Register free!
Search
 
     

The Green Industry's Resource Center


Click for Weather
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #31  
Old 01-20-2013, 09:58 AM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is offline
LawnSite Fanatic
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Central Wisconsin
Posts: 9,809
turfmd101, mss222 said he was watering ONLY 12 minutes twice per week...
That misunderstanding has driven this thread into mass confusion... i.e., too much water is NOT likely the problem with 24minutes/week of irrigation...

The problem is most likely drought conditions... Either way,,, this is what you'll want to do:
Use a sturdy spade or shovel and push it into the turf as far as you can,,, open up a wedge by moving the shovel forward and backwards... at this point you should have a visual into the root system and even get your hand into the dirt to feel the moisture level... like sticking your finger into a potted plant to see if it needs watering...
It would also be helpful to take a little sample of the dirt and rub it between your fingers... if it is Gritty like grits then it is sandy ,,, if it is greasy like fresh Play-doh then it is probably clay,,, if it is crumbly like old dried out Play-doh then it is possibly good soil...

Doing these little steps are as important as they would be in maintaining a window box watering... once you find out where your soil is at, then follow turfmd101's step #5...
Hope this helps...
__________________
*
Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
,,, I wonder what does...
*
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 01-20-2013, 10:20 AM
gunsnroses's Avatar
gunsnroses gunsnroses is offline
LawnSite Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 257
Here is an extention service link http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/lh010 (I dont believe this has been provided yet)


It should clear any bad, good, complicated or wrong information previously given.

Watering (as needed) is what you need to work on the most, and is pretty hard to figure out.

Unless you pay for a full service company, it may be wise to "nerd" out a bit and really figure out your irrigation system. Paying someone may be wise, but that is your math equation to compute.

good luck
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 01-20-2013, 10:43 AM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is offline
LawnSite Fanatic
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Central Wisconsin
Posts: 9,809
I don't know of many professionals that are willing to babysit an irrigation system so that the lawn gets water, "as needed"...
The best that can be done is to figure out how much water/time it takes to soak up the root zone for this individual lawn... then ,,, depending on weather conditions,,, see how long it takes to become dry again as turfmd101, suggests...
That's all the math necessary for a perfect lawn... too much water becuz of lots of rain??? shut off the irrigation until it is showing drought or the soil actually dries enough to get air in the structure again...

This business about "Irrigation Formula" is just another money making scheme to remove common sense from watering, "As needed"...
__________________
*
Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
,,, I wonder what does...
*
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 01-20-2013, 12:16 PM
turfmd101 turfmd101 is online now
LawnSite Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: orlando fl
Posts: 478
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smallaxe View Post
turfmd101, mss222 said he was watering ONLY 12 minutes twice per week...
That misunderstanding has driven this thread into mass confusion... i.e., too much water is NOT likely the problem with 24minutes/week of irrigation...

The problem is most likely drought conditions... Either way,,, this is what you'll want to do:
Use a sturdy spade or shovel and push it into the turf as far as you can,,, open up a wedge by moving the shovel forward and backwards... at this point you should have a visual into the root system and even get your hand into the dirt to feel the moisture level... like sticking your finger into a potted plant to see if it needs watering...
It would also be helpful to take a little sample of the dirt and rub it between your fingers... if it is Gritty like grits then it is sandy ,,, if it is greasy like fresh Play-doh then it is probably clay,,, if it is crumbly like old dried out Play-doh then it is possibly good soil...

Doing these little steps are as important as they would be in maintaining a window box watering... once you find out where your soil is at, then follow turfmd101's step #5...
Hope this helps...
smallaxe, please do not take this as a challenge response,,, for I enjoy reading your post most and respect your fair, respectful insights. I don't always come a cross so respectful. My trust and respect in the industry, face to face, is my strongest mechanism. On keyboard,,, my fingers do the talking and look what they said about my face. Working on the connection... "those that know me GET me"...

