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View Full Version : is murray a good brand


BLandL
12-28-2004, 11:50 PM
just wondering if murray is a good brand and if it will work for commercial use?

Guthrie&Co
12-28-2004, 11:52 PM
C:\Documents and Settings\Jack Guthrie\My Documents\My Pictures\wtf.jpg

The Dude
12-28-2004, 11:58 PM
Murray is one of the best brands out there. And a little known fact about Murray is that their mowers require no oil. Yep, no oil! Saves lots of $$ that other guys have to spend, putting your operation on top.

Have fun

out4now
12-28-2004, 11:59 PM
Definatively, No. Stick with the stronger brands and don't be duped by a commercial tag on anything that can be bought at Sears, Home Depot, Target, Walmart etc. Go to a good repuatable lawn shop and pick out something good. Be prepared, it won't be cheap. A good highend 21 inch self propelled push mower commercial will run 800 - 1000 bucks to give you an idea of price.

bldinkel
12-29-2004, 12:08 AM
everyone knows that murray is top of the line. it's way better than dixie chopper, hustler, etc. why would you ask such a stupid question?

actually if your just starting and that's all you can afford --- use it till you get enough money and enough clients to need a commercial mower. just my opinion.

TheKingNJ
12-29-2004, 12:18 AM
yeah if i owned anything made buy murry i wouldn't waiste my money buy putting oil in it eather. The oil would be worth more then the mower to me.

geogunn
12-29-2004, 12:29 AM
blandl--murray mowers are not generally made to, nor would they perform to commercial mowing specifications/expectations.

they have an anticipated mowing life expectancy and that isn't long as compared to a heavy commercial made unit.

I think your question is a valid question.


GEO :)

Geezer
12-29-2004, 12:34 AM
Murray, owned by Senyang Hejin Holding Company (a Chinese company), filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy in November of this year. They owe Briggs and Stratton $40 MILLION !!! The Murray product line is big with mass retailers such as WalMart.....not commercial users.

Keep researching....

65hoss
12-29-2004, 12:37 AM
As I stated in your other thread...buy comm'l grade equipment if at all possible. Don't spend the same money over and over again. No, murray is not a comm'l grade mower. It may cut pretty good and get you started, but it will NOT hold up to comm'l work.

ChadA
12-29-2004, 12:43 AM
I Agree. A Residential Mower Just Can't Take The The Abuse Day In And Day Out That A Commercial Mower Can.

meets1
12-29-2004, 12:46 AM
I agree with the Oil statement. No matter the kind of oil, the oil will be worth far more in the end than the mower!

Soupy
12-29-2004, 12:48 AM
For a 21" that is not going to get used much at all they are fine. The 21" actually has a great cut. I used to use one for 2 back lawns every week. But for a primary mower you will want to stay away from them.

For a rider I would look at a good commercial brand like John Deer or kabota to name a couple. But these can cost a lot of money and I think you would be better off getting a quality walk-behind.

smlavin
12-29-2004, 01:23 AM
To quote a line from the movie "The Fly": "Be afraid. Be very afraid."

A 21" push mower that runs $150 might be OK. You can recoup your money in 6 to 10 lawns. Just be sure to put a lot of money back by mid summer because you WILL be buying a replacement. Don't, however, go spend 500 to 1000 dollars on a rider. You would be much better off using that money toward a used commercial mower and by mid summer some of those may be for sale.

YardPro
12-29-2004, 09:17 AM
keep in mind that these mowers are for homeowners. they only cut thier lawns a maximum of 40 times per year. it's only 18 or so if they cut every two weeks.

in one week you will but a whole year's wear and tear on the machine

Ol'time Lawncare
12-29-2004, 10:07 AM
Murray is one of the best brands out there. And a little known fact about Murray is that their mowers require no oil. Yep, no oil! Saves lots of $$ that other guys have to spend, putting your operation on top.

Have fun
mmmmmmmmmmm, no oil , never herd of that, what does it use? water,lol- it has to have oil or it won't cool down. unless its a 2 stoker, but Murray don,t make 2 stokes.

ztoro
12-29-2004, 10:14 AM
Murray is one of the best brands out there. And a little known fact about Murray is that their mowers require no oil. Yep, no oil! Saves lots of $$ that other guys have to spend, putting your operation on top.

