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  #41  
Old 12-03-2012, 12:28 PM
StanWilhite StanWilhite is offline
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Originally Posted by weaver122876 View Post
I don't know much about BB mowers, but that's a BOLD statement comparing them to a 28 hp Cat TT...
You do realize that you can get a BB a equiped with a Cat?
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  #42  
Old 12-03-2012, 12:48 PM
badbart badbart is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StanWilhite View Post
You do realize that you can get a BB a equiped with a Cat?
My understanding is the BadBoy diesel comes with a 35 hp Cat that puts out 94 ft/lbs torque(to the 28 hp Cat's 52 ft/lbs). That's a lot of power. not sure what the torque is on my JD 997. Can't find it in the specs.
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  #43  
Old 12-03-2012, 01:29 PM
StanWilhite StanWilhite is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GMLC View Post
Bad Boy is not an equal mower in my opinion(you get what you pay for). I have extensive design, fabrication, assembly and welding experience so I have a keen eye which is very very picky(to picky). They keep there costs down by limiting there designs using basic fabrication/assembly techniques. This doesn't always equal the best design for durability and strength but keeps production costs down, thus lowering the end cost to the consumer. I would say Bad Boy is worth what they sell them for but you can't compare them to other top manufacturers that build machines stronger than they have to be and spend a ton on R&D. Cut quality would also be a concern for me as why would they spend any more money on that aspect instead of build design, but who knows? BB customer service has been horrific with many stories on this site.

This is just my personal opinion for what it's worth. Others will say BB builds the best machine out there and just sells it cheaper. I think most people can figure out why on there own...
GMLC I can't understand why you have your "stinger run out" for BB. I've never heard you say that you've ever owned one, or.....operated one for any length of time, or.....that you even personally know anyone that's ever owned or operated one. If I'm wrong about this please enlighten me. This in itself should disqualify you from insinuating that you know something that we owners don't.

But, let me add, I understand the personal preference of yours to designs that incorporate "curves" instead of "straight lines and angles". You formerly admitted that was something you didn't like about BB....but that appeared to be the only thing you could specifically come up with that you didn't like.

But that has nothing to do with the build quality of BB. Do you realize that the commercial BB's use 4 frame rails where others use 2? Do you realize that all BB's (even the most inexpensive model) have the thickest deck of ANY ZTR manufacturer's decks? Do you know of a problem with BB frames that any other builder doesn't have?...because I don't. If you do, please let us know about it.

So they look "boxy" compared to some other mowers...I'll give you that....but so do several other brands. Why don't you have a big issue with those manufacturers too?

As I said, it helps no one to hate something just for the sake of hating it, but it certainly doesn't help anyone when you won't admit that the appearance is the only reason you hate them, and try to turn other people off by making statements like "I'm sure most people can figure it out on their own". Figure what out? Why don't you help us "figure it out" if you know something we don't.

Making statements like the ones you so often make, are just a scare tactic to try to turn away from BB, when you don't have any legitimate specific complaint. Why would you, or anyone for matter, want to do that?

Some people , for some reason, can't help themselves when it comes to making completely unfounded remarks. You just can't reason with someone that is unreasonable. That's something I "can figure out on my own".

I think a good rule to live by would be that you should have experience with any eqp before making any statements...good or bad...about it.

To the OP, sorry, I'm out.
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  #44  
Old 12-03-2012, 01:30 PM
StanWilhite StanWilhite is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badbart View Post
My understanding is the BadBoy diesel comes with a 35 hp Cat that puts out 94 ft/lbs torque(to the 28 hp Cat's 52 ft/lbs). That's a lot of power. not sure what the torque is on my JD 997. Can't find it in the specs.
Try PMing Retrodog, I'm sure he can help you.
Stan
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  #45  
Old 12-03-2012, 08:07 PM
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GMLC GMLC is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StanWilhite View Post
GMLC I can't understand why you have your "stinger run out" for BB. I've never heard you say that you've ever owned one, or.....operated one for any length of time, or.....that you even personally know anyone that's ever owned or operated one. If I'm wrong about this please enlighten me. This in itself should disqualify you from insinuating that you know something that we owners don't.

But, let me add, I understand the personal preference of yours to designs that incorporate "curves" instead of "straight lines and angles". You formerly admitted that was something you didn't like about BB....but that appeared to be the only thing you could specifically come up with that you didn't like.

But that has nothing to do with the build quality of BB. Do you realize that the commercial BB's use 4 frame rails where others use 2? Do you realize that all BB's (even the most inexpensive model) have the thickest deck of ANY ZTR manufacturer's decks? Do you know of a problem with BB frames that any other builder doesn't have?...because I don't. If you do, please let us know about it.