Here goes... I do not factor in any of his irrigation info because there is only IMHO,,, ONE WAY TO H2O your landscape,,, as I had discussed,,,AS NEEDED...
For this reason alone,,, since the HO never mentioned the reasons for his irrigation schedule he made it up, or someone did, without using important factors that do not follow a schedule but undoubtedly MAKE IT,,, I would go against my view on Proper Irrigation Management and he doesn't know it exist to make his schedule.

I can not replay or review the things which may have created his dilemma but I can tell you,,, in my time in the field,,, there are a lot of things that can go wrong but only a hand full of problems that create from these. I believe this because we only primarily use a small arsenal of tools ( 3 types of pesticides, nutrients, soil
amendments, irrigation and our BRAIN) for all most issues.

In my experience BP needs what all things require,,, a formula to exist. BP's can not exist and survive under drought conditions,,, the dryer the harder,,, the wetter the easier,,, he is real active. Drought in Fl normally causes either drought damage or chinch bug then death if left unattended. IMHO,,,properly dried turf disables BP's trigger. He has it... over wet is not a matter of a schedule as much as it IS a matter of FACT. Its something that shows in the life that uses it. Whether its up/down.

No doubt his root system is littered with issues, ( good ones, desiccated ones, anchor roots with minimal fine hair feeder roots, swollen roots from nematodes, roots 2" to 8" roots, it was probably muck base sod and that will cause soil surface areas in week, hot sun conditions to become hydrophobic after over irrigation and rain have ceased to continue. JMHO.

That's some cliff notes to my observations of the HO pictures. I see what he has as most and after 26 years of seeing the same pictures with the usual issues. I also see the same old trail of disaster and it always Leeds to irrigation. Mechanical damage,,, another story.

I don't believe in mystery in the environment. But I do go by a certain set of factors and condition effects all created from the same recipe just a change of ingredients and I've tasted most versions.
Posted via Mobile Device

Last edited by turfmd101; 01-20-2013 at 12:24 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 01-20-2013, 12:21 PM
mss222 mss222 is offline
LawnSite Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smallaxe View Post
turfmd101, mss222 said he was watering ONLY 12 minutes twice per week...
That misunderstanding has driven this thread into mass confusion... i.e., too much water is NOT likely the problem with 24minutes/week of irrigation...

The problem is most likely drought conditions... Either way,,, this is what you'll want to do:
Use a sturdy spade or shovel and push it into the turf as far as you can,,, open up a wedge by moving the shovel forward and backwards... at this point you should have a visual into the root system and even get your hand into the dirt to feel the moisture level... like sticking your finger into a potted plant to see if it needs watering...
It would also be helpful to take a little sample of the dirt and rub it between your fingers... if it is Gritty like grits then it is sandy ,,, if it is greasy like fresh Play-doh then it is probably clay,,, if it is crumbly like old dried out Play-doh then it is possibly good soil...

Doing these little steps are as important as they would be in maintaining a window box watering... once you find out where your soil is at, then follow turfmd101's step #5...
Hope this helps...
I just did what you said, the soil is a dark black it is not gritty, im not sure what you mean bye greasy, and it didn't per se crumble like dried out playdoh.

The soil itself definitely didnt feel like it had a lot of moisture to it, at the same time it didn't feel like it was completely dried out. At the same time it seemed pretty easy for the roots to come out of the soil.

If its a lack of watering, why would I have all of those orange circled chunks that appear to look like brown patch fungus. Doesn't that come from excessive mositure?

The spots that aren't orange but are kind of a light grey/brown and look liked dried up dead spots is that from a lack of water? Could I possibly save it by spot watering it?

I was told that twice a week with each zone being watered for 12 minutes was adequate. Maybe I'm wrong? Especially since some of them are rotary sprinklers so its not constantly watering the same spot for 12 minutes straight.

Is 6:30 am a good time to start the sprinkler system and any recommendations on what to change it to right now to try and get back the grass in shape.