Have fun


mmmmmmmmmmm, no oil , never herd of that, what does it use? water,lol- it has to have oil or it won't cool down. unless its a 2 stoker, but Murray don,t make 2 stokes.


dont look into Medusa's eyes or you will be stoned...... :waving:

Ol'time Lawncare
12-29-2004, 10:25 AM
dont look into Medusa's eyes or you will be stoned...... :waving:
Ztoro, is there a murray that does not use oil???? teach me something

fga
12-29-2004, 10:42 AM
Ztoro, is there a murray that does not use oil???? teach me something
old time,
that is their cunning use of sarcasm... to not use oil cuz they think the oil is worth more then the machine.

I used a murry lawn tractor on one account, a few acres. it cut great when i used it. My grandfather uses a 21" murry when i can't get there to cut it. leaves a nice finish, but i don't know how they would hold up from everyday use.
but i'm one to tell you use what you have until its in your budget to upgrade. would you try a lower series lawnboy? i think they are in the 250 - 300 range new, cheaper if you buy them used. I use commercial lawnboys, paid about 7 or so when i bought them. you can always upgrade later on.

what does a murry go for? 150? cut 1 day and your machine is paid for!
like GEO said, i think you question was legitimate. good luck.

Lux Lawn
12-29-2004, 11:04 AM
I buy the 21 inch rear bag Lawnboys for around $450 with a 6.5 horse engine not as good as the ones Adam buys for $700 but still a very good mower.

fga
12-29-2004, 11:28 AM
I buy the 21 inch rear bag Lawnboys for around $450 with a 6.5 horse engine not as good as the ones Adam buys for $700 but still a very good mower.
what is that, the gold series or silver pro? that's just below the commercial model.

i think lowes offers the standard silver series, not even the silver pro, for about 3.

fga
12-29-2004, 11:32 AM
anyone ever use troy built?

Lux Lawn
12-29-2004, 11:34 AM
what is that, the gold series or silver pro? that's just below the commercial model.

i think lowes offers the standard silver series, not even the silver pro, for about 3.

Its the silver pro I got them where i buy my commercial stuff, the Lowes around here have the side baggers for around $350 but the rear I think fit on the trailer a little better and hold more in the catcher.

Triple L
12-29-2004, 11:50 AM
maby that's why Murray is going bankrupt!, I don't think murray would last a week of commercial mowing.

pjslawncare/landscap
12-29-2004, 11:53 AM
I just LOVE my fleet of Murrays! :rolleyes:

walker-talker
12-29-2004, 11:55 AM
As the majority states, Murray is not built for commercial, day in and day out use. I started using a Murray. Cables started to break and bolts falling out after the first season. I bought my Walker and sold the Murray to my dad. He mows about 1/2 acre every two weeks. Well, he use to until the axle broke after it's 3rd season. He had it welded and it broke again (not at the weld, but in another place). He retired the mower and sold it for the engine....it was still good. This was not a lower end Murray either. New, it was around $1400. Had 14hp electric start engine, 44" cut with rear wheel steering. It was great for starting out, but was not dependable in the field...where it counts.

Smalltimer1
12-29-2004, 12:01 PM
I just resurrected a Murray yesterday, rebuilt the carb, new battery and spark plug, and new fuel filter. Runs great now. It's one of the older ones, I'm guessing its around 20 years old. Has the original 11hp Briggs and Stratton. Heck, even the headlights still work. The only down side is the deck is shot from rust. I figure on keeping it til the spring and finding someone that wants a cheap rider, and let it go for something like $200.

Rust is the biggest enemy of Murrays, their metal isn't very thick and if it gets exposed to any kind of salt or corrosive agent, they will dissolve in a hurry. I've got 2 more Murrays around back that are well beyond repair though, so I'm gonna try to fix their engines and then pull em out and repower something else, or sell the engines.

beransfixitinc
12-29-2004, 12:45 PM
This is a funny thread. Actually, there is a guy that does business with us that runs Murrays, (and now one MTD from tractor supply) riders. They are cheap, and with the houses he has to cut (HUD foreclosures) and the amount of rock that overpowers the actual grass, they are much more affordable for him to use than to spend $6500 on a commercial mower only to have it torn up certainly on those trash lawns.

