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Old 03-19-2001, 12:41 AM
kermit kermit is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 138
Hey, Turfman, you'll let the cat out of the bag if you tell everybody this is all in fun! The only serious thought I actually have is that most of the posts in favor of drug testing seem to be coming from you southerners,we in the Great White North seem to be a little more laid back and have a live and let live attitude.
Do you guys really have that bad a problem where you live? Do you REALLY have to stomp on peoples personal freedoms? If I really felt that an employee was blasted I'd just send him home or eventually fire his ass. No way would I ever agree to a drug test(which I would pass)just on principle. If I'm not willing to do it myself why would I subject anemployee to it?
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Old 03-23-2001, 05:40 PM
LawnSite Member
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: WEST MI
Posts: 201
It may be a surprise to some, but there are many of us left that still feel that personal character matters, and also many that feel that doing drugs anytime, anyplace represents a lack of character. Just like I dont want that person coming to my door in a few years to pick up my daughter for a date, I also do not want him representing my company, on his time or mine.

If that is what you call "freedom", then feel free to exercise your freedom while employed with my competitors.
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Old 03-23-2001, 09:49 PM
Evan528 Evan528 is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Montgomery County, PA.
Posts: 2,144
I know alot of people who smoke weed every day after work and are very responsible still. As long as you dont work while stoned and can still act professional I dont have a problem with it. Youd be surprised at how many people smoke weed that youd never even suspect!
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Old 03-24-2001, 04:47 AM
jmartmel jmartmel is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 41
character? The best employee you have could maybe fail one of those tests? What then, would you fire him. We are not talking about falling down hammered or stoned on the job! What ever happened to just basing someones ability on the job they perform at work. If you need a test to tell you something about character then I think you need to get training in personal observation skills before intuding on someones privacy. I don't do drugs! just dont agree with all the intrusion that seems to be taking hold in society.
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Old 03-24-2001, 01:52 PM
turfman99 turfman99 is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Forest Grove, Oregon outside Portland
Posts: 212
what it all boils down too...

is not whether it is right or worng, its the fact that society has enacted penalities in the form of civil damage actions in courts for employees being impaired on the job.

I put it several ways... if you drink to get drunk off your ass, then you have a drinking problem. Most of us did that in our early 20's just to be cool, then there were those of us who decided hanging your head in a toliet and puking, pounding hangover headaches and total waste of time.

If you smoke pot to get high, if you take meth to amp up, then you have a drug problem. Statistics prove that over 60% of the baby boom populaiton got high at one point or time intheri lives and did make a habit out of it for a period of time. Times change and we all move on. Drinkers become social drinkers, pot smokers either continue or quit and meth and herion freaks die.

It's not whether is morally right or wrong. Its the plain fct that the laws of the US and its states, and the regulations a lot of insurance companies operate under in order to reduce losses, insititute rules that say you can not take drugs or drink and be under the influence of affected by those drugs in any way during the work day. Weed stays in your blood stream for up to 45 days after your last hit. Thats just science and thats just business. You can choose to do it or not. Lot of companies that don't drug test still around.

You can go along with what the CDL regs and those of your particular insurance carrier require or you can just mow lawns and be a one man operation and keep getting high and quit bitching. If you want to do commercial work for , or under a GC, you and your employees will be subject to the rules that GC operates under with their companies. Same with some public agencies.

Artifical alteration of your normal mental state by ingestion of any foreign substance is nothing more than an temporary escapist mechanism to help you escape from the realities of the situation and usally excerbates the problem situation. Escaping solves the problem temporarialy, or sometimes increase the damage ( domestic violence) in the process.

Whats the difference between a half rack of beer and 5 hits of No Cal sensimillia ?? Your hammered the same.

Dale Wiley

Landscape Contractor
Landscape Specialty Services
Forest Grove, OR
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Old 03-24-2001, 03:01 PM
plowjockey plowjockey is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Dayton, Ohio
Posts: 332

I agree with your statement but I also hold that I have a responsibility to the public to do all I can to insure that no one operates any of my equip. in a state of any impairment.
Freedom not with standing if one of my people hurt, or worse yet, killed someone working impaired (think of your children or your own parents for instance) while in my employ I would have trouble sleeping at night if I hadn't at least tried to make sure that this could not be happening.
We all love freedom but that does not give us the freedom to risk other peoples lives. Many of our businesses include the operation of large and or dangerous equipment and I want any of my people to be in top shape when working for me.


Barger Signs Services Div.
Huber Heights, Ohio
SIMA Member
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Old 03-25-2001, 11:53 AM
kutnkru kutnkru is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: 93-04 (Zone5b) 05-now (Zone9a)
Posts: 2,662
Sureeeeeeee, I spend the week at the hospital and the next thing I know there is a communist coup d'état -LOL.

I do not drug test as an employment qualification. I agree with L. Stone, that if you eat a poppyseed bagel that you are addicted to opiates etc.

I think that the majortity of us here were not Clinton's and did in fact inhale while in college or at some point in our lives. Some here may still be weekend warriors. I think it is extremely hypocritical for us to assume that many are not capable of performing on an exemplary level at the workplace because they enjoy the stimulation of certain narcotics during sex, for religious reasons, or for meditative purposes.

I also think that with the Sudafeds and Contacts showing up the same as Mary-Jo-Wanna when the tests are given, that this is an obvious scapegoat for employees to use to avoid the entrapment.

The other tendancy that employers seem to overlook is the GoldSeals that are used as a supplimental part of an employees diet because of his extra curricular activites.

I am in agreement with JAA that we as employers should make sure that we have the right to a random test after an injury or accident occurs. This to me is not an infringement on the employees right to a personal life, but part of protecting our vested interests as a Company.

Just my nickle bag(ROFLMAO-LOL)
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Old 08-18-2001, 01:36 AM
Albemarle Lawn Albemarle Lawn is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: VIRGINIA
Posts: 1,546
Keeping the post alive

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Old 08-19-2001, 03:43 AM
RLM RLM is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Florida
Posts: 1
As far as drug testing and workers compensation goes--it's a farce. In a resent Florida Supreme Court case, the court ruled that unless the insurance company could prove that the person or persons were under the influence at the time of the accident and that being under said influence was a contributing factor, the insurance company had to pay up.

In other words, just because one of your employees happen to catch an illegal buzz over the weekend it does not give the insurance company the option to refuse payment. The insurance company MUST PROVE that smoking a joint on Friday night was a contributing factor to the accident that happened on the following Monday.

Personally, I would rather work with someone that smoke after work than with someone who drinks after work.

Mark one up for FREEDOM!
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Old 08-23-2001, 11:23 AM
Island Lawn Island Lawn is offline
LawnSite Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Golf Coast, SC
Posts: 632

If peeing in a cup for a job is not an unreasonable search, then neither is looking into your genetic code and finding other
"character flaws".

"Looks like Little Johnny might consider experimenting with pot.
We better abort this mutant!
We can't even use his mutant stem cells!"

Your $49.95 Wal Mart Urine Licker might cause you to falsely fire your best worker, possibly even face a lawsuit for doing so.
If he tests positive,
policy is policy or it is not policy!

Pothead stereotypes fit humans just as well as other steroetypes fit humans.

Reefer Madness!

Divide and Conquer!

Morals and Values? I wish more conservatives would consider the moral implications of a government striping a nation of personal freedoms while fighting a quagmire war against its own citizenship!

What will it take to win?
Look at the total costs ($ and human) to date.
No end in sight.

At this point, the war is a self-perpetuating industry. Lots of people on the gov payroll would be unemployed if peace broke out!
That might be bad for the economy/political careers!

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