locknut at the bottom of the hanger and turn the other nut. It goes up, it goes down. Go to your Exmark and adjust that deck up and down or side to side. I can hear you now, "Okay, which way do I turn that nut to make the deck go down?"

Admit it, you went to GIE looking for reasons not to like the Dixie.

ztoro
12-10-2004, 11:06 AM
I like my Exmarks.....

For me, it may sound dumb but I l;ike the way a machine looks as well..... The exmarks are cool a$$ looking machines....

TO me the Dixie chopper looks a little out dated...... I cannot comment to performance cause I havent used one but from the pictures above it does look like it stripes very nice. I have seen exmark stripes that looked just as good though...

YardPro
12-10-2004, 04:52 PM
What's complex about the chain deck hangers? They give the Dixie Chopper about the easiest to adjust deck there is. You loosen the locknut at the bottom of the hanger and turn the other nut. It goes up, it goes down. Go to your Exmark and adjust that deck up and down or side to side. I can hear you now, "Okay, which way do I turn that nut to make the deck go down?"

Admit it, you went to GIE looking for reasons not to like the Dixie.

LOL
i went to see the hooters chicks....

looking at the machine, it looks much more complex.
may not be, and i didn't look at them that closely. just in passing.
didn't spend any time looking at mowers there.
went looking at accessories,
pro lockers, muclh suppliers, and for the mini skid steers.

ProMo
12-10-2004, 05:21 PM
my dixie broke last week the rod that engages the blade snapped and I went to the dealer to get a new one, the dealer didnt have the part so he welded mine back together and told me I didnt owe him anything. the bypass filter broke off earlier this year and caught on fire and I had to have that rewelded thats the only major repairs ive needed in 9 yrs.

Eric 1
12-13-2004, 10:48 PM
my dixie broke last week the rod that engages the blade snapped and I went to the dealer to get a new one, the dealer didnt have the part so he welded mine back together and told me I didnt owe him anything. the bypass filter broke off earlier this year and caught on fire and I had to have that rewelded thats the only major repairs ive needed in 9 yrs.


And had that been any other mower with an electric clutch, that would have cost about $300, And atleast 1 day down time. :cool:

Eric 1
12-13-2004, 10:51 PM
I like my Exmarks.....

For me, it may sound dumb but I l;ike the way a machine looks as well..... The exmarks are cool a$$ looking machines....

TO me the Dixie chopper looks a little out dated...... I cannot comment to performance cause I havent used one but from the pictures above it does look like it stripes very nice. I have seen exmark stripes that looked just as good though...


Ztoro, this is not directed at you, I just here it allot.

To buy a mower because "it looks cool" is the stupidest thing i have ever heard of.

poonero
12-14-2004, 12:56 AM
if your looking for a easy deck to adjust, the deere is a dial thats easy. it definately isnt "stupid" to want a machine that looks good the mower is the first thing you see and no one would want a lawn that looks like a slopper. furthermore who wants to vacuum their lawn mower.

JKOOPERS
12-14-2004, 01:16 AM
i personally think the dc's look like they are home made . i looked at them 1 time and i ddint like the way the enigne was exposed

Richard Martin
12-14-2004, 05:38 AM
The engine is exposed for a reason. So it can be easily serviced or repaired if necessary.

Exmark engines are almost as exposed. The difference being an Exmark engine is horizontal and can seem to be further forward then the verticle engine of a Dixie Chopper. Why add additional weight to the mower with unrequired engine covers?

ztoro
12-14-2004, 08:22 AM
Ztoro, this is not directed at you, I just here it allot.

To buy a mower because "it looks cool" is the stupidest thing i have ever heard of.


I wouldnt only buy a mower because it looks cool... If you had 2 companies like Dixie and Exmark where the machines are pretty comparable.. I would choose the exmark because like JKoopers said the DC's look homemade....

JKOOPERS
12-14-2004, 12:55 PM
rick you said it perfectly the dixie has more access to the engine because they know you will have to work on it unlike the exmark and if you go dixiechopper.com you see what i mean by being exposed. then go to the exmark site hmmmmmmmmmm :dizzy: :cry:

Richard Martin
12-14-2004, 02:10 PM
rick you said it perfectly the dixie has more access to the engine because they know you will have to work on it unlike the exmark and if you go dixiechopper.com you see what i mean by being exposed. then go to the exmark site hmmmmmmmmmm :dizzy: :cry:

You would no more have to work on a Dixie Kohler than an Exmark Kohler. In fact over the long haul the Dixie will clearly last longer because of the superior oil filtration. There are things on the Dixie that just aren't available on a Exmark.

bigz1001
12-14-2004, 02:14 PM
rick you said it perfectly the dixie has more access to the engine because they know you will have to work on it unlike the exmark and if you go dixiechopper.com you see what i mean by being exposed. then go to the exmark site hmmmmmmmmmm :dizzy: :cry:

A Kohler is only a supplier. Both companies purchase the motors, neither are built in house. Makes no sense to say you will have to work on one Kohler any more than the next.

ztoro
12-14-2004, 02:16 PM
Does Dixie offer the liquid cooled option on their mowers?

