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View Full Version : Lebanon Fert's vs. Lesco Fert's


sniggly
02-03-2005, 08:04 PM
Okay.......I'm bored. It's been raining here for 3 days and I keep getting chased back into the house when I go out and attempt to finish my paver install........so.........my brain wanders where it will. Besides I am tired of reading posts about licensure, permagreen, etc.

Did some calling around today - just checking on Lebanon turf fert pricing vs. Lesco. Here's what caught my ear; I was told I WILL, and I emphasize WILL, get 16 weeks of controlled release from their 23-4-8.

Question 1: Has anyone experienced this? Is it true?

If I compare the cost per k, assuming we sterilize the cost down to the material only, say Lesco 24-2-11 with Lebanon 23-4-8.....the Lebanon is 85 cents higher per k (and I think you get 1k less sqft in the Lebanon bag). Here's the kicker though.......and I haven't followed through on the mathematical side of this yet.......but if the 16 week release is real, I could, in theory, reduce my annual prop visit schedule by 2 visits. THHEEENNNNNNNnnnn we get into the real cost of a visit bla bla bla. Thinkin on my fingers here......hmmmmmmmm....

Anyone pondered this? Changed from SCU to Lebanon stuff.....and saved money?

Thanks Yall!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:D

sjj14
02-03-2005, 08:15 PM
I played around with this theory when I was in the golf world(it was'nt my money i was playing with, ha-ha) and on paper it works........but mother nature usually has a say in this theory. Lets say you try it and it rains for a week directly following the app. do you think your gonna get that kind of coverage? I usually found that some follow up remedy or re-app was necessary and did you save $ by doing this? If your treatments and mother nature cooperate fully it should save you $ but how often would you be willing to bet on that!

sniggly
02-03-2005, 09:25 PM
........according to the Lebanon 'dude'.......now I can't remember what the guy said. Anyway, I think he said something about the release rate not being affected by elements such as rainfall etc. Sounds wrong I know......but....I am going to have to call him back tomorrow I guess.

philk17088
02-03-2005, 09:31 PM
........according to the Lebanon 'dude'.......now I can't remember what the guy said. Anyway, I think he said something about the release rate not being affected by elements such as rainfall etc. Sounds wrong I know......but....I am going to have to call him back tomorrow I guess.
It depends on what type of slow release N it is.

I use Lebanon and it's a much better fert than Lesco in my opinion.

kfish
02-03-2005, 09:48 PM
I have access to both Lebanon & Lesco. Haven't checked the Lebanon prices yet for '05 but saw a couple of Lesco's prices on line the other day - one was up about 6% & another was about 18% ! My lebanon dealer is about 3 minutes from my house sooooo....

timturf
02-04-2005, 09:41 AM
Okay.......I'm bored. It's been raining here for 3 days and I keep getting chased back into the house when I go out and attempt to finish my paver install........so.........my brain wanders where it will. Besides I am tired of reading posts about licensure, permagreen, etc.

Did some calling around today - just checking on Lebanon turf fert pricing vs. Lesco. Here's what caught my ear; I was told I WILL, and I emphasize WILL, get 16 weeks of controlled release from their 23-4-8.

Question 1: Has anyone experienced this? Is it true?

If I compare the cost per k, assuming we sterilize the cost down to the material only, say Lesco 24-2-11 with Lebanon 23-4-8.....the Lebanon is 85 cents higher per k (and I think you get 1k less sqft in the Lebanon bag). Here's the kicker though.......and I haven't followed through on the mathematical side of this yet.......but if the 16 week release is real, I could, in theory, reduce my annual prop visit schedule by 2 visits. THHEEENNNNNNNnnnn we get into the real cost of a visit bla bla bla. Thinkin on my fingers here......hmmmmmmmm....

Anyone pondered this? Changed from SCU to Lebanon stuff.....and saved money?

Thanks Yall!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:D

Why don't you post the labels for the two products!

In other words, we need alot more info

sniggly
02-04-2005, 10:17 AM
I read your post and thought......not a bad idea. I don't have a lot of time this morning to do a thorough search but greenbook.net didn't have the label for their product...or I didn't see it.

Here is a link to their website that list technical data sheets for the product line. http://www.lebanonturf.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=prd.product_details&pid=324

Bear in mind these are not labels. I'll have to look better later.

Thanks.

kfish
02-04-2005, 10:22 AM
Good point. Sorry about that.

Merit .2% 0-0-7 2004 $44.70 - 2005 $64.75
MACH 2 1.33% 24-5-11 2004 $45.00 - 2005 $54.70
MOMENTUM 21-0-12E W&F 2004 $23.48 - 2005 $25.65

timturf
02-04-2005, 11:35 AM
I read your post and thought......not a bad idea. I don't have a lot of time this morning to do a thorough search but greenbook.net didn't have the label for their product...or I didn't see it.

