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chambers 38
12-20-2004, 06:58 PM
Ya I know this is a RESADENSHAL mower, But I think its going to be better then my craftsmen rider 42”
I was at Lowe’s home improvement and found this new ZTR cub cadet 50” ZTR rider.
Price was $2999.99 this for me is a big selling point,
I’m thinking this would be better then my craftsmen until I can get my Ex mark that I want.
So who here has a cub cadet, and what do you think about it??
Thanks Gil

Envy Lawn Service
12-20-2004, 07:11 PM
I guess you are talking about that Z-Force ZTR? Most people seem to like the cut from that new 50" deck on the 1024 Cub lawn tractor. I wouldn't think it would be a bad choice for a temporary mower. It's hard to get much in the way of a commercial mower around 50" for 3K.

j fisher
12-20-2004, 07:32 PM
I made the same mistake your getting ready to make. I purchase the 44" ZForce. Had trouble with the spindles and deck. The REAL problem was getting parts. Took 6 months to get a new deck (under warranty). Do yourself a favor and get a commercial machine if possible. You'll save yourself a lot of headaches. By the way, I sold my ZForce as soon as I got it back together for less than half what I paid.

Travis Followell
12-20-2004, 07:37 PM
I think it would work out pretty good for you as a temporary machine. It is made by MTD so parts should be easy to get and there are plenty of service centers if you had a warranty issue. It is a pretty good deal at $3000.

j fisher
12-20-2004, 07:41 PM
I think it would work out pretty good for you as a temporary machine. It is made by MTD so parts should be easy to get and there are plenty of service centers if you had a warranty issue. It is a pretty good deal at $3000.

That's what I thought.

matthew horner
12-20-2004, 07:44 PM
finance the exmark

chambers 38
12-20-2004, 07:56 PM
Ya on the finance,, its that 14 % interest thing
and one a hand full of custemers,, I know I will be getting more in the upcoming spring, but on the other hand my crapman has already let me down on a hand full of custemer's.
Ever since I work on the gas tank (it was leaking so i replaced it) it dosent like to start the first time.

Envy Lawn Service
12-20-2004, 08:05 PM
Many are offering 0% - 3.9% for 36 months. Some are even offering a winter program of 0 interes, 0 payments for 6 months, the 1.9% there after with monthly payments of 2% of the original balance.

But yeah, I understand about financing. I don't like to do it, not even with the above offers. It's risky business and a lot can happen over the term of a loan, especially if you just have a handful of accounts.

rodzilla94
12-20-2004, 08:08 PM
i have the exact same one the ztr 50 cub cadet for a back up i traded a old 4 wheeler for it. the guy at my mower shop wanted it so we traded it was a new cub....as far as my opinion its ok machine but dont use it for your primary mower it wont last the thing hates mowing hills its to light for that i just took it to the shop to get some warranty work done and the brigs 22hp motor (the thing only has 10 hours on it) they have had the thing for 3 weeks and cant figure out the prob. with the motor save your money and get a walk behind mower trust me my friend dont bother

Envy Lawn Service
12-20-2004, 08:23 PM
i have the exact same one the ztr 50 cub cadet for a back up i traded a old 4 wheeler for it. the guy at my mower shop wanted it so we traded it was a new cub....as far as my opinion its ok machine but dont use it for your primary mower it wont last the thing hates mowing hills its to light for that i just took it to the shop to get some warranty work done and the brigs 22hp motor (the thing only has 10 hours on it) they have had the thing for 3 weeks and cant figure out the prob. with the motor save your money and get a walk behind mower trust me my friend dont bother

I thought about the hill thing because I see one around here where there is hills and this sucker has had some AGRESSIVE tires put on it. But, this guy is in Florida, so I didn't figure that was an issue.

As far as the Briggs motor, gimmie the info on it and describe the problem.
I can probably help you get this resolved presto. Believe me, 3 weeks will turn into 3 months with todays techs. Most have little to no diagnostic skills.

chambers 38
12-20-2004, 08:28 PM
all right,, I'm going to go to Sarasota chain saw sometime soon and talk to them about a 32 ex mark wb, I think I can get a belt drive for like $3500 or so??
Thanks for the forewarning
Gil

rodzilla94
12-20-2004, 08:36 PM
well i took the thing in for a recall on the pulleys and i told the guy it wont start (turn the motor over like it has a weak battery). he called and told me about 2 weeks ago that the cam was wrong in the motor so i said well just fix it so i called today he told me that he put in the new cam and a new crank and he lased the valves back to spec then he told me the thing back fired like a cannon and to beat all he doesn't know what else to do to it so he was going to get the brigs rep to come by and take a look at it.......i told him if it was not fixed by or after Christmas that i request a new motor he told me that he will discuss it with the guy...by the way it really doesn't like hills it will slide off them quick....real quick :p

Envy Lawn Service
12-20-2004, 08:43 PM
all right,, I'm going to go to Sarasota chain saw sometime soon and talk to them about a 32 ex mark wb, I think I can get a belt drive for like $3500 or so??
Thanks for the forewarning
Gil
Now that's not a bad idea. Get your small mower purchase out of the way while you are small. But if you can, I would scan the local trade papers for a lightly used hydro at a good price. You should be able to pick one up reasonable this time of year.