Metro Lawn
12-14-2004, 03:00 PM
LOL
i went to see the hooters chicks....


Here you go... some of them posing with my Road Runner...

JKOOPERS
12-14-2004, 04:27 PM
hey rick i never once said what brand motor did i ? i love it how everyone puts words in your mouth :dizzy:

bigz1001
12-14-2004, 04:53 PM
hey rick i never once said what brand motor did i ? i love it how everyone puts words in your mouth :dizzy:

No, you didn't, but there are only 4 Exmark models available with a 52in. deck. 2 are exclusively available with a Kohler. One is available with either a Kohler or Kawasaki. And one is solely with the Kawasaki. Not far fetched to assume the mower would be a Kohler.

Lazer Z 52in. deck- Kohler(27 H.P)
Lazer Z AS 52in. deck- Kohler(20 H.P)
Lazer Z HP 52in. deck- Kawasaki(23 H.P.) and Kohler(23 H.P)
Lazer Z CT 52in. deck- Kawasaki(19 H.P.)

ztoro
12-14-2004, 05:08 PM
No, you didn't, but there are only 4 Exmark models available with a 52in. deck. 2 are exclusively available with a Kohler. One is available with either a Kohler or Kawasaki. And one is solely with the Kawasaki. Not far fetched to assume the mower would be a Kohler.

Lazer Z 52in. deck- Kohler(27 H.P)
Lazer Z AS 52in. deck- Kohler(20 H.P)
Lazer Z HP 52in. deck- Kawasaki(23 H.P.) and Kohler(23 H.P)
Lazer Z CT 52in. deck- Kawasaki(19 H.P.)


I didnt see jkoopers comment limiting it to a 52" either your assuming again...

Besides doesnt Dixie use a motor built by Guradian as well.... Guardian wouldnt be the same as kohler or kawasaki...

JKOOPERS
12-14-2004, 06:07 PM
bigz if you knew anything about exmark you would know 3 not 2 models are exclusively with kohler lazer z 23 & 27 , lazer z efi 28 and lazer z as 20 & 23 kohler . with the 52" you mentioned not me :dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy:

Richard Martin
12-14-2004, 06:07 PM
Does Dixie offer the liquid cooled option on their mowers?

No, but no one but Dixie offers a 54 hp gas option either.

s and s mowing
12-14-2004, 06:14 PM
Does Dixie Recommend Shampooing Carpet Before Winter Storage???????

JKOOPERS
12-14-2004, 06:15 PM
lmao s & s would you like berber or shagg on your new mower i made in my backyard?

bigz1001
12-14-2004, 06:16 PM
bigz if you knew anything about exmark you would know 3 not 2 models are exclusively with kohler lazer z 23 & 27 , lazer z efi 28 and lazer z as 20 & 23 kohler . with the 52" you mentioned not me :dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy:

Well, the Lazer Z EFI is not available with a 52" deck(only in 60" and 72" with a 28 H.P. Kohler), which Mack, the person who started the thread mentioned. So, as I said...

No, you didn't, but there are only 4 Exmark models available with a 52in. deck. 2 are exclusively available with a Kohler. One is available with either a Kohler or Kawasaki. And one is solely with the Kawasaki. Not far fetched to assume the mower would be a Kohler. :cool2:

JKOOPERS
12-14-2004, 06:19 PM
well you got me bigz i just checked the exmark book i have . but as far as th rest :dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy:

Richard Martin
12-14-2004, 06:21 PM
hey rick i never once said what brand motor did i ? i love it how everyone puts words in your mouth :dizzy:

No but the name Dixie Chopper is kinda eternally linked with Kohler since a couple of Dixie innovations ended up as standard equipment on Kohler engines. Dixie Chopper was almost singlehandedly responsible for the heavy duty canister filter that is standard equipment today and is wholely responsible for that oil cooler that comes on them.

s and s mowing
12-14-2004, 06:54 PM
What Mower Maker Is The Pioneer In Chains To Hang From Blade To Try To Help Clean Deck.

bigz1001
12-14-2004, 07:29 PM
What Mower Maker Is The Pioneer In Chains To Hang From Blade To Try To Help Clean Deck.

Mack, as you can now notice that there is nothing bad about a Dixie Chopper. If the worst thing someone can criticize is the "carpet" on the area you rest your feet, or an accessory as mentioned here, you must be looking at a solid machine.

ztoro
12-14-2004, 07:36 PM
Mack, as you can now notice that there is nothing bad about a Dixie Chopper. If the worst thing someone can criticize is the "carpet" on the area you rest your feet, or an accessory as mentioned here, you must be looking at a solid machine.



No ones arguing that Dixie isnt a top notch machine just that it looks like it was built in a garage....

although it would be nice to curl up on the berber and take an afternoon nap under a nice oak tree...

s and s mowing
12-14-2004, 07:52 PM
Come On,blade Chains An Accessory.no Other Maker Has This Accessory.please Explain.

bigz1001
12-14-2004, 07:52 PM
No ones arguing that Dixie isnt a top notch machine just that it looks like it was built in a garage....

although it would be nice to curl up on the berber and take an afternoon nap under a nice oak tree...