I have sent emails to 3 pesticide companies to come out this week and give me a free diagnostic on what must be done and how much. But preferrably I'd rather take care of this myself if possible.
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 01-20-2013, 12:24 PM
mss222 mss222 is offline
LawnSite Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smallaxe View Post
turfmd101, mss222 said he was watering ONLY 12 minutes twice per week...
That misunderstanding has driven this thread into mass confusion... i.e., too much water is NOT likely the problem with 24minutes/week of irrigation...

The problem is most likely drought conditions... Either way,,, this is what you'll want to do:
Use a sturdy spade or shovel and push it into the turf as far as you can,,, open up a wedge by moving the shovel forward and backwards... at this point you should have a visual into the root system and even get your hand into the dirt to feel the moisture level... like sticking your finger into a potted plant to see if it needs watering...
It would also be helpful to take a little sample of the dirt and rub it between your fingers... if it is Gritty like grits then it is sandy ,,, if it is greasy like fresh Play-doh then it is probably clay,,, if it is crumbly like old dried out Play-doh then it is possibly good soil...

Doing these little steps are as important as they would be in maintaining a window box watering... once you find out where your soil is at, then follow turfmd101's step #5...
Hope this helps...
Quote:
Originally Posted by gunsnroses View Post
Here is an extention service link http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/lh010 (I dont believe this has been provided yet)


It should clear any bad, good, complicated or wrong information previously given.

Watering (as needed) is what you need to work on the most, and is pretty hard to figure out.

Unless you pay for a full service company, it may be wise to "nerd" out a bit and really figure out your irrigation system. Paying someone may be wise, but that is your math equation to compute.

good luck
I looked at that site and I am wondering it a lot of the areas that no longer have green and look dried out are from chinch bugs. I was told by the previous owner that his whole yard had chinch bugs in them at one point and ruined his grass, and that he paid to have them removed, but maybe they came back? How would I be able to tell.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 01-20-2013, 12:28 PM
turfmd101 turfmd101 is online now
LawnSite Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: orlando fl
Posts: 478
Probably some mole cricket damage and chinch bug dont just come back, they are invited back to feed in stress areas.They hunt for food and live where its easily accessible. Healthy turf resist damage not activity.
Posted via Mobile Device

Last edited by turfmd101; 01-20-2013 at 12:36 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 01-20-2013, 12:30 PM
mss222 mss222 is offline
LawnSite Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by turfmd101 View Post
With all due respect. You asked what was killing your turf and unfortunately its you. The type of irrigation practices you described leads me to believe you set the stage for this poor performance. You probably had the classic rain help making it look as though you were doing a good job but when the real dry weather settled in...the errors of your ways were exposed.
Someone needs a good lesson in herbicide applications also.
Before you take in more responses. Make sure you get the better pictures for responders. Pulling up a couple of runners trying not to damage the roots. Lay them on the blacktop to ensure visibility so all can see the nematode activity before they give any product suggestions. I can not suggest any products at this time or tell you if these areas will survive. They can but unless you get proper cultural practices implemented most products will give false hope.

Start with correcting your irrigation management as well as keep that blade sharp and HIGH.
Posted via Mobile Device

When you say pull up a couple of runners without damaging the roots, I don't know what a runner is?Can you clarify what exactly needs to be pulled and shown on the blacktop for the picture you would like to see. Thank you.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 01-20-2013, 12:40 PM
turfmd101 turfmd101 is online now
LawnSite Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: orlando fl
Posts: 478
Quote:
Originally Posted by mss222 View Post
When you say pull up a couple of runners without damaging the roots, I don't know what a runner is?Can you clarify what exactly needs to be pulled and shown on the blacktop for the picture you would like to see. Thank you.
Google a picture of one then go find one. Know your plant.
Posted via Mobile Device
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 01-20-2013, 03:04 PM
mss222 mss222 is offline
LawnSite Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 11
More close up pictures to show the areas where the grass is not healthy looks like this:


Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump





Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©1998 - 2012, LawnSite.comô - Moose River Media
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:07 AM.

Page generated in 0.07643 seconds with 9 queries