The only thing I would like to stress is that you will have a more durable piece of equipment by going commercial, but shouldn't expect production gains from a small commercial mower. Not unless your Craftsman is a real slug.

edward hedrick
12-20-2004, 08:46 PM
Try your local Lesco dealer The 52 hydro w 19 kaw and a Lesco sulky around 3500. I saw the Cub at Tractor Supply
Looked good. The Toro time cutter Z w 17 Kaw is another option.Ed

N.H.BOY
12-20-2004, 08:47 PM
Ya I know this is a RESADENSHAL mower, But I think its going to be better then my craftsmen rider 42”
I was at Lowe’s home improvement and found this new ZTR cub cadet 50” ZTR rider.
Price was $2999.99 this for me is a big selling point,
I’m thinking this would be better then my craftsmen until I can get my Ex mark that I want.
So who here has a cub cadet, and what do you think about it??
Thanks Gil


I own a Cub Tank, but this is a ztr also, but it's a commercial cub. Runs and cuts great. I understand money is always an issue. I got mine for 0% for three years and my one commercial job I have pays for it twice a month. Check with your local dealer, if your mowing for good I would get a commercial mower for sure. What is the warranty on that Cub at Lowes?

Envy Lawn Service
12-20-2004, 08:49 PM
well i took the thing in for a recall on the pulleys and i told the guy it wont start (turn the motor over like it has a weak battery). he called and told me about 2 weeks ago that the cam was wrong in the motor so i said well just fix it so i called today he told me that he put in the new cam and a new crank and he lased the valves back to spec then he told me the thing back fired like a cannon and to beat all he doesn't know what else to do to it so he was going to get the brigs rep to come by and take a look at it.......i told him if it was not fixed by or after Christmas that i request a new motor he told me that he will discuss it with the guy...by the way it really doesn't like hills it will slide off them quick....real quick :p

Briggs will replace that whole motor once the rep gets involved. If not, call Briggs Tech support and discuss the problem with them. The person you talk to there will contact your district rep and have him deliver a replacement ASAP. They stand behind their product very well.

chambers 38
12-20-2004, 08:50 PM
well i took the thing in for a recall on the pulleys and i told the guy it wont start (turn the motor over like it has a weak battery). he called and told me about 2 weeks ago that the cam was wrong in the motor so i said well just fix it so i called today he told me that he put in the new cam and a new crank and he lased the valves back to spec then he told me the thing back fired like a cannon and to beat all he doesn't know what else to do to it so he was going to get the brigs rep to come by and take a look at it.......i told him if it was not fixed by or after Christmas that i request a new motor he told me that he will discuss it with the guy...by the way it really doesn't like hills it will slide off them quick....real quick :p



cam is in wrong!!!! is it 180 degree back!! small engine's are EZ
no comps (yet)

chambers 38
12-20-2004, 08:54 PM
I own a Cub Tank, but this is a ztr also, but it's a commercial cub. Runs and cuts great. I understand money is always an issue. I got mine for 0% for three years and my one commercial job I have pays for it twice a month. Check with your local dealer, if your mowing for good I would get a commercial mower for sure. What is the warranty on that Cub at Lowes?

It is only one year

chambers 38
12-20-2004, 08:55 PM
Try your local Lesco dealer The 52 hydro w 19 kaw and a Lesco sulky around 3500. I saw the Cub at Tractor Supply
Looked good. The Toro time cutter Z w 17 Kaw is another option.Ed

