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  #11  
Old 01-25-2013, 01:05 PM
MikeT MikeT is offline
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I've used a Kioritz injector, but it's no longer available. Check out the link for it's replacement option.

http://www.rittenhouse.ca/asp/product.asp?PG=1936
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  #12  
Old 01-25-2013, 02:54 PM
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turf hokie turf hokie is offline
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What is your target pest on River Birch? on Maple?

These are trees that dont routinely need to be treated.

Also, what good could you possible be able to do with one broad spectrum application per year and who advised you of this?

I dont think you are going to get much more help on pricing as different products have different pricing.

If you have been using an IPM program for years and have not incorporated soil or tree injections as part of your service, you may not be using an IPM program.

As was said in another post, mauget and like products are a specialty product, not one that is used as a replacement for say...an oil spray.

It does sound like you just may be a touch out of your league or at the very least out of your area of expertise with this project.
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  #13  
Old 01-25-2013, 04:42 PM
Nitroman Nitroman is offline
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Ok. So let me ask the question this way. You have a client with hundreds of different species. They want a IPM program, it's winter and your pricing it now. I don't have a crystal ball to see what problems are going to come up down the road with each tree or shrub. How do you price the account and what do you tell the customer you are going to do?

Obviously each species needs a different approach. Different preventative products at different times of year ie crab apple trees.

If anyone knows where to pick up this crystal ball let me know since I'm such a newb and have no experience.
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  #14  
Old 01-25-2013, 05:09 PM
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turf hokie turf hokie is offline
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Sigh....I REALLY dont want to come off as a smart ass....

Your original post asked for an IPM program that only included injections and only 1x per year.....that is not an IPM program.

This is what I tell my potential client, weather it is 10 trees or 1000 trees.

My IPM program consists of X site visits throughout the year based on GDD and the plant material that is onsite. These site visits include diagnosis and treatment as needed. Your price is X per visit and Y for the year.

We estimate all the time during the winter because I can identify what type of plant material is on site and the potential problems based on my experience and knowledge of MY area.

Just because this site is large does not mean it is different than a bunch of average residential houses.

You have yet to answer a single one of my questions except to tell me that 600 ft of hose wont reach the area of service.

You have mentioned River Birch, Maple and Crab apple so far, what are your potential problems with each of those trees? That would be a good starting point in putting together a program.

But since you seem to think we are just giving you a hard time and not answering your questions and you have all the experience you need to do an IPM program except how to ID, diagnose, treat or price....

Here is my answer: imidicloprid Mauget caps and charge $2 per tree, you should be good....or get a spray rig that will get to your service area and continue with your pseudo IPM spray program.

Good luck.
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  #15  
Old 01-25-2013, 05:18 PM
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phasthound phasthound is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitroman View Post
Ahh there are some river birch trees, small maples, and a few other species.

Really need pricing guys. 200 to 300 small trees. Pricing gents...pricing. Please
What is the history of insect problems?
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  #16  
Old 01-25-2013, 09:51 PM
MikeT MikeT is offline
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Maybe there's some confusion with definitions here, Nitro. Are you referring to a conventional Plant Health Care program that you're trying to price, something that will cover all the bases, or Integrated Pest Management? In either case you would know the target you wish to treat. Did the client ask for an "IPM" treatment plan, thinking that means, "treat my trees," or did you suggest that strategy?
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  #17  
Old 01-26-2013, 12:47 AM
Nitroman Nitroman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turf hokie View Post
Sigh....I REALLY dont want to come off as a smart ass....

Your original post asked for an IPM program that only included injections and only 1x per year.....that is not an IPM program.

But since you seem to think we are just giving you a hard time and not answering your questions and you have all the experience you need to do an IPM program except how to ID, diagnose, treat or price....
Congrats you are a smart ass. I didn't say one per year. I said I read it can be damaging to do more than on injection per year for certain situations. This is a great site but I can't say I'm surprised to ask a question such as what is your preferred method for tree and shrub care(IPM) without being able to spray higher than 10' and the ELITIST come out of the wood work.
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  #18  
Old 01-26-2013, 11:30 AM
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turf hokie turf hokie is offline
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Ok, now you have me quoting just about this whole thread, because I just dont think you get it. We have been trying to help but you are not answering any pertinent questions nor are you being clear with what you are asking. It seems you think you are asking and giving information but those thoughts are not making it here. You are looking for a solution and a price for a problem that does not exist.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitroman View Post
Obviously species and insects make a difference, but just looking for broad spectrum products. I've been advised not to make more than one application per year.

I asked without an answer, "who advised you to not make more than one application." The reason for this is from your original post above, you make it sound like you want a one application IPM program which does not exist.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitroman View Post
I didn't say one per year. I said I read it can be damaging to do more than on injection per year for certain situations.
This quote is from your last post, contradicting yourself?

Also how do you price your jobs?
if you have experience in IPM programs you would know how to price already
Thanks
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitroman View Post
No. Wish I could. this needs to be done by a back pack or injection. So I really can't do a dormant oil app can I if I'm limited to the trunk?

Why are you limited to the trunk? Injections dont have to just be done to the trunk

Also what products would you use for nutrients namely, fungicide, and insecticide for a trunk saturation treatment.
fungicide and insecticide are not nutrients

I know pesticides are out there for this but what about fert.?
???? you need to trunk inject fertilizer now too?