So they look "boxy" compared to some other mowers...I'll give you that....but so do several other brands. Why don't you have a big issue with those manufacturers too?

As I said, it helps no one to hate something just for the sake of hating it, but it certainly doesn't help anyone when you won't admit that the appearance is the only reason you hate them, and try to turn other people off by making statements like "I'm sure most people can figure it out on their own". Figure what out? Why don't you help us "figure it out" if you know something we don't.

Making statements like the ones you so often make, are just a scare tactic to try to turn away from BB, when you don't have any legitimate specific complaint. Why would you, or anyone for matter, want to do that?

Some people , for some reason, can't help themselves when it comes to making completely unfounded remarks. You just can't reason with someone that is unreasonable. That's something I "can figure out on my own".

I think a good rule to live by would be that you should have experience with any eqp before making any statements...good or bad...about it.

To the OP, sorry, I'm out.
Im cursed as I spent most of my teenage years working at my uncles fabrication/machine shop. I was in charge of quality control for several of those years which involved testing welds with x-rays, reading blue prints and specs, setting up jigs and a lot of time on Auto-CAD. All before becoming a master technician by my mid 20's. It doesnt take me long to look at any equipment and form an opinion which I feel Im highly qualified to do. As I said before spend some time at a machine shop and learn about production methods and fabrication. Actually maybe you shouldnt because you may end up like me.....

I would also suggest you write a detailed review of your BB with tons of pics of your machine inside and out. Also please include cut quality pics at all angles and even at ground level.
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  #46  
Old 12-03-2012, 08:34 PM
badbart badbart is offline
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One of my sons went to use the JD 997 this afternoon, he said, Dad, it's making a noise, come listen to it! Now the left front wheel bearing is shot, moves all around. I checked the caster on that wheel(the one that was replaced about a month ago)while I had it in the air, it's hanging up when you turn it all the way around?! Took it to John Deere and was told the wheel bearings only last about 1000 hours....and there is no grease fittings on the wheel?! An 1800 lb. mower and non-greasable wheels! I'm amazed....
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  #47  
Old 12-03-2012, 09:11 PM
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retrodog retrodog is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badbart View Post
My understanding is the BadBoy diesel comes with a 35 hp Cat that puts out 94 ft/lbs torque(to the 28 hp Cat's 52 ft/lbs). That's a lot of power. not sure what the torque is on my JD 997. Can't find it in the specs.
Hey man, the 33.5hp cat 3 cylinder is 57lbs at 2800 rpms on the ferris, yours is a 31 so it is prolly like 54 or so guessing...
The cool thing about the 4 cylinder is the terror factor of the power and how much smoother it is. Its amazing to have that much power and still have fuel consumption like a 25hpnew kubota...
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Oh and the weird thing is the fabricator guys and welders especially these big trailer manufactures are amazed at the welds and metal fab put into the badboys... my neighbor is a bigger guy at pj trailers and they are amazed by them...

Last edited by retrodog; 12-03-2012 at 09:16 PM.
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  #48  
Old 12-03-2012, 10:10 PM
StanWilhite StanWilhite is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GMLC View Post
Im cursed as I spent most of my teenage years working at my uncles fabrication/machine shop. I was in charge of quality control for several of those years which involved testing welds with x-rays, reading blue prints and specs, setting up jigs and a lot of time on Auto-CAD. All before becoming a master technician by my mid 20's. It doesnt take me long to look at any equipment and form an opinion which I feel Im highly qualified to do. As I said before spend some time at a machine shop and learn about production methods and fabrication. Actually maybe you shouldnt because you may end up like me.....

I would also suggest you write a detailed review of your BB with tons of pics of your machine inside and out. Also please include cut quality pics at all angles and even at ground level.
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I can appreciate your background, in fact, I took my first welding course in 1970....so that's what, about 43 years ago? And how long after that were you born?

I still weld occasionally now (in my own shop), so I guess you could say I know a little about what a good weld looks like too...and the ones on my Bad Boy Lightning all look great. Most done by robotic welders like BB (and other name brand brands use) do look good, because, as I'm sure you know, they're more precise, and consistent, than "human hands".

You also say that you don't like BB because they use a "simpler design that is cheaper to make". To that I say, GREAT! As long as it doesn't adversely affect the build quality, that's what I want! Cosmetics that cost extra don't mow the grass any better....and they certainly do nothing for the longevity of the mower. They do one thing....they cost more. If that's what you're after, go for it.....but I'll keep my money.