Personal opinion. You see homemade I see professional. I see a stainless steel machine that will not rust, reminds my of industrial kitchen equipment. As opposed to Exmark which is painted red and has the gray plastic tanks, reminds me of me stove and refrigerator.

Out of curiosity, what exactly is it that Exmark uses for it's non-slip on the floor pan?

JKOOPERS
12-14-2004, 07:58 PM
i'll tell ya what wait till that carpet gets wet and you fall and bust your a$$ . not to mention when it gets algae growing on it

ztoro
12-14-2004, 07:59 PM
Personal opinion. You see homemade I see professional. I see a stainless steel machine that will not rust, reminds my of industrial kitchen equipment. As opposed to Exmark which is painted red and has the gray plastic tanks, reminds me of me stove and refrigerator.

Out of curiosity, what exactly is it that Exmark uses for it's non-slip on the floor pan?


skateboard grip tape :)

they put the difference between the cost of grip tape and berber into the looks.. money well spent... :)

bigz1001
12-14-2004, 08:08 PM
skateboard grip tape :)

they put the difference between the cost of grip tape and berber into the looks.. money well spent... :)

I wonder where they put the money they saved using plastic and red paint instead of stainless steel.

This didn't need to be a bashing thread. The only reason I got involved in it was because someone said you would need to work on a motor more in one than another, when odd's are they would be the same brand of engine (which Exmark doesn't have the Amsoil filtration) than the other, and then the biggest thing against it are the looks and carpet.

ztoro
12-14-2004, 08:35 PM
I wonder where they put the money they saved using plastic and red paint instead of stainless steel.

This didn't need to be a bashing thread. The only reason I got involved in it was because someone said you would need to work on a motor more in one than another, when odd's are they would be the same brand of engine (which Exmark doesn't have the Amsoil filtration) than the other, and then the biggest thing against it are the looks and carpet.


Bashing......? I think its opinions..... no one has said the machine is junk....

Just like you dont like plastic gas cans, we dont like berber on our mowers....

ztoro
12-14-2004, 08:38 PM
.......... to work on a motor more in one than another, when odd's are they would be the same brand of engine (which Exmark doesn't have the Amsoil filtration) ........

what are you trying to say about the AMS filter? That the same kohler would perform different in 2 different machines because of the AMS filter....

TGIB
12-15-2004, 01:50 AM
Could someone tell me why Dixie Chopper makes the mower deck out of regular carbon steel and the body panels are stainless.

I don't get it. The mower shell is the part most likely to suffer from rust, with all the high acid, wet grass clippings impacted inside it, and the paint on the under side of any mower will only last a few days at most before the grit and stuff begin to wear through it. Why not make the mower deck out of stainless and make the body panels out of regular painted steel. Have you ever seen the body of a mower rust through ?

What purpose is served by putting 2 filters in series on the same hydraulic line ? If you need to filter the oil down to say 10 microns - then use a single 10 micron filter and it will do the job for you. The second filter is just there for Dixie's marketing dept. to talk about. It's a "sales tool " - it has no other real purpose.

If other brands of Z mowers were having problems with their pumps and motors wearing out prematurly, there might be some percieved value in using extra filters - but I have never heard that WEAR OUT is a problem for any brand of Z mower. How often have you ever heard of WEAR OUT occuring in anything with less than 4000 hours on it ? You might see a blown gasket, or seal, and maybe even a twisted or broken motor shaft - but wear out ? - not hardly.

Extra cooling for the hydro oil [a radiator or fan] has a lot more value than an extra filter gives. Keeping the oils temperature down will maintain the oils viscosity and slows the oxidation and chemical degradation of the oil. This is what will really extend the useful life of the hydro pump and motors.

Finally, when will Dixie Chopper figure out that their smaller diameter rear tires don't lay down enough rubber surface area, and their high seating position, and high body structure give it a high center of gravity , combined with small tires the machine is not a good hill mower as noted in an above post. They try to overcome their design problems by putting super aggresive bar cleat tires on the rear end so it will mow a bit on the hills, and these tires then want to rip up the turf in a nice yard when you zero turn the mower.

As for the appearance of the Chopper, what it really looks like to me is that it's state of the art in zero turn mowers - CIRCA 1983 ! All the Z mowers looked like this 20 or 25 years ago ! But , most everybody else has changed and updated their design - except DC !!!

Richard Martin
12-15-2004, 04:15 AM
TGIB, welcome to the boards.

To address the stainless body panels, some people like the way stainless looks. That's why they are there.

About the twin hydro filters, you should have left this one alone because you don't have a clue. The twin filters are not in series, they are in parallel. The left filter goes to the left side pump and motor and the right filter goes to the right side pump and motor. After the fluid leaves the motors it is mixed back together with a t fitting and then goes through large twin coolers.