Here is a link to their website that list technical data sheets for the product line. http://www.lebanonturf.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=prd.product_details&pid=324

Bear in mind these are not labels. I'll have to look better later.

Thanks.

Go to that link,
look to right, click on product info, you get the label

need a link or label for other product (lesco)

sniggly
02-04-2005, 01:02 PM
Timturf.......

Okay....I guess a technical data sheet can be a label.

Here is the link to the Lesco comparative label http://www.lesco.com/?PageID=27&ItemNumber=082918
The label is on the right side of the screen.

Just as a reminder, I am more interested in knowing if someone can verify through 1st hand experience the claim that this Lebanon product will actually last 16 weeks. Please don't tell me to read the information that the company provides. We all know that information provided by a company about it's own product is advertisement that can MOSTLY be backed up by practical application. I rely on labels mostly for their legal content, then claimed product specifications after that.

kfish - The prices you list for those combo products are very close to what I was quoted.

kfish
02-04-2005, 01:13 PM
Quite an increase. I expect prices to go up but when they jump that much then it's a little harder to pass along.

timturf
02-04-2005, 01:51 PM
[QUOTE=sniggly]Timturf.......

Okay....I guess a technical data sheet can be a label.

Here is the link to the Lesco comparative label http://www.lesco.com/?PageID=27&ItemNumber=082918
The label is on the right side of the screen.

Just as a reminder, I am more interested in knowing if someone can verify through 1st hand experience the claim that this Lebanon product will actually last 16 weeks. Please don't tell me to read the information that the company provides. We all know that information provided by a company about it's own product is advertisement that can MOSTLY be backed up by practical application. I rely on labels mostly for their legal content, then claimed product specifications after that.

Sniggly,

never used that product, but have used lebanon products in the past.
They have many lines, and I used from the country club line in the past! the products I used where high quality, but can't verify for the product you are asking about!

NOW
the 23-4-8 lebanon has 2% cl, 70% crn, (with 32% is win) sop, while lesco 24-2-11 has 8.25% cl, 20% crn, ( which none is win) mop

Lebanon is by far a better product when comparing these two products

The lebanon will give a much longer release due to the win in product from methylene fert. Will it last 16 weeks, proable, but you need to remember, when you apply 1 lbs of n/m, .31 lbs of n will release pretty quickly, another
.37 lbs of will release more slowly, while the last .32 lbs of n will be very slow release, again the last of that n releasing close to 16 weeks. Since 70% of this fertilizer is slow release, which in this case depends on microbes, soil temp will have a big influence on the release rate and how long it release.
I believe you will loose more nitrogen to leaching and volatilization from the lesco product than the lebanon product

Wasn't the lebanon product in a 45lbs/bag, if so, 1 bag covers 10.3m, while lesco product 12m, with both delivering 1 lbs of n/m

Again, I know this isn't exactly what you ask, but I hope it was helpful
tim

kfish
02-04-2005, 02:36 PM
In this description what does the FL represent?
24-2-11 40%PPSCU 6FE 1MN FL

timturf
02-04-2005, 03:34 PM
In this description what does the FL represent?
24-2-11 40%PPSCU 6FE 1MN FL

I believe it is stating it's a florida label

sniggly
02-04-2005, 09:33 PM
Yup.......the Lebanon product is in a 45# bag and yes you get roughly 1k less.

Looks like the prill size is much smaller too.....which is to my liking.

I really need someone to provide some experience with the Lebanon line of pure fert's versus SCU based N source fert's. I know, based on Lebanon's N type and other things, that the product is better, but the length of active release is more important to me at this stage of the game.

I need to put a spreadsheet together and do an annual cost analysis for it. :sleeping:

goforgreen2
02-04-2005, 11:21 PM
It is a Florida label. Fl. standards are different here than every where else. Lesco got nailed several years ago on % of SCU so they mandated a change in what they claim. Usually 10-20% more SCU on average of what they claim. Also, I would be hard press to rely on that claim here in Fl. with the volatile conditions we have.

sniggly
02-05-2005, 08:27 AM
goforgreen2 - That is EXACTLY why I am asking the question. My experience tells me that a 16 week release period is inflated. It may be longer than Lesco's fert......but it would HAVE TO BE 16-18 for it to save me any money or time.

I haven't said this but, another reason is I just don't like using a product on a customer's property that they can go buy at any local Home Cheapo. It's a big deal with me.

I know Lebanon makes a blend under the Sunnyland name. Ain't homogenous like the Proscape but it's different than Lesco's blend. I am going to look into that and see what the numbers are. Until then, if someone on this board can't speak directly to the release duration of the Proscape bag, I am not changing it. Oh I might buy a bad or two and test it on my own property just to see...I don't know.

Where is Ric?.....he usually jumps in on threads like this :cool2:

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