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  #21  
Old 08-26-2014, 08:36 AM
whiffyspark whiffyspark is online now
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Seal n lock.
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  #22  
Old 08-26-2014, 06:10 PM
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JimLewis JimLewis is offline
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Originally Posted by G-Home View Post
Thanks, I'll give it a try. The big box store stuff lasts one year only.
Techniseal and the other companies all make a variety of different kinds of sealers. It's important to understand the difference. Most varieties of sealers are FILM-FORMING sealers. They create a film over the pavers and the advantage to this is it saves you time and materials. Usually takes just one good coat and you're done. The disadvantage to the film-forming sealers is that film will eventually crack and peel in around 4-5 years. When that happens, you not only have an angry customer, but then you have to totally strip the sealer off first before you can apply a new coat again. Stripping a sealer is a HUGE PITA. We've done it. Not worth it.

We use the Color Boost sealer because it is a PENETRATING SEALER. So the sealer actually goes INTO the paver. It gets absorbed into the pours of concrete and seals it from the inside out. Then in 4-5 years when the seal starts to fade, there is no cracking or peeling. All you have to do is clean and re-apply a coat or two. The disadvantage to this method is it usually takes a few more coats to get the patio totally sealed. That means the initial cost of patio sealing is more, if you use this method. But I find it to be a pretty easy sell. We've sold over $50,000 in sealing just over the last month just from a newsletter we sent out to our paver patio install clients. Our price for sealing wasn't cheap, because we're going with this method. But we landed over 50% of the bids we gave for sealing anyway, despite it costing our customer more to do it this way. We just had to take time and educate the customer on why we do it this way and why it's worth it. Once we did that, they saw the value and were happy to spend the money. And by the way, of the 50% of bids that we lost, most of them said they still want to do it. Just might wait until next year so they can save up a little.

Anyway, I'm a big fan of Techniseal. But whatever brand you end up using, I recommend using a PENETRATING sealer, rather than a film-forming one.
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  #23  
Old 08-27-2014, 08:49 AM
G-Home G-Home is offline
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Thanks for the info, penetrating is definitely what I want, and my local mason supply carries it.
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  #24  
Old 01-06-2016, 11:28 AM
Paver Protector Paver Protector is offline
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@JimLewis How long have you found the "wet look" of the color boost sealer to last?
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  #25  
Old 01-10-2016, 10:23 AM
lukemelo216 lukemelo216 is offline
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I would agree with Jim patio cleaning and sealing or just in general restoration/repair work is some of the easiest money made. Most patios with a two man crew could be completed over a two day period. The first day would include repairing any areas that may have sunk or settled (majority of the time this would be our competitors patios), repairing edging, cleaning joints, cleaning and sanding the patio. Second day we would return and seal the patio after its had a chance to fully dry. Depending on the product we would do 1-2 coats. Again like Jim said, we always use products that were absorbed into the pavers rather than the products that just create a film over the top.

As I said it is great money and a market that there is very little to no competition in. For a 400 sqft patio I was getting around $2000-2200 to clean and seal the patio, more if we had to do repairs. Two guys could complete that in about 20 hours, and materials would run you around $350 for a good cleaner and sealer. We always used SEK/Surebond products. Depending on your overhead you could probably net around $600-800 (30-35%.) You aren't going to see those numbers too often installing a patio, walkway or retaining wall. Plus the investment is low. You could set up a pickup truck or van and be set. You don't need a trailer full of hardscape tools, a skid steer or anything like that.

Like the others said, you asked for advice and there was some sound advice given but you didn't listen. You used the wrong product and missed an opportunity for an easy up sell. Don't be surprised if you don't hear back from them again next year or when you do its going to be to come and redo the work that wasn't done properly.
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  #26  
Old 01-10-2016, 08:33 PM
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JimLewis JimLewis is offline
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Originally Posted by Paver Protector View Post
@JimLewis How long have you found the "wet look" of the color boost sealer to last?
Well, I want to clarify something first, even if it's just for the other people reading this thread. Techniseal does make a "wet look" sealer. And that's one that I do not use because the Techniseal rep. has not recommended it in my region.

The Techniseal Color Boost sealer has two main benefits:
1) Protects the pavers from water, fading, spills, etc.
2) enhances/restores the look of the pavers.

