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  #111  
Old 05-16-2011, 09:27 PM
ToroZTR ToroZTR is offline
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Well there are several professional pond builders and part dealers over at the pond forum who advise the use of it. I never claimed the manufacturer said it was safe said several have called. They recieved product information and makeup of this material. It is not much different than EPDM which was originally used for roofing in different form. I have personally used this product extensively in my pond and i have 6 koi who are healthy and growing so i do know it is safe for fish. I am not saying this is the complete answer but with seam tape and this it might be a long term solution i know it sealed my 5 ft wide stream with no leaks as of 2 years and still running. I do understand your point though. Kinda the same with waterfall sealant u can use expanding foam but it is a yellow not black so you throw some pebbles on it when its drying and you save 10 dollars a can.
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  #112  
Old 05-17-2011, 09:15 AM
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Niagara Falls Niagara Falls is offline
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I finally have my pond enlarged, but with a spliced liner. Made it a bit bigger than the one piece liner I had, so I used an extra one I had also. I tried to use a splicing tape, but it didn't feel too secure, then when I phoned a pond company 2 hours away in Toronto, they suggested a product called Eternabond, it is readily available because it is used in the roofing industry and is fish safe. It comes in various widths and lengths and was quite easy to work with. I filled the pond and the level remained for 2 days, so I decided all is well. It's now been running for 5 days and the level has not dropped. Mind you we've had lots of rain....

I will post a couple of pics as soon as I can, my computer died and I had to replace the harddrive....ARGH!!! As an off side, remember to back up your files regularly.
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  #113  
Old 05-17-2011, 10:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Niagara Falls View Post
I finally have my pond enlarged, but with a spliced liner. Made it a bit bigger than the one piece liner I had, so I used an extra one I had also. I tried to use a splicing tape, but it didn't feel too secure, then when I phoned a pond company 2 hours away in Toronto, they suggested a product called Eternabond, it is readily available because it is used in the roofing industry and is fish safe. It comes in various widths and lengths and was quite easy to work with. I filled the pond and the level remained for 2 days, so I decided all is well. It's now been running for 5 days and the level has not dropped. Mind you we've had lots of rain....

I will post a couple of pics as soon as I can, my computer died and I had to replace the harddrive....ARGH!!! As an off side, remember to back up your files regularly.
I really hesitate to ask.....but, how long was the applied seam?

I looked up the specs and MSDS on Eternabond. It appears to be very similar to the usual splicing tape sold for Water Feature applications. You stated that you first used a splicing tape (what type?). What were the obvious differences between the 2 products? I did notice that it is not UV stabilized. This would prove to be a problem in a bare liner pond. I DO like the fact that it is available in varying widths.

It was not stated, where I could find, how this product reacts in a constantly wet environment. Even the double sticky and cover tape made for aquatic applications will have the bond integrity degrade over time if; (1) The liner surface was not properly and adequately prepped before application; (2) If the required amount of recommended pressure was not applied during application and; (3) Adequate curing time was not allowed.

Anyway, you have a larger pond now and I hope that it is trouble free. Post pics as soon as you can.

Sorry about your computer, I have had the same hard drive crash. Lost some, but not all of my data.

BTW, how does the missus like the pond expansion? Did you have to move her roses?
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  #114  
Old 05-17-2011, 11:07 PM
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Niagara Falls Niagara Falls is offline
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What I did was overlap the 2 pieces by about a foot because my original plan was to use the AquaScape tape and then a water proof caulking to help with the seal, but when I discovered the Eternabond, I used that instead of the caulking.

The big difference in the two products is that the tape is really just that, a tape, but the Eternabond is more like a putty and when I went over it with a roller it seemed to spread just a bit. I prepared both surfaces as instructed by the tape...cleaning with unleaded gasoline and letting it sit for a couple of hours before adhering the tape.
Then after it was all done I let it cure for over 24 hours, even though both stated it needed just 8hours. The information and instructions that came with the product say it is guaranteed to remain water tight in a submersed environment for 5 years or they will replace the product...just keep the original bill of sale. We'll see how that goes.
Oh yea, the seam is 18 feet long.

The missus is thrilled because I only moved 5 of the roses and she now has a new area of about 15 X 8 to plant even more........And the fish are happy with their new home, there is so much more space to swim about in.....LOL
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  #115  
Old 05-18-2011, 11:05 AM
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Wow! Really a tremendous difference in size. Looks good. Keep us posted.

I am planning on ordering from Eternabond. I want to do my own testing on this product. If it performs as they claim, it would be definitely be easier to work with than standard seaming tape.
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  #116  
Old 05-19-2011, 11:54 AM
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Niagara Falls Niagara Falls is offline
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After all the work on the expansion, the wtaer level started dropping and I flipped......it's the seam!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
But no it's not. One of the things about living here in The Great White North, is that the ground tends to heave and move things around each spring. I found a spot on the stream that the frost had moved a boulder that then folded the liner into the stream to allow water to run out. I'm going over the whole thing to ensure that there is now more of this.
In the path beside the wall that goes down to the pond, I had put in some limestone and cement to simulate an old Roman style stair case. A couple of the stones have lifted about an inch and these are very heavy, it took 2 people to place them.

But it appears the fish like there new home, they are very active.
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  #117  
Old 05-19-2011, 12:08 PM
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The way that your property collects and holds water, I would imagine that you would experience quite a bit of heaving. Need to put checking the pond and stream perimeter on your yearly Spring To-Do list.
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  #118  
Old 05-24-2011, 03:01 PM
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Niagara Falls Niagara Falls is offline
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The way that your property collects and holds water, I would imagine that you would experience quite a bit of heaving. Need to put checking the pond and stream perimeter on your yearly Spring To-Do list.
You are oh so right. I've been all around the stream and have found 3 areas where the rock had shifted and the resettled but pushed the liner below the water level. I am now concerned about the weir falls. On the left side, looking from the pond, I put in a huge rock that pulled the liner down with it, and it is way too heavy to lift to pull the liner up, so I had to adjust the water flow to make sure the water didn't run over and down the side of the rock, because there is no liner....it's all under the rock. Now it appears that everything has tilted a little counter-clockwise...and there is a bit more water on the rock than last year.
I'm trying to place a couple of rocks and silicone them in, hoping that the water will follow where I want it to.....LOL
Although it never has in the past. There's always a first time.
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  #119  
Old 05-24-2011, 05:32 PM
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I guess ground movement is a common occurrence in climate areas such as yours. Down here, we don't experience ground movement. For that matter, there is also a great lack of people movement.

I got the Eternabond tape today. One short roll of 2" 60 mil RoofSeal and one short roll of 2" 60 mil DoubleStick. I am curious to see how it holds up under- a) constant submersion and b) how well it can maintain adherence under tension.
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  #120  
Old 05-25-2011, 12:00 PM
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Niagara Falls Niagara Falls is offline
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I've got my Eternabond seal under about 2' of water and so far no leak. As to the adherence under pressure, I found it almost impossible to separate the two pieces of liner after 24+ hours.
Let me know what you think, I'm quite interested.
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