As for taking pics of my work, I'm not here to push BB, I just get annoyed when people with no experience at all with them, pretend to know more than people like me that have actually owned and operated them for years.

To the OP. Once again I apologize. I won't reply again, no matter how ridiculous the statements about BB get.
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Last edited by StanWilhite; 12-03-2012 at 10:12 PM. Reason: typo
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  #49  
Old 12-03-2012, 10:25 PM
djagusch djagusch is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StanWilhite View Post
I think the thing that should be pointed out about your statement "Bad Boy is a price point mower" is, to me, that insinuates that "Bad Boy" is made cheaper... and that's just not the case at all.

The fact that is, Bad Boy is built every bit as heavy (and in a lot of cases, heavier) than the competition ....all the way from very the bottom of the line (that you see at TSC) to the very top of the line (powered by a Caterpillar diesel engine). It's just that they are "priced" cheaper than the competition's equally built mower.

My Lightning isn't even the "top of the line" Bad Boy and it still sold for 8400.00 in 2009, so you can't say that Bad Boy is a "price point" mower, meaning they're "cheap". The insinuation that "BB's are built cheaper" just isn't accurate. It's just that, you can take whatever money you DO have to spend, and buy more machine from BB than from the competition.

As I've said before, one of my sons has a 260 Gravely and I like Gravely. But when you park his machine beside mine, it's clear at a glance which is built the heaviest....and mine has a LC 26 Kaw while his has an AC 26 Kaw. The fact is also that the Gravely lists for more than my BB listed for.



What is accurate is the fact that in my case, I bought a whole lot more mower for 8400.00 than any other brand I looked at....and I looked at a lot.
Ill say it again its a price point mower.

Its funny my buddy comes on here a month giving a review on his kubota mower and it changes into bb is the best ever made.

Every bb thread states msrp prices on main stream mowers and then says how low the bb price compares. Its a price point mower just on how it is spoken even in this thread.

I don't shop mowers based on price. I base it on quality of cut, build, and dealer support. Figure the cost of operation and then base it off those items. True otd prices compared from main stream and non main stream mowers don't change the cost of operation much over the life of the mower. After you factor resale pricing there isn't a difference if you know how to buy sell.

But back to the thread. Long time kubota owner (think he has owned over 10 kubotas that I have seen) is switching because their newer model gearboxes are not holding up. Went from diesel to gas also (he bought his first gas dodge this year but still has 11 and 06 diesels). The exmark he felt would operate less per hr and felt the dealer would take care of him. He tried toro (diff deck) and scag (felt more in the dust being lower, I think the deck wasn't pitched right).

It was a review with over 20 yrs of being in the industry in the op.
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  #50  
Old 12-03-2012, 10:26 PM
StanWilhite StanWilhite is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Decatur AL
Posts: 1,775
Quote:
Originally Posted by GMLC View Post
Im cursed as I spent most of my teenage years working at my uncles fabrication/machine shop. I was in charge of quality control for several of those years which involved testing welds with x-rays, reading blue prints and specs, setting up jigs and a lot of time on Auto-CAD. All before becoming a master technician by my mid 20's. It doesnt take me long to look at any equipment and form an opinion which I feel Im highly qualified to do. As I said before spend some time at a machine shop and learn about production methods and fabrication. Actually maybe you shouldnt because you may end up like me.....

I would also suggest you write a detailed review of your BB with tons of pics of your machine inside and out. Also please include cut quality pics at all angles and even at ground level.
Posted via Mobile Device
I can appreciate your background, in fact, I took my first welding course in 1970....so that's what, about 43 years ago? And how long after that were you born?

I still weld occasionally now (in my own shop), so I guess you could say I know a little about what a good weld looks like too...and the ones on my Bad Boy Lightning all look great. Most done by robotic welders like BB (and other name brands) use, do look good. Because, as I'm sure you know, they're more precise, and consistent, than "human hands".

You also say that you don't like BB because they use a "simpler design that is cheaper to make". To that I say, GREAT! As long as it doesn't adversely affect the build quality, that's what I want! Cosmetics that cost extra don't mow the grass any better....and they certainly do nothing for the longevity of the mower. They do one thing....they cost more. If that's what you're after, go for it.....but I'll keep my money.

As for taking pics of my work, I'm not here to push BB, I just get annoyed when people with no experience at all with them, pretend to know more than people like me that have actually owned and operated them for years.

To the OP. Once again I apologize. I won't reply again, no matter how ridiculous the statements about BB get.
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