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  #21  
Old 01-26-2012, 05:40 PM
mrusk mrusk is offline
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I think this whole lip thing is something that might work in theory but isn't going to work in real life.

For one, you would never be able to keep the batter anywhere near the same without the lip, or pins for that matter.
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  #22  
Old 01-26-2012, 07:30 PM
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xtreem3d xtreem3d is offline
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I kinda get the gravity thing for block buried 4 rows deep but what about the top row on a steep hill that water runs down...can gravity hold that block in place for long? i'm not an expert but i think will continue to use the lips just for piece of mind...informative post Jim
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  #23  
Old 01-26-2012, 09:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xtreem3d View Post
I kinda get the gravity thing for block buried 4 rows deep but what about the top row on a steep hill that water runs down...can gravity hold that block in place for long? i'm not an expert but i think will continue to use the lips just for piece of mind...informative post Jim
Which I *believe* your thought sorta coincides with my thoughts. Like the picture I posted. It's a very short wall, you can see the movement that took place, and of course it lacks the proper ingredients (gravel, etc). But the wall is so short, what gravity is there to hold the block in place?

That's why block like cornerstone uses 3/4" aggregate placed in the cores. The aggregate doesn't break and it doesn't shear.
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  #24  
Old 01-26-2012, 09:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrusk View Post
I think this whole lip thing is something that might work in theory but isn't going to work in real life.

For one, you would never be able to keep the batter anywhere near the same without the lip, or pins for that matter.
Matt - didn't you see the memo! Even though some of us have been building walls since 1997, we're not allowed to say "i think" "I think" "I think". Especially if you didn't maintain your NCMA certification!!! LOL
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  #25  
Old 01-26-2012, 10:23 PM
pavinpreacher pavinpreacher is offline
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Nice work bustin a hardscape myth Jim!
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  #26  
Old 01-26-2012, 10:31 PM
pavinpreacher pavinpreacher is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrusk View Post
I think this whole lip thing is something that might work in theory but isn't going to work in real life.

For one, you would never be able to keep the batter anywhere near the same without the lip, or pins for that matter.
Well, it's been stated in this thread that the lip is there in order to maintain alignment/batter. It's also been falsely claimed that the lip is there to "help" hold the blocks in place.

From your post, it seems you agree that the lip helps with alignment/batter, but not in holding the blocks in place. Is that correct?
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  #27  
Old 01-26-2012, 10:41 PM
crazymike crazymike is offline
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Does nobody else agree that THAT many lips should not break off and might indicate a weak batch? or am I out of my mind?

Personally, I've never had that many break off, it doesn't seem normal.

That to me, would be my fear.
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  #28  
Old 01-26-2012, 10:47 PM
pavinpreacher pavinpreacher is offline
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Originally Posted by crazymike View Post
Does nobody else agree that THAT many lips should not break off and might indicate a weak batch? or am I out of my mind?

Personally, I've never had that many break off, it doesn't seem normal.

That to me, would be my fear.
Unless I missed something, Jim stated that "the workers noticed a fairly high percentage of blocks where that lip was broken off by more than 50%."

How many blocks is that? What percentage of the blocks Jim was installing were effected?
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  #29  
Old 01-26-2012, 11:07 PM
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zedosix zedosix is offline
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Lets look at it with another type of block, I'm sure some of you have used the Pisa 2 block or roman pisa as unilock calls it. These have a ridge in the middle of the block and are used to align the next block on top and they are also used imho to secure and prevent the blocks from falling forward (while placing and compacting the back fill). I would also suggest that once the blocks are set and have a load on them that the lips probably have no bearing on the structural integrity of the wall.
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  #30  
Old 01-26-2012, 11:10 PM
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It was about 7% of the blocks that had the lip broken either partially or fully.
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