Hustler Super Z - problems with model

[Ridin' Green]

Originally Posted by puppypaws

The statement Jack made was generic answer, and I've dealt with enough people at Hustler when asking complicated questions to realize you can ask numbers of different people, and get numbers of different answers.

Now, let's get down to hard evidence as if it were presented in a court of law to be proven as right or wrong.

A Judge and jury will decide based on written documentation as to whether Hustler actually meant, but did not write in their advertisements or specifications as to the 15 mph top speed being used as a transport speed only. I can tell you from dealing with many legal issues over time that it would be decided by a court as to believing when Hustler wrote their advertisement, and to back it up even further, as written in their specifications, that they were portraying to the general buying public their mower was a machine used to cut grass at up to 15 mph. If this is not what was meant when legally describing what the 15 mph could be used for, then it would definitely been described as a "15 MPH Transport Speed," and if they had really been serious about making sure the buying public did not attempt to mow at 15 mph, they would have advertised as a "15 MPH Transport Speed Only."

To back this up even further, they would pull in so-call expert witnesses such as some in this thread that have already stated they mow grass at top speed on their Hustler Super Z when conditions allow. These people would sit on the witness stand and when asked the question of whether they use the 15 mph top speed more of the time for mowing, or more of the time for transport only, what do you think would be said. If I'm the one on the stand under oath, I would truthfully say, I use the mower at top speed for mowing grass 50% of the time, and for transporting approximately 1% of the time, or less.

Put me on the side arguing the case in favor of the 15 mph being advertised as a speed you can mow grass up to, and you others on the side of making the Judge and jury believe that although Hustler did not specify in their advertisements, or specifications, the 15 mph top speed was meant to be utilized for transport only, and actually would not cut grass at the listed 15 mph.

Now be honest, who do you think will win this case?

Something tells me that if he has sided with you, you would have told me "There you have it, straight from Hustler. Now do you believe it?"

Your court anaolgy is amusing with all due respect, but not a very accurate representation of how it works. You're not the only one here to have been involved in court cases before.

Re-read the man's reply to me. He does not say that it can't mow at top speed. He does say that it is designed basically for transport, but can be used under ideal conditions to mow when they present themselves.

I find it very interesting that you know Hustlers intent better than the man they have hired to represent them, and to answer questions like mine. As I said, if he would have told me I was wrong, you would more than likely have sung his praises and rubbed my nose in it. He didn't agree with you, so now you want to discount/discredit his statement?

[mtmower]

Originally Posted by Mickhippy

Im certainly trying! Ive watched those vids many times, the one where I said to slow the vid down kind of gives the best example (although yes, there is a lot of grass for sure). It discharges really well until it throws full width of the chute, clippings build up on the rear of the chute, some gets hit by the blade and the rest falls to the ground. While clippings come out the front of the chute there is no problem! Im just trying to stop the build up at the rear of the chute.

Anyway, Ive said all that enough times already. Im just waiting on Hustler to help me out with it............

Once we get a little more growth (expecting some rain today finally) Ill try and get someone to hold the cam and get the clumping on vid.

Mick, I had called Hustler a couple weeks ago on a non-related item and talked to Dan (didn't get a last name). After talking to me a little I picked his brain on any updates, new models, etc. Asked about fixes for the VX4 discharge and brought up you and your issue up. He laughed and said he just got back from down under visiting dealers and wish he'd been aware. Australia is part of the territory he covers. I gave him your LS screen name. He seem genuinely interested and acted as if he'd attempt contacting you. Figure it couldn't hurt. Hope he gives you the silver bullet.

[Mickhippy]

Originally Posted by mtmower

Mick, I had called Hustler a couple weeks ago on a non-related item and talked to Dan (didn't get a last name). After talking to me a little I picked his brain on any updates, new models, etc. Asked about fixes for the VX4 discharge and brought up you and your issue up. He laughed and said he just got back from down under visiting dealers and wish he'd been aware. Australia is part of the territory he covers. I gave him your LS screen name. He seem genuinely interested and acted as if he'd attempt contacting you. Figure it couldn't hurt. Hope he gives you the silver bullet.

Man, I dont know what to say but, thank you very much! I would like nothing more than to sing the praises of all aspects of the SZ, Im over the tank issue (pointless stressing about it) but the discharge is another matter.

I have been in contact with the importers here, its how I got the ok to do those mods but havent had any help with it, except from my friendly local Scag dealer.

I truly hope to hear from him!

Again, thanks a heap mate!

[puppypaws]

Originally Posted by Ridin' Green

Something tells me that if he has sided with you, you would have told me "There you have it, straight from Hustler. Now do you believe it?"

Your court anaolgy is amusing with all due respect, but not a very accurate representation of how it works. You're not the only one here to have been involved in court cases before.

Re-read the man's reply to me. He does not say that it can't mow at top speed. He does say that it is designed basically for transport, but can be used under ideal conditions to mow when they present themselves.

