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  #31  
Old 06-05-2014, 07:58 PM
agrostis agrostis is offline
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I know you are trying to be proactive but i think those airborne pathogen's are gonna get you in the end. Good luck.
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  #32  
Old 06-05-2014, 08:07 PM
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YellowDogSVC YellowDogSVC is offline
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Originally Posted by agrostis View Post
I know you are trying to be proactive but i think those airborne pathogen's are gonna get you in the end. Good luck.
It's the underground root to root transmission that's the biggest problem. If it was just airborne, we'd only worry about it at certain times of the year (spring and maybe some fall) and you'd need a vector (bug or open wound to move the spores into the sap).

Our live oak forests are often dense with cedars, persimmons, cedar elms, hackberry, mountain laurels and other trees/shrubs. Getting to the oaks to remove them or sever roots is truly a big undertaking. It's not like trying to prune or remove a tree in the middle of a yard so everything requires more planning and patience.
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  #33  
Old 06-05-2014, 10:41 PM
anthonyp anthonyp is offline
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Up in Western N C she have a cabin, and a few years ago the Hemlocks started to die..It came from a little white `attachment` that has a tiny worm inside…..We found a product called Merit, and it cost maybe a hundred dollars a gallon, made by Bayer…..I purchased some , and followed the instructions, and systemically it killed the disease, saving all of our hemlocks
I got back to Charleston and found that the ingredient `imidacloprid` is very diluted in the Bayer produce, and they sell a much stronger cheaper product…..I strongly urge you to look this up, and further even if they (experts) say it won`t work, get some and put it around the most important trees ….I`v had great luck, but haven`t it stop the `pine beetle` once it got started…..The trees I treated that are more important did not get sick. Maybe just fate, but it sure worked for the Hemlocks, and I think maybe a good preventative….Hope this helps in some way Tony ps the spelling again with my eyesight in dull light :-) lmidacloprid
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  #34  
Old 06-05-2014, 11:23 PM
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YellowDogSVC YellowDogSVC is offline
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this is a fungus. fungi are very tough to kill and can live many years underground. There is literally millions of acres under attack so treatment, whether it's a fungicide or fungistat, is very expensive. I plan to micro inject trees around my house, if and when, things get bad but the micro or macro injections don't kill the fungus but rather keep it from reproducing effectively in the host tree. It's a scary deal and there's not a lot of press unless you live in an affected area or have high value trees.

Here's a little info for those interested. I may have posted this before.

http://texasforestservice.tamu.edu/u...e_Oak_Wilt.pdf

http://texasforestservice.tamu.edu/u...20Billings.pdf
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  #35  
Old 06-06-2014, 06:40 AM
Mark Oomkes Mark Oomkes is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anthonyp View Post
Up in Western N C she have a cabin, and a few years ago the Hemlocks started to die..It came from a little white `attachment` that has a tiny worm inside…..We found a product called Merit, and it cost maybe a hundred dollars a gallon, made by Bayer…..I purchased some , and followed the instructions, and systemically it killed the disease, saving all of our hemlocks
I got back to Charleston and found that the ingredient `imidacloprid` is very diluted in the Bayer produce, and they sell a much stronger cheaper product…..I strongly urge you to look this up, and further even if they (experts) say it won`t work, get some and put it around the most important trees ….I`v had great luck, but haven`t it stop the `pine beetle` once it got started…..The trees I treated that are more important did not get sick. Maybe just fate, but it sure worked for the Hemlocks, and I think maybe a good preventative….Hope this helps in some way Tony ps the spelling again with my eyesight in dull light :-) lmidacloprid
Fungicide vs insecticide.
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  #36  
Old 06-06-2014, 06:13 PM
anthonyp anthonyp is offline
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Well Mark I know it, but that is why sometimes `belief`has strange consequences :-) I like Richard Feynman thoughts, and when there is not a known killer, then we can all be experts :-) a person has to have `hope` and that is what I was trying to do….Give Some…Tony
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  #37  
Old 06-07-2014, 09:16 AM
Mark Oomkes Mark Oomkes is online now
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Originally Posted by anthonyp View Post
Well Mark I know it, but that is why sometimes `belief`has strange consequences :-) I like Richard Feynman thoughts, and when there is not a known killer, then we can all be experts :-) a person has to have `hope` and that is what I was trying to do….Give Some…Tony
And if you apply an insecticide in the hope of controlling a fungus, you violated the label, which is a federal law.

