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  #21  
Old 10-10-2012, 08:45 PM
Rvldesign Rvldesign is offline
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Whatever happened to working hard for your money and getting your hands a little dirty? I think Jim is paying a more then fair amount regardless of what degree he has. They applied for the job didn't they? I'm tired of people saying they are to good for a job and should be paid Atleast X amount based on education or their opinion on their personal intelligence level.
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  #22  
Old 10-10-2012, 09:46 PM
krzys555 krzys555 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimLewis View Post
WHOA!!!! Relax there a little 32vld. You gotta get your facts straight before you go piping off at the mouth on things you don't know anything about.

I never said I pay anyone 25% less. I said I had guys coming to us, WILLING TO WORK for 25% less. We've always paid very competitive wages, they get good benefits, and some nice fringe benefits as well. Just because they were willing to work for less doesn't mean I took advantage of that. In fact, I told you above that, in fact, I did NOT take advantage of that. Every one of the people I've hired since the recession are getting paid as much or more than we ever paid for that position and as good or better than any of our competitors pay for the same position.

If you'd actually bother to take a minute and read what I actually wrote rather than just reading a sentence or two then making false accusations, you would have caught this. Go back and re-read the part above where I said,


If you want to have a pissing match over proper wages, let's compare notes a little. What are you paying your workers per hour for the different positions withing your company? Do you offer health insurance to your workers? A company vehicle to take home? Cell phone with unlimited minutes they can use any time? Flexible hours? Or do you even have employees? My bet is you either don't have any - which means you have no experience in the area which you are criticizing me for - or if you do have employees I'd love to see you put your money where you mouth is and explain to me how you offer them so much better pay and benefits than I do.
for us we pay 10 per hour for the first two weeks. (training period)

after that they move to 12 an hour. people in the feild. crew leader get 15.
irigation gets 19 an hour.

feild and crew leaders get about 60 hours a week, 1.25 pay for overtime.
2 weeks sick/vacation 8 hour days paid. could be used or saved, for end of the year cash out on remaining days.

no trucks to take home, optional health insurance. they pay half. optional company phone on Verizon for 50 a month a line,

hours are typically 7 to 7.
start time is never flexible, i pay you from 7, i want you there at 7 even at breakfast 2 times a week, paid by me. end time can be flexible but not to often.

we are one of the best paying places around here. compared to a brickman person 1-2 years experience is getting 9 something an hour.

we are very strict with hiring. only legal people allowed to work, no criminal background, no drug history, and we drug test on a monthly basis.

we have 17 people.
3 4person crews
1 3 person crew landscape
1 irrigation tech
1 manager
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  #23  
Old 10-10-2012, 11:51 PM
CITY PARK CUTTER CITY PARK CUTTER is offline
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You hire the best for the least...that's the american way, 32vid

Quote:
Originally Posted by 32vld View Post
He is paying them 25% less then before.

The problem is not that they are over qualified they are under paid.

When you are making a lot less then before you can't afford to pay your mortgage, default loans, can't afford to buy a car, spend less on food, clothes, etc.

How can the economy come back when people have very little disposable income to pay for goods and services.

Sales stay down the economy stays down.

One thing to be happy that you are getting the best employees ever. Another to exploit them.
If you never learned that in Biz school, now's the time to learn it well. "Exploitation" is the Nike shoe factory in China paying pennies on the dollar, that's exploitation. Me and others putting an ad out there for X dollars and having a line of folks wanting work is called "the Obama economy". It's not my job in this life to see to it that everybody makes their mortgage payment on time, or has a nice car to drive, or can afford their kid's college fund. Not my problem. I've got plenty of things to think about in a day's time and that ain't one of 'em.

I'm not responsible for "an economy". I hire based on what I can get out there for the jobs I need completed. Does it matter to me that MBAs want to edge curbs for me? No. I could care less what worthless paper is behind their resumes. Get your ass out there and mow grass for me!

Economies will take care of themselves if the right policies and politicians are in office to allow owners like myself to prosper. If I don't prosper, I don't hire and I don't give raises. If I do prosper, then I expand and am forced to pay more. During Bush's era I paid more, during OBama's reign I don't. Simple economic realities. One favors business and one doesn't.

