Lightingfacts.com

[starry night]

Originally Posted by David Gretzmier

I have found that folks who don't like big government cannot be convinced otherwise.

regardless of the facts, folks believe what they want and have the opinions that they want. nearly all folks want clean water to drink, clean air to breathe, safe medicines that work, labels that are correct and fair, cars that are safe, more fuel efficient and pollute less, gas that is inexpensive and pollutes less, workplaces are safe, k-12 education that is free, fire and police that do not charge for "service calls", medical care that is available and affordable, criminals are locked up or executed, streets and interstates are paved and safe, homes are inspected and built safe, and yes, labels on light bulbs that are fair and true.

The problem is, all the the problems above don't get solved by the marketplace. People and factories make stupid choices to save a buck. The government has to step and and make folks play fair. conservatives hate it, will argue it, and vote against it. but they will drink the clean water and breathe the air, drive the cars and enjoy the fruits of the "big government" all day long.

C'mon David. Conservatives don't argue against having ANY government.
We just argue against government involvement where it is not needed.

and yes, in the end, the government wil make light bulb and LED's have a label that has relevant info that is true. If not, folks will just lie, build it cheaper and people will believe it and buy it.

Why do we need goverment to do this when we have David Gretzmeier
doing all the testing?

[David Gretzmier]

I just do a bit of real world testing here and there. I wish more folks on here did and reported the results. we all would benefit from more info from installers experience with products.

But if you truly believe that conservatives want some government, do the research- check the voting record on all the above items I mentioned. who votes for it and against it?

when you propose a fair label for LED products, you will find that conservatives rarely will vote for it. It places a burden on producers to test and then tell the truth. that hurts all big business except one- the one who typically produces the product with the best label results at the lowest cost. since far more businesses are hurt in this equation, and that is who funds conservative capaigns, you will find them absolutely consistant on voting against anything that requires businesses to do much of anything. sorry, but mostly true. look it up and check.

[starry night]

[QUOTE=David Gretzmier;4351129]I just do a bit of real world testing here and there. I wish more folks on here did and reported the results. we all would benefit from more info from installers experience with products.
That's it! That's the way conservatives would handle this issue

But if you truly believe that conservatives want some government, do the research- check the voting record on all the above items I mentioned. who votes for it and against it?
You moved the target on me. I prefer to talk about "man-on-the-street" conservatives, like myself. Still, I would argue, concerning much of the voting, that it isn't against education generally(for example) but against excessive spending or taking away local control. But let's conclude this political discussion. It really belongs on the political forum. But I won't go on that forum because those guys argue just for the sake of argument.

when you propose a fair label for LED products, you will find that conservatives rarely will vote for it. It places a burden on producers to test and then tell the truth. that hurts all big business except one- the one who typically produces the product with the best label results at the lowest cost. since far more businesses are hurt in this equation, and that is who funds conservative capaigns, you will find them absolutely consistant on voting against anything that requires businesses to do much of anything. sorry, but mostly true. look it up and check.
Here again, let me suggest the conservative point of view: Let the marketplace rule in this instance. Whether a certain product is effective should not be a concern of government unless the product involves public health or safety. Involving whether LEDs are effective or have quality will eventually get worked out by the market. Does Cast or Illumicare or Brilliance or Volt need to be "forced" to produce a superior LED? No, they are working to produce the best they can because they want to succeed in the marketplace. And they will. In the meantime, if certain consumers want to waste their money by not properly studying what they buy, then so be it.[

Because this is not a forum for politics, I will not reply further, David. But please reply once more yourself. By the way, sorry about having spelled your last name wrong in my previous post.