I find it very interesting that you know Hustlers intent better than the man they have hired to represent them, and to answer questions like mine. As I said, if he would have told me I was wrong, you would more than likely have sung his praises and rubbed my nose in it. He didn't agree with you, so now you want to discount/discredit his statement?

All speed can be considered transport speed if the mower is moving from one point to another, so we'll just say some of us prefer to mow at top transport speed more than at the slower transport speeds, but don't let anyone say you can't mow grass at a Super Z's top speed because it is done every day, and I've done it with many different Super Z mowers for over 10 yrs.

Mowing grass at a Hustler Super Z's top speed has definitely be proven by many different testimonies (including "Mickhippy"), and for someone to say the calculations to not work due to lack of blade strikes for this to be possible, well, let's just say the calculator must be off.

Quote:

"Re-read the man's reply to me. He does not say that it can't mow at top speed. He does say that it is designed basically for transport, but can be used under ideal conditions to mow when they present themselves."

It could also be said, "he does not say that the top speed is designed basically for mowing, but will also be used for transport in certain situations." This would sound more reasonable since the word "transport" is never mentioned by Hustler in any written form.

[Mickhippy]

Speaking of top speed, watch this but pay attention at 10.32 and listen to what he says when he gets back to the cam. I cracked up!
http://youtu.be/6vAvGTCJjF8

[puppypaws]

Originally Posted by Mickhippy

Speaking of top speed, watch this but pay attention at 10.32 and listen to what he says when he gets back to the cam. I cracked up!
http://youtu.be/6vAvGTCJjF8

I like the Cheetah, and I believe the Scag Velocity Plus deck is probably the best all-around deck on the market. With that said, this grass is at a thickness and dryness level enabling it to be cut perfectly. I could go pass for pass beside him at the speed he was running, and a person could not tell with the naked eye which mower cut each pass.

I think, which he did not mention, but his cut was pretty equal in what he described as the larger grass at the higher speed, which would have been in the 15 mph range, if the actual speed with blades turn off and deck up is truly 16 mph.

I think someone said you could not cut at that speed without leaving uncut grass, and this was due to the blades not turning fast enough according to his calculations...WRONG...and I think this gentleman even brought that out when saying, to cut grass at maximum speed the property would need to be perfectly smooth, he is basing that statement from a ride standpoint, and says nothing about it not being able to cut grass at that speed.

I watched his mower as he moved over this property, and it would be considered relatively smooth, if not, he would've had a hard time staying in the seat while crossing it at top speed, and as you noticed, there was no problem.

[Realslowww]

Originally Posted by Mickhippy

Speaking of top speed, watch this but pay attention at 10.32 and listen to what he says when he gets back to the cam. I cracked up!
http://youtu.be/6vAvGTCJjF8

I like the Scag as well for the fact that they are built like art but the overall design is no match for the Super,the Super being so simple in design and less joints parts and so forth is what makes it a 15 MPH mower that can take the punishment that mowing at 15 MPH brings with it over rough terrain without having to wrench the chasses because of how simply made they are.

[puppypaws]

Originally Posted by Realslowww

I like the Scag as well for the fact that they are built like art but the overall design is no match for the Super,the Super being so simple in design and less joints parts and so forth is what makes it a 15 MPH mower that can take the punishment that mowing at 15 MPH brings with it over rough terrain without having to wrench the chasses because of how simply made they are.

You know a mower can't cut grass at 15 mph, the blades (according to someone's calculations) just can't turn fast enough to hit all the standing grass...but this is a facetious statement, just added that because many will take take the statement as what I actually believe.

I will totally agree with you on this point, there is no ztr built today with the strength and simplicity of a Hustler Super Z, and this is the reason I continue to buy the Super Z over other mowers. I do want to run a Cheetah for a comparison, and the first thing I will do is check the speed by distance and time, which is more accurate than GPS.

[GMLC]

Originally Posted by puppypaws

You know a mower can't cut grass at 15 mph, the blades (according to someone's calculations) just can't turn fast enough to hit all the standing grass...but this is a facetious statement, just added that because many will take take the statement as what I actually believe.

I will totally agree with you on this point, there is no ztr built today with the strength and simplicity of a Hustler Super Z, and this is the reason I continue to buy the Super Z over other mowers. I do want to run a Cheetah for a comparison, and the first thing I will do is check the speed by distance and time, which is more accurate than GPS.

You said it yourself, math is math. Numbers are numbers whether a distance/time calculation or blade tip speed/area calculation.

I know for a fact that Scag not only reccomends not mowing at top speed they dont even recommend mowing in high gear on the cheetah's 2 speed trans. Apparently Hustler feels the same way. And im sorry you get different answers depending on who you talk to at Hustler. That speaks volumes in itself!!
Posted via Mobile Device

[Realslowww]

You can't mow everything at top speed but I was able to mow 2 week old bahai with a Super in the summer as long as it was not to thick at top speed,the XR7 was specifically designed for that.

I wqs real skeptical as well until I bougt one back in 06.