Thanks I will look in to that hydro

yrdandgardenhandyman
12-20-2004, 08:56 PM
I started last with a cub Z-Force 44" for smaller yards. Put 200 hours on it last year and not a lick of problem. Some of the early ones had problems with pulleys and spindles but that was corrected and some had problems with the drives but the answer to that was that people were pressure washing the drive units and getting water in them through the vents. 100% of the drive failures were due to that one issue.
I wouldn't get the 50" RZT. It is built pretty light and I can see were there would havelittle durability.
Some of my customers liked the smaller Z-Force over the 50" Tank that I demoed. They just had a problem with a large heavy unit in their yard. Also, if you don't have a lot of money to start I think the Cub is a great starting point. Lots of grease zerts and built heavier than most residentials. In my opinion, which I'm sure will be slaughtered here :p , it is as close to commercial as you can get. Very well built machine after they got a few early bugs out of the design. Of course, if you can afford a true commercial, I'd certainly go for the commercial. I'm looking at a new Tank to start the next season with.
All in all, the Z-Force IS a fine machine compared to Craftsman.
I should add that my main mower was a 1999 Husky 48" garden tractor/ mower. Does a good job too and is very reliable but not very fast. Still use the Husky to push snow and on landscaping and reseeding jobs and my wife likes to use it on our own yard because it gives a very good cut. Surprisingly, it has held up very well too, for what it is. The only thing I don't like about it is the front wheel pivot system. Too light and the bracket bends too easily. Should have been cast instead of stamped.

rodzilla94
12-20-2004, 08:58 PM
thanks guys for your opionons ....im not bashing cub that bad it is a good mower for home owners but thats it. as far as cut the thing cuts like any commecal mower i must say it does a good job just the motor thing chaps my a#@ :p ...

beransfixitinc
12-20-2004, 09:00 PM
Briggs will replace that whole motor once the rep gets involved. If not, call Briggs Tech support and discuss the problem with them. The person you talk to there will contact your district rep and have him deliver a replacement ASAP. They stand behind their product very well.


For what it's worth, I wish every customer would call Briggs first, give them a sob story, and get a repair authorization number. We, as a shop have no problem replacing stuff, it's getting Briggs to cop to the thing being their mistake. Believe me, as a dealer, we are only one face up the totem pole from the customer. We can see what would need to be replaced to fix the problem, but because it costs $20 more, they have you replace all the little stuff first.. The customer gets it back, it messes up again and you have a customer back at the shop and upset. So, they actually spend $100 to save $20 by the time we replace the new parts that were damaged again when the actual cause of the problem happens again and takes out all the new parts.

rodzilla94
12-20-2004, 09:04 PM
well he called the rep they told him they had a lot of factory defects go out that slipped by inspection so they sent the parts to fix it to begin with the guy at the shop told me that he put the parts in and BANG back fire and i could mentally picture the guy standing there scratching his head lol

TGIB
12-20-2004, 09:16 PM
The RZT 50 Cub Cadet is an OK machine for its intended purpose. But this is a light duty homeowner machine. It will not hold up to the amount of use you will give it in a lawn service in Florida.

If the price of your equipment is the controling factor for you, I would suggest that you consider a 48 inch commercial walk behind mower.

For instance, you could get a Gravely GR1548 Pro walk mower with a trailing sulkey for the SAME price as the light duty Cub Z you are considering. A commercial machine like this will last 10 times longer with 1/10 the repair costs !!

The maintenance costs will be so much lower for the commercial machine - you simply cannot afford to make the mistake of thinking that the light duty machine will cost less - trust me , it will wipe you out !

There may be other brands of pro walk machines that you could also consider. Since you mentioned Exmark, why don't you also look at their pro walks ? I only mentioned Gravely because I know their price is no greater than the price of the Cub Z you saw at Lowes.

Finally, if you want to have a mowing BUSINESS - stay out of Lowes, Walmart, Home Depot, or Sears if you are searching for equipment. These places do not have the power equipment a professional needs in his business. All they have is the lightest duty throw away stuff [without prompt parts or service] and you cannot afford any of this silliness if you have a real business.

You need to get familiar with the better power equipment dealers in your area. Why do you think all the other real pro lawn companies have this higher grade of equipment that comes only through proffessional DEALERS ?
It's because this is the lowest cost way to go. A good dealer with good reliable service and high quality equipment will make your business - the junk house box stores with nothing to offer will eventually break you.

Envy Lawn Service
12-20-2004, 09:21 PM
For what it's worth, I wish every customer would call Briggs first, give them a sob story, and get a repair authorization number. We, as a shop have no problem replacing stuff, it's getting Briggs to cop to the thing being their mistake. Believe me, as a dealer, we are only one face up the totem pole from the customer. We can see what would need to be replaced to fix the problem, but because it costs $20 more, they have you replace all the little stuff first.. The customer gets it back, it messes up again and you have a customer back at the shop and upset. So, they actually spend $100 to save $20 by the time we replace the new parts that were damaged again when the actual cause of the problem happens again and takes out all the new parts.

well he called the rep they told him they had a lot of factory defects go out that slipped by inspection so they sent the parts to fix it to begin with the guy at the shop told me that he put the parts in and BANG back fire and i could mentally picture the guy standing there scratching his head lol

Well, I've never had any issues dealing with briggs. The story has always been similar to the second quote. Usually they are very proactive and will openly admit if issues exsist. I can't say the same for Kohler or Kawasaki. They would let you chase your own tail for a year before they would admit they had 1000 engines in a model series come in with the same symptoms. Then they would part it out or short block it before they would replace it.

