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Mark McC
02-02-2005, 09:14 PM
I've used the search widget and have come up with little in the way of conclusive discussions, so here we go.

A few caveats: One is that rates vary geographically and demographically. Have to leave a fudge factor for that. The second is that the age of the operation may tell a lot about how many services an LCO has sold its regular customers: mature businesses have had more time to sell a higher percentage of customers more services. There are more, no doubt, but this is a good start.

For an LCO offering mow/edge/trim/blow, fertilization, aeration/seeding, shrub trimming and fall clean-up on lawns running between 1/3 and 2/3 acre, assuming the average lot is about half an acre, how much revenue would you average per customer?

DennisF
02-02-2005, 10:11 PM
I haven't done a lot of research into per customer revenue in my business, but based on the criteria that you laid out, I would guess the average to be between $1200-$1500 per year per customer in this area of Florida. The larger lawns would obviously generate considerably more revenue.
Here in Florida most customers don't take full service lawn care from the same business. Most lawns are mowed by an LCO who does not have a chemical license. There are local companies here that do nothing but fert, pesticides, herbicides for lawn and shrubs.
Another area of expertise is shrub trimming. There are companies here that specialize in topiary and custom shrub shaping. Some of my accounts use these services. There is one guy here that use to work for Disney. He maintained the topiary at Disney and Epcot. He retired from Disney and now runs a business that provides custom shrub shaping and topiary. From what I here his fees are in the stratosphere. He is also very busy.

Mark McC
02-02-2005, 10:31 PM
Dennis, that's a good start. I wondered if the per-customer wouldn't be in the range you described. I'm thinking that I should be able to average roughly $1,350, but in northern VA, that should be easier than where you are because the per-capita income up here is substantially higher (I presume).

I raise the question because I recently saw a post in which someone (I can't recall who it was) claimed to average a dab more than $2,200 per customer. I found the notion pretty interesting, but maybe a chem license is one of the things needed to start working toward that range.

has anyone else worked out this kind of number for their operation?

chefdrp
02-02-2005, 10:38 PM
if im reading the question right, in my area. My lawns will generate around 1,200. Thats without doing fert. Mow,trim,blow and shrubs and bushes. Then there the spring cleanup and leaves.

YardPro
02-02-2005, 10:41 PM
for all new full service customers we charge $1500.00/year minimum ( lots here are 75x1500 with 3Ksqft homesplus decks and drives). we have several that are $2K and up.
we are dropping an area that we have 11 homes that are almost side by side, but they are larger lots 1/3 acre and mow blow and go only. customers here are $500.00/year.

Mark McC
02-02-2005, 10:43 PM
if im reading the question right, in my area. My lawns will generate around 1,200. Thats without doing fert. Mow,trim,blow and shrubs and bushes. Then there the spring cleanup and leaves.

Darrin and Dennis, I just realized that I didn't ask how many cuts per year your regular customers average. That's an important number.

I mowed my first customer last year 27 times and it could easily have been two or three more. Of course, i signed them up before March was over and not everyone else got on board that quickly. Those who like fertilizer signed on earlier. I'm projecting this year's gross based on an average of 25 cuts, so the marketing program rolls out in a big way starting e/o February.

Dennis, I gotta figure you're averaging about 40 cuts, maybe more, per year. Sound about right?

Darrin, are you averaging 25? More than 25?

Mark McC
02-02-2005, 10:45 PM
for all new full service customers we charge $1500.00/year minimum ( lots here are 75x1500 with 3Ksqft homesplus decks and drives). we have several that are $2K and up.
we are dropping an area that we have 11 homes that are almost side by side, but they are larger lots 1/3 acre and mow blow and go only. customers here are $500.00/year.

Yardpro (what in heck is your first name?), when you say "full service," what precisely does that entail?

chefdrp
02-03-2005, 12:46 AM
right around 27. Give or take. some lawns have a fert company so in heavy growth i might have to cut 2 times a week.

DennisF
02-03-2005, 08:30 AM
My average lawn received 42 cuts during 2004. Some of them received other services (mulch, shrubs, clean-ups, gutter cleaning, etc) but about 50% were mowing, trimming, edging only. I'm going to try to do some analysis on my service records and get some accurate per customer revenue numbers. It'll take to time to study the data, but it is interesting to know the per customer revenue numbers.

timturf
02-03-2005, 09:13 AM
I've used the search widget and have come up with little in the way of conclusive discussions, so here we go.

A few caveats: One is that rates vary geographically and demographically. Have to leave a fudge factor for that. The second is that the age of the operation may tell a lot about how many services an LCO has sold its regular customers: mature businesses have had more time to sell a higher percentage of customers more services. There are more, no doubt, but this is a good start.