I think what you're asking is how long does item #2 last. It's not really a "wet look" sealer. That is, it's not a glossy finish, like a true wet look sealer would give. But when you first apply it, it does restore the original color of the pavers quite a bit. So I think that's what you're asking - how long does that color restoration benefit last.

Well, this was something we didn't have as much experience with until this year. Now that we've done a bunch this year, a fair amount last year and a few the years before, I have more long-term experience to give me an adequate answer to this.

And it's a complicated answer. So sorry for being long-winded here. But it takes a little to explain.

First, I've found that the color-enhancement benefit of the Color Boost sealer only really lasts a year or two. That is: you seal it, it looks great, customer is happy with how great it "looks". But then a year or two later that enhanced look is mostly gone and the patio is back to looking like it did before it was sealed.

So at this point, it's important to note that the protection part of the sealer (item #1 above) is still working, usually. You can tell because if you put some water on the paver, it will bead up (as in this photo here). This is important to know and understand because the customer may launch the accusation at you that the paver sealer you installed isn't working anymore. It's important to show this to them and explain that the MAIN benefit of the sealer actually IS still working.

Second, I've found that sometimes you don't have to actually re-seal the pavers to bring back the enhanced color or look of the pavers. Sometimes they just need a good cleaning.

Consider your pavers to be like a car. If you just put a car outside and left if there for 12+ months how shiny and clean would it look? Not very....right? Because over those 12+ months things like pollen, dust, dirt, spills, bird crap, etc. have fallen on the car, right? So you can restore the car's nice paint and shine back just by giving it a good wash job, right? It's similar with pavers. Consider sealing is like a wax job and cleaning pavers with Hardscape Cleaner is like giving it a wash job. The wash job needs to be done fairly regularly, but the wax job is something you only need to do once in a while.

With that in mind, some people like to keep their cars waxed 2-3 times a year. Others just once every year or less. It will be the same with your customers. The frequency of how often you need to clean the pavers and seal them will sort of depend on how picky your client is in regards to keeping that patio looking it's best at all times.

So my thinking of paver sealing has evolved a little, once I understood this. I now explain this to customers in advance, BEFORE we seal their patio. Also, Techniseal recommends cleaning all pavers with their Hardscape Cleaner at least once every 6 months. Which sounds like a lot, I know. But keep in mind it doesn't take all that long. The cleaning process, with two guys, can be done in an hour or two for most residential patios. And the product is fairly inexpensive. So it's like maybe $150-$250 to do this. Not a huge price to pay to keep your patio looking it's best and not a real hard sell. Also benefits your company in two other ways. 1) Adds some residual income and 2) keeps you in front of that same happy customer regularly. We all know that many customers fade away over time and if they are left alone for too long we often lose touch and they eventually become someone else's customer. The better your company does at staying in front of the customer regularly, the more apt you are to keep them as a customer for the long run.

I also explain to the customer that if they like the "new" look of the pavers when they are sealed that they may need to have it done every year or two to maintain that look.

One other thing - I've found on some new sealing jobs we've done this year, that the new look of the sealer wears off in just a month or two. In this case, it's more because I didn't apply enough coats, rather than the product not working. So I always tell my customer that if it doesn't stay looking great, I'll be happy to come back within the next month or two to do another coat, if needed. Don't have to do this very often. But when I do, it doesn't take very much time or money to do a quick cleaning and then one more quote. The thing is: you can't really tell 100% for-sure if you have installed enough coats until it is 100% cured and dry. And in Oregon, at least, it sometimes looks cured and dry that afternoon. But come back 7 days later and you'll notice that it doesn't really look sealed. In those cases, we needed to do one more coat. So I'll come back and do it for free. I'd rather lose a couple hours and a little sealer than I would lose a customer because they thought we did a crappy job.

So it's all about managing expectations and letting the customer know about your recommended maintenance regarding cleaning and sealing.

I'm even in the process of creating a 1-page document on "Maintaining Your New Paver Patio" that we will be handing out to customers from now on. It will explain everything from paver cleaning and sealing, frequency, etc. to answers to commonly asked questions regarding weed control or power washing the pavers. This will help set more reasonable expectations for our customers as well as help set it up for us to make an easier sell down the road when we approach them about paver cleaning and/or sealing. Once we get this document finished, we'll hand this out after every hardscape job we install.
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