Maybe they don't treat their certified shops as well as the customer.
They should if they don't. If I were you, if you are having that much trouble, why not go ahead and suggest that to the customer as the first step to save you time and trouble?

rodzilla94
12-20-2004, 09:31 PM
well the dealer has been up front with me the hole time the only thing that gets me is they dont call me i call them the cub dealer is a good guy but i have to call to get a update......im going to sell it to a friend and get a q36 with the money for a back up mower .....oh my primary is a m60 tank love the thing the only reasone i dont get that upset is i got it for a trade i dont have alot of money in it...if i had to buy it outright.......no no no

chambers 38
12-20-2004, 09:41 PM
The RZT 50 Cub Cadet is an OK machine for its intended purpose. But this is a light duty homeowner machine. It will not hold up to the amount of use you will give it in a lawn service in Florida.

If the price of your equipment is the controling factor for you, I would suggest that you consider a 48 inch commercial walk behind mower.

For instance, you could get a Gravely GR1548 Pro walk mower with a trailing sulkey for the SAME price as the light duty Cub Z you are considering. A commercial machine like this will last 10 times longer with 1/10 the repair costs !!

The maintenance costs will be so much lower for the commercial machine - you simply cannot afford to make the mistake of thinking that the light duty machine will cost less - trust me , it will wipe you out !

There may be other brands of pro walk machines that you could also consider. Since you mentioned Exmark, why don't you also look at their pro walks ? I only mentioned Gravely because I know their price is no greater than the price of the Cub Z you saw at Lowes.

Finally, if you want to have a mowing BUSINESS - stay out of Lowes, Walmart, Home Depot, or Sears if you are searching for equipment. These places do not have the power equipment a professional needs in his business. All they have is the lightest duty throw away stuff [without prompt parts or service] and you cannot afford any of this silliness if you have a real business.

You need to get familiar with the better power equipment dealers in your area. Why do you think all the other real pro lawn companies have this higher grade of equipment that comes only through proffessional DEALERS ?
It's because this is the lowest cost way to go. A good dealer with good reliable service and high quality equipment will make your business - the junk house box stores with nothing to offer will eventually break you.
sorry I messed up read the one under this one

chambers 38
12-20-2004, 09:42 PM
The RZT 50 Cub Cadet is an OK machine for its intended purpose. But this is a light duty homeowner machine. It will not hold up to the amount of use you will give it in a lawn service in Florida.

If the price of your equipment is the controling factor for you, I would suggest that you consider a 48 inch commercial walk behind mower.

For instance, you could get a Gravely GR1548 Pro walk mower with a trailing sulkey for the SAME price as the light duty Cub Z you are considering. A commercial machine like this will last 10 times longer with 1/10 the repair costs !!

The maintenance costs will be so much lower for the commercial machine - you simply cannot afford to make the mistake of thinking that the light duty machine will cost less - trust me , it will wipe you out !

There may be other brands of pro walk machines that you could also consider. Since you mentioned Exmark, why don't you also look at their pro walks ? I only mentioned Gravely because I know their price is no greater than the price of the Cub Z you saw at Lowes.

Finally, if you want to have a mowing BUSINESS - stay out of Lowes, Walmart, Home Depot, or Sears if you are searching for equipment. These places do not have the power equipment a professional needs in his business. All they have is the lightest duty throw away stuff [without prompt parts or service] and you cannot afford any of this silliness if you have a real business.

You need to get familiar with the better power equipment dealers in your area. Why do you think all the other real pro lawn companies have this higher grade of equipment that comes only through proffessional DEALERS ?
It's because this is the lowest cost way to go. A good dealer with good reliable service and high quality equipment will make your business - the junk house box stores with nothing to offer will eventually break you.