BLandL
12-29-2004, 01:14 PM
thanx everybody murray seemed ok but not for commercial use just sumtin to get me going

PMLAWN
12-29-2004, 01:24 PM
On a HOA that we do they have a boat storage lot that has an alarm system that is sensitive to the touch on the fence. We have to keep the weeds off the fence all the way around inside and out which is almost a mile. The tool that I found works the best is a $150.00 Murry. Faster than a string trimmer and no line cost-too many rocks and junk for any think good. We just finished our 2nd season with it and it may still work part of next year. We store it out back of the boat storage under a plastic bag. We added to the overall contract to do this add-on when thay got the alarm. We get $2100.00 a year for this part. So yes I think that the Murry is a great tool for this job.

But no I would not get one for every day cutting of customers lawns.

mownredneck
12-29-2004, 02:28 PM
Are we talking about the same Murry sold at wal-mart? Those are nothing but junk! I started out last year with one and mantained 4 yards with it last year. I sold it for $275 in sep. and bought a used John Deere lx 288 and have mantained over 25 yards this year. I had to rebuild the carberater on the Deere this year and thats it. I know the guy i sold the Murry to and he has put $900 in it. He is selling it and buying a deere. Buy a deere you may have to pay extra for it but will pay off in the long run.

Precision
12-29-2004, 02:39 PM
it is kinda like car insurance, you can't afford the car if you can't afford the insurance.

If you are just looking to make some beer money, then a murray is fine. If you just need a back yard mower for some small properties then a murray is fine.

If you want to be taken seriously by your clients and get paid top dollar for your work, a murray is not fine.

running solo you should be cutting between 8-15 lawns per day depending on acreage. The rated life span of home owner units if 50-100 hours. Assume half an hour of mowing per lawn you have 100-200 mowing before you have failure. Lets be generous and assume 15 minutes per lawn that is a max of 400 mowing before failure.

10 lawns a day that is only 40 days of mowing. that means serious repairs or replacement 5 times per year. $1200 murray rider times 5 replacements is $6000 and you still have a piece of crap. Get a 48" belt drive walk behind <$3500 and at the end of year one still have 3-5 good years left in it.

But as others have said, you will save time and money in oil changes, belt sharpenings, spark plugs, air filters and the like. No need to change them on a disposable mower. ;-)

Smithers
12-29-2004, 03:57 PM
everyone knows that murray is top of the line. it's way better than dixie chopper, hustler, etc. why would you ask such a stupid question?



If you think it's a stupid question, why are you writing your opinion with a response to a "stupid question"?

Aren't you and everyone else here to ask questions/get information. Your comment was highly inappropriate.

PrecisionLawnsInc
12-29-2004, 04:10 PM
You can find a low hours used belt drive walk behind and be better off. It will still be worth something in a couple years. No matter what you buy remember keep the blades sharp, the greasable parts greased, and the oil changed.

Ty

PLM-1
12-29-2004, 04:22 PM
I've gotta crapsman that i mow my gravel lots with...haven't torn that 10 gauge deck up yet!

K c m
12-29-2004, 06:04 PM
blandl--murray mowers are not generally made to, nor would they perform to commercial mowing specifications/expectations.

they have an anticipated mowing life expectancy and that isn't long as compared to a heavy commercial made unit.

I think your question is a valid question.


GEO :)

I beg to differ. When i first started 3 years back my murray was used on every account. It did a nice job for ther 3 years ive had it however it is used up now. Time for a new 21.

TURF DOCTOR
12-29-2004, 06:55 PM
If you mow a easy flat lot no ruts a murray is going to work a little, we mow big areas with ruts we pin there ears back if the blow up we buy again.welds break minor parts are down we fix it.

osc
12-29-2004, 07:00 PM
Information is way too cheap these days. In a few years, the green industry won't be worth anything.

Sir mowsalot
12-29-2004, 07:43 PM
I would suggest that you should try to buy a used wb on ebay. You could get a good enough one for the price of a new murray and you would be glad that you chose that route. One big thing about non commercial mowers is if you hit something like an unseen stump or root, you can very easily bend the spindles and twist the mower deck. And nothing compares to the stripes in a lawn by using a commercial mower. That alone will keep you a cut above anyone else using a non commerical mower.

Travis Followell
12-29-2004, 08:09 PM
Yes, Murray is a good brand, if your a homeowner with a small yard and want a cheap mower. They will not hold up to commercial use because they are not designed to. You'd be better off getting a used gear drive WB.

geogunn
12-29-2004, 08:11 PM
I said:blandl--murray mowers are not generally made to, nor would they perform to commercial mowing specifications/expectations.

they have an anticipated mowing life expectancy and that isn't long as compared to a heavy commercial made unit.



and you sir, quoted me and said:I beg to differ. When i first started 3 years back my murray was used on every account. It did a nice job for ther 3 years ive had it however it is used up now. Time for a new 21.

