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  #1  
Old 10-20-2001, 06:55 PM
steveair steveair is offline
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Location: morristown, nj
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Installation over existing concrete stoop

Hello,

Just priced a job out where the people wanted to redo/repair/or replace and existing concrete/brick stoop at the front door of their house.

My idea was to simply build around the old one rather that redo it or completely rip it out and start from scratch.

Any one ever do this?

The old stoop is cinder block with brick steps/capping and a poured concrete area on top.

My plan is to just build around the old one using wall block and then setting pavers on top of the concrete with a inch or so of sand as base.

I decided on this because the old stoop is quite massive. It has a cinder block base that probably goes 3 feet done and the brick work is somewhat tied into the brick work of the house. If I were to go and demo it, it would easily be an 500 to 1000 dollars depending on how much block is under it, and also, some damage may occur to the house when trying to remove it as it is 'worked in' somewhat.

Am I out of line doing this. I already stated to the customer that it may settle a little over time, but only in the pavers used to construct the step area out of the door. the walls and step I can build around the stoop (ample room and easily worked into the house) and will only need to feel in the area between the new walls/steps and old stoop, which is where I figure the pavers might settle out in a few years.

My theory is that it may need some minor repair later on, but that the savings of not demoing the old one will be well worth the risk.

Also, there was plenty of room between the bottom of the door and the existing stoop (about 8 inches) to accomodate a paver overlay. The only problem will be that the step into the house will not be consistent with the steps going up to it, but I don't thing it is a concern (hopefully no enforcement officers around that day.....)

steve

and one more thing, the stoop has a post on the one corner that is supporting a overhang from the roof over the area. It is still in good shape, and I did not want to alse get involved with setting up temporary supports and then resetting the post/replacing it.


Last edited by steveair; 10-20-2001 at 07:20 PM.
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  #2  
Old 10-20-2001, 07:13 PM
eskals eskals is offline
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Location: Northville, MI (Near Detroit)
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Steve:


I don't have much experience in these types of things and have never aptempted this type of installation, but here is my take on it. Those old stoops can be VERY massive and were often built fairly well. If it is an old house and the stoop shows no signs of major settling (ie. cracking motor joints, concrete shifted, signs of tuckpointing) then I believe you have a solid foundation. If its been in the ground for years with no adverse affects, the odds of it moving all of a sudden are minimal.

About the step into the house. If I understand correctly, there are steps leading up to a small, elevated concrete landing pad. If this is the case, I don't believe that code will require you to have the step into the house the same rise as the other steps because of the landing. The reason the step into the house is there is to prevent snow and water from sitting on the door sill.

Eric
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  #3  
Old 10-21-2001, 12:08 PM
paul paul is offline
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Steve, What kind of shape is the stoop in? Large cracks? Is it settling? A picture might help
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  #4  
Old 10-21-2001, 12:27 PM
steveair steveair is offline
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Hello,

The stoop is not in that bad of shape. Mainly, all of the brick work is falling apart, and there are a few minor cracks in some of the concrete, but overall, I have seen much worse.

It does not appear to have settled that much. When looking at the seems between the house and the stoop, there was very little if not no seperation.

I also thought about the idea of 'veneering' the existing stoop with pavers and new treads, but it would be much more intricate work, and I'm not crazy about the work involved in getting it perfect.

steve
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  #5  
Old 10-21-2001, 12:32 PM
paul paul is offline
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I would seal any cracks that you have in it then do like you where thinking, build around it. using soild units, foam backer rods, and some concrete sealant to keep the sand from settling around the wall units.
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  #6  
Old 10-21-2001, 12:47 PM
steveair steveair is offline
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one question,

what are foam backer rods?

thanks,

steve
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  #7  
Old 10-21-2001, 12:55 PM
paul paul is offline
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Foam backer rods are used to fill cracks in concrete before a sealer is used. They come in different widths and support the sealer so it doesn't take 4 tubes to fill a 3/4" crack in concrete.

One more thing make sure your sealer is dry before you start your brick work.
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  #8  
Old 10-21-2001, 08:25 PM
steveair steveair is offline
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Thanks for the tips paul.

I really am not 100% into the idea, and would rather just rip out the old one now that I think about it, but money wise I think the client is going to think twice about the price then. We already sold them on a few extras, and I don't know how much much father they will go.

this is one of those decisions I hate to make. I know what the right way to do it is and hate doing it any other way, but then again, I really want them to repair the stoop as it will complete the job.

steve
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  #9  
Old 10-22-2001, 08:27 PM
diginahole diginahole is offline
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Good day folks,

Long time, no see, been real busy.

I have a suggestion to solve the seasonal movement problems associated with ths type of insallation. Around the perimiter of the existing concrete you can use paverbond to fasten a Pisa coping on the top and Pisa faces (waste pieces of pisa cornersabout 2" thick) to the front. You can then build regular steps in front of the stoop that can move up and down with the seasons without effecting the unmoveable stoop and the new pavers on top. If you can't get the faces from the factory as we can here in Ontario, you can just cut them off a standard unit. This is the only way to properly handle this situation in my opinion, unless you can stop the world from moving.
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  #10  
Old 10-28-2001, 08:50 PM
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SCAPEASAURUSREX SCAPEASAURUSREX is offline
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Steveair,

If I understood correctly you are going to build a new stoop over an existing one ?? The only problem I see is that the wall you construct on the sides / around the existing concrete block stoop will settle over time and the pavers in the center will become higher than the ones on the outside edges ?? Since this existing stoop has been around a long time it's unlikly it will settle any further, but your new interlocking wall may settle some ???
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