Also Dixie Chopper uses a 25 X 12.00 rear tire. How much bigger in diameter would you like it to be? In-so-far as hillside stability goes Dixie makes up for the higher center of gravity by making the mowers with the widest rear wheel base there is. A Dixie will slide down a hill long before it flips over. Wanna use the Dixie on hills at more than 20 degrees (which is pretty dang steep) just switch over to the optional "turf" type tires that Dixie has available.

The bar type tires do no more damage to any lawn than the turf type with an experienced user.

You talk like someone who has seen a Dixie but never actually used one.

Richard Martin
12-15-2004, 04:37 AM
what are you trying to say about the AMS filter? That the same kohler would perform different in 2 different machines because of the AMS filter....

The use of a 1 micron bypass filter is proven to decrease engine wear by a significant amount. I don't remember the percentage but I can look it up on http://www.bobistheoilguy.com if you would like or you can go there and look it up yourself.

Richard Martin
12-15-2004, 06:44 AM
On the Amsoil bypass filter check this out:

http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g1063.pdf

Read the part about the independant testing done on the BE-90 (the filter Dixie Chopper uses) on the second page.

Now would you rather have a engine with the Amsoil filter or one without it?

This isn't to say that you can't put the Amsoil filter on any Kohler engine. You can. It's just going to cost you extra if it's not a Dixie Chopper.

ztoro
12-15-2004, 08:27 AM
On the Amsoil bypass filter check this out:

http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g1063.pdf

Read the part about the independant testing done on the BE-90 (the filter Dixie Chopper uses) on the second page.

Now would you rather have a engine with the Amsoil filter or one without it?

This isn't to say that you can't put the Amsoil filter on any Kohler engine. You can. It's just going to cost you extra if it's not a Dixie Chopper.


my point was that BIGZ1001 said that the same motor in 2 different machines would not perform differently.. According to you and your links they would???????????

bigz1001
12-15-2004, 09:22 AM
my point was that BIGZ1001 said that the same motor in 2 different machines would not perform differently.. According to you and your links they would???????????

Actually, if you are wanting to point fingers...

rick you said it perfectly the dixie has more access to the engine because they know you will have to work on it unlike the exmark and if you go dixiechopper.com you see what i mean by being exposed. then go to the exmark site hmmmmmmmmmm

And my post was mearly stating there was no factual evidence to support this claim.

ztoro
12-15-2004, 09:29 AM
I am confused..

You say there is no difference between the kohlers

A Kohler is only a supplier. Both companies purchase the motors, neither are built in house. Makes no sense to say you will have to work on one Kohler any more than the next.


Jkoopers says the Exmarks are more reliable(doesnt specify a make)
rick you said it perfectly the dixie has more access to the engine because they know you will have to work on it unlike the exmark and if you go dixiechopper.com you see what i mean by being exposed. then go to the exmark site hmmmmmmmmmm :dizzy: :cry:

Richard says the Dixie Kohler engines are better.....
On the Amsoil bypass filter check this out:

http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g1063.pdf

Read the part about the independant testing done on the BE-90 (the filter Dixie Chopper uses) on the second page.

Now would you rather have a engine with the Amsoil filter or one without it?

This isn't to say that you can't put the Amsoil filter on any Kohler engine. You can. It's just going to cost you extra if it's not a Dixie Chopper.

Richard Martin
12-15-2004, 09:32 AM
my point was that BIGZ1001 said that the same motor in 2 different machines would not perform differently.. According to you and your links they would???????????

It depends on what you mean by perform differently.

If the question is longevity then yes, the Kohler engine on the Dixie should out-perform almost any other Kohler engine mounted on any other mower given every thing else is equal.

If the question is mowing power that changes things. Dixie Chopper muddied things by coming out with the HP+1 high performance muffler. The low restriction muffler supposedly gives the Kohler twins 1 extra horsepower.

Does it work?

I changed from the factory muffler on my XW2500 25 Kohler equipped mower to the HP+1 a couple of years ago. The HP+1 definitely had a different tone and I thought I could feel a little bit more power but without putting the engine on a dyno I think you would have a hard proving that it actually had more power.

ztoro
12-15-2004, 09:32 AM
And my post was mearly stating there was no factual evidence to support this claim.

Actually Richard just posted a link that he says supports the Dixie choppers engines are a better engine than the Exmark engines

Meg-Mo
12-15-2004, 09:35 AM
Take a look at the BAD BOY.

Richard Martin
12-15-2004, 09:36 AM
I am confused..

Richard says the Dixie Kohler engines are better.....

Where's the confusion? Just read the document that I linked to and draw your own conclusion. It's a no brainer.

Richard Martin
12-15-2004, 09:40 AM
Actually Richard just posted a link that he says supports the Dixie choppers engines are a better engine than the Exmark engines

He was replying to JKOOPERS claim that the Dixie Chopper Kohler would break down more ofen that the Exmark Kohler.

bigz1001
12-15-2004, 09:42 AM
Actually Richard just posted a link that he says supports the Dixie choppers engines are a better engine than the Exmark engines

I can only speak for myself, not Richard even though it apears him and I are on the same page.