For an LCO offering mow/edge/trim/blow, fertilization, aeration/seeding, shrub trimming and fall clean-up on lawns running between 1/3 and 2/3 acre, assuming the average lot is about half an acre, how much revenue would you average per customer?

Plus hardwood mulching
largest lawn, 12m is $4500 note:30 yds of mulch
smallest lawn is 4m, $1,800 note: no mulch
All lawns get mowed weekly, start between 3/27 -4/7 till week after thanksgiving, which is final clean up
Occasionally will do some other work, like power wash and treat docks, half of clients are weekenders!

Mark McC
02-03-2005, 09:18 AM
Darrin, I hear ya about mowing more than once a week. I really dislike liquid fertilizers and always will until someone comes up with a way to get water-insoluble nitrogen into water. But that sounds a lot like room-temperature fusion, doesn't it?

Dennis, I'm looking forward to seeing what you'll say about per-customer revenues. As for half your customers getting more than just mow/edge/trim/blow, is that a percentage you're satisfied with or do you feel there's a reasonable way to boost it substantially?

Mark McC
02-03-2005, 09:29 AM
largest lawn, 12m is $4500 note:30 yds of mulch
smallest lawn is 4m, $1,800 note: no mulch
All lawns get mowed weekly, start between 3/27 -4/7 till week after thanksgiving, which is final clean up
Occasionally will do some other work, like power wash and treat docks, half of clients are weekenders!

Tim, I'm impressed by the numbers you get for that one client with only 4,000 square feet. $1,800 bucks? I wanna be you when I grow up.

When you say "half of clients are weekenders," do you mean you mow on Saturdays?

timturf
02-03-2005, 09:49 AM
Tim, I'm impressed by the numbers you get for that one client with only 4,000 square feet. $1,800 bucks? I wanna be you when I grow up.

When you say "half of clients are weekenders," do you mean you mow on Saturdays?

General cut 2/3 thursday, when dry, and 1/3 friday morning. I only have 8 clients, and 4 of them use the house on the weekend! By the way, general mow every 5 days in may, I try not to remove more than 1/3 of grass blade, and generally still cutting at 2.5 inches in may, and almost NEVER exceed 2.75"

DennisF
02-03-2005, 02:05 PM
Mark
I'm satisfied with the percentages of customers that take other services, since I'm solo and I really can't handle much more work than what I'm already getting. I would like to see more customers accept mulch work during the Winter and Spring when there is less mowing going on. Mulch is a high profit service since there is very little cost involved other than the mulch. I can get $45 per yard for premium cypress mulch. The mulch cost is $17 average if you buy 10 yards or more. I can put down about 3 yards of mulch per hour, so the net profit on mulch work is $84 per hour.

Gutter cleaning is another high profit service. Most homes here in Florida are single story and I can clean and flush the gutters and down spouts on the average home in less than an hour. I can get $65 per home. Again...another service with nearly no cost involved.
These prices might not sound terrific, but for Florida it's exceptional.

Lawn-Scapes
02-03-2005, 02:43 PM
I don't have many yards the size you're inquiring about. I deal with an average of 1 acre lawns. "IF" every one of my 36 clients took full service... the average cost per client would be $3964.00

Mark McC
02-03-2005, 03:52 PM
I don't have many yards the size you're inquiring about. I deal with an average of 1 acre lawns. "IF" every one of my 36 clients took full service... the average cost per client would be $3964.00

What's the range of services in question?

Lawn-Scapes
02-03-2005, 04:19 PM
Lawn maintenance (mowing), landscape maintenance (hedge trimming 2x/year & some light weeding), mulching, aerating (2x/year), fertilizing (4x/year) and lime application.

PMLAWN
02-03-2005, 04:39 PM
If i take just the residential in the 6to8K range, I get around $175 per month or $2100 a year for full service. This includes Aeration and shrub trimming.
It does not include mulch which can add another hundred or two. I will also get more for any Irrigation service.

In the commercial area they are all over the board but the biggest HOA that I do pays just over $60K. Mulch on that one is pine needles which has a limit of how many. If over, we charge. All irrigation maintenance (shut down/start up) is included but service (broken stuff-unless we did it) is not.

Cuts per year= 38 or so, Full service is March 15 thur Nov 30 each week, every other week all winter and will cut if need it.

Mark McC
02-03-2005, 09:34 PM
Well, two things are clear to me.

One is that established LCOs have a lot more market power when it comes to setting rates for standard lawn care (mowing, edging trimming and so on) than start-up operations.

The second is that the mark-up for other services is a good bit higher than for standard lawn care.

GREAT!