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  #21  
Old 03-06-2013, 12:10 AM
joed joed is offline
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Originally Posted by joemower View Post
Picked mine up last Friday. I've been debating one since I saw it at the GIE Expo last October. I looked at the Exmark & Toro side by side and felt that the Exmark was the better option for us. We have used the Toro commercial 21" mowers for 30 years but switched to the Exmark 21" mowers 2 years ago and really like them better. I hope the same works for the 30". We debated about even buying a 30'' also. This is how we looked at it. Over the years we have tried to replace the push mowers with several different types of 32" walk-behinds but none of them filled the niche. My employee always preferred them and were more productive using the 21'' push mowers in these niche yards over the 32". The client's preferred it that way also. Therefore the 32" walk-behinds always ended up just taking up trailer space and then eventually sold. Bottom line is that we have to look at these new 30" mowers not as a replacement to a 32'' walk-behind but as an upgrade to a push mower. One that hopefully will be more productive upgrade.
Good feedback Joe Mower. I've been looking to purchase either a toro commercial 21" or exmark 21". Having used both, can you explain why you like the exmark 21" better? Thanks
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  #22  
Old 03-06-2013, 12:48 AM
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sildoc sildoc is offline
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So the reason the Kawasaki 6hp can be used successfully on the 30 is the same reason as it was enough on the 26. It is not direct drive like a 21 is. They use spindles and on top of that spindle is a very well calculated pulley that allows the engine to stay in the peak operating range. Now wet thick tall grass will slow it down but it also does so with a 21, 36, 52 or 72. In those conditions you need to slow down like any other mower. The kawasaki 6hp is a great mower and has had test that range from the low 6hp up to almost 8 I believe, need to find that site again. The good thing about Kawi motors is they guarantee the hp they say it is to be the minimum that it will produce.
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  #23  
Old 03-06-2013, 05:25 AM
rbljack rbljack is offline
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" Bottom line is that we have to look at these new 30" mowers not as a replacement to a 32'' walk-behind but as an upgrade to a push mower. One that hopefully will be more productive upgrade"

This is exactly how I looked at it also. It provides a faster cut on smaller yards AND if I'm right, will serve well as a trim mower and speed things up. Best part is that I now will also have back up. IF the 30 goes in the shop, I can still fall back on the Honda HRC.

And to be honest, I really am not sure what the true horspower ratings are for the Kawi engine. I was mainly looking at the reliability of that engine instead because the HP ratings and Torque ratings have become so unreliable. Most of the reviews I have read were positive overall for the exmark 21.

Today I set up the trailer and made some room for the new mower, and adjusted the handle height. This was easily done with a ratchet and a single socket (cant remember which size).

The mower seems solid overall, with only one area that seems to be a weak point at the moment. The gas tank isnt mounted as securely as I would like. One other small detail that bugged me was the plastic Oil Dip Stick. It just feels cheap to me, but this is a small gripe.

Someone mentioned the bag seems small, and I have to agree with you on that. Its the same size as the exmark 21, so it will fill quickly during the growing season. I mulch most yards, so this shouldnt be a big deal.

Regarding the trans...someone mentioned its a single speed, but that isnt the case on the exmark. I was supposed to be mowing some weeded properties with it today, but instead I ended up trimming crepe myrtles and shaping a few shrubs and rose bushes for a new customer. She liked the work, and hired me for lawn care this season, and already paid up front for the month of March.... so tomorrow I'll get the mower dirty. Stay tuned for more.....
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  #24  
Old 03-06-2013, 08:09 AM
Roger Roger is offline
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Originally Posted by rbljack View Post
...

Regarding the trans...someone mentioned its a single speed, but that isnt the case on the exmark. ...
Please elaborate. Information regarding the ground drive has been very sparse. If not a single speed, then how many? Geared transmission change? Belt slip? CVT?

I have not seen anybody post pictures (>10) with covers removed so that the inner workings of the machine are exposed. If anybody has a link, please post.

Thanks.
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  #25  
Old 03-06-2013, 09:43 AM
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Jason Rose Jason Rose is offline
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It is in fact a single speed transmission. No neutral, no gear selector and nothing in the owners manual that says otherwise. It relies on belt slip to adjust speed, just like the personal pace residential version.

The cable can be adjusted on the handle, and I've not been able to play in the lawn with it yet, but id think the cable could be backed off just enough to limit the top speed when the bail is fully squeezed against the handle.
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  #26  
Old 03-06-2013, 10:53 AM
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JFGLN JFGLN is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Rose View Post
It is in fact a single speed transmission. No neutral, no gear selector and nothing in the owners manual that says otherwise. It relies on belt slip to adjust speed, just like the personal pace residential version.

