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  #11  
Old 02-07-2008, 09:07 AM
Tom Jaszewski's Avatar
Tom Jaszewski Tom Jaszewski is offline
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Location: Winona MN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by growingdeeprootsorganicly View Post
tom,
I have a question for you. I'm wondering why does S ag's earth tea 22 produce the best results as far as test #'s for bacteria and fungal growth from of their brewers?

I've also noticed that other companies brewers have trouble producing good numbers like their smaller units.

what would cause this in your opinion?
or is there something I'm missing from reading these results?

any thoughts on this subject would be helpful,
thank you,
charlie
I often get in trouble for my opinions. That being said I need to tell you I am biased since I use and am willing to sell and support S Ags equipment......

While getting good test results is important, those results are also a function of the parent materials and the nutrient packs used and designed for the equipment. So many variables affect the test results and testing gets so tedious and expensive that I just stick with manufacturers recommendations these days. When I did have the testing budget and was only an end user customer I found S Ags designs to perform as advertised. I have tested and owned all three sizes, personally I think the 22 results are probably going to be tough to consistently repeat. But that's not the goal....the goal is to meet the standards set for quality tea...and all models do that.
Fell free to contact me off list or email me for more of a discussion....
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Tom

"The ultimate test of man's conscience may be his willingness to sacrifice something today for future generations whose words of thanks will not be heard."
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  #12  
Old 02-07-2008, 09:17 AM
Tom Jaszewski's Avatar
Tom Jaszewski Tom Jaszewski is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smallaxe View Post
Yes, it would.

Right now as a guy in the business. As a guy who will be busy during the busy season.
I would like to represent the fella who thinks this is a big hassle and why doesn't dry matter eventually work anyway?

This whole compost tea business needs to be more user friendly before it becomes popular with the LCO's. So far all I have heard about the details is arguements, but no pictures.
Glad to hear you will be very busy!
I'm not sure what's NOT user friendly about the CT business, can you enlighten me? I have no arguments, as a matter of fact when the pundits and raving practicianers show up yo'll find me withdrawing from the converstion. I'll soon be to busy with my own LCO customers that I won't have the time for the crap often dished out...

I do think that with "the dry stuff" and the correct iputs you could eventually get you there. But I don't think you built your business on eventual results!

Again let me know what you need.

Regards,

Tom
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Regards,

Tom

"The ultimate test of man's conscience may be his willingness to sacrifice something today for future generations whose words of thanks will not be heard."
— Gaylord Nelson
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  #13  
Old 02-07-2008, 01:19 PM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Jaszewski View Post
Glad to hear you will be very busy!
I'm not sure what's NOT user friendly about the CT business, can you enlighten me? I have no arguments, as a matter of fact when the pundits and raving practicianers show up yo'll find me withdrawing from the converstion. I'll soon be to busy with my own LCO customers that I won't have the time for the crap often dished out...

I do think that with "the dry stuff" and the correct iputs you could eventually get you there. But I don't think you built your business on eventual results!

Again let me know what you need.

Regards,

Tom

Thanks for the response. The basic understanding in my mind is that I buy liquid over the internet that is quite volatile in that if it 'did' have the right bugs in the first place I need to carefully brew it for several days to reactivate them and get it on the ground before they all die. Is this even a correct assessment?

I bought a brewing kit to make my own beer one time and that was as much as I accomplished. I can't imagine setting up barrels with special aerators, especially if it is as easy to fail as it sounds.
A couple of pictures of some handy dandy set ups would be nice. I got maybe a couple of small lawns to start on and see how it goes.
Since alot of us have no experience in this and can't sort out the debates about what and who is better; there is really nothing to associate with as to whether it is something I could add to my routine in a practical fashion.

Another thing that confuses me about the whole industry is : Why can't these bacteria and fungi be produced and put in a drier medium to go dormant and then shipped? Wouldn't it provide a longer shelf life and cheaper shipping costs? I thot both fungi and bacteria sporoform when conditions become less than favorable.