The engines are made by the same manufacturer, so it is a bogus claim to say you will have to work on a Dixie Chopper Kohler Engine more than an Exmark Kohler engine. However Dixie Chopper does give you the added benefit of advanced filtration to help extend the life of the engine.

ztoro
12-15-2004, 09:58 AM
It all comes down to whether you want stainless steel and berber

or plastic and flashy red paint..........

bigz1001
12-15-2004, 10:07 AM
It all comes down to whether you want stainless steel and berber

or plastic and flashy red paint..........

and skateboard tape

ironhead
12-15-2004, 04:39 PM
One of the first things you should look at when comparing the 2 machines should be how reliable and safe it is. With so much talk in other threads on here about being professional and a legit business with insurance and licenses it makes me wonder about some things. Can you DC guys please tell me how your insurance company feels about covering a machine that can't pass the ANSI power equipment safety standards? A machine so "well built" that ANSI considers it unsafe. That's kind of an oxymoron isn't it?

JKOOPERS
12-15-2004, 04:46 PM
i never said anything about the kohler being better on an exmark i am talking about being better overall in the whole machine. yes dc has more access but exmark knows they build a quality machine and they dont need all that open space like dc

bigz1001
12-15-2004, 05:43 PM
One of the first things you should look at when comparing the 2 machines should be how reliable and safe it is. With so much talk in other threads on here about being professional and a legit business with insurance and licenses it makes me wonder about some things. Can you DC guys please tell me how your insurance company feels about covering a machine that can't pass the ANSI power equipment safety standards? A machine so "well built" that ANSI considers it unsafe. That's kind of an oxymoron isn't it?

I don't know much about this subject and will have to do some research. However because the Dixie Chopper isn't ANSI complaint doesn't mean it is unsafe. Besides John Deere and Everride, what brands and models are?

"ANSI/OPEI B71.4-1999 Commercial Turf Care Equipment - Safety Specifications. This standard was developed by the Outdoor Power Equipment Institute (OPEI), an organization comprised of manufacturers of this type of equipment, with assistance and input from over 20 other technical organizations including the American Society of Agricultural Engineers. It was then reviewed and approved by ANSI. This is an industry consensus standard, meaning that manufacturers voluntarily comply with it; it is not enforced by any government agency. Riding mowers that comply with this standard will have a decal on the machine certifying compliance. Compliance certification is done by an independent testing organization, not the manufacturer. The manufacturer has to pay for the compliance testing. Not all manufacturers of commercial mowers choose to comply with this standard or obtain certification."

Fatheroftwo
12-15-2004, 06:23 PM
I have 2 Snapper Z's and 1 Dixie Chopper. The DC will cut circles around both of the Snapper's. Mine has the 32 HP on it and I've never had it in a bind to where it wouldn't finish the job. Works great in hilly areas and will cut as fast as it will go. Food for Thought.

Richard Martin
12-15-2004, 06:41 PM
One of the first things you should look at when comparing the 2 machines should be how reliable and safe it is. Can you DC guys please tell me how your insurance company feels about covering a machine that can't pass the ANSI power equipment safety standards? A machine so "well built" that ANSI considers it unsafe. That's kind of an oxymoron isn't it?

The reliability of Dixie Chopper is as good if not better then most other mowers. Like my local Dixie dealer said a couple of weeks ago, "Belts, blades and filters, that's all I ever sell".

State Farm didn't even bat an eye and yes, they know it's a Dixie Chopper.

Can you show where it says that Dixie Chopper couldn't pass the ANSI test?

The ANSI test is like the Good Housekeeping Seal of Approval. It's nice to have but it's not required.

If the Dixie is so unsafe then why hasn't the CSPC ever ordered any recalls like they have several times on Exmark mowers?

YardPro
12-15-2004, 07:21 PM
i don't really know anything about the DC, but from an asthetic viewpoint, BOY THEY"RE UGLY.

nanny nanny boo booo

chevyman1
12-15-2004, 07:27 PM
Since when is stainless steel ugly? Be a man, drive a Chopper!

Sir mowsalot
12-15-2004, 07:33 PM
I love my chopper, but my wife says the outdoor carpet is hard on her knees. :)

YardPro
12-15-2004, 07:36 PM
Since when is stainless steel ugly? Be a man, drive a Chopper!

when it's shaped into a crude looking box with an engine hanging off the back and astro turf on the front.

seriously
it looks like the vent hood over a grill in a resturant.

chevyman1
12-15-2004, 07:40 PM
YardPro you are a riot man....Dixie builds their mowers like for a couple reasons. Keep the price down on BS parts you don't need, allows easy access for belt changes and general maintenance, and no rust. The engine hardly hangs off the back, it's safely mounted like your mower. Exmarks seem to mow great too.

ztoro
12-15-2004, 07:48 PM
The only dixie chopper I like is the one that OCC built for them.. i was glad to see they didnt use berber on the floorboards....

bigz1001
12-15-2004, 08:14 PM
One of the first things you should look at when comparing the 2 machines should be how reliable and safe it is. With so much talk in other threads on here about being professional and a legit business with insurance and licenses it makes me wonder about some things. Can you DC guys please tell me how your insurance company feels about covering a machine that can't pass the ANSI power equipment safety standards? A machine so "well built" that ANSI considers it unsafe. That's kind of an oxymoron isn't it?

