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  #21  
Old 02-04-2014, 09:36 AM
knox gsl's Avatar
knox gsl knox gsl is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DVS Hardscaper View Post
Humans are nothing more than sheep. They like to follow one another and all do the same thing. "Oh, it's January / February, time to go to the paver seminars". Not realizing that they've been to the same seminars for the past 6 consecutive years! Or it's "eou eou, gotta go, or the local competitors will think I've gone out of business".

Anyone remember going to these seminars back when Nextel's were the big thing? (and remember how big those Nextels were!) And how everyone at the seminars JUST HAD to be on their Nextel Direct Connect during the seminars feeling important and king of the world? LOL
I hated those things, always beeping in when trying to talk to a customer.
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  #22  
Old 02-04-2014, 09:50 AM
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DVS Hardscaper DVS Hardscaper is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrusk View Post
I know vanderkoi is very big on teaching contractor to know their costs and expenses to do business so they price accurately. The thing that always bothered me is that your expenses really don't dictate the job price. The free market dictates the price. You can't just buy a fleet of new trucks every year and factor it into your hourly rate and think everything is going to be ok.

Well, not so much new trucks or equipment every years.

What vanderkoi preaches is correct, but the hardscape market does not enable the contractor to properly recover costs.

For patio construction I can not factor in every gallon of fuel consumed for that job. I can not factor in the cost of equipment expenses (parts, repairs, and costs of purchasing equipment). If I were to factor in every penny affiliated with the job (which I should), I would not get the job.

And this is exactly what the title of this thread is about!

You can't properly price a job because this hardscape industry is EASY START-UP! And it's the paver manufacturers ARE spawning the EASY START-UP.

Paver Pete has always said that Techo wants the best contractors. only the best. end of story. Period. gotta go. But....his showcases have told me otherwise. 30-40 minutes spent on door hangers. 1 hr spent on job costing. 40 minutes spent on image. All components that of business that veterans have mastered, veterans are the one's that Techo wants on their team, but that's not who Techo is talking to at the showcases!!! And it's not just Paver Pete, it's all the manufacturers. They are spawning the low ballers! They are spawning everything that vanderkoi is against.

Am I the only one that see's this?? Of course I am, I'm the only one with a brain here! And I don't even have glasses yet! Just imagine how much smarter I'm gonna be when I get glasses!

With the type of excavating work we do - I DO factor in fuel expenses. I DO factor in equipment costs. I DO factor in toll road expenses. I am able to factor in everything that vanderkoi preaches. Hardscaping - no way no how. Not happening. bye bye.
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Last edited by DVS Hardscaper; 02-04-2014 at 09:56 AM.
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  #23  
Old 02-04-2014, 11:22 AM
neighborguy neighborguy is offline
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I think the argument could also be made that the seminars are there to help the guy that is on the cusp of getting big. I realize that there are a lot of guys on here that have been doing this the right way a long time. They have struggled at some point, learned a lesson, gotten better and now don't need the advice given at the seminar.

There are also the little guy that is on the verge of a second crew that may need a little encouragement from one of the seminars to help him get a little bigger/better.

I have been going to all the seminars in the area for years; not necessarily to learn how to put in a patio (been doing that for 15 years) but to pick up that one little bit of information that might help me sway a customer to upgrade or install the lights that were on option. You get out of the seminars what you want. (this is not a shot at anyone) If you know it all, stop going. Let the newbie go to get what he needs. I think the lowballers have no interest in learning the right way.
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  #24  
Old 02-04-2014, 11:49 AM
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zedosix zedosix is offline
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Nothing wrong with seminars, you take what you can from it and move on. I actually love going to them, not that I take many in, but its a great meeting place for alot of bored and cold hardscapers.
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  #25  
Old 02-04-2014, 12:59 PM
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DVS Hardscaper DVS Hardscaper is online now
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seminars are one thing. (I think some are misinterpreting)

The content of the seminars are another.......




.
__________________
"It's You vs. You"

"People Throw Rocks At Things That Shine"


My Equipment Brag List:

-1 CAT hat
-16 pairs of Hanes socks (the Heavy Duty model), many with holes.
-12 pairs of underwear, ranging from Joe Boxers to Jockey, many are in need of replacement. (no more photo requests please)
-hundreds of t-shirts. Some w/ grease stains, some torn & tattered.
-7 pairs of jeans, ranging from Levis to Polo to GAP. 1/2 of them have holes in 'em.
-1 belt
-1 pair of old worn out Nike shoes.
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  #26  
Old 02-04-2014, 09:27 PM
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alldayrj alldayrj is offline
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This will be my third year going to Cambridges. They never once told us how to market, job cost, or lay brick. Its strictly intrudcing changes to the product line, new stuff, catch up with the product reps etc. i love it, makes me learn the stuff that other dont(if you pay attention and stay off the nextel)

Im trying to go to nicolock to see tom G this year but i dont think the weather will cooperate. Unilock is hosting theres at the same time, real smart. Never been to either of theire before though so i cant comment.
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  #27  
Old 02-04-2014, 11:02 PM
DVS Hardscaper's Avatar
DVS Hardscaper DVS Hardscaper is online now
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nicolock's schedule of events does look like the most appealing that I've seen yet this year
__________________
"It's You vs. You"

"People Throw Rocks At Things That Shine"


My Equipment Brag List:

-1 CAT hat
-16 pairs of Hanes socks (the Heavy Duty model), many with holes.
-12 pairs of underwear, ranging from Joe Boxers to Jockey, many are in need of replacement. (no more photo requests please)
-hundreds of t-shirts. Some w/ grease stains, some torn & tattered.
-7 pairs of jeans, ranging from Levis to Polo to GAP. 1/2 of them have holes in 'em.
-1 belt
-1 pair of old worn out Nike shoes.
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  #28  
Old 02-11-2014, 07:08 PM
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jmkr02 jmkr02 is offline
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They tend to be commercials to buy product. Once I took my guys to one, big mistake they liked lunch, but thought it was a waste of their time. They were picking out the flaws in the presentation but then it became a issue in critiquing the people soaking up the bs. One of the presenters asked what have you done with the product and it was substantialy more involved then the intallion process that they were pitching.
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  #29  
Old 02-11-2014, 07:24 PM
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jmkr02 jmkr02 is offline
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I will admit one paver company did do one good seminar they provided a NCMA SRW course, and another a good course in paver maintenance. Later I heard the manufacturer was upset because it didn't directly spawn sales! The real problem was the manufacturer representative's made and continue to make is corporate makes promises that the local can not deliver. What was this thread about oh yeah the first seminar was a dozen contractors in their shop now it's an arena with a few hundred excited to get a package of door hangers and chance to win a ipad. I guess it helps sell the product through exposure then after all of the spawned sales people the authorized Contractor sells the install. It's good and bad.
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  #30  
Old 03-01-2014, 11:52 AM
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4 seasons lawn&land 4 seasons lawn&land is online now
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Lol this is a funny thread. I'm glad pavers are not a popular thing around here at all. I went to one of the seminars once.... Yeah it was bad.
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