Again, thanks for your time.
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Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
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  #14  
Old 02-07-2008, 06:26 PM
growingdeeprootsorganicly growingdeeprootsorganicly is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smallaxe View Post
Thanks for the response. The basic understanding in my mind is that I buy liquid over the internet that is quite volatile in that if it 'did' have the right bugs in the first place I need to carefully brew it for several days to reactivate them and get it on the ground before they all die. Is this even a correct assessment?

I bought a brewing kit to make my own beer one time and that was as much as I accomplished. I can't imagine setting up barrels with special aerators, especially if it is as easy to fail as it sounds.
A couple of pictures of some handy dandy set ups would be nice. I got maybe a couple of small lawns to start on and see how it goes.
Since alot of us have no experience in this and can't sort out the debates about what and who is better; there is really nothing to associate with as to whether it is something I could add to my routine in a practical fashion.

Another thing that confuses me about the whole industry is : Why can't these bacteria and fungi be produced and put in a drier medium to go dormant and then shipped? Wouldn't it provide a longer shelf life and cheaper shipping costs? I thot both fungi and bacteria sporoform when conditions become less than favorable.

Again, thanks for your time.
smallaxe,

I'm not even going to try to sound like an expert in the subject of compost tea but I do have a little bit of knowledge in the ohl noggin that I might be able to share with you.
There's plenty on line to get you started as far as seeing brewers and how they are made and how the tea is brewed. some might come in liquid form to begin with but that's not what your after.

you want to start with dry compost to begin with, any compost will do but the more higher quality compost you start with the better diversity you will have in your finished tea,

most guys use vermicompost(worm compost) because the amazing product they produce, a very rich diversity of bacteria and fungi and all the other goodness from the worms, probably the best thing you can use in any grow situation, meaning in tea or in it's natural state used as a top dressing or incorporation in the soil, it's very powerful.

now from what i read the true benefit from ct is that the biology is active not dormant and that's the key cause you could buy some product bottled or bagged with micro biology in it but once its in the soil it will take way longer to grow that biology and that dormant product will in no way have the same active or DIVERSE biology in it. diversity is key more diversity you have the more likely your soil and plants will benefit.

finished ct does not have along self life only few of hours if not aerated
the dry compost has the self life you need and when you need tea brew it fresh.

best advice i can give you is to go to YOU TUBE on line and type compost tea in the search column and look for a 6 part video from BRUCE DEULEY on ct
I think he can explain better then me what you are looking for.
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  #15  
Old 02-07-2008, 08:28 PM
tadhussey tadhussey is offline
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Location: Redmond, WA
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What kind of pictures would you like? I have no problems describing what we're doing with our brewer setup. There's a bunch of brewer manufacturers that make good brewers.

Things to look for:

1. Price and customer support of product.
2. Consistent lab results (this means more than one)
3. Microscopy (are they checking their teas/compost on a regular basis)
4. HOW EASY IS IT TO CLEAN? (this is a biggie in my opinion for larger brewers)
5. How much is replacement materials (compost and foods)?

Of course, this is just if you're buying a brewer from a company. Otherwise you don't need to follow these guidelines, but they're helpful in determining how you design your own brewer.

~Tad
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  #16  
Old 02-07-2008, 08:32 PM
tadhussey tadhussey is offline
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In our 100 gal. brewer, it's a similar design only we suspend 2 bags and run air into both of those bags in addition to the bottom of the tank.

Hope that helps!

~Tad
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  #17  
Old 02-07-2008, 08:39 PM
tadhussey tadhussey is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by growingdeeprootsorganicly View Post
tom,
I have a question for you. I'm wondering why does S ag's earth tea 22 produce the best results as far as test #'s for bacteria and fungal growth from of their brewers?
I've also noticed that other companies brewers have trouble producing good numbers like their smaller units.

what would cause this in your opinion?
or is there something I'm missing from reading these results?

any thoughts on this subject would be helpful,
thank you,
charlie
Charlie,

You have to realize that one of the biggest issues with our industry is that anyone can design a brewer and say it makes compost tea. Only a smaller handful of companies actually test their design and determine a proper recipe. In reality, designing a brewer and making compost tea is not a complicated thing. Once you understand the mechanics of it, and have a way of verifying that the biology is there, it's very simple. I think you could make your own brewer and recipe provided you have a dissolved oxygen meter and a microscope. Or for more detailed information you could send a sample into a lab.