Doing a quick search on this site it is stated by several sponsors that various additions many do to their mowers on the site knock them out of ANSI compliance. Two examples are of running double blades and installing an OCDC.

YardPro
12-15-2004, 08:20 PM
chevyman
i am glad you're seeing the humor

i am sure they have a very high quality mower.
i'm just ribbing
they just look clunky and boxie to me.

K c m
12-15-2004, 08:24 PM
Looked up dixie chopper and saw the "run behind model" anyone run these? how do they cut at 8mph?

Travis Followell
12-15-2004, 09:29 PM
I don't know the maximun speed on it but it uses the same decks as their ztr's and they will cut perfect at 15 mph. They have the best cutting deck available. There's no other machine that can cut at full speed as good as the Dixie's.

s and s mowing
12-15-2004, 09:42 PM
I don't know the maximun speed on it but it uses the same decks as their ztr's and they will cut perfect at 15 mph. They have the best cutting deck available. There's no other machine that can cut at full speed as good as the Dixie's.



ARE YOU SAYING THAT THE DIXIE CUTS BETTER THAN A EXMARK???????? OR A SCAG????? OR A HUSTLER??????? OR A TORO????

Macvols
12-15-2004, 09:51 PM
Go with Exmark!! Have many hrs. on both machines and Exmark is the way to go!!

Travis Followell
12-15-2004, 09:54 PM
ARE YOU SAYING THAT THE DIXIE CUTS BETTER THAN A EXMARK???????? OR A SCAG????? OR A HUSTLER??????? OR A TORO????
Yes at 15 mph because Exmark doesn't even make a mower that goes 15 mph. Please don't take my comment the wrong way. I'm not bashing any manufacturer here i'm simply saying that a dixie will cut better at 15 mph than any other mower. There are only 3 mowers that will run that fast- Dixie, Hustler, & Bad Boy.

s and s mowing
12-15-2004, 09:59 PM
now travis,do you really believe you can get even a fair cut at 15 mph.??aint no way.

Travis Followell
12-15-2004, 10:37 PM
I know it sounds far fetched but I do believe it is possible to achieve a good cut at that speed if the ground and grass will allow it. Around here the answer to that question is no. The ground is just too rough and we only mow once a week. The only way it would cut that fast is if the ground was as smooth as a piece of paper so the deck would not bounce and just be cutting the tips off of the grass. If the grass was very tall it would not be possible. You'd have to mow twice a week.

s and s mowing
12-15-2004, 11:17 PM
[QUOTE=Travis Followell]. They have the best cutting deck available. There's no other machine that can cut at full speed as good as the Dixie's.



hummmmmmmmmmm,i dont understand your logic,if it cuts better at 15 than any other mower,and has best cutting deck available,why in the world wouldnt it cut better than any other at 6mph.also,also travis have you or have you seen anybody cut at 15 mph with a dixie chopper,and the cut looked better than any mower available,or at 12 mph.

tshank
12-16-2004, 12:26 AM
I don't know the maximun speed on it but it uses the same decks as their ztr's and they will cut perfect at 15 mph. They have the best cutting deck available. There's no other machine that can cut at full speed as good as the Dixie's.

Restrain yourself, young man. I have a Dixie that I dearly love, but a Exmark will give a better cut. But I take the Dixie to places that 'marks would fear to tread. As for being ugly, so are A-10 Warthogs, but they do what they do quite well.

1grnlwn
12-16-2004, 01:16 AM
This is the stupidest thread I have ever read. You are arguing over whether a 5" dong or a 5 1/4' dong is best. Any real man knows it's all about the man in the boat! Shut up and worry about your business, that where the difference is. :blush:

JKOOPERS
12-16-2004, 02:28 AM
Yes at 15 mph because Exmark doesn't even make a mower that goes 15 mph. Please don't take my comment the wrong way. I'm not bashing any manufacturer here i'm simply saying that a dixie will cut better at 15 mph than any other mower. There are only 3 mowers that will run that fast- Dixie, Hustler, & Bad Boy.
now look what thier solgan is " THE WORLD'S FASTEST LAWN MOWER " how is that possible with the quote above

Travis Followell
12-16-2004, 06:46 AM
They can call them the worlds fastest lawnmower because they put a small jet engine on one and had it going about 80 mph. That was the worlds fastest lawnmower.

Mack
12-16-2004, 06:46 AM
Wow, I did not mean to start anything, but I am glad of all the comments. I
feel I guess that its all up to what you like. Like I said I have the exmark and have been happy and no problems. I just like how the dixie chopper looks and drives.