I don't know whattinthehell you think you are differing with me about. your piece of crap murray only lasted 3 years which is no where near the life of an ordinary commercial mower and I clearly said just that.

GEO :dizzy:

Ol'time Lawncare
12-29-2004, 08:46 PM
Murray is one of the best brands out there. And a little known fact about Murray is that their mowers require no oil. Yep, no oil! Saves lots of $$ that other guys have to spend, putting your operation on top.

Have fun
HEY DUDE...hide that northern NJ thing on your side bar :dizzy:

the scaper
12-29-2004, 08:50 PM
thanx everybody murray seemed ok but not for commercial use just sumtin to get me going
Thats right bland, If your just starting out and have a murray that runs and cuts grass, use it to get the money flowing so you can get a commercial mower. I started out with a K-Mart chain drive self propelled 21" that someone gave me. It had more rust than it did paint, I used it for my first six months and actualy had aquired 19 accounts before I hit a stump with it and bent the main shaft. You gotta start somewhere. Good luck buddy!

richard coffman
12-29-2004, 08:59 PM
murray is pretty much the bottom of the barrell mowers, yes they run, but they can't be run like a commercial mower is made. if you mow 10 houses a week, you'll be lucky if it lasts you 3 months. better upgrade to top quality. spend money on equipment that lasts.

think of it like this, i'f you want a girl that's cheap, you'll pay for a hooker, shure it'll last 1 or even 2 hours, but then the fun is over and you have nothing to show for it the next day other than a memory. not worth it to even the best of us guys here. Now think of a good woman as a commerial mower, shure she costs a lot, but that is in time, and when you do have her, you'll have her for life as long as you treat her good, she'll treat you good. so, in short, buy a commercial mower and have it fro many years or you could make a big mistake and have a cheap mower only last you a short time. to us professionals here, it isn't worth it. BUY COMMERCIAL. just my 2 cents.

Respectfully,

Richard/Owner :p :p :p :p

the scaper
12-29-2004, 10:11 PM
Dont listen to Richard, what could possibly be a better way to start out than a Murray mower and a cheap hooker?? :) just kidding Rich!

Guthrie&Co
12-30-2004, 01:20 AM
C:\Documents and Settings\Jack Guthrie\My Documents\My Pictures\gay_thread.jpg

Jay Ray
12-30-2004, 01:21 AM
Have a 1984 Murray 36" rider bought for $100 but the engine was smoking bad. Was given a 13hp Tecumseh and stuck it on the frame. I run doubles on it. Use it for unknown high grass lawns (foreign object damage potential), and for very wet grass.

It spares the Exmark belt drive and saves having to pull the mulch kit off it. Cut quality on the old Murrays (14 gauge deck) is better than the new ones (18 gauge sardine can metal). No manicure cut but not too awful bad.

Hope it lasts. The shallow deck packs up fast, but I lower the deck just the right amount down into a puddle with blades engaged for a couple minutes and the underside looks like it came out of the dishwasher. Hasn't hurt the spindle bearing seals so far but can't guarantee it wouldn't hurt some models.

It ain't pretty on the trailer but serves its limited purpose. Would use it for a primary mower if necessary -- to raise cash for a down payment on a belt w/b. Would try to find a spare carb, solenoid, module, starter, and make a cheap flywheel puller to keep on hand though. Shops here will work on Murrays but they hate 'em and hardly rush them to the front of the line.

PMLAWN
12-30-2004, 05:22 PM
Hey Richard- I beg to differ-- there are lots of guys that have something to show for a night with a cheap hooker. Good thing modern medication can clean a lot of it up!