yes I agree with every thing you have said, the think is that I am trying to give my customers the most I can, but the crapman is not the way I wont to go, to explain my situation to all,, I am 22 and a tech of 5 years, I lost my dad in November of last year and I'm now caring after my mom of 60 young years. I don't make a more then $19,000.00 a year and need to do more to cover what my father left behind (alot of bills).I did lawn care before I became a auto tech and was good at it but I was a scrub!!
And now I am trying to be a full time LCO hopefully in the upcome year or two. I don't have two penny's to rube together and only have what I have.
I was hoping to get something bigger and faster for the upcoming year example,,
Hustler 36" ZTR
Gravely new34" ZTR
or something from Ex mark like a 48" or so
I like the hustler super z 36" but I don't have a dealer near me
I have a business plan and "all my duck in a row" the only thing missing is the 40 or so customers that I'm hoping to get this spring.
The other thing that is agents me is my credit, its not great but not bad either.
All I know is This going to work out , just God has'net shone me how yet. payup :waving:

chefdrp
12-20-2004, 09:58 PM
you might want to checkout the Lesco like another had said. I have a Hydro 48 inch float deck with casting sulky and accelerator grass catcher. Mower was only 3,799 or real close to that. Great cutting mower. Check some of my pics of some lawns.

chambers 38
12-20-2004, 10:08 PM
Dose anyone one have a link to THAT mower, I whent on there web site and dident see it

Envy Lawn Service
12-20-2004, 10:09 PM
Well, as dad always used to tell me.... "son that's a hard row to hoe"

And it is. Life is hard sometimes, and business is harder. But it can be done. I started out with less stuff, less income, and no credit. In other words I started out as scrub kid. I used a borrowed 21" push mower, hand scythe, sling, hand sheers, loppers and other non-powered hand tools. Feet were my transportation.

I made the sacrafices, did the best I could with what I had, did whatever I had to, and sometimes did without. Ironically, I hated this back then too... with a passion. Just as I hated a lot of the other crap I had to do to make a buck when I had no other choice.

But the point is I did it. I did without all the things that were not a must, only spend what I absolutely had to until I had enough to buy something of my own or make an investment in something that would pay for itself many times over with the money I would earn with it. It sucked but I made it!

You can too!

Envy Lawn Service
12-20-2004, 10:13 PM
Dose anyone one have a link to THAT mower, I whent on there web site and dident see it
That's a good suggestion for a mower, no doubt.
Here is a link:
http://www.lesco.com/?PageID=81&MenuItemID=5&SubMenuItemID=78&P=lesconews/vol42_2/vol42_2_newproducts.htm

And a picture:
http://www.lesco.com/LESCONews/vol42_2/float-48-54-2004.jpg

Envy Lawn Service
12-20-2004, 10:15 PM
Same thing as the Cub...
But cheaper and available with bigger decks as well.

Sir mowsalot
12-20-2004, 10:21 PM
Chambers 38,
Since your looking at buying a temp mower till you get exmark, and you dont want to do the financing thing, did you consider the possibility of buying a good used commercial ztr? Who knows, if you got a good one, you might not need to buy a brand new one for a while. Just some food for thought.

Travis Followell
12-22-2004, 08:01 PM
You may also want to check out the Better Quick 36. There is a link at the top of the page for it. It is a 36" commercial hydro walk behind for $2000 including shipping. Check it out.

edward hedrick
12-23-2004, 08:03 PM
Chambers: the Lesco is #708688 its a fixed deck machine

I own 52 Lesco wb fixed deck, cuts good,very well made.

bought mine 1997. Ed

chambers 38
12-25-2004, 05:54 PM
Well I was going to my local dealer Wednesday to see about financing a grasshopper 218? (I think it was) small 48inch ZTR. On grasshopper website there was a deal for 1.9% interest no payment, no nothing for 6 months. As I left the dealer I ran apone 2 walk behind for sale one 48” lesco and one proline 36”encore.
The man wonted 1000.00 for both!! The encore was in good shape and lesco needed drive belts and blade belts. So I asked what he wonted for the encore since I didn’t have 1,000.00. So I bout the proline 36” for 400.00$, I demo the mower there worked fine only needs a switch to kill the motor.
I think I made out ok I now have at least a commercial mower for a little while.

Thanks for all your help
Gil

Travis Followell
12-25-2004, 06:11 PM
Sounds like you got a good deal on that Encore. It should be a good mower to get started with.

Envy Lawn Service
12-26-2004, 12:29 AM
Now that's not a bad idea. Get your small mower purchase out of the way while you are small. But if you can, I would scan the local trade papers for a lightly used hydro at a good price. You should be able to pick one up reasonable this time of year.

The only thing I would like to stress is that you will have a more durable piece of equipment by going commercial, but shouldn't expect production gains from a small commercial mower. Not unless your Craftsman is a real slug.

Gil,
Congrats on the Encore. Sounds like you atleast bought yourself piece of mind. Small mower purchase taken care of. Now go get some work, charge accordingly and let the little mower earn you one of the big boys before you wear it out. Then use the pair to keep moving on up!!!