If you accept what I pay, then you have a hand in your so-called "exploitation" don't ya? I can't force you to do anything. If you want to lay on the gov'ment with unemployment, food stamps, assistance, fraud, etc...nothing I can do to stop you. That rarely gets mentioned, friend, rarely. I'm paying for that. You and I are paying the freight and it isn't going to stop. I'll keep on paying peanuts and my margins will continue to rise. I've got to make up lost time due to this damned drought you know...somebody's gotta pay?
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  #24  
Old 10-11-2012, 12:04 AM
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knox gsl knox gsl is online now
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Jim I have a lot of respect for your operation and personal character. Most of us on here hope to have a business like yours one day.
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  #25  
Old 10-11-2012, 06:38 AM
coolluv coolluv is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knox gsl View Post
Jim I have a lot of respect for your operation and personal character. Most of us on here hope to have a business like yours one day.
Anyone that knows Jim knows he is a stand up guy that started with nothing and now has a very successful business.


I'm glad that he still posts here and is willing to help others out.

Dave...
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  #26  
Old 10-11-2012, 07:12 AM
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gcbailey gcbailey is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrs.landscaping View Post
Or maybe they were living beyond their means to begin with?
You can tell that around here by looking at the number of new home construction builds that were never finished and foreclosed on. I'm not talking about homes in sub-division were the general contractor went under.

We have several doctors/orthodontist/lawyers as clients, people who easily make 6 figures a year. Most of them live in what anyone would consider nice neighborhoods, but very few of them even drive anything more expensive than a BMW 3 series or Mercedes C class.

Now on the other hand we have several mid to upper middle class residential and those are the ones where you see the soccer moms in the 70k escalades, the 70k king ranch super duty and such. These are also the same neighborhoods with the most foreclosures and you frequently see the repo man coming out with his roll back about once a week.

Do you blame it on the people or blame it on the banks for allowing the people to live beyond their means?
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  #27  
Old 10-11-2012, 12:52 PM
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yardworkswi yardworkswi is offline
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Hopefully our industry is not taking advantage of people by paying low wages and further hurting the economy. It is much harder now to get a good paying job than it was in previous generations and things cost considerably more. Obama is far from perfect but it was the hole we were put in by the previous administration that is to blame. Its no coincidence that when a pres and vp that came from the oil company get in office that prices skyrocket and oil companies have record profits. Imagine if you could get away with price fixing and charge whatever you wanted without someone else taking your business. And I thought monopolies were made illegal because of standard oil many yrs ago. Campaign funds given to the republican party from oil companies tripled during Bush while it remained the same for democrats ironically so did the price per gallon. People used to make enough money to buy things with cash once that fizzled out credit cards came around so that we could still buy and now we pay interest on top of the cost. When I was young and we needed things my family spent the day going to a hardware store, bakery, meat market, grocery store, sporting goods store, electronics store and wherever else goods were that we needed. Now we go to Walmart. All of these businesses had owners, managers, skilled tradesmen, and general employees and have been replaced with minimum wage part timers with no benefits all so that Walmart can monopolize just about anything you can think of by paying low wages and buying in bulk. The loss of wages to these employees of businesses that "used to be" are all going to one place now and Sam isnt spending it like they used to. With this and the rise in cost of almost everything we have to pay for there is not much hope for us middle class remaining much longer soon you will be either rich or poor and just like in monopoly when the poor run out of cash the game is over!
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  #28  
Old 10-11-2012, 01:30 PM
CITY PARK CUTTER CITY PARK CUTTER is offline
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You can't blame bush for your entire life going forward

Quote:
Originally Posted by yardworkswi View Post
Hopefully our industry is not taking advantage of people by paying low wages and further hurting the economy. It is much harder now to get a good paying job than it was in previous generations and things cost considerably more. Obama is far from perfect but it was the hole we were put in by the previous administration that is to blame. Its no coincidence that when a pres and vp that came from the oil company get in office that prices skyrocket and oil companies have record profits. Imagine if you could get away with price fixing and charge whatever you wanted without someone else taking your business. And I thought monopolies were made illegal because of standard oil many yrs ago. Campaign funds given to the republican party from oil companies tripled during Bush while it remained the same for democrats ironically so did the price per gallon. People used to make enough money to buy things with cash once that fizzled out credit cards came around so that we could still buy and now we pay interest on top of the cost. When I was young and we needed things my family spent the day going to a hardware store, bakery, meat market, grocery store, sporting goods store, electronics store and wherever else goods were that we needed. Now we go to Walmart. All of these businesses had owners, managers, skilled tradesmen, and general employees and have been replaced with minimum wage part timers with no benefits all so that Walmart can monopolize just about anything you can think of by paying low wages and buying in bulk. The loss of wages to these employees of businesses that "used to be" are all going to one place now and Sam isnt spending it like they used to. With this and the rise in cost of almost everything we have to pay for there is not much hope for us middle class remaining much longer soon you will be either rich or poor and just like in monopoly when the poor run out of cash the game is over!
Should I bring up Zachery Taylor, or Woodrow Wilson...how about Lyndon Baines Johnson? How far back are we going to go in the blame game? No. Enough of the "Bush put us in such a hole, blah,blah, blah..." rhetoric. OBama said he could fix it, and he didn't...simple as that. If he would've fixed it, I'd vote for him. But he didn't. Walmart isn't your problem, people are your problem. America is chock full of takers, people who produce nothing but suck off the teets of the producers. My teets are red and swollen from the amount of suckers milking my money in food stamps, welfare, assistance, fraud, etc each and every day. Don't blame Bush or Cheney or Condoleeza or Walmart...blame the American people who cheat on disability claims or the 45 million folks on food stamps and sell half of 'em for cash, or the unmarrieds who stay unmarried because they can get more section 8 benefits...those are your real problems.