Quote:
Originally Posted by phasthound View Post
Can you be more specific about what you are treating for and how this fits into an IPM program?
yet another question left unanswered, and without some input from you, nobody will be able to help

Quote:
Originally Posted by phasthound View Post
What is the history of insect problems?
Another unanswered question that would be helpful in getting help from us

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitroman View Post
Ahh there are some river birch trees, small maples, and a few other species.

Really need pricing guys. 200 to 300 small trees. Pricing gents...pricing. Please
I asked the following and did not get an answer
What is your target pest on River Birch? on Maple?

These are trees that dont routinely need to be treated.

No way we can add to the conversation without having this answered first, otherwise we are spitballing at what product you need OR DONT NEED.

[QUOTE=Cadzilla;4655900]It's like anything else. Figure your costs, and what you want to make on the job but honestly it doesn't sound like the kind of job that requires injection.

Injecting trees is a specialty. It requires experience and some know how.

If you're trying to inject these trees because you are not capable of spraying them with a foliar application then maybe you need to think about other options like subbing it out or getting a sprayer.

No offense but it sounds like you're way out of your league dude.[/QUOTE]

Cadzilla gave some sound advice here,



Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitroman View Post
Ok. So let me ask the question this way. You have a client with hundreds of different species. They want a IPM program, it's winter and your pricing it now. I don't have a crystal ball to see what problems are going to come up down the road with each tree or shrub. How do you price the account and what do you tell the customer you are going to do?

I answered the above question, unfortunately for you, it doesnt fit into a nice neat box and give you exactly what you need to do with a price, because nobody can give that to you. Your costs, along with disease and insect pressure will vary too greatly from the rest of us to give you a hand out, especially with no real input from you other than, I need a broad spectrum injection 1x per year and a price for 200-300 trees..

Obviously each species needs a different approach. Different preventative products at different times of year ie crab apple trees.

Yes, certain types of trees and their pests need to be treated differently and and different times and that is why I suggested you use an IPM approach where you scout and treat as needed.

If anyone knows where to pick up this crystal ball let me know since I'm such a newb and have no experience.There is no crystal ball, its called experience, which you claim to have. Experience would include knowledge and history of the site, if the site is new then at the very least a knowledge and histroy of problems in the general area along with monitoring, mechanical control, spraying, soil and trunk injections and sometimes nothing at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by turf hokie View Post
This is what I tell my potential client, weather it is 10 trees or 1000 trees.

My IPM program consists of X site visits throughout the year based on GDD and the plant material that is onsite. These site visits include diagnosis and treatment as needed. Your price is X per visit and Y for the year.

We estimate all the time during the winter because I can identify what type of plant material is on site and the potential problems based on my experience and knowledge of MY area.

Just because this site is large does not mean it is different than a bunch of average residential houses.

You have yet to answer a single one of my questions except to tell me that 600 ft of hose wont reach the area of service.

You have mentioned River Birch, Maple and Crab apple so far, what are your potential problems with each of those trees? That would be a good starting point in putting together a program.

I thought I gave you a pretty decent answer above with the information you have given us

But since you seem to think we are just giving you a hard time and not answering your questions and you have all the experience you need to do an IPM program except how to ID, diagnose, treat or price....

Here is my answer: imidicloprid Mauget caps and charge $2 per tree, you should be good....or get a spray rig that will get to your service area and continue with your pseudo IPM spray program.
Yes, the above is a smart ass answer, why? because all you want is the name of a product and a price quote. You have not answered any pertinent questions asked of you in order to receive any sound advice
Good luck.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitroman View Post
Congrats you are a smart ass. I didn't say one per year. I said I read it can be damaging to do more than on injection per year for certain situations. This is a great site but I can't say I'm surprised to ask a question such as what is your preferred method for tree and shrub care(IPM) without being able to spray higher than 10' and the ELITIST come out of the wood work.You never asked the above question, not even close. because the answer to this question is, why can you not spray higher than 10ft? An IPM program will be severely hampered if that is the case.......is the reason for not spraying above 10ft at the request of the customer? then you need to educate them...is the reason because you dont have the proper equipment, then go get the proper equipment.....an IPM program or any program for that matter does not consist solely on injections....as a matter of fact soil injections are a small part of our program and I cannot remember the last time we trunk injected.....
Until you can answer some of the questions posed to you we are all going to come off as "Elitist" because we do not have enough information to give you a good answer to anything.

And I still stand by the fact that if you did indeed have the experience and knowledge that you think you do....you would not be asking the questions you are and you would be able to answer the simple questions that I have asked.
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  #19  
Old 06-22-2013, 06:13 PM
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americanlawn americanlawn is offline
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turf hokie makes sense. I can spray trees as tall as 50 feet, but I prefer Mauget for micronutrient defiences.

Anybody gunna rip me a new one?
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  #20  
Old 06-23-2013, 11:38 AM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by americanlawn View Post
turf hokie makes sense. I can spray trees as tall as 50 feet, but I prefer Mauget for micronutrient defiences.

Anybody gunna rip me a new one?
Spraying trees that are indigenous and populous, in a forest setting, as a preventative measure is now currently the biggest rip-off stupidity existing in our business... it even surpasses fertilizing frozen turf...
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