Register free!
Search
 
     

Click for Weather
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-10-2007, 06:19 PM
americanlawn's Avatar
americanlawn americanlawn is offline
LawnSite Fanatic
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: midwest
Posts: 5,577
Amine or Ester now???

Creeping Charlie, oxalis, violets (tough), clover, knotweed, purslane, clover, spurge, etc.
Been advised by some (here) to use "amine" formulations....problem = "amines" don't touch the above"?? Been using Chaser + LI700 with really nice results, so I'm wondering "What's up"??? Why the amine recommedations ?? Been told that "esters" penetrate the leaf tissue"??

Any results/opinnions out there??
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 06-10-2007, 06:59 PM
mkroher mkroher is offline
LawnSite Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 539
I *think* the amines are more volatile than the ester. I assume the reason being for summer apps for less stress on the lawn?
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-10-2007, 09:00 PM
LawnJohn LawnJohn is offline
LawnSite Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkroher View Post
I *think* the amines are more volatile than the ester. I assume the reason being for summer apps for less stress on the lawn?

Actually, it's the opposite. Follow the amine recommendation. It's too hot for esters. Yes ester works by penetration, but commonly used during cooler weather.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-10-2007, 09:15 PM
mkroher mkroher is offline
LawnSite Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 539
Quote:
Originally Posted by LawnJohn View Post
Actually, it's the opposite. Follow the amine recommendation. It's too hot for esters. Yes ester works by penetration, but commonly used during cooler weather.
... that's what i just said?
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 06-10-2007, 11:47 PM
Victor's Avatar
Victor Victor is offline
LawnSite Bronze Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 1,635
Hi MK

What he was telling you, is that Ester-based formulations (like Speedzone) are more volatile than Amine-based formulations (like Surge). He said you had it backwards, because you stated that Amine-based formulations were more volatile than Ester-based formulations.

Amine formulations are the only way to go this time of year. I get great results using Surge on all of the weeds you listed Larry. I've even had good luck burning down Violets this time of year. Sure, they come back by the time Fall rolls around. That just means though, that they're rearing their ugly heads at just the right time for me to finish them off for good, with an Ester-based formulation like Speedzone.
__________________
Vic Cundiff
Owner, Par 5 Lawn Care
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 06-11-2007, 04:50 PM
The Ranger The Ranger is offline
LawnSite Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: NE Ohio
Posts: 208
Quote:
Originally Posted by americanlawn View Post
Creeping Charlie, oxalis, violets (tough), clover, knotweed, purslane, clover, spurge, etc.
Been advised by some (here) to use "amine" formulations....problem = "amines" don't touch the above"?? Been using Chaser + LI700 with really nice results, so I'm wondering "What's up"??? Why the amine recommedations ?? Been told that "esters" penetrate the leaf tissue"??

Any results/opinnions out there??
Drive on the violets, fall is the best time....amine formulation (lesco 3 way, triplet, trimic 992) and I am sure there are more out there will all work on the other stuff, although oxalis might be a little tuff because of the leaf direction and the runoff.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 06-11-2007, 06:46 PM
americanlawn's Avatar
americanlawn americanlawn is offline
LawnSite Fanatic
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: midwest
Posts: 5,577
I'm gunna try side-by-side comparisons this week. LESCO 3-way is less than 1/3rd the cost of Speedzone & Chaser, so maybe we'll save some money too. Target weeds will be purslane, knotweed, spurge, oxalis, and ground ivy (altrhough we've never smoked ground ivy with amines). I still think I'm right by using esters for these hard-to-kill summers weeds (waxy coating), but I trust you guys. Thanks very much, americanlawn
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 06-11-2007, 07:22 PM
RigglePLC's Avatar
RigglePLC RigglePLC is online now
LawnSite Fanatic
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Grand Rapids MI
Posts: 9,268
I am with you on this idea--ester is better for the tough weeds. Strong odor scares customers, though. I add a wetting agent. Probably there is increased risk of vapor drift. One of my customers has grape vines in his yard. I tried to keep spray 3 feet away with Permagreen Ultra in April--still got some injury. (Grape vines are extremely sensitive.)

Can't wait to see results of your side by side comparison, American. I hope you do some double and triple strength Speedzone to see if you get any injury.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 06-12-2007, 09:52 AM
LawnJohn LawnJohn is offline
LawnSite Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor View Post
What he was telling you, is that Ester-based formulations (like Speedzone) are more volatile than Amine-based formulations (like Surge). He said you had it backwards, because you stated that Amine-based formulations were more volatile than Ester-based formulations.

Amine formulations are the only way to go this time of year. I get great results using Surge on all of the weeds you listed Larry. I've even had good luck burning down Violets this time of year. Sure, they come back by the time Fall rolls around. That just means though, that they're rearing their ugly heads at just the right time for me to finish them off for good, with an Ester-based formulation like Speedzone.
Thanks Victor!!

I'm at Disney World with the kids so I didn't have much time to go into detail.

Momentum FX2 may be a good solution..It's a tad more than 3-way, but cheaper than Speedzone. Works good for me..


I'd be really careful about using the esters if it's hot..I don't know the weather conditions where you are, but if it's been hot/dry, I would consider half rate and adding chelated iron to counter phytotoxicity.


I hope everything works out.

John..
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 06-12-2007, 04:59 PM
shaneb shaneb is offline
Sponsor
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Carmel, IN
Posts: 34
You could also try adding Octane to your 3-way for a better and quicker kill for not much more money than the 3-way alone.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump





Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©1998 - 2012, LawnSite.comô - Moose River Media
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:12 PM.

Page generated in 0.10324 seconds with 7 queries