I thank the good Lord for the rich. "The rich" hire you. Many of my best lawn customers are rich. Love 'em. They cut me big fat checks to mow grass for 'em. You work for the rich. The rich own stuff and make things happen and risk capital that only the rich have. The rich went to medical school or law school, things you couldn't hack. You settled for "Elementary Ed" or "Safety" degrees while partying your life away. They got 31 MCAT scores by busting ass and making it happen. Now, they're rich and own things and can afford to pay for services. The Poor and middle class people have nothing to risk. They cash paychecks by trading time for money, that's the way it works. Go out, middle class, and borrow from friends and family to start up that BBQ joint or soft serve ice cream stand or automatic car wash. Go ahead, see how tough it is. That's right, you don't want the risk do you? You want safety, steady, you want to know that the paycheck will always be there. But you'll work at those places, take care of your families off that paycheck, and go home and badmouth the boss or owner because they have more toys than you. Right? I'm too right...that's the problem...
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  #29  
Old 10-11-2012, 01:30 PM
Mark Oomkes Mark Oomkes is online now
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I have a question:

http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=319739

Why didn't you continue your original thread?

You are RECESSION PROOF MOWING, aren't you?
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  #30  
Old 10-11-2012, 05:36 PM
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jrs.landscaping jrs.landscaping is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CITY PARK CUTTER View Post
Should I bring up Zachery Taylor, or Woodrow Wilson...how about Lyndon Baines Johnson? How far back are we going to go in the blame game? No. Enough of the "Bush put us in such a hole, blah,blah, blah..." rhetoric. OBama said he could fix it, and he didn't...simple as that. If he would've fixed it, I'd vote for him. But he didn't. Walmart isn't your problem, people are your problem. America is chock full of takers, people who produce nothing but suck off the teets of the producers. My teets are red and swollen from the amount of suckers milking my money in food stamps, welfare, assistance, fraud, etc each and every day. Don't blame Bush or Cheney or Condoleeza or Walmart...blame the American people who cheat on disability claims or the 45 million folks on food stamps and sell half of 'em for cash, or the unmarrieds who stay unmarried because they can get more section 8 benefits...those are your real problems.

I thank the good Lord for the rich. "The rich" hire you. Many of my best lawn customers are rich. Love 'em. They cut me big fat checks to mow grass for 'em. You work for the rich. The rich own stuff and make things happen and risk capital that only the rich have. The rich went to medical school or law school, things you couldn't hack. You settled for "Elementary Ed" or "Safety" degrees while partying your life away. They got 31 MCAT scores by busting ass and making it happen. Now, they're rich and own things and can afford to pay for services. The Poor and middle class people have nothing to risk. They cash paychecks by trading time for money, that's the way it works. Go out, middle class, and borrow from friends and family to start up that BBQ joint or soft serve ice cream stand or automatic car wash. Go ahead, see how tough it is. That's right, you don't want the risk do you? You want safety, steady, you want to know that the paycheck will always be there. But you'll work at those places, take care of your families off that paycheck, and go home and badmouth the boss or owner because they have more toys than you. Right? I'm too right...that's the problem...
It's at both ends. Most poor look for handouts and the rich you describe live beyond their means to maintain a "lifestyle." There was a couple that moved in from me a few years ago, and mind you I don't live in a rich town. They had the newer suburban, new truck and ALL the toys. Less than a year later the toys were for sale and the house was foreclosed on. So those "rich" people you talk about, when they piss their money away I feel no sympathy for them. I feel sympathy for the people working at jobs that no longer exist, the ones who are trying to make it and can't make ends meet, and mostly for the elderly, who worked their whole life, to see their country reduced to what it is now.......
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