Travis Followell
12-16-2004, 06:54 AM
[QUOTE=Travis Followell]. They have the best cutting deck available. There's no other machine that can cut at full speed as good as the Dixie's.



hummmmmmmmmmm,i dont understand your logic,if it cuts better at 15 than any other mower,and has best cutting deck available,why in the world wouldnt it cut better than any other at 6mph.also,also travis have you or have you seen anybody cut at 15 mph with a dixie chopper,and the cut looked better than any mower available,or at 12 mph.
I'm not saying they cut better than any other mower at a slower speed like say 10 mph. There are many mowers that go that speed that have a great cut. Too many to list. Maybe what i'm trying to say is a 15 mph cut with a Dixie would be as good as 10 mph cut with other mowers. I'm not trying to tell everyone dixie's are better than any other mower but this is just my opinion.

Mack
12-16-2004, 07:33 AM
So if you can cut at 15mph and others at 10mph would you not be saving time and be able to do another yard or two in the day. Just asking

YardPro
12-16-2004, 08:44 AM
now travis,do you really believe you can get even a fair cut at 15 mph.??aint no way.


no way.
they have a maximum blade tip speed of 18000fps.
the same as all the others. how then can the blade cut any better than the hustler, etc.

YardPro
12-16-2004, 08:45 AM
Any real man knows it's all about the man in the boat!

only guys with small boats say that


:p

Richard Martin
12-16-2004, 09:46 AM
no way.
they have a maximum blade tip speed of 18000fps.
the same as all the others. how then can the blade cut any better than the hustler, etc.

Not quite. The 60" Dixie comes from the factory with a engine pulley to blade pulley ratio of 1:1. With a blade length of 20.5 inches that works out to 19,311 feet per minute at 3600 rpm. At the factory recommended 3750 rpm it works out to 20,117 fpm.

There is no maximum blade tip speed.

chevyman1
12-16-2004, 09:59 AM
You guys should listen to Richard Martin. The guy knows what he is talking about and only quotes stats and facts, not hearsay

YardPro
12-16-2004, 01:34 PM
guess that's why they don't meet the ANSI saftey standards.
for a machine to comply with ansi
the blade tip speed cannot exceed 18000fps.

and just to clarify.....
I am in no way disparaging DC. i don't know a thing about them, except i think they are ugly. and that's all a matter of personal preferance.
I have talked with several people that swear by them. so they must be pretty good.

I like My hustler alot. it's as fast, somewhat lighter, and cuts fantastic, but i am sure there are some out there that don't like them...

it's really nice that in this thread we can DEBATE and not get into heated personal attacks.

kudos to all

Richard Martin
12-16-2004, 02:30 PM
guess that's why they don't meet the ANSI saftey standards.
for a machine to comply with ansi
the blade tip speed cannot exceed 18000fps.



Actually the number that you seek is 19,000 FPM. Even the Hustlers are bumping at that number and can just as easily go over it with a slight change in top RPM.

52" Super Z 18,900 FPM
60" Super Z 18,350 FPM
72" Super Z 18,800 FPM

If Dixie Chopper was really worried about the BTS it would be a simple matter of slowing the RPM back down to 3600. At that RPM the BTS would be argueable as to whether or not it's over or under 19,000 due to differences in belt and pulley widths.

YardPro
12-16-2004, 06:05 PM
19,000
man i thought it was 18K

also i thought the test was done at full throttle.
but since i'm wrong on the actual speed, that info is suspect too..
lol
they still look like a resturant grill hood...

:)

Travis Followell
12-16-2004, 06:49 PM
[QUOTE=Mack]So if you can cut at 15mph and others at 10mph would you not be saving time and be able to do another yard or two in the day. Just asking[/QUOTE
If some of your yards were smooth enough and the grass wasn't very tall you could go over 10 mph and save some time so you could mow more in a day.

Willmow4dough
12-16-2004, 06:53 PM
I have had both exmark and dixie and I would agree that dixie's are tough machines.

The only problem that I had with the dixie was the cut quality. For the most part I thought that it did fine until there was a little dew on the grass. I had deck clearing trouble.

I switched to exmark the next season after I tried the demo. I love my exmarks and until I find a better deck design I will stick with exmark.

I would Demo both and form your own oppion first.

Richard Martin
12-16-2004, 08:00 PM
also i thought the test was done at full throttle.
but since i'm wrong on the actual speed, that info is suspect too..


I know of very few (actually none) 4 stroke engines that are run at wide open throttle. If they were run at full throttle the governor would be pointless. A lot of people think the governor's purpose is to limit the RPM but that is wrong. The governor opens the throttle when the RPM drop under engine load in an attempt to move the RPM back up. If the engine were already running at full throttle the governor would have nothing to do. That's why you don't see governors on 2 strokes. They are run at wide open throttle because that's where they make power. The top RPM on a 2 stroke is set by richening up the air/fuel mixture. The richer the mixture, the lower the top RPM. It explains the procedure in your Stihl service manual if you have one.

If you have an old B&S equipped push mower that you don't care about yank the air cleaner assembly off of it and play with the carburetor butterfly by hand. You can get those little suckers really cranking some RPM that way and I'm talking in excess of 4,000.