The cable can be adjusted on the handle, and I've not been able to play in the lawn with it yet, but id think the cable could be backed off just enough to limit the top speed when the bail is fully squeezed against the handle.
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It's tricky getting the cable adjusted properly. Too loose you have to give the mower a little push to get going. Too tight and it takes off too fast.
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  #27  
Old 03-06-2013, 12:30 PM
joemower joemower is offline
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Originally Posted by johnaandp View Post
So joemower, why do the 32 wb's stay on the the trailer? Are they not an effective replacement for the 21's? I only ask because I have been debating 30" Toro/Exmark vs 32 Ferris. I was leaning toward Ferris because of larger engine , fuel tank, spindles and heavier transmission. Plus, my thought is that the Ferris would do better on the 25-30 lawns per day ( we use 21's and 36ztr sometimes) than the toro/exmark. Am I incorrect in my assumption and why?
John- The 32'' would stay on the trailer because of several reasons. First and foremost they are just more cumbersome to use in the small areas compared to the 21". Our guys seemed to have to fight the machines and it just simply wore them out quicker. Secondly the larger and heavier machine seem to damage the turf in smaller areas and on hills. Thirdly the 21" mowers always mulched and and bagged better than the 32". Overall the productivity was better for us when we used a quality 21" mower in small area situations. Save the room on your trailer for a 48" WB or bigger. I've just found that a WB is only truly productive when you can use a 48" or bigger. I know there are fans of 32" & 36" WB out there and I'm not knocking them, but for us our sweet spot for a WB is a 48" or 52". Although we have gotten away from the traditional WB's all together and now use the Toro Grandstands. Just remember when your making your decision that heavier and bigger is not always better. Chose what will be the most productive for the majority of your situations. Any decent quality of machine will last if properly operated and taken care of. We would traditionally get 6 years or more out of our Toro 21" Commercial push mowers. The same would go for our larger WB's. It would be our hope to replace a 21" push with the a 30" push instead of adding a 32" WB and still needing a 21".
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  #28  
Old 03-06-2013, 12:50 PM
joemower joemower is offline
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Originally Posted by joed View Post
Good feedback Joe Mower. I've been looking to purchase either a toro commercial 21" or exmark 21". Having used both, can you explain why you like the exmark 21" better? Thanks
Joed- There are a many of reasons I like the Exmark 21" over the Toro 21". First I like the simplicity of the bails. The smaller less obtrusive bails on the Exmark are so much more user friendly. I also really like the height adjusters and wheels better on the Exmark. The height adjuster on the Toros always bent up and wore out quickly. If they didn't they were tough to move or even seized up in the body casting prohibiting you from replacing them. Over all the Exmark's mower deck is a cleaner and more sturdy design than the Toro. They both cut fairly equal but I must admit that the Toro might mulch slightly better but not enough to make a difference. The Exmark just feels better balanced and has a tougher but more simplistic functional design. The Honda GX engine on the Exmark doesn't hurt either. I really hope this is true for the 30" also. From what I can see thus far I think it will. One more thing to take into consideration is your dealer support. We have better dealer support with our Exmark dealer than with our Toro dealer.
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  #29  
Old 03-06-2013, 02:19 PM
Kevin R Kevin R is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sildoc View Post
So the reason the Kawasaki 6hp can be used successfully on the 30 is the same reason as it was enough on the 26. It is not direct drive like a 21 is. They use spindles and on top of that spindle is a very well calculated pulley that allows the engine to stay in the peak operating range. Now wet thick tall grass will slow it down but it also does so with a 21, 36, 52 or 72. In those conditions you need to slow down like any other mower. The kawasaki 6hp is a great mower and has had test that range from the low 6hp up to almost 8 I believe, need to find that site again. The good thing about Kawi motors is they guarantee the hp they say it is to be the minimum that it will produce.
Finally someone who has right!

The twin blades help this as well, not needing the horsepower you may think it needs.

All's that motor is doing is turning blades, no hydro's, pumps or blowers, that stuff robs horsepower. Yes you may have a bigger motor in the Ferris 32 but I bet the same power down at the blade as the 30"



I get mine tomorrow! (:

KR
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  #30  
Old 03-06-2013, 04:32 PM
smallstripesnc smallstripesnc is offline
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I sent toro a lot of feedback on the timemaster when I had issues with it. I will never buy another briggs and stratton engine after having the issues I did with it (governor gear shattered within a week of daily use) and I insisted they try putting a kawasaki or kohler on it and make it a lot more "commercial" friendly because in this economy tons of people are starting up lawn business's and a 30inch mower is perfect for that guy to put in the back of a pick up easily and even buy two at the price of one hydro 36in walk behind.

Personally I agree you can't replace a true 36in walk behind and the commercial 30's have their place.
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