My problem is that many of the companies selling compost tea brewers don't bother to do testing or make sure that they can consistenly produce good teas. In my opinion, compost tea is a viable tool for the organic gardener or lawn care provider, but it needs to be made and applied correctly.
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  #18  
Old 02-07-2008, 10:02 PM
DUSTYCEDAR's Avatar
DUSTYCEDAR DUSTYCEDAR is offline
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never thought to look on u tube for info thanks
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  #19  
Old 02-07-2008, 10:37 PM
wrs1 wrs1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by growingdeeprootsorganicly View Post

smallaxe,

I'm not even going to try to sound like an expert in the subject of compost tea but I do have a little bit of knowledge in the ohl noggin that I might be able to share with you.
There's plenty on line to get you started as far as seeing brewers and how they are made and how the tea is brewed. some might come in liquid form to begin with but that's not what your after.

you want to start with dry compost to begin with, any compost will do but the more higher quality compost you start with the better diversity you will have in your finished tea,

most guys use vermicompost(worm compost) because the amazing product they produce, a very rich diversity of bacteria and fungi and all the other goodness from the worms, probably the best thing you can use in any grow situation, meaning in tea or in it's natural state used as a top dressing or incorporation in the soil, it's very powerful.

now from what i read the true benefit from ct is that the biology is active not dormant and that's the key cause you could buy some product bottled or bagged with micro biology in it but once its in the soil it will take way longer to grow that biology and that dormant product will in no way have the same active or DIVERSE biology in it. diversity is key more diversity you have the more likely your soil and plants will benefit.

finished ct does not have along self life only few of hours if not aerated
the dry compost has the self life you need and when you need tea brew it fresh.

best advice i can give you is to go to YOU TUBE on line and type compost tea in the search column and look for a 6 part video from BRUCE DEULEY on ct
I think he can explain better then me what you are looking for.

smallaxe, for someone who says they dont know much about compost tea your pretty right on.
a few more people you might want to contact would be Dr. Elaine Ingham soil food web.com,Jeff lowenfel teaming with microbes,and bruce elliot, at epm inc. they specialize in compost tea brewers and he has the most awesome worm bind you have everseen so are his brewers he sells them around the world, that kiss brewer is a pretty dang good brewer to.
bruce at epm by the way has a company in alabama who has been useing compost tea in his already exhisting spray company and doing quite well with it but you should call and talk to him about it he loves to help people get a better understanding.
thats all it is taking the time to understand and learn something new even if you just get a small brewer of some sort and start to experiment a little have fun you will like the results.
good luck wrs1
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  #20  
Old 02-08-2008, 09:33 AM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is online now
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Central Wisconsin
Posts: 9,886
Quote:
Originally Posted by tadhussey View Post
What kind of pictures would you like? I have no problems describing what we're doing with our brewer setup. There's a bunch of brewer manufacturers that make good brewers.

Things to look for:

1. Price and customer support of product.
2. Consistent lab results (this means more than one)
3. Microscopy (are they checking their teas/compost on a regular basis)
4. HOW EASY IS IT TO CLEAN? (this is a biggie in my opinion for larger brewers)
5. How much is replacement materials (compost and foods)?

Of course, this is just if you're buying a brewer from a company. Otherwise you don't need to follow these guidelines, but they're helpful in determining how you design your own brewer.

~Tad

Ok , let's say I have confidence in what you are doing and your tea quality. I do not want to make my own tea.
What I am unclear about is what do I have to do with it when when I open your package of tea and want to put on a lawn ??
Do I in fact need to rebrew with a brewer of my own?
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Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
,,, I wonder what does...
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