JCA1
12-30-2004, 07:25 PM
If you're talking push mowers then thats not a bad place to start. If you're talking riders then pass on the Murray's and go a step or two higher in the homeowner line-up. The newer Murray riders don't cut very well, and don't hold up for crap.

pottstim
12-30-2004, 07:36 PM
Murrays are good for what they are, which is a good entry-level homeowner mower. They have their place within the market, just like commercial equipment. My family has used them for years with good results with the only weak link being spindle bearings. Since Murray switched to greaseable bearings over sealed, we haven't replaced one yet. My dad has run a 17hp/42" hydro-drive for 6 seasons with no problems at all. The carb is starting to act up, so we are going to tear into it this coming spring. Someone mentioned above that Murray decks were 18 gauge steel, which is untrue. The widebody LT's use 13 gauge steel. Yes, the company has filed for bankruptcy protection, and has recently been bought by Briggs & Stratton for $150 million. They are going to reorganize the company and get it back on track. The Chinese owners are the ones that ran the company into the ground. When it was known as Murray Ohio MFG, things were very good for the company. Hopefully, things will get better for the company so some of our fellow American workers can put food on their tables. If you can afford a commercial-grade mower, by all means go for it. But, if a Murray is all you can afford for now it should get you by for a while until you can upgrade to better equipment. Just remember its design limitations.

richard coffman
12-30-2004, 07:49 PM
Hey Richard- I beg to differ-- there are lots of guys that have something to show for a night with a cheap hooker. Good thing modern medication can clean a lot of it up!

Yea, your right, thankfully, I've never had that exsperience. Got a good laugh off your comment.

Rhett
12-30-2004, 08:21 PM
Didn't read all of the posts. I started with a Murray and a Ryobi Kombi hanging out of a Nissan. Was stationed 600 miles from family and with that I made 200 or so a week for three years. Did this after working full time. Pushed the mower so much that I broke the handle several times. Finally had a bar welded into the inside of the handle. If that is all you can afford start there and work your way up. That 169 dollar mower will start you on your way to a bigger commercial mower.

BobwithECLC
12-30-2004, 08:55 PM
Where is good ole bobbygedd to get in on this one?

Envy Lawn Service
12-31-2004, 12:58 AM
Ahhh.... trying to find old pics that are not too big :realmad:

OK.... Here's one of some warm season turf.
Can anyone guess what this was cut with?

PLM-1
12-31-2004, 01:15 AM
Ahhh.... trying to find old pics that are not too big :realmad:

OK.... Here's one of some warm season turf.
Can anyone guess what this was cut with?

A murray?

Do i get a prize????

Envy Lawn Service
12-31-2004, 01:25 AM
A murray?

Do i get a prize????

No, the free giveaway was sitting in the background of the pic if you looked hare enough.

The finished cut and stripes looks pretty much like a 36" WB.

PLM-1
12-31-2004, 02:19 AM
that looks like a Ranch King? It's it black??? Murray impostor? hard to beat that isn't it?!?!?

YardPro
12-31-2004, 08:58 AM
envy.
murray and the others will cut well.
the problem is they don't HOLD UP well.

i started out with lowe's brand MTD's and homelite weedeaters and blowers( had one shindawa t-25). they cut fine, but after three seasons, a new one would not even last through one season without the rear end or the front axle wearing out.
also they have non serivcable spindles that are $100.00 per spindle and last about a season....

Envy Lawn Service
12-31-2004, 06:48 PM
that looks like a Ranch King? It's it black??? Murray impostor? hard to beat that isn't it?!?!?

Yeah it's black and it's a Murray. It's what they call a Murray 'Select' and I bought this one back when they first came out with the line. The one in question here has a commercial grade power plant and a hydro version of the tranny that drives a lot of belt drive WB's.

envy.
murray and the others will cut well.
the problem is they don't HOLD UP well.

Absolutely agreeable. It all depends on how good the operator is and how well he takes care of the mower. Me and that little Murray do a better job than most of the outfits around here. I have the business to prove it as well. I kept the mower up and used it well. Without it, I wouldn't be where I am today and I wouldn't have all the other toys I have today.

No, ordinarily they do not cut or hold up that well. I think to a large degree this mostly henges on how most of them are equipped and I hate to say this but, on average, the type of person that typically owns them.

What I mean is, a lot of these folks mow bad places, mow over stumps, roots, rocks, scalp to the dirt, ect, and just keep on trucking. They mow with bent blades, decks, linkages, decks out of level, dull blades, ect. These same people tend not to service the equipment. They don't check, much less change the oil regularly, don't service the air filter, don't grease anything, ect.

Let's face it, when certain moving parts are not top notch quality or design to begin with, it doesn't take much neglect to do them in. Give that same type of person a commercial piece of equipment and it would last them much longer. But still, it would die a premature death.

