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  #11  
Old 09-19-2012, 05:42 PM
Skipster Skipster is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ric View Post
BEST OF BOTH WORLDS I agree 100%.

I am a well know Organic hater, But not because Organic Fertilizers are bad. It is the Organic Only attitude of Tree Hugging Granola Nuts that makes me bad mouth Organic Fert. I even use some Organic Pesticides.

Understanding What Organics can do and can not do is the question here. Then supplement with Synthetics. But whether you have sandy soil or heavy clay, organic fertilizer should add SOM to your soil. SOM or Soil organic matter helps the Physical aspect of the soil profile. In the case of sandy soil it adds water & chemical Holding power. In clay soil is help prevent run off and compaction. If you are pulling Hollow core and not Top Dressing with Organic fertilizer you are really missing the the whole point of aeration.

.
My main issue with this is being played out by my competitors as they speak. They offer an "Organic" program, but use Screamin' Gren (with conventional fert in it) and they include a spring Dimension application for crabgrass and other annual weeds.

They say their program is 100% organic, but they still clean up weed escapes with 2,4-d, apply conventional ferts, and use conventional PRE products.

Since we don't have a legal definition of organic lawn care, I guess people can apply whatever they want and call it whatever they want. They tell the customer they're organic and they're preventing crabgrass, and their invoice even tells the customer they used Dimension, but they don't tell the customer that Dimension is the same thing the non-organic guy uses, or that its NOT and "organic" product!

I have too much integrity to tell my customers they're getting something "organic" is the whole program's not "organic."
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  #12  
Old 09-19-2012, 05:59 PM
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weapons of grass destruction weapons of grass destruction is offline
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I use this stuff called jungle grow. it is chicken feather meal works well.
scotts also makes called Scott natural,
I have a guy I use who does mostly organic lawn spraying and he uses fish emulsion it is a liquid fertilizer .
also milograntie is human waste.
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  #13  
Old 09-19-2012, 06:15 PM
grassmasterswilson grassmasterswilson is online now
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Thanks guys. I'm not looking to go organic. I have heard a couple of local guys say how they have added 1-2 rounds of Fert with organics and have seen a noticeable difference in the soils

Thought it might be worth adding. My problem I that at 1lb N/1000 it will get expensive
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  #14  
Old 09-19-2012, 06:26 PM
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phasthound phasthound is offline
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Originally Posted by turfmd101 View Post
Milorginite = Biosolids = Organic. Yes?
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The organic community does not see it this way.
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  #15  
Old 09-19-2012, 06:35 PM
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Ric Ric is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skipster View Post
My main issue with this is being played out by my competitors as they speak. They offer an "Organic" program, but use Screamin' Gren (with conventional fert in it) and they include a spring Dimension application for crabgrass and other annual weeds.

They say their program is 100% organic, but they still clean up weed escapes with 2,4-d, apply conventional ferts, and use conventional PRE products.


Since we don't have a legal definition of organic lawn care, I guess people can apply whatever they want and call it whatever they want. They tell the customer they're organic and they're preventing crabgrass, and their invoice even tells the customer they used Dimension, but they don't tell the customer that Dimension is the same thing the non-organic guy uses, or that its NOT and "organic" product!

I have too much integrity to tell my customers they're getting something "organic" is the whole program's not "organic."

First there is a legal definition of Organic Fertilizer and Pesticides.

Next if you haven't figured it out by now I guess I will have to Tell you.

A Pesticide License like all Chemicals license, is a License to legally Steal. The Organic Lier's can't compete with synthetics so they use them and Lie to the Customer. The worst case I have seen is a Company who had the Public School contract.

.
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  #16  
Old 09-19-2012, 06:56 PM
Weekend cut easymoney Weekend cut easymoney is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ric View Post
BEST OF BOTH WORLDS I agree 100%.

I am a well know Organic hater, But not because Organic Fertilizers are bad. It is the Organic Only attitude of Tree Hugging Granola Nuts that makes me bad mouth Organic Fert. I even use some Organic Pesticides.

. If you are pulling Hollow core and not Top Dressing with Organic fertilizer you are really missing the the whole point of aeration.

.
without them we wouldn't have tie dye and patchouli oil cologne

please tell me more about your experience with organic fertilizer post aeration, I advocate top dressing with compost after aeration, but have not spread organic fert. post aeration-
thanks-
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  #17  
Old 09-19-2012, 07:24 PM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grassmasterswilson View Post
Thanks guys. I'm not looking to go organic. I have heard a couple of local guys say how they have added 1-2 rounds of Fert with organics and have seen a noticeable difference in the soils

Thought it might be worth adding. My problem I that at 1lb N/1000 it will get expensive
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The noticeable difference in the soils is about the most important aspect of the 'organic matter additions...
What's the point of water soluable urea every 4 weeks when the stuff either leaches or volitizes as soon as it put down? or heavier ground = no air in the soil or CEC,,, just mud and NPK...
its like living on cheese w/out fiber in the diet at all...
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Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
,,, I wonder what does...
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  #18  
Old 09-19-2012, 07:39 PM
turfmd101 turfmd101 is offline
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What good is any nutrient app without extreme populations of microbial action. Especially to breakdown NPK's into nitrates. So their eatable.
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Last edited by turfmd101; 09-19-2012 at 07:49 PM.
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  #19  
Old 09-19-2012, 08:24 PM
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phasthound phasthound is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skipster View Post
My main issue with this is being played out by my competitors as they speak. They offer an "Organic" program, but use Screamin' Gren (with conventional fert in it) and they include a spring Dimension application for crabgrass and other annual weeds.

They say their program is 100% organic, but they still clean up weed escapes with 2,4-d, apply conventional ferts, and use conventional PRE products.

Since we don't have a legal definition of organic lawn care, I guess people can apply whatever they want and call it whatever they want. They tell the customer they're organic and they're preventing crabgrass, and their invoice even tells the customer they used Dimension, but they don't tell the customer that Dimension is the same thing the non-organic guy uses, or that its NOT and "organic" product!

I have too much integrity to tell my customers they're getting something "organic" is the whole program's not "organic."
I'm not aware of any LCO claiming Screamin Green is part of a 100% organic program. Please PM with company names so I can verify your claims.
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  #20  
Old 09-19-2012, 08:38 PM
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phasthound phasthound is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ric View Post
First there is a legal definition of Organic Fertilizer and Pesticides.

Next if you haven't figured it out by now I guess I will have to Tell you.

A Pesticide License like all Chemicals license, is a License to legally Steal. The Organic Lier's can't compete with synthetics so they use them and Lie to the Customer. The worst case I have seen is a Company who had the Public School contract. .
No doubt there are scoundrels out there, both organic and chemical applicators. There are also upstanding honest LCO's doing organic and/or chemical applications.

Here in NJ many LCO's are breaking the law when they apply pesticides on school grounds. The NJ School IPM law requires that cultural methods be used first and documented. Monitoring and keeping records are required before a decision can be made to use a pesticide. Once the decision is made the law states that first application must be with a product on the State's Low Impact pesticide list. The next application may be with a chemical pesticide, however then the school must notify all employees and parents that such an application will be made and on what date.
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