Travis Followell
12-16-2004, 08:08 PM
They might turn 4000 but not for long. I've seen rods and rod caps literally shatter after about a minute or two at speeds like that.

YardPro
12-16-2004, 08:25 PM
I know of very few (actually none) 4 stroke engines that are run at wide open throttle. If they were run at full throttle the governor would be pointless. A lot of people think the governor's purpose is to limit the RPM but that is wrong. The governor opens the throttle when the RPM drop under engine load in an attempt to move the RPM back up. If the engine were already running at full throttle the governor would have nothing to do. That's why you don't see governors on 2 strokes. They are run at wide open throttle because that's where they make power. The top RPM on a 2 stroke is set by richening up the air/fuel mixture. The richer the mixture, the lower the top RPM. It explains the procedure in your Stihl service manual if you have one.

If you have an old B&S equipped push mower that you don't care about yank the air cleaner assembly off of it and play with the carburetor butterfly by hand. You can get those little suckers really cranking some RPM that way and I'm talking in excess of 4,000.


uh,
i am quite the 2 stroke expert having raced motocross all my life, and been my own mechanic and a mechanic for several others, and also a the 2 stroke forum (due to technical expertiese) moderator on a very large MX website.. Without going into detail i will say that your comparison is incorrect.
the description you are refering to is in lamens terms, and is not how to "set the Rpm's" all the fuel screw does is to richenor lean out the mixture of the main jet circut. this will affect the RPM, but the air volume as dertermined by the butterfly opening is a better way to do so.
also you don't see governors on two srokes becuase there is no valve train that can "float the valves" from excessive rpm's.

the "wide open" setting on a machine is set at the rpm range that generates the most HP while not exposing the engine to sustained rpm's that is outside it's design specs that would shorten it's life.

alot of the new high performance 4 strokes will out rev a two stroke.
they have ultra light skirtless pistons, and can churn out 14,000rpm, sustained.
my las bike was a crf 450 and woould rev to 12000 rom's, it's little nrother, the crf 250 and the ys250f will generate in the neighborhood of 13500 rpm's.

Richard Martin
12-17-2004, 04:33 AM
uh,
Without going into detail i will say that your comparison is incorrect.
the description you are refering to is in lamens terms, and is not how to "set the Rpm's" all the fuel screw does is to richenor lean out the mixture of the main jet circut. this will affect the RPM, but the air volume as dertermined by the butterfly opening is a better way to do so.
also you don't see governors on two srokes becuase there is no valve train that can "float the valves" from excessive rpm's.

We're talking hand held 2 stroke engines here, not racing 2 strokes. My information comes directly from the Stihl service manual.

The setting of the high speed screw affects not only engine performance but also its maximum speed. The maximum permissible engine speed will be exceeded if the setting is too lean (screw turned too far clockwise). There is then a risk of engine damage, particularly as a result of a lack of lubrication and overheating. Corrections to the high speed screw may be carried out only if an accurate tachometer is available. Using the tachometer, run the engine at full throttle and turn the high speed screw clockwise to obtain the engineís maximum speed.

Richard Martin
12-17-2004, 04:54 AM
My time ran out. Here's the rest of my post:

That sounds pretty clear to me. I am aware that if a person were to put a bigger bore carb on one of these engines that they would wind far beyond design specifications at WOT but on these hand held it cannot be assumed that a user would know when to stop giving the engine the gas.

BTW, I am from the old school of 2 stroke bike engines. We used to race Suzuki GT-380s and Yamaha RD-350s. The buzz words back then (mid 70s) were Barnett clutches, reed valves, stacked cylinder base gaskets (the classes didn't allow porting), shaved heads, Wiseco pistons, K&N filters, expansion chambers etc. So yeah, I've been around a 2 stroke or two in my time.

YardPro
12-17-2004, 06:10 PM
no difefence in the operating principle of the two though
the screw is for fine tuning only.
richening the mix cuases a hp drop, lowering the attainable rpm, leaning increases rpm by increasing hp once you're past the optimum mixture setting on the lean side you get a lean "bog"
with the small walbor's and zamma's you don't have a tapered needle that lifts out of the main jet allowing more fuel to pass as the taper is lifted out with more throttle opening like the larger bike carbs. the small carbs accomplish this with a mix screw. the screw it determined the amount of fuel that can pass through the oriface.

alot of those terms are still around. Barnett still makes clutches, although hinson is the hot one now, all 2 strokes have reeds, the boyseen rad valve and the V force are the hot setups now. you can still stack base gaskets to alter port timing, and shave the head to compensate for the increased cylinder volume.
wiseco pistons are still trick, K&N only makes filters for thumpers. Twin air, and uni are the hot aftermarket filters.
All two strokes have expansion chambers now, FMF, pro circut,and bill's are the hot aftermarket ones.......... There's a time warp to bring you into the present..... :)

this dialog started however with the assumption that BPS was measured at WOT.
and what wide open really is. Is it the max engine RPM's or the max sustainable rpm, that is preset from the factory by was of throttle stops.
i think it's the latter.

good debate.....