Wouldn't want to hear of someone taking that advice and then getting busted by the EPA.
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  #38  
Old 06-07-2014, 10:01 PM
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YellowDogSVC YellowDogSVC is offline
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A few years back (within the last 10 years) there were quite a few guys selling "oak wilt" cures. A lot of it was snake oil. I found out one guy was using Miracle Grow in a big spray tank and spraying the leaves. Another sprayed leaves with a "mystery chemical" that was "high dollar". He never would say where it came from or what it was...but it was blue and looked a lot like Miracle Grow too!

You have to have a pesticide applicator's license in TX to spray trees for a fee. You are supposed to get one for your own property but plenty of guys don't. Injecting trees requires a pesticide applicator's license too but I know of several contractors who don't hold a license and inject trees all the time. There's only one chemical that I know of that's got research behind it for protecting an oak from wilt but it doesn't stop the fungus in the ground and that's the big problem. The trenching, which severs roots, is only 66%-75% effective depending on where you read and what nobody can answer is how an otherwise healthy tree, far enough away from root to root transmission and WITHOUT another "known" vector, can suddenly get wilt. Does the fungus travel through the ground using mycorrizae fungi or other root systems until it finds a suitable host? Why doesn't it just dry out in times of drought when a oak wilt center is isolated or has no other trees within root reach? We've dug up trees that supposedly died from wilt and the root systems were extremely dry and with the drought, the soils have been dry 2-3 and sometimes 4 feet down.

I wish I had all the answers. I know that it's a lot of work and until it hits you, most people don't think much about it. I know many contractors including tree trimmers that know virtually nothing about the disease and yet they may unknowingly help spread it or open up otherwise healthy trees to disease vectors.

I wish more people in the Central US were talking about it. I see/have seen a lot of clearing work done and you go by a year or two later and the oaks are dead or dying.. probably from oak wilt yet there are otherwise undisturbed properties where a center starts and radiates death outwards. It's just a very difficult disease/pathogen and because no every oak death is wilt-caused, it makes it even harder to suggest the nuclear option (removal, trenching, high-dollar injections, etc.)

In the coming weeks I'm going to post some pics as I start a secondary trench line and start on removals.

Here's a couple of pics of what I'd rather not have to do. This is from another contractor and it didn't solve the root transmission problem to other trees. Whole area (about 200 acres) has a lot of trees dead or continuing to die off.
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  #39  
Old 06-07-2014, 10:51 PM
anthonyp anthonyp is offline
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Yellow, I`m just a landowner, such as yourself, with my own equipment, and no licenses etc, and I just do my own thing Today I sprayed Copper on the rhododendron leaves to kill of a fungus ….It is very inexpensive but does the job for a year, and each year there is less and less….I don`t want to belabor the point, but it sure would be encouraging if some combination of things would help you out…Incidentally it is blue and looks just like `miracle-gro`…

And Mark, I guess I violate a federal law every day-----alot of which are a waste of time…..Try a silt fence on a flat field ridiculous :-) Tony
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  #40  
Old 06-08-2014, 10:22 AM
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YellowDogSVC YellowDogSVC is offline
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They've tried the copper sulfate. It's very toxic in high concentrations such as that used for fungal control. The property I know where they used it, supervised by another arborist with a lot of experience, lost almost every tree treated. It wasn't applied topically but rather into the roots since wilt clogs the tree from the roots up. It is blue and stains everything and like I said, it's toxic in high concentrations but you can buy it just about anywhere.

This particular pathogen is a very strong survivor. There's been some talk about mutations and/or resistance. Some guys have given up with treatment and devote their time to removals. There is something to that..

I've worked with wilt for almost 20 years and have seen entire ranches decimated... tens of thousands of dollars in remediation, trenching, etc. It's just bad news and I'm hoping to get more discussion going on it. A lot of other products have been tried and tested and I'm okay with any and all ideas put forth.

I guess what I don't get is why there isn't more research and money thrown at this problem. This wilt is pretty much a silent killer and doesn't get the press that EAB or even sudden oak death in California gets. It's in everyone's best interest to keep the oaks healthy before it's too late like with Dutch Elm disease.
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