Myself on the other hand, well I'm anal about keeping my stuff serviced and in good shape. In the case of this Murray, I also think I got pretty lucky and landed a good one. This is not at all typical, but this one has seen 4 or 5 years of commercial mowing duty, used on hills too steep to be good for an engine, used for hard core towing, has slipped off ramps more than once and has actually been ran over once.

Total damage and repairs to date: One broken hood clip, had to clean carb once, and will need a starter before much longer. Not bad in my eyes because although all years can be considered part time use, some years main mower part time, last two second mower in use, it has logged thousands of hours.

So yeah, it's a way far cry from a ZTR as far as rugged construction and I have been very lucky. But I also cannot bash or complain....

YardPro
12-31-2004, 08:30 PM
just wait until you're mowing 20 yards per day with it.
i'll bet you'll be singing a different song.

Envy Lawn Service
01-01-2005, 12:52 AM
just wait until you're mowing 20 yards per day with it.
i'll bet you'll be singing a different song.

Oh lord no! I wouldn't 'WANT' it to be the lone ranger in a full time operation.

Heck naw!!! :D

But it did serve me fine as my main mower under a pretty heavy part time schedule. During my last two full time seasons, it has served me well part time as my second mower. Wet lawns, tender lawns, gated/fenced lawns, rough lawns/places, nasty hills, and all the attachment work/towing work. It also does a good job mulching leaves and is the better quick change option for use as a convertable mower.... bag, mulch, side discharge, bushog....

There are a heck of a lot better options on the market today, that's for sure. And maybe I've been the luckiest Murray owner in the world. But all in all, for a guy starting out with little more than two nickels to rub together.... it beats the heck out of walking and will mow more than twice as fast as a commercial 21" mower, for close to the same price, or a few hundred more.

Mine paid for itself the first week I owned it, and since, it has logged more than twice the hours it cost me in dollars. Not a bad value.

sbvfd592
01-01-2005, 11:15 AM
SHOT its a matter of how long it lasts if you are nice change oil weekly and all might last you a month if u are gential with it

Smalltimer1
01-01-2005, 12:52 PM
That Murray I fixed this past week chops leaves really good to not have a mulcher kit on it or a mulcher plug. It's at least 20 years old. There's tons of people around here who actually have Murrays this old and still use them regularly. I know a guy in the next town over who does a bunch of residential mowing and uses nothing but Murrays. He replaces them every 3 years from what I can tell. He buys 2 at a time. Usually the 18hp/6spd. models. Says hydros are too much trouble (and I can agree in a Murray). There's another guy that uses Craftsmans like that too. It's all in how you take care of them.

My personal preference is John Deere, but if its free, I'm gonna use it. I got a Simplicity Regent 4211H for free 2 years ago and used it for a season trouble free and sold it for $200 the next fall.

cantoo
02-03-2005, 08:46 PM
Where are Murray's made?
Assembled?
Sold?

QualityLawnCare4u
02-03-2005, 08:55 PM
blandl, my first year in biz I bought one. It lasted 24 days and in the 24 days it tore up 10 times. Dont waste your money unless you are cutting one small yard a week.

locutus
02-03-2005, 09:38 PM
Is someone out there getting paid to recycle these tired-azz threads?

Smalltimer1
02-03-2005, 10:13 PM
Where are Murray's made?
Assembled?
Sold?

Their engines are ok, just what surrounds them is junk.

Guthrie&Co
02-03-2005, 10:45 PM
geez let it die

lawncare4u
02-03-2005, 11:13 PM
Had a friend with a Murry,made well over $100,000 with it/but he had oil in it :cool: :p :p :p :p :p :cool:

smlavin
02-03-2005, 11:17 PM
Is someone out there getting paid to recycle these tired-azz threads?
:laugh: I know what you mean. What is the deal? And this thread is relatively new. ;)

cantoo
02-03-2005, 11:44 PM
How do you make a thread die? Please post here and tell me. :p

captaingreen
02-03-2005, 11:48 PM
How do you make a thread die? Please post here and tell me. :p
Roundup Bobby, a few Italian guys, a shovel and a big trunk.....yup, that should do it :cool:

Geezer
02-04-2005, 12:26 AM
Lawrenceburg, Tennessee

...sold everywhere mass produced cheaper the better crap is sold....

Smithers
02-04-2005, 09:46 AM
Roundup Bobby, a few Italian guys, a shovel and a big trunk.....yup, that should do it :cool:
dont forget the cement truck too!!!

Norm Al
02-04-2005, 09:52 AM
murray isnt even an option!