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  #41  
Old 06-06-2010, 06:55 PM
MnGreen MnGreen is offline
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: Minnesota
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25 solo daily

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimslawncareservice View Post
what size of lawn are we talking here.in my area i can do 20-25 yards a day myself. add another guy i have done 40 yards and 2 3acre props. but our lawn are small here. mow/blow/go ave time is 10- 12 mins. we have done some with 2 guys at 5 mins.
Owatonna, MN market will bear $30 rates for "mow and go" service on lots small enough
to service (25) alone ?

I've been doing postage stamp to 1/4 acre lots in south Minneapolis for 3 plus years.
Nasty banks and hills on 50% of them.
2 minutes max between stops
Cut, trim, edge, and blow (every week) No mow and go.

(18) a day solo
(26-30) day 2-man

Found the 2-man to be the way to go.
$750-$850 gross daily...(9) hr day's.
Get my (60) done in 2 day's...2nd guy allows you to keep up a pretty intense pace and not kill yourself, and keeps the other guy efficient and cost effective.
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  #42  
Old 06-06-2010, 06:57 PM
rjh4758 rjh4758 is offline
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: south central Oklahoma
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonnau View Post
Alright, here's the exact break down for this past week. This is personal stuff here!
Tuesday: 9.25 hours, gross income for mowing: $719
Wednesday: 9.5 hrs, gross income for mowing: $637
Thursday: 5.5 hrs (didn't start until noon rain delay): gross income from mowing: $441
Friday: 7.25 hrs, gross income from mowing: $607

Total gross income from mowing: $2404

Total hours: 31.5 X two employees @ $21 per hour together
Gas equals out to about $5 per hour
Workers comp, ss, unemployement: somewhere around 15% additional per hour
Seems like most everyone looked right past they fact that you deducted some expenses off the hourly number you posted earlier. So I broke it down a bit more for you. I may have missed some other expenses like advertising, administrative costs, website, phone, ect. as I do not know all the expenses that you have.

OK I will make the assumption that you are running one ZTR and maybe a 21 and handhelds.

$2404-15%=$2043.40 Workers comp, ss, unemployement

73 man hours X $10.50=$766.50

$2043.40-$766.5=$1276.90

31.5 hrs equipment use(replacement cost and maint.)$6.00hr=$189

$1276.90-$189=$1087.90

$800 liability Ins. + $500 auto ins + $4800 annual truck payment/28 weeks = $217.85

$1087.90-$217.85=$870.05

31.5 hrs of fuel at $5.00=$157.50

$870.05-$157.50=$712.55 net income

They are putting $9.76 per man hour in your pocket. Could be better but if you are putting out $1200 of work yourself you should be able to get by OK. But look for ways to get more efficient or get more business and look at adding a crew as you can make a higher income that way as well.

Last edited by rjh4758; 06-06-2010 at 07:02 PM.
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  #43  
Old 06-06-2010, 07:01 PM
rain man rain man is offline
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Ten thousand mowers will be purchased tomorrow based solely on this thread alone. Its all good.
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  #44  
Old 06-06-2010, 08:12 PM
hackitdown hackitdown is offline
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Location: Groton, MA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rjh4758 View Post
Seems like most everyone looked right past they fact that you deducted some expenses off the hourly number you posted earlier. So I broke it down a bit more for you. I may have missed some other expenses like advertising, administrative costs, website, phone, ect. as I do not know all the expenses that you have.

OK I will make the assumption that you are running one ZTR and maybe a 21 and handhelds.

$2404-15%=$2043.40 Workers comp, ss, unemployement

73 man hours X $10.50=$766.50

$2043.40-$766.5=$1276.90

31.5 hrs equipment use(replacement cost and maint.)$6.00hr=$189

$1276.90-$189=$1087.90

$800 liability Ins. + $500 auto ins + $4800 annual truck payment/28 weeks = $217.85

$1087.90-$217.85=$870.05

31.5 hrs of fuel at $5.00=$157.50

$870.05-$157.50=$712.55 net income

They are putting $9.76 per man hour in your pocket. Could be better but if you are putting out $1200 of work yourself you should be able to get by OK. But look for ways to get more efficient or get more business and look at adding a crew as you can make a higher income that way as well.
Your numbers are pretty much right on in my case, too. But I can usually bill a for a few extras here and there that bump up the bottom line.
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  #45  
Old 06-06-2010, 09:31 PM
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milo milo is offline
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Location: Allentown PA
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this question as others have said is dumb. what size mowers you run? ztr or walk behinds? way to many factors left out. if your using 21 inch push mowers than its great money, if your running 2 60 inch ztr's and have route planed good than thats not good.
its perty simple, for 1 week you eork with 1 guy and see how long you guys do it all, than next week work with the other guy and see how long, while you do this send them out to do the stuff you do. now, if your working about the same as the guys are than live with it, if you get done like 6 hours less with both of them then fire one or both or have a talk with them.
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  #46  
Old 06-06-2010, 11:09 PM
TMlawncare TMlawncare is offline
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Location: nw missouri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TJLANDS View Post
My two man crews, doing residential only, avg 650.00 a day.
That is an avg day of 9 hrs.
There are some better days, (tighter routes easier homes), and then there are worse days, (wet grass, heavy growth weeks etc) but thats my avg so far this year.
$650 per day for a 2 man crew is very common. This is about what we average. Its also what the industry for a whole averages. 8hr day at $40/hr = $320 per man x 2men = $640.

That 40/per man hr includes all time at the jobsite, bathroom, windshield time, load/unload, trash pickup. It is a whole day average, not a "wow I mowed that sucker in 12 minutes, I must have avg a $100/hr."
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  #47  
Old 06-06-2010, 11:13 PM
nepatsfan nepatsfan is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Franklin MA
Posts: 3,156
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMlawncare View Post
$650 per day for a 2 man crew is very common. This is about what we average. Its also what the industry for a whole averages. 8hr day at $40/hr = $320 per man x 2men = $640.

That 40/per man hr includes all time at the jobsite, bathroom, windshield time, load/unload, trash pickup. It is a whole day average, not a "wow I mowed that sucker in 12 minutes, I must have avg a $100/hr."
haha...lmao...that is awesome and true
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  #48  
Old 06-06-2010, 11:29 PM
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jasonnau jasonnau is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Northern KY
Posts: 454
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjh4758 View Post
Seems like most everyone looked right past they fact that you deducted some expenses off the hourly number you posted earlier. So I broke it down a bit more for you. I may have missed some other expenses like advertising, administrative costs, website, phone, ect. as I do not know all the expenses that you have.

OK I will make the assumption that you are running one ZTR and maybe a 21 and handhelds.

$2404-15%=$2043.40 Workers comp, ss, unemployement

73 man hours X $10.50=$766.50

$2043.40-$766.5=$1276.90

31.5 hrs equipment use(replacement cost and maint.)$6.00hr=$189

$1276.90-$189=$1087.90

$800 liability Ins. + $500 auto ins + $4800 annual truck payment/28 weeks = $217.85

$1087.90-$217.85=$870.05

31.5 hrs of fuel at $5.00=$157.50

$870.05-$157.50=$712.55 net income

They are putting $9.76 per man hour in your pocket. Could be better but if you are putting out $1200 of work yourself you should be able to get by OK. But look for ways to get more efficient or get more business and look at adding a crew as you can make a higher income that way as well.
That's probably pretty darn close. I've never broken down the hidden expenses such as insurance, and truck cost. Always been afraid to. My whole reason for posting this thread is that forever it's been just me and a 10
$ guy. The bottomline is always acceptable. Yes, I'm better than both of them by a long shot, but I can't do everything all the time without working 70 hrs a week. I've got three kids and a wife that is about half way to divorcing me every spring because I'm gone so much. So, this is the first year sending a crew out that didn't involve me being the main part of it. I really had no idea what to expect, and didn't like the idea of having so much overhead in labor. I have gotten on them about being efficient as well as fast, but, my lead guy is new to all of this but a quick learner who takes pride in what he does. My string trimmer came from another company who would just hit it and get it without paying so much attention to detail. It's been a battle to get the lead guy to stop spending too much time on detail and trying to get the trimmer guy to spend more attention to detail. Summer is finally here and their time and skills have been improving. It is slightly depressing to see the $10 per hr per employee number, but I'm doing at least $1200 if not 1/3 more than that by myself. Things will slow down in the next month or so, and I'll probably have the trimmer guy drop down to 3 days a week and i'll pick up for the other 2. Just depends on the work load. But, thank you for breaking down everything. Looking at your estimates, they are probably making closer to $11 per hr per employee. My liability is a little cheaper and they are driving a nice looking 01 f250 that I picked up this year for $6500 to run the mowing route. And they take a 60 lazer, a 60 turf tracer, a 36 turf tracer, and a 21 with them. Usually only one guy is mowing unless the back yard is too small to get the 60 in. So I'm glad to here they are in the ballpark, as depressing as the low numbers are.
Thanks again.

Last edited by jasonnau; 06-06-2010 at 11:36 PM.
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  #49  
Old 06-06-2010, 11:38 PM
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jasonnau jasonnau is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Northern KY
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In all honesty, I've never broken everything down to figure it out exactly because I've been too busy working!!!!
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  #50  
Old 06-07-2010, 12:42 AM
Darryl G Darryl G is offline
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Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 7,957
I don't know what pay rates are by you but I pay my 16 year old son $10/hr for trim and blow and help on mulch jobs. I don't see how you can even get someone to work at that rate. Not sure what the norm is in your area though.
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