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  #61  
Old 12-16-2009, 09:23 PM
quiet quiet is offline
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Awww. Now that's nice. I almost thought the moderators would have to move this thread to the Organic forum!
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  #62  
Old 12-16-2009, 11:23 PM
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grassman177 grassman177 is offline
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Originally Posted by phasthound View Post
Life is grand!
now you are talking, reminds me of boy scouts in the wilds of the earth
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all is fair in love and grass! Man, it smells like sheet, do you smell that!!
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  #63  
Old 12-16-2009, 11:24 PM
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grassman177 grassman177 is offline
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good to know american lawn care . looking forward to ironing out some details.
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all is fair in love and grass! Man, it smells like sheet, do you smell that!!
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  #64  
Old 12-17-2009, 07:36 AM
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phasthound phasthound is offline
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Liberty,
your Nutrients PLUS rep will be contacting you soon with LTL pricing.
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The nation that destroys its soil destroys itself.
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  #65  
Old 12-17-2009, 08:46 AM
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LIBERTYLANDSCAPING LIBERTYLANDSCAPING is offline
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Originally Posted by phasthound View Post
Liberty,
your Nutrients PLUS rep will be contacting you soon with LTL pricing.
Got it last night

Looks like $4+/ bag additional for less than a full truckload of 22 pallets. (at least to Indiana)

I may look for some other companies local to split a full truckload with. I hate to pay $160+ additional per pallet for delivery....
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  #66  
Old 12-17-2009, 09:07 AM
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phasthound phasthound is offline
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Originally Posted by LIBERTYLANDSCAPING View Post
Got it last night

Looks like $4+/ bag additional for less than a full truckload of 22 pallets. (at least to Indiana)

I may look for some other companies local to split a full truckload with. I hate to pay $160+ additional per pallet for delivery....
That's a good strategy, we do that a lot.
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The nation that destroys its soil destroys itself.
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  #67  
Old 12-17-2009, 11:33 AM
B-Easy B-Easy is offline
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Questions... If you continue to apply herbicides does that not inhibit/kill the micro-organisms present in the organic matter which we are trying to establish in the turf by using this product? If this is true, would timing the use of fertilizers containing organic matter during rounds when we would only spot spray increase the effectiveness of the OM? What about pre emergent? Will the presence of this "barrier" stifle the organic matter? Thinking of using NP's 6-2-4 in the spring & early summer (R2 & R3). May do a split app w/ the pre emergent this year which would be R3.
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  #68  
Old 12-17-2009, 12:29 PM
Marcos Marcos is offline
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Originally Posted by Rayholio View Post
The 'natural' option is something that no one would pay for in my market.. I've conducted surveys asking that very question.. People say that they are 'concerned' about enviormental effects of lawn care, Then they say that they are unreceptive to a price increase based on making services enviormentally sustainable.

So there ya have it.. If I can get better results for smaller $ then I'll go organics in a heart beat.. otherwise the customers have spoken.. and they are my boss.
If you have your customer survey worded anything like this post, then I can see exactly why your customers have been "unreceptive".
It's more than obvious that you're flagrantly bias toward the use of chemicals & generally against "natural options".
Next time, hire the services of an independent surveying firm before you post such an idiotic conclusion on here.
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  #69  
Old 12-17-2009, 01:11 PM
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phasthound phasthound is offline
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Originally Posted by B-Easy View Post
Questions... If you continue to apply herbicides does that not inhibit/kill the micro-organisms present in the organic matter which we are trying to establish in the turf by using this product? If this is true, would timing the use of fertilizers containing organic matter during rounds when we would only spot spray increase the effectiveness of the OM? What about pre emergent? Will the presence of this "barrier" stifle the organic matter? Thinking of using NP's 6-2-4 in the spring & early summer (R2 & R3). May do a split app w/ the pre emergent this year which would be R3.
I'm not aware of any studies showing the effects of herbicides on soil microbes. Maybe Kiril does?
That being said, we have not seen anything in the field that points to decreased results due to pre-emergent. We always urge that if you decide to use post emergent just spot treat as needed. And the best defense against weeds is a thick healthy lawn.
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Barry Draycott

The nation that destroys its soil destroys itself.
Franklin D. Roosevelt
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  #70  
Old 12-17-2009, 01:11 PM
Marcos Marcos is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by B-Easy View Post
Questions... If you continue to apply herbicides does that not inhibit/kill the micro-organisms present in the organic matter which we are trying to establish in the turf by using this product? If this is true, would timing the use of fertilizers containing organic matter during rounds when we would only spot spray increase the effectiveness of the OM? What about pre emergent? Will the presence of this "barrier" stifle the organic matter? Thinking of using NP's 6-2-4 in the spring & early summer (R2 & R3). May do a split app w/ the pre emergent this year which would be R3.
Continue using herbicides if you have to, but try to limit it as much as possible to non 2,4-d formulations, and work toward a goal of keeping it all IPM (backpacks & hand tanks) only.

You're probably thinking:
'Wow....how can this be done'!

Job #1 on your list should ALWAYS be increasing &/or maintaining turf density.
A thick healthy lawn will crowd out most weeds before they get a chance to even rear their ugly heads; the key to it all is PERSISTENCE by both you & the customer in terms of proper organic fertilization, mowing practices, edging practices & irrigation.
Some perennially repeat weedy areas in turf may actually be in need of renovation to a certain extent to increase turf density. It's up to YOU to illustrate this problem to your customer, describe/show them the potential solution, and then sell it!
Try to keep the customer INVOLVED in the progression/successes in their own lawns. Usually, consumers love to be 'part of a team'.
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Regarding pre-emergents...
The precedent that they create a 'chemical barrier' in the soil is largely a myth brought about thru the years by marketing geniuses like Scotts & Chemlawn, who no doubt were looking for an easy mind's eye picture to paint.
There is indeed a chemical half-life in the soil, but not necessarily is it laid down in 'barrier' form.

Putting pre-emergents in perspective with turf that's dense enough to effectively choke out (most) weeds on its own:
Why would you really need to use it at all?

One place to need pre-emergent: Perimeter edges.
These are places of high stress, high foot / vehicle traffic & higher soil temperature.
We'll use either Dimension or corn gluten meal along all hard edge perimeters after they've been thoroughly edged in the spring.
Then, as the season progresses we'll work with the customer in somewhat of a training mode to talk about mowing, irrigation, and try to prevent nonsense such as weed eater 'scalping' of turf to soil level , which is the absolute harbinger to crabgrass & other weed problems